ZOS… Please rework dark convergence

Danse_Mayhem · August 2022

Yeah this is posted every patch and here’s another one for High Isle / Lost depths.

This set is still the biggest pile of broken BS that’s ever hit ESO. We as a community flagged it at PTS and it was ignored, and it continues to completely ruin pvp.

1. It still pulls from way outside of its visual radius / doesn’t show a visual until pulled consistently
2. It can be stacked. So blocking one DC pull doesn’t help at all when people just throw 6 of them down… You’re getting pulled and that’s all there is to it.
3. We can still be pulled off walls. Chains was nerfed years ago to not be able to do this, please bring DC in line.
4. It enhances other broken stuff like Plaguebreak / occult procs on guards. Even if you block it, you can still expect a whole crowd of guards / new or low level players to be pulled to your location and explode for unavoidable massive damage. These procs are way overtuned and it’s ridiculous they work on guards but they are made infinitely worse by dark convergence.
5. This set does nothing to combat ball groups / zergs. It’s a tool for them to perform better. Sure we may see some one off clips of smaller groups using this to overcome a ball group / Zerg but in 9/10 cases, the larger group just stacks multiple procs all over the place to decimate smaller groups.

Wasn’t the whole point of the epic DPS nerf in Lost Depths to make the game more accessible to newer players? What is even remotely ‘accessible’ for newer players about a proc set that does what dark convergence does? Even as an experience pvper there’s not much I can do with 6 procs going down one after another - One will always land and then it’s instant group wipe to occult overload.

This midyear has been the most garbage and stale action I’ve played since release of ESO because every second player is just a copy / paste necromancer bomber pulling people in with dark convergence.

It’s legit terrible for pvp. Please please rework it to do something else. Anyone who understands game balance and has seen these awful metas is saying the same thing about this being the worst thing to hit pvp, ever.

Fhritz · August 2022

Is it really a problem ?? I don't see a lot of DC these days, and even stacked you can easily roll dodge, things like plaguebreak, VD are far more deadly now.

Danse_Mayhem wrote: »

..
4. It enhances other broken stuff like Plaguebreak / occult procs on guards. Even if you block it, you can still expect a whole crowd of guards / new or low level players to be pulled to your location and explode for unavoidable massive damage. These procs are way overtuned and it’s ridiculous they work on guards but they are made infinitely worse by dark convergence.
5. This set does nothing to combat ball groups / zergs. It’s a tool for them to perform better. Sure we may see some one off clips of smaller groups using this to overcome a ball group / Zerg but in 9/10 cases, the larger group just stacks multiple procs all over the place to decimate smaller groups.

Okay, and ? They are still effective against large group too, especially plaguebreak, and it's not a matter of proc but rather the fact that a bigger group will always have an advantage over smaller groups because of their numbers. You could remove these set and you'll see the same issue with bigger group.

I don't use DC or plaguebreak myself, but DC isn't a problem anymore, it work as intended.

Danse_Mayhem · August 2022

Yes a bigger group will always win, and that’s precisely the point. Stop adding in these ridiculous sets to try and counter that, and just accept that numbers usually win.

Dark convergence is just further used to make it impossible to fight a larger group. This mid year event has just been one proc after another.

If you think this set is remotely balanced / good for pvp then I’m going to assume you either aren’t a PvP main or haven’t been playing since before it came out… That’s not to sound elitist but for real this set is killing any sense of variety in pvp and is just feeding this bomber meta of copy paste builds.

Vetixio · August 2022

DC is annoying but the damage isn't that high if you block/move out of it. The only thing that me and guildees have noticed is that it can still pull you if you use immovability pots/Templar heal ult/mist form the same applies for DK talons they also seem to ignore cc immunity.

Danse_Mayhem · August 2022

Vetixio wrote: »

DC is annoying but the damage isn't that high if you block/move out of it. The only thing that me and guildees have noticed is that it can still pull you if you use immovability pots/Templar heal ult/mist form the same applies for DK talons they also seem to ignore cc immunity.

This is true for single uses, but that wasn’t the point of this post.
Sure when one person uses DC every 15s you can block and move out of it easily with no big consequence, but when a whole group of enemy players has it, this is legit impossible.

People are starting to pair it with rushing agony now for the double pull, and lay down AOEs one after another to effectively keep a constant pull attempt for however many procs they get. It only takes one to work and the whole group is gone because of occult overload / plaguebreak.

You can’t exactly stand there blocking for 10s taking all kinds of ulti dump whilst the multiple procs hopefully go away, and even if you do - Guards and low levels can get pulled to -you- and explode with VD/PB/OO and there is zero you can do about that.

Right from day 1 this was a brainless set that does all of the work for copy / paste builds and only serves to aid the larger group more than anything ever has before.

Vetixio · August 2022

Danse_Mayhem wrote: »

Vetixio wrote: »

DC is annoying but the damage isn't that high if you block/move out of it. The only thing that me and guildees have noticed is that it can still pull you if you use immovability pots/Templar heal ult/mist form the same applies for DK talons they also seem to ignore cc immunity.

This is true for single uses, but that wasn’t the point of this post.
Sure when one person uses DC every 15s you can block and move out of it easily with no big consequence, but when a whole group of enemy players has it, this is legit impossible.

People are starting to pair it with rushing agony now for the double pull, and lay down AOEs one after another to effectively keep a constant pull attempt for however many procs they get. It only takes one to work and the whole group is gone because of occult overload / plaguebreak.

You can’t exactly stand there blocking for 10s taking all kinds of ulti dump whilst the multiple procs hopefully go away, and even if you do - Guards and low levels can get pulled to -you- and explode with VD/PB/OO and there is zero you can do about that.

Right from day 1 this was a brainless set that does all of the work for copy / paste builds and only serves to aid the larger group more than anything ever has before.

I agree totally the set is kinda stupid and braindead as are Plaguebreak and Occult Overload. But I've learnt to deal with them in PvP. I am very glad ZOS have finally nerfed DC and Plague next patch I don't think it would hurt for them to nerf their damage more as well as changing OO back to 4k.

OnGodiDoDis · August 2022

Fhritz wrote: »

Is it really a problem ?? I don't see a lot of DC these days, and even stacked you can easily roll dodge, things like plaguebreak, VD are far more deadly now.

Danse_Mayhem wrote: »

..
4. It enhances other broken stuff like Plaguebreak / occult procs on guards. Even if you block it, you can still expect a whole crowd of guards / new or low level players to be pulled to your location and explode for unavoidable massive damage. These procs are way overtuned and it’s ridiculous they work on guards but they are made infinitely worse by dark convergence.
5. This set does nothing to combat ball groups / zergs. It’s a tool for them to perform better. Sure we may see some one off clips of smaller groups using this to overcome a ball group / Zerg but in 9/10 cases, the larger group just stacks multiple procs all over the place to decimate smaller groups.

Okay, and ? They are still effective against large group too, especially plaguebreak, and it's not a matter of proc but rather the fact that a bigger group will always have an advantage over smaller groups because of their numbers. You could remove these set and you'll see the same issue with bigger group.

I don't use DC or plaguebreak myself, but DC isn't a problem anymore, it work as intended.

Oh man, did you just say "you can easily roll dodge" out of a DC? Doing that will pull you right back in because roll dodging does not grant CC immunity. Blocking will only result in doing what the enemy wants you to do which is pin you down so they can fear you and kill you. A DC negate is unstoppable.

OnGodiDoDis · August 2022

This set will never go away because this is their "solution" to the ill server performance. If there are less players, there is less lag. I would also like to add that DC is granting everyone an ultimate-like AoE pull that was only accessible to one class before: Dragonknight. DK Standard was a very widely used ultimate back in the day and nobody uses it now. Because why wait for 200+ ult when you can AoE pull every 15 seconds? They need to bring the old combat team back. At least they didn't give us DC, PB, and Nocturnal's Ploy.

deleted221205-002626 · August 2022

Your being pulls from far out of visual because its NOT dcon doing it. Its rush of agony pulling u in 1st and not giving u any cc immunity, then dcon after even if only half a second later. Rush of agony not applying cc immunity is the issue imo. Its allowing dcon to be the 2nd pull!

Danse_Mayhem · August 2022

My suggested change here ;

Keep the damage, remove the pull.

That would still be useful, as a growing purple AOE that doesn’t really bother a single player but hits a whole group for 20k if they stay near it would still be viable for fighting outnumbered and dealing with crowds, but wouldn’t give the crazy synergies with occult overload / plaguebreak / VD that it does now. Also wouldn’t decimate solo players / small groups and wouldn’t allow groups to use friendly guards against you by pulling them in to explode with other stuff.

Also, remove occult overload from guards/NPCs. VD only procs on players, surely it’s an easy change to add the same rule to occult overload? It’s not like that CP is remotely useful in PVE. It’s pretty much only used to break pvp in tandem with dark convergence.

Please listen to us ZOS.

CameraBeardThePirate · August 2022

sinnereso wrote: »

Your being pulls from far out of visual because its NOT dcon doing it. Its rush of agony pulling u in 1st and not giving u any cc immunity, then dcon after even if only half a second later. Rush of agony not applying cc immunity is the issue imo. Its allowing dcon to be the 2nd pull!

This. Yes, it's true that DC's visual disappears sometimes (especially with certain skills such as sorc mines), but I'm going to go out on a limb and say most of the time people complaining about invisible DCs or DCs double pulling are actually getting pulled by Rush first.

etchedpixels · August 2022

On PC EU half the time the lag is so bad that what you see is irrelevant. Nothing is going to happen whatever buttons you push. That's half the problem.