How to make the Tank role really enjoyable

Eratas_Dualitas · July 2022

Ever since I started playing the game I always perceived that role as a sacrifice, not only it can be hard to play and master, but you also have way less fun than playing as a dps or a healer.

It's also the only role in which I was heavily criticized, mostly by other Tanks main players who knows and enjoy playing it way better than I do; which was a complete different experience when I would play my god of damage shields healer for example.

But everything isn't black and white, I had some great time, I was respected and understood/tolerated/thanked during the time I would play Tank.

And now you may think that maybe I was just really bad but I assure you I was not, I would watch videos, take good builds, optimize, farm stuff on my other toons... etc, and I'm able to perform well enough in most Veteran dungeons if I have a good team.

But the main reason I'm writing this post is because of the Taunting.
There's not much ways of taunting targets in ESO, and while taunting single targets can be useful in some cases, most of the time it is not.

So here's what I'm proposing: Make taunt attacks a Cone Attack.

That's it, that's what I propose. Just by doing that, tanking could become much more fun and we would actually have more players playing that role and we won't have to wait more than 10 mins for a random dungeon.

We could also change the ranged taunt ability to taunt enemies around the target too, or simply add more ways of taunting, increase the durations, whatever.

I know that there are some sets out there that allows you to taunt several ennemies at the same time but it's not that great and you must have the abilities to do so, so unless we start copying WoW, it's really not newbie friendly and not for everyone.

Do you guys have any better suggestions?

Brrrofski · July 2022

How would it make it more enjoyable?

It'd make it easier, but wouldn't that make it more boring?

deleted221106-002999 · July 2022

Looks like yet another 'aoe taunt' request.

No thanks.

phaneub17_ESO · July 2022

WoW made tanking fun by making tanks more focused on the offensive with active tank abilities, but that only works because those abilities are exclusive to them so essentially you're a moderate DPS with high survivability. While on ESO whatever you have access to so does everyone else, if you start having offensive or active tanking abilities then others will use them too.

I love my big bear butt Guardian Druid!

Eratas_Dualitas · July 2022

phaneub17_ESO wrote: »

WoW made tanking fun by making tanks more focused on the offensive with active tank abilities, but that only works because those abilities are exclusive to them so essentially you're a moderate DPS with high survivability. While on ESO whatever you have access to so does everyone else, if you start having offensive or active tanking abilities then others will use them too.

I love my big bear butt Guardian Druid!

Yea, I remember, it was great, we kind of have some abilities and passives with most classes for tanking.
But WoW has a threat system that ESO doesn't have so Aggro-ing the mobs are harder and annoying.

Eratas_Dualitas · July 2022

Brrrofski wrote: »

How would it make it more enjoyable?

It'd make it easier, but wouldn't that make it more boring?

Well, what would be the best?

Personally, I feel like having to spam to taunt every mobs all the time is annoying, especially when I want to taunt the ones that are behind the others and then I forget which one I taunted and I need to prevent the others to kill my friends while trying to pack them up so they're easier to kill...

Eratas_Dualitas · July 2022

Comrade_Ogilvy wrote: »

Looks like yet another 'aoe taunt' request.

No thanks.

Why? You gave no arguments.

BXR_Lonestar · July 2022

Honestly, I love playing my offtank more than I like to play my main tank because he brings more to the table in 4 man content. I have him set up as a mag tank with a healing back bar, and he can basically seamlessly do both roles for all but the hardest dungeons where its better to have a dedicated healer. I find it fun to be able to bring more to the table than just boss/ad positioning and bash mechanics, and I'm set up to give quite a few different buffs to the group - sustain, armor debuff, and extra damage. Its actually harder than standing there and just tanking, but like I said - I feel like I can bring more to the table with him and I enjoy the challenge.

My pure tank is way tankier in terms of damage reduction, but most of the time, I prefer to play my offtank.

OolongSnakeTea · July 2022

Honestly most players only need the tanks to taunt the 'heavy' or 'dangerous' adds in most pulls. You'll find that if you lock down the lil ones that it is quite sufficient. Like caltrops, or DK talons, hell even some ice moves help out a lot in this.

I play with a tank who uses rush of agony to lock things down in perfect cluster stacks, and it's just made it so much more enjoyible to clear dungeons with (and he recently got his fang lair hard mode clear!). I've played with another tank who likes to use the void-bash for this same reason - a little clunkier then rush of agony, but it provides a cool debuff!

Tanking is a learning curve, and it's at a decent spot for entry level, but it does ramp up quick like for everyone else in the veteran level. I myself tank but i'm like the Keanu of tanking, but from the Replacements. I'm OK, I get the job done, and we win the game, but man I wasn't meant to be on the tank team in the long run. I've tango'd with the Manticora on HM vSO at the end, I've earned some stripes, but dang if I have a hard time with them dragons in Sun Spire- so I just off tank in there (plus picking up the iron atros on Yoln is fun).

I feel this request falls under the learning that's missing's in ESO. That 'we need a space where players can learn what expected end game is like/ what the game devs designed end game to be like'. IE: Tanks in PVE are expected to taunt a few adds but not necessarily all ads, and tanks are expected to buff their team, debuff their targets, and crowd control trash packs with stuns/locks ect.

A good strat is to of course open the pulls with your snares (like caltrops)- or rush in and talons / ice portals- then chain in things and taunt the heavies so they don't run loose. Its a timing thing, but once you get it down, very rewarding for both the tank and the DPS, and hell the healer def loves only healing 1 target getting beaten over 3.

dmnqwk · July 2022

Tanking in ESO is very simplistic compared to every other MMO.

You hit 1 button and you have aggro for 15 seconds, no issue. Compared to the games with AoE taunts on 45 second cd's, they all have a threat mechanic.

Wow had some threat issues when it began - with tanks needing time to build stacks or threat before the DPS could open up. It solved the issue for a decade by increasing tank damage, or adding vegeance at one point, which simplified things. (I remember having to hold aggro on 7 targets with a 3 target swipe ability... good times!)

Swtor was having threat issues in 6.0, where the dps could burst 30k threat per second (with 33k dps openers) while the tanks were doing like 6k damage (with 150% bonus threat, so around half the dps!) making taunts a bit mandatory in places.

FFXIV (I have not played so I have to rely on my sister's for info here) has a stance you turn on for 10 times threat, where tanks can have openers doing more damage than the dps - so it's no issue in this game at all.

Balancing tank damage/threat has always been rough for games but the main thing in ESO is that tanking is nothing in this game because you dont really tank, you just hit a single button on a mob every 15 seconds then you can literally stand there contributing nothing if you wanted. I have 1 of each class and 3 are set up with tank specs that hit 25-30k single target, 35-40k health and full resists. I do this because it helps make tanking more fun for my randoms. My warden has proper tanking sets for more difficult content, but honestly I am old and not really planning on raiding seriously so for me, I have no problem enjoying the simple tanking you get in ESO which takes almost zero effort to do (hit pierce armor, stand still for 15 seconds... repeat).

To make it enjoyable would make it more difficult, but then not everyone wants that from the game so, realistically, there's no single method to make tanking fun for people - either it's already fun, or it's not.

Eratas_Dualitas · July 2022

Thanks to all of you, very insightful!
Very good arguments, I know what I want to do now with my tanks.

Elendir2am · July 2022

dmnqwk wrote: »

Tanking in ESO is very simplistic compared to every other MMO.

You hit 1 button and you have aggro for 15 seconds, no issue. Compared to the games with AoE taunts on 45 second cd's, they all have a threat mechanic.

Balancing tank damage/threat has always been rough for games but the main thing in ESO is that tanking is nothing in this game because you dont really tank, you just hit a single button on a mob every 15 seconds then you can literally stand there contributing nothing if you wanted. I have 1 of each class and 3 are set up with tank specs that hit 25-30k single target, 35-40k health and full resists. I do this because it helps make tanking more fun for my randoms. My warden has proper tanking sets for more difficult content, but honestly I am old and not really planning on raiding seriously so for me, I have no problem enjoying the simple tanking you get in ESO which takes almost zero effort to do (hit pierce armor, stand still for 15 seconds... repeat).

To make it enjoyable would make it more difficult, but then not everyone wants that from the game so, realistically, there's no single method to make tanking fun for people - either it's already fun, or it's not.

This is wrong. ESO tank isn't only about holding aggro. It is about CC, buffing and debuffing as well. I enjoyed tanking because CC, getting all mobs on one heap in as short as possible time.

Tanking with reliable group, for example guild mates is still fun. Problem is tanking for PUGs where you can get week group mates and you cannot do anything with it, if you are pure tank. Also, new trials force tanks to perma hold block, which decrease what you can do.

Dracan_Fontom · July 2022

One of my main complaints about tanking in ESO is how centered it is on providing DPS buffs for the group. Meta is typically sets which is meant to buff the DPS of the group. Even the meta Ultimate is used to boost DPS further. It just annoys me personally. In FFXIV, tanks do not buff DPS but instead contributes to it. They have tools to increase their dps and mitigation without sacrificing either. Here, it's almost like we have to sacrifice being able to do damage ourselves and gaining additional tools for defenses in order to buff the damage of others. At least it was like that when I was tanking trials and stuff.

DigiAngel · July 2022

Backbar Dark Convergence with a Frost Staff and Unstable Wall. Thank me later.

etchedpixels · July 2022

Eratas_Dualitas wrote: »

So here's what I'm proposing: Make taunt attacks a Cone Attack.

There are already sets for area taunting if you want. Use them wisely in veteran content however because some of that does require sensibly splitting of taunts. The AoE taunt sets are useful when shepherding newbie squishies though as you can keep a lot more off them whilst they find their feet.

DC backbar is fun although if you are running with an organized guild group getting the healer to proc it over you with a healing AoE I find works better.