Vhozek wrote: »

I didn't look much into it just saw someone explain it real quick in a video. So you light attack and you can cancel the whole animation with another action, typically a skill while the damage still goes through? Because I've been doing this since my very first day playing this game and never once did I look up what LA weaving is. All I did to discover it for myself is left click then right click quickly after, cancelling the animation with shield. I figured this would be good for cancelling your attack to protect yourself instead when you messed up and then found out the damage still went through so I started doing it with skills. I've been LA weaving for 2k+ hours without knowing what it was and I got it down to as fast as possible just by trying to simply do it faster. I don't PvP, I rarely PvE past normal dungeons. I'm super casual and typically spam threads about how overland mobs need to be buffed.
I'm sorry but who is ZoS catering to? Who are these people below even my skill gap?

TBH zos has no clue on what they're doing, this isn't gonna close the gap at all, may even make it wider tbh, to me(some may disagree) and thats fine but weaving is not animation cancelling, there is a cooldown between skills and if you hit a LA between them that is not cancelling anything, cancelling is when you barswap right after a skill or using block to cancel which on console you never see ppl block cancelling. The changes in coming update is just bad feedback and will result in nothing because the ppl that complain about not being able to weave will still not be able to weave so whats the point? If ppl that cannot do end game content now, how is lowering the damage for ppl that learned or practiced how to weave gonna help them get better at it?

A big problem with light attack weaving is there is a lot of misinformation about what it actually is. There are people who think you can input 5-10 actions in a single second and so they think it's a level of APM beyond their abilities when it's just clicking once before each ability.

When I was teaching someone to light attack weave, a common issue I found is that the person was spam clicking or trying to put too many inputs in a single GCD tick, no wonder their wrists are hurting.

That said, there are people with disabilities that do struggle to light attack weave legitimately, but I would think the solution there would be adding an official macro or something under the accessibility options or something, not nerfing it for everyone.

When it comes to the average person, they're usually incapable of judging their personal competence when it comes to tasks, such as weaving or not standing in fire.
Many high end raiders will have had teammates who suffer from Illusory Superiority (The Dunning-Kruger effect) wherein these players believe they are performing at a higher level than their teammates (regardless of statistical evidence disproving that fact) and it can be very frustrating for them because they are under the belief 'well I know how good/bad I am so why can't they?'

Often it's not actually true that one person is worse than the others, it's usually a simple fact that players want to be surrounded by others who are better than they are - because it increases their chance of success by being the worst person on the team (so when fluctuations in performance lead to them performing better, there is a significant increase in the odds of completing a task since they are the weak link the chain.)

Imposter Syndrome (wherein a person is of the belief they are worse than they actually are/incapable of completing a task they are more than qualified to perform) is the other end of the spectrum, wherein a person doubts their own ability and becomes resistant to attempting content that, in reality, they could crush.

Having spent 25 years among high end performers across a number of games, the best players are never the ones capable of performing as the best person in their group, nor is it the person who 'keeps up against all odds' but it's the person who is capable of both SHOWING and TEACHING others how to perform better - the coach.
During my time in world of warcraft I had an excellent raid leader, an elemental shaman named Sean, who was usually low on the damage rankings. This was not because he was bad at the game, nowhere near, but because he did his job which was to study the fights, help the rest of us out with positioning/cooldown usage/mechanics etc. If we replaced him with a person producing 20% more damage, we'd be a worse team because of it. We were only an average-ish team in terms of end game (our best finish was US27th in 10man) and some of us produced top 10 logs on world of logs (at least 4 of us had parsed world number 1s in our career on the site) but it was the coach/raid leader who helped us to excel and made us better.

And this brings me back to the crux of the issue - people can see numbers, they can see 'mistakes' and they can get annoyed - often the annoyance is because 'well if I can do it everyone can' except... if you have to be LUCKY to do something, then you should play the lottery more because there are tens of thousands of people out there who haven't found that bit of luck that let them discover something to improve their performance when 99% of the time it wouldn't matter.

Light Attack Weaving is a feature of the game that needs to be explained, it needs to be taught and it needs to be encouraged before the average player is going to understand why it's good - and simply put while there are a high number of excellent players out there only a very small number of them are capable of teaching others how to be better... and those are the REAL heroes in games

Vhozek wrote: »

I didn't look much into it just saw someone explain it real quick in a video. So you light attack and you can cancel the whole animation with another action, typically a skill while the damage still goes through? Because I've been doing this since my very first day playing this game and never once did I look up what LA weaving is. All I did to discover it for myself is left click then right click quickly after, cancelling the animation with shield. I figured this would be good for cancelling your attack to protect yourself instead when you messed up and then found out the damage still went through so I started doing it with skills. I've been LA weaving for 2k+ hours without knowing what it was and I got it down to as fast as possible just by trying to simply do it faster. I don't PvP, I rarely PvE past normal dungeons. I'm super casual and typically spam threads about how overland mobs need to be buffed.
I'm sorry but who is ZoS catering to? Who are these people below even my skill gap?

I think this just shows there needs to be a tutorial on it. Nowhere in the game does it teach you how to LA weave and I believe the only mention about it is in a loading screen.

CaptainVenom wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

People shouldn't be 'required' to do LA weaving... period.

Most people forget no everyone got a nice 40ms latency to easily weave. In fact I think only a minority of players live in the US near the NA servers.

Try weaving from SA or even Oceania (where latency will be present due to distance and not even the best connection could do something about it), and people maybe will understand your statement.

I sometimes play on the EU server, where my latency is 300+. I weave just as well (or badly) there as I do on NA with lag of about 60.

Lapin_Logic wrote: »

XxCaLxX wrote: »

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Vhozek wrote: »

I'm sorry but who is ZoS catering to? Who are these people below even my skill gap?

Get off your high horse. There's a huge segment of the playerbase that doesn't LA weave. You don't need to know who they are or why they play the way they do.

don't need to know but can look on forums and find out real quick who complains that they cannot do it...sorry but it's facts. Hope they're happy when they do less damage than they did before...

Firstly, Nobody will lose damage, if you read the article they are just moving damage around, Less on Dots, Flat amounts on Light/ heavy attacks, Big Boy spammables.... think Stamplar from a few patches ago, 1 dot, Then 7 Jabs for 100k DPS.

Secondly I can and do light weave.... but the game can't handle it because it forgets CC immunity is a thing, so you get a wraith Fear you, a nightblade mob CC you instantly after then a dragon knight talons you after another break free just in time for an archer to knock you back as a wraith fears you again.... and that's IF your skills actually go off and more importantly hit the mob you are aiming at instead of a LA whizzing past their ear and your force pulse hitting a rat...... and this is only in a Skyreach run... I am just Sick of Light weaving at this point and just want anything that resembles a game now, if that means mash one button then fine, I don’t play a game to Turn Pro at it or get frustrated at it, I play for Fun, Most the time we are 2 manning dungeons and arenas and im doing over 40k damage.

This is wrong according to the Update 35 combat preview post.

No where did Gilliam say that skills are getting a buff to compensate for the lost LA damage. The only thing he mentions is that classes will be looked at to ensure they all are balanced in their damage output (since some classes have skills that directly modify LA damage through skills).

"we’ll also be making a significant number of changes to item sets, passives, and buffs to ensure classes remain balanced in damage production"

In reference to the LA changes:
"While testing these adjustments internally, we’ve seen a reduction of 6–11% to overall damage,"

Everyone's damage WILL be going down, its just that its more likely to affect proficient LA weavers rather than poor LA weavers since proficient LA weavers would have more of their overall DPS coming from LA's

For those who just spam LA and nothing else this would ironically affect them the most as they would see a 50% reduction in their damage. They might want to rebind their LMB (or RT button for controller users) to their spammable skill come U35. Maybe the change will actually require them to learn a bit more about the game or face failure (gasp!) in overland content.

DoTs are also getting a DPS nerf, but those who were poor at DoT cycling will, again, see less of a DPS nerf than those that are proficient at it since overlapping or expired DoT's will have less damage impact per second.

LA weaving is absolutely necessary for me to enjoy this game. ABSOLUTELY.
I give this game a try every time they release a new big update and every time, every single time, without fail, I end up constantly dropping my head after about 30 minutes because I'm falling asleep. I HAVE to weave as fast as I possibly can in order to stay awake. I'm sorry but it's so boring and I have fallen asleep in the past like an old man ONLY to this game. It's so weird man, why would you guys make it even worse?
I can't even enjoy questing, I'm freaking spitting ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ's all the time while my fingers play the game on their own.

I don't think it's intended for players wanting to progress in Veteran raid settings. I think it's just a general sweep to bring everyone to the same gameplay.

In the current context of PC EU servers (already sluggish), part of me thinks this is going to be detrimental to enjoyment, but we'll see if I login and check it out after the implementation. For now these changes and current content delivery isn't pushing me to play, I must admit.

AzuraFan wrote: »

Vhozek wrote: »

I sometimes play on controller. I like to just tap trigger and bumper and that's it, super easy. I use middle and index finger for that. I can level all the way up just spamming those 2 buttons all day and running circles around an enemy. It's so braindead.
If there's a red circle, just stop moving but keep spamming RT > RB and then continue. I had to make the circles black so I can't see them and it made battles slightly more interesting but turns out that taking damage is still not enough to make the game fun.

I'm glad it's super easy for you. It's not for me, with my bum wrists. Also, I have small hands (I'm female), so I have more reaching to do with my fingers, which causes strain. And it's not possible for me to spam anything due to my wrist limitations.

If you're bored with ESO because it's too easy for your god-like powers, maybe you should try another game. Not being snarky here, but if a game is boring me, I generally move on.

You can also try a controller with digital trigger and bumper. That way you can just squeeze your index and middle finger together on top of the gap between both buttons, and then LA weave with basically no effort. I have carpal tunnel and tendonitis from being a field worker and playing super smash bros Melee and digital trigger buttons are better for your hands.

Vhozek wrote: »

You can also try a controller with digital trigger and bumper. That way you can just squeeze your index and middle finger together on top of the gap between both buttons, and then LA weave with basically no effort. I have carpal tunnel and tendonitis from being a field worker and playing super smash bros Melee and digital trigger buttons are better for your hands.

I'll look into it.

I have news for y'all,

I born in 91, I saw the banking crash and I played shooter games online all the time back then, I wasn't even aware there is words for it these stuff.

I played Delta Force black hawk down online in my youth and learned Left/Right Leaning aiming and writing "ns" (as in nice shot) was a permanent ban reason in many servers.

Wait until you learn even more strange things in video gaming. There is no age or experience for this, you can learn things at any time. And that is the beauty of video gaming = learn something all the time. good or bad.

JMadFour wrote: »

This entire thread is cap.

None of you "just discovered LA weaving today after 600 million bajillion hours playing".

[snip]

*Edit* I've always known what LA weaving is, and I do it. It's a stupid bug-turned-"mechanic" because ZOS never figured out how to fix it. it makes your character look like it is having a seizure, and it doesn't bother me if ZOS makes it less important than it is. I don't like it to begin with, the only reason I do it is because I have to.

No, I knew that the name of the mechanic existed and I thought it had something to do with spacing your light attacks because of the "weaving" part so I just didn't care since the game is so easy. All I knew is that you can spam 2 buttons all day to take down mobs faster. That's all I've been doing for 2000 hours.

[edited to remove quote]

ADarklore wrote: »

People shouldn't be 'required' to do LA weaving... period. People that LA weave will still do better than those who don't, however, it won't be AS great as it is now. You are still being rewarded for your extra effort, but not nearly as much as it is now. All the 'people should be taught how to LA weave' comments are pointless because not everyone WANTS to LA weave. If people wanted to 'get gud' they would do a lot more research in how to improve, but the fact remains that many many people are OK with where they are. So ZOS is basically making it so these people don't have to get gud, but they'll be more effective now since they won't be losing damage by not reapplying their dots as frequently as they should.

So in essence, players the LA weaving is a roughly 10% nerf to vet LA weaving... but should result in a better playing experience overall because now bad players will have more DPS with their dots lasting longer because they don't want to bar swap and reapply them after xx seconds. At least, I hope that's how it works out.

Yes you have two bars - and you are actually "teached to uses both" ?
Idk what you wanna tell us but the majority of bad dungeon player i found are just spamming LAßs and those people gonna get nerfed.