Coral Riptide granted its maximum potential at 33% stamina now.

What_In_Tarnation · May 2022

Like you know, if they change bahsei like coral riptide, then you don't need to running your resource dangerously low like the devs said in their own patch notes.

Should Bahsei also getting changed like coral riptide? Or is there any reason not to do it?

Dracane · May 2022

I can say that Riptide outperforms Bahsei at any rate. I tested it with below 10% magicka (which is 10% damage from Bahsei, meaning the full 12% it promises is essentially impossible to gain) And Riptide deals more damage at 30% stamina than Bahsei. Yes, Bahsei also needs such a limit.

The developers clearly made an error here when designing Riptide. They probably balanced around the 12% of Bahsei and maybe disregarded that the 760 (or so) damage Riptide gives, can scale up heavily with buffs and passives. Riptide should have been balanced around the realistic 10% Bahsei grants.I recommend 680 spell/weapon damage instead.

Iron_Warrior · May 2022

What_In_Tarnation wrote: »

Should Bahsei also getting changed like coral riptide? Or is there any reason not to do it?

There IS a reason for that. You only use your mag pool for your abilities. But you use your stam pool for your abilities AND dodging, blocking, breaking free and sprinting. You can drop to 0% percent magicka and still do these defensive actions with your stam pool, but if you drop to 0% stamina you are defenseless.

Joosef_Kivikilpi · May 2022

Iron_Warrior wrote: »

What_In_Tarnation wrote: »

Should Bahsei also getting changed like coral riptide? Or is there any reason not to do it?

There IS a reason for that. You only use your mag pool for your abilities. But you use your stam pool for your abilities AND dodging, blocking, breaking free and sprinting. You can drop to 0% percent magicka and still do these defensive actions with your stam pool, but if you drop to 0% stamina you are defenseless.

"Annulment, Sun Shield, Empowered Ward, Igneous Shield has entered the chat*

Razorruk · May 2022

Joosef_Kivikilpi wrote: »

Iron_Warrior wrote: »

What_In_Tarnation wrote: »

Should Bahsei also getting changed like coral riptide? Or is there any reason not to do it?

There IS a reason for that. You only use your mag pool for your abilities. But you use your stam pool for your abilities AND dodging, blocking, breaking free and sprinting. You can drop to 0% percent magicka and still do these defensive actions with your stam pool, but if you drop to 0% stamina you are defenseless.

"Annulment, Sun Shield, Empowered Ward, Igneous Shield has entered the chat*

Not comparable - these abilities aren't used by competent endgame DDs to mitigate damage.

Mr_Stach · May 2022

Even on Stam builds, Mag is still super important, most utility skills do not have a Stam Cost so nuking your Mag is never a good idea.

Also if you happen to be running Ice Staff, you block with Magicka..... just a side note

Iron_Warrior · May 2022

Joosef_Kivikilpi wrote: »

Iron_Warrior wrote: »

What_In_Tarnation wrote: »

Should Bahsei also getting changed like coral riptide? Or is there any reason not to do it?

There IS a reason for that. You only use your mag pool for your abilities. But you use your stam pool for your abilities AND dodging, blocking, breaking free and sprinting. You can drop to 0% percent magicka and still do these defensive actions with your stam pool, but if you drop to 0% stamina you are defenseless.

"Annulment, Sun Shield, Empowered Ward, Igneous Shield has entered the chat*

All of them are abilities, you can't roll dodge or break free using sun shield, you need stam for that. Also since hybridization is now a thing you can use stamina defensive abilities like vigor or bone shield on a mag toon.

Joosef_Kivikilpi · May 2022

Razorruk wrote: »

Joosef_Kivikilpi wrote: »

Iron_Warrior wrote: »

What_In_Tarnation wrote: »

Should Bahsei also getting changed like coral riptide? Or is there any reason not to do it?

There IS a reason for that. You only use your mag pool for your abilities. But you use your stam pool for your abilities AND dodging, blocking, breaking free and sprinting. You can drop to 0% percent magicka and still do these defensive actions with your stam pool, but if you drop to 0% stamina you are defenseless.

"Annulment, Sun Shield, Empowered Ward, Igneous Shield has entered the chat*

Not comparable - these abilities aren't used by competent endgame DDs to mitigate damage.

I understand that. My point is bringing up the issue that some adjustments can be made by Damage Dealers for survivability if they gave Riptide the same treatment as Bahsei where it scales to 0% for the max damage pretty much, which is useless. But since this is the argument on the inverse side, Bahsei should be buffed up to Riptide standard of 33% resources.

Dracane · May 2022

In the end, this is only the 100th time a stamina version of a set is straight up superior than the magicka version. Happens every time there is a mirror version.

WrathOfInnos · May 2022

Razorruk wrote: »

Joosef_Kivikilpi wrote: »

Iron_Warrior wrote: »

What_In_Tarnation wrote: »

Should Bahsei also getting changed like coral riptide? Or is there any reason not to do it?

There IS a reason for that. You only use your mag pool for your abilities. But you use your stam pool for your abilities AND dodging, blocking, breaking free and sprinting. You can drop to 0% percent magicka and still do these defensive actions with your stam pool, but if you drop to 0% stamina you are defenseless.

"Annulment, Sun Shield, Empowered Ward, Igneous Shield has entered the chat*

Not comparable - these abilities aren't used by competent endgame DDs to mitigate damage.

Lol, disagree. There are plenty of scenarios where competent endgame DDs slot a shield. Keeping Magicka low for Bahsei is a risk defensively, but not as severe as keeping stamina too low to block or dodge.

I could see Bahsei getting a similar low cap to reach max effectiveness, but maybe something like 20% mag to hit 12% damage. It is annoying that reaching the "12%" cap is not possible. Then again, I dislike the entire concept of Bahsei (low sustain gives higher damage), so I would not be sad to see it fade into obscurity. Hopefully replaced with sets like Rele, Siroria or Whorl of Depths, not another low resource set.

skinnycheeks · May 2022

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

Razorruk wrote: »

Joosef_Kivikilpi wrote: »

Iron_Warrior wrote: »

What_In_Tarnation wrote: »

Should Bahsei also getting changed like coral riptide? Or is there any reason not to do it?

There IS a reason for that. You only use your mag pool for your abilities. But you use your stam pool for your abilities AND dodging, blocking, breaking free and sprinting. You can drop to 0% percent magicka and still do these defensive actions with your stam pool, but if you drop to 0% stamina you are defenseless.

"Annulment, Sun Shield, Empowered Ward, Igneous Shield has entered the chat*

Not comparable - these abilities aren't used by competent endgame DDs to mitigate damage.

Lol, disagree. There are plenty of scenarios where competent endgame DDs slot a shield. Keeping Magicka low for Bahsei is a risk defensively, but not as severe as keeping stamina too low to block or dodge.

I could see Bahsei getting a similar low cap to reach max effectiveness, but maybe something like 20% mag to hit 12% damage. It is annoying that reaching the "12%" cap is not possible. Then again, I dislike the entire concept of Bahsei (low sustain gives higher damage), so I would not be sad to see it fade into obscurity. Hopefully replaced with sets like Rele, Siroria or Whorl of Depths, not another low resource set.

yep, agreed here. I gave that as a point of feedback as well, that i'd like to see bahsei cap out at a certain %. but 33% for a 12% boost w/ magicka does feel a little too easy. 15%ish seems okay though since you could at least actually hit the cap in that case.