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Please stop to complain about everything. We have to push ZOS fix performance instead ask to nerfall
UntouchableHunter
✭✭✭✭
Sorry guys but a lot of people here asking to:
Nerf heals
Nerf werewolf
Nerf vamp stage 3
Nerf ball groups
Nerf solo players
Nerf tanks
Nerf nerf nerf nerf
I play this game since 2016 and I still "work on it" to try be S tier one day. But the learning curve in pvp is so huge that it is impossible a casual player be really good in pvp and pve in the same time.
I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable players. But I guaranty you those players didn't come from nowhere. They play for years. You can get the same race, class, sets everything and you won't be able to do the same before years of dedication.
So please try to understand how this players got there before ask to nerf everything.
If we have only one build in the game that makes only 1k damage, this players will find a away to still being better than you and they will be.
If you understand this you will have better discussions n here.
And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
Just my thoughts
Edited by UntouchableHunter on April 23, 2022 3:39PM Nerf heals
Nerf werewolf
Nerf vamp stage 3
Nerf ball groups
Nerf solo players
Nerf tanks
Nerf nerf nerf nerf
I play this game since 2016 and I still "work on it" to try be S tier one day. But the learning curve in pvp is so huge that it is impossible a casual player be really good in pvp and pve in the same time.
I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable players. But I guaranty you those players didn't come from nowhere. They play for years. You can get the same race, class, sets everything and you won't be able to do the same before years of dedication.
So please try to understand how this players got there before ask to nerf everything.
If we have only one build in the game that makes only 1k damage, this players will find a away to still being better than you and they will be.
If you understand this you will have better discussions n here.
And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
Just my thoughts
9
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xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
And when the unkillable players fight each other? Walking away from yet another stalemated Cyro fight, or yet another low scoring BG that drags out to timer... stall metas drive away players of every skill level.UntouchableHunter wrote: »I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable playersPC/NA || CP/Cyro || RIP soft caps9 -
Stamicka✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think people asking for balance adjustments is completely fine. Even if they magically fixed every performance issue right now, I would still be unhappy with PvP because the time to kill is way too high and sets like Dark Convergence exist. Many of the "nerf" threads you see could very well be from skilled players.JaeyL
PC NA and Xbox NA7 -
Psiion✭✭✭✭Greetings,
We would like to leave a reminder after removing a few posts. We understand everyone has differing opinions, and debates and disagreements are a natural occurrence on a Video Game Forum, however, Baiting, mocking, or otherwise inciting conflict on the forums is never acceptable.
Please keep the Community Rules in mind moving forward.0 -
taugrim✭✭✭✭✭UntouchableHunter wrote: »And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
So there are 2 things that I want to point out:
1. there are 0 MMORPGs in-market today where the game can gracefully handle high numbers of PVP players (e.g. over 100) in the same area without meaningful performance degradation. So you're expecting / asking ZoS to fix a problem that is inherently challenging to fix
2. ZoS may be able to throw server capacity at this problem to improve performance, but that may not be economically viable / attractive to them
Regarding #2, ESO PVP content creators have pointed out that performance in Cyrodiil does improve around certain events, so boosting server capacity outside of events is something they could do. If ZoS isn't doing that outside of events, you have to wonder why.
Beyond all the above, you may not care about balance, but I care about balance more than anything. Crappy balance across classes and poor itemization such as at-launch Hrothgar's Chill and Dark Convergence drive PVP players away. The upcoming changes are going to worsen balance broadly, not improve it.PC | NA | CP 2.3k- Active: Dark Elf Stamina Templar | Dark Elf Stamina Arcanist | Dark Elf Stamina Necromancer
- Inactive: Nord Stamina Warden | Orc Stamina Sorceror | Nord Stamina Nightblade | Nord Stamina Dragonknight
BUILDS- Stamina Warden Brawler PVP: Full Guide / Videos | Forum Discussion
- Ankle Biters | Legends Syndicate (PVP) | Moonlit Shenanigans | Song of Broken Pines (PVP) | Ulfhednar (PVP)
4 -
WeylandLabs✭✭✭✭✭UntouchableHunter wrote: »Sorry guys but a lot of people here asking to:
Nerf heals
Nerf werewolf
Nerf vamp stage 3
Nerf ball groups
Nerf solo players
Nerf tanks
Nerf nerf nerf nerf
I play this game since 2016 and I still "work on it" to try be S tier one day. But the learning curve in pvp is so huge that it is impossible a casual player be really good in pvp and pve in the same time.
I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable players. But I guaranty you those players didn't come from nowhere. They play for years. You can get the same race, class, sets everything and you won't be able to do the same before years of dedication.
So please try to understand how this players got there before ask to nerf everything.
If we have only one build in the game that makes only 1k damage, this players will find a away to still being better than you and they will be.
If you understand this you will have better discussions n here.
And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
Just my thoughts
Its crazy right ! so Toxic ! but couldn't agree more its like they think its a sport and forgot to have fun...0 -
UntouchableHunter✭✭✭✭xylena_lazarow wrote: »
And when the unkillable players fight each other? Walking away from yet another stalemated Cyro fight, or yet another low scoring BG that drags out to timer... stall metas drive away players of every skill level.UntouchableHunter wrote: »I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable players
I guarantee you that this same player can't will a tournament duel.
The same way good players can have a similar build and nobody kill each other. Bar players with bad builds can fight forever without kill each other.0 -
UntouchableHunter✭✭✭✭I think people asking for balance adjustments is completely fine. Even if they magically fixed every performance issue right now, I would still be unhappy with PvP because the time to kill is way too high and sets like Dark Convergence exist. Many of the "nerf" threads you see could very well be from skilled players.
What I see is some players happy only theirs builds are good and complain alot about other builds and yes most of them are skilled players
0 -
UntouchableHunter✭✭✭✭UntouchableHunter wrote: »And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
So there are 2 things that I want to point out:
1. there are 0 MMORPGs in-market today where the game can gracefully handle high numbers of PVP players (e.g. over 100) in the same area without meaningful performance degradation. So you're expecting / asking ZoS to fix a problem that is inherently challenging to fix
2. ZoS may be able to throw server capacity at this problem to improve performance, but that may not be economically viable / attractive to them
Regarding #2, ESO PVP content creators have pointed out that performance in Cyrodiil does improve around certain events, so boosting server capacity outside of events is something they could do. If ZoS isn't doing that outside of events, you have to wonder why.
Beyond all the above, you may not care about balance, but I care about balance more than anything. Crappy balance across classes and poor itemization such as at-launch Hrothgar's Chill and Dark Convergence drive PVP players away. The upcoming changes are going to worsen balance broadly, not improve it.
I care about balance, but if I can't fire my skill doesn't matter the balance.2 -
neferpitou73✭✭✭✭✭
✭UntouchableHunter wrote: »And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
So there are 2 things that I want to point out:
1. there are 0 MMORPGs in-market today where the game can gracefully handle high numbers of PVP players (e.g. over 100) in the same area without meaningful performance degradation. So you're expecting / asking ZoS to fix a problem that is inherently challenging to fix
2. ZoS may be able to throw server capacity at this problem to improve performance, but that may not be economically viable / attractive to them
Regarding #2, ESO PVP content creators have pointed out that performance in Cyrodiil does improve around certain events, so boosting server capacity outside of events is something they could do. If ZoS isn't doing that outside of events, you have to wonder why.
Beyond all the above, you may not care about balance, but I care about balance more than anything. Crappy balance across classes and poor itemization such as at-launch Hrothgar's Chill and Dark Convergence drive PVP players away. The upcoming changes are going to worsen balance broadly, not improve it.
I would buy that if performance wasn't taking exponentially. It's been much better in the past when pop caps were higher. So this is clearly something on their end.
2 -
WordsOfPower✭✭✭UntouchableHunter wrote: »Sorry guys but a lot of people here asking to:
Nerf heals
Nerf werewolf
Nerf vamp stage 3
Nerf ball groups
Nerf solo players
Nerf tanks
Nerf nerf nerf nerf
I play this game since 2016 and I still "work on it" to try be S tier one day. But the learning curve in pvp is so huge that it is impossible a casual player be really good in pvp and pve in the same time.
I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable players. But I guaranty you those players didn't come from nowhere. They play for years. You can get the same race, class, sets everything and you won't be able to do the same before years of dedication.
So please try to understand how this players got there before ask to nerf everything.
If we have only one build in the game that makes only 1k damage, this players will find a away to still being better than you and they will be.
If you understand this you will have better discussions n here.
And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
Just my thoughts
Reinstatement of DM queue is more important to me even above performance
There can be lag in BGs and even overland but not on the level of Cyro.
For me, Cyro has fundamental problems from day 1 that encourages zerging and exploits, and unless they totally change that, I'm not interested.
But I'm not gonna wait 1-2 years with baited breath for performance fixes that might not even happen.
I'm gonna keep stating my priorities, as is my prerogative.
When the majority stay silent, real change cannot ensue.2 -
taugrim✭✭✭✭✭I think people asking for balance adjustments is completely fine. Even if they magically fixed every performance issue right now, I would still be unhappy with PvP because the time to kill is way too high and sets like Dark Convergence exist. Many of the "nerf" threads you see could very well be from skilled players.
👏 nailed itneferpitou73 wrote: »UntouchableHunter wrote: »And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
So there are 2 things that I want to point out:
1. there are 0 MMORPGs in-market today where the game can gracefully handle high numbers of PVP players (e.g. over 100) in the same area without meaningful performance degradation. So you're expecting / asking ZoS to fix a problem that is inherently challenging to fix
2. ZoS may be able to throw server capacity at this problem to improve performance, but that may not be economically viable / attractive to them
Regarding #2, ESO PVP content creators have pointed out that performance in Cyrodiil does improve around certain events, so boosting server capacity outside of events is something they could do. If ZoS isn't doing that outside of events, you have to wonder why.
Beyond all the above, you may not care about balance, but I care about balance more than anything. Crappy balance across classes and poor itemization such as at-launch Hrothgar's Chill and Dark Convergence drive PVP players away. The upcoming changes are going to worsen balance broadly, not improve it.
I would buy that if performance wasn't taking exponentially. It's been much better in the past when pop caps were higher. So this is clearly something on their end.
Sounds like they are rearchitecting the server. Hopefully that meaningfully helps.ZOS_MattFiror wrote: »In short – just like we did for the client a year or so back when we introduced multithreaded rendering to increase client frame rates – we are going to rearchitect our server. The version of ESO in 2022 is many magnitudes larger and more complex than the ESO that launched in 2014. So, in order to give everyone a good play experience in high-intensity situations like PvP and Trials, we need to essentially rewrite some of the foundational server code to account for it. This should dramatically increase server performance, but obviously we will need to test and evaluate as we go along.
We’ve been planning this for the last quarter and we’re starting work on it right now. But, as you can imagine, changing the fundamentals of a huge live game such as ESO is a delicate and multi-stepped process, so expect this to take up much of 2022. Much of the early work is going to happen behind the scenes and we are definitely not going to rush it. A re-architecture of this magnitude will require the entire game to be re-tested and evaluated, as this particular code is the foundation on which the game is built. It will take tons of QA and testing time as well, and I’m sure that when the time comes, we’ll do as large a test as we can on the PTS.
In the meantime, we’ll consider additional ways to keep Cyrodiil and Battlegrounds interesting and exciting (for example, potentially special rulesets or weekend events) and will continue to work on bug fixes affecting combat, but we won’t be adding any new features to PvP until the work mentioned above is complete. Doing so would not only prolong the fixes we want to implement but would also exacerbate the issue of poor performance.
We completely understand the frustration many of you are feeling, especially with lack of information about our PvP plans. This was a huge decision to make and we needed to make sure we had exhausted all other possibilities before announcing this. Thanks for bearing with us, and we will give you periodic updates about the re-architecture progress over the course of the year.PC | NA | CP 2.3k- Active: Dark Elf Stamina Templar | Dark Elf Stamina Arcanist | Dark Elf Stamina Necromancer
- Inactive: Nord Stamina Warden | Orc Stamina Sorceror | Nord Stamina Nightblade | Nord Stamina Dragonknight
BUILDS- Stamina Warden Brawler PVP: Full Guide / Videos | Forum Discussion
- Ankle Biters | Legends Syndicate (PVP) | Moonlit Shenanigans | Song of Broken Pines (PVP) | Ulfhednar (PVP)
1 -
JanTanhide✭✭✭✭✭
✭Agree with OP. It's never going to change. We have, in my opinion, maybe 3% of the player base living on the ESO Forum. Of those 3% I would guess 95% are PVP players.
PVP players live here and post for balance changes constantly. Some are obviously needed (Arctic blast for example) and often ZOS goes above and beyond to appease the PVP community which results in massive nerfs or just crazy changes to the game.
From CP to skills to racial passives it's usually in the name of "Balance" for PVP. If you haven't seen what ZOS has done to Arctic Blast on the PTS have a look. It's been made even worse than it is now on Live.
CP is getting nerfed yet again in the upcoming High Isle update. I think this nerf is another "PVE" nerf but soon the CP system will be a novelty use item. How many more nerfs to so much in game can the Player base take?
I've been here since 2014 and the game has changed so much. Some of it good, some of it not good in my opinion.
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Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Yeah. Let’s focus on just fixing performance so that MDK’s can murder us all faster.4 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
I don't think anyone is talking about dueling tournaments, but I would agree that on PC/NA Cyro, evenly matched fights at any scale or skill level will frequently stalemate. Open world builds and playstyles already tend towards tanky/defensive, and the current metagame gives much more agency to the players trying to stall the fight than the players trying to end it. I think it would be positive for them to nerf stalling and buff killing.UntouchableHunter wrote: »I guarantee you that this same player can't will a tournament duel. The same way good players can have a similar build and nobody kill each other. Bar players with bad builds can fight forever without kill each other.PC/NA || CP/Cyro || RIP soft caps0 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yeah. Let’s focus on just fixing performance so that MDK’s can murder us all faster.
Yeah. Every single time when one class gets OP there is someone saying "no more nerfs, focus on performance" and usually he plays that OP class.
ZOS promised us that this time we will get more buffs than nerfs and they kept their word.
They have buffed useless skills so nobody will use them anyway because they are still slot waste, while almost not touching mDK at all and barely touching magplar.
Performance would be nice but it's a fairytale, I prefer balance
Say no to Toxic Casuals!
I am doing my best, but I am not a native speaker, sorry.
"Difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including A Realm Reborn-tier overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver&Gold as a "you think you do but you don't"-tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game." - @AlexanderDeLarge2 -
divnyi✭✭✭✭✭
✭UntouchableHunter wrote: »I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable players. But I guaranty you those players didn't come from nowhere. They play for years. You can get the same race, class, sets everything and you won't be able to do the same before years of dedication.
The same players were perfectly killable with less damage mitigation via battle spirit.
Everything was killable before dot normalisation patch.
Balance discussions in PTS happen because devs change the balance.
Lots of the times new patches go off from PTS with all the issues and bugs being pointed out, as well as potential fixes.
I'd really like them to use PTS to fix bugs instead of testing on the live server, and fixing that months after the release.2 -
MEBengalsFan2001✭✭✭✭✭UntouchableHunter wrote: »Sorry guys but a lot of people here asking to:
Nerf heals
Nerf werewolf
Nerf vamp stage 3
Nerf ball groups
Nerf solo players
Nerf tanks
Nerf nerf nerf nerf
I play this game since 2016 and I still "work on it" to try be S tier one day. But the learning curve in pvp is so huge that it is impossible a casual player be really good in pvp and pve in the same time.
I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable players. But I guaranty you those players didn't come from nowhere. They play for years. You can get the same race, class, sets everything and you won't be able to do the same before years of dedication.
So please try to understand how this players got there before ask to nerf everything.
If we have only one build in the game that makes only 1k damage, this players will find a away to still being better than you and they will be.
If you understand this you will have better discussions n here.
And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
Just my thoughts
Using exploits to stay alive isn't skill, its cheating. The devs first need to fix the game so players cannot exploit gear, skills, CP etc... to become god like. Secondly, it isn't about nerfing it is about adjusting things to be more inline with one another.
I personally would like the devs to simply fix the game so players cannot stack the same HoT or abuse exploits. Fixing these two items would greatly improve PVP and PVE.
Than the devs can go back to balancing the game out.1 -
Commandment✭✭✭MEBengalsFan2001 wrote: »UntouchableHunter wrote: »Sorry guys but a lot of people here asking to:
Nerf heals
Nerf werewolf
Nerf vamp stage 3
Nerf ball groups
Nerf solo players
Nerf tanks
Nerf nerf nerf nerf
I play this game since 2016 and I still "work on it" to try be S tier one day. But the learning curve in pvp is so huge that it is impossible a casual player be really good in pvp and pve in the same time.
I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable players. But I guaranty you those players didn't come from nowhere. They play for years. You can get the same race, class, sets everything and you won't be able to do the same before years of dedication.
So please try to understand how this players got there before ask to nerf everything.
If we have only one build in the game that makes only 1k damage, this players will find a away to still being better than you and they will be.
If you understand this you will have better discussions n here.
And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
Just my thoughts
Using exploits to stay alive isn't skill, its cheating. The devs first need to fix the game so players cannot exploit gear, skills, CP etc... to become god like. Secondly, it isn't about nerfing it is about adjusting things to be more inline with one another.
I personally would like the devs to simply fix the game so players cannot stack the same HoT or abuse exploits. Fixing these two items would greatly improve PVP and PVE.
Than the devs can go back to balancing the game out.
So a person being able to stack x of this because he was able to gather a group is bad.. Hmmm. We should just ban teaming up in a MMORPG in general. It worked for ZOS when they did it for BG's. Play with friends? I don't think so. It's all about solo players like me. Forget purge, I just want them to not go against my build!0 -
UntouchableHunter✭✭✭✭MEBengalsFan2001 wrote: »UntouchableHunter wrote: »Sorry guys but a lot of people here asking to:
Nerf heals
Nerf werewolf
Nerf vamp stage 3
Nerf ball groups
Nerf solo players
Nerf tanks
Nerf nerf nerf nerf
I play this game since 2016 and I still "work on it" to try be S tier one day. But the learning curve in pvp is so huge that it is impossible a casual player be really good in pvp and pve in the same time.
I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable players. But I guaranty you those players didn't come from nowhere. They play for years. You can get the same race, class, sets everything and you won't be able to do the same before years of dedication.
So please try to understand how this players got there before ask to nerf everything.
If we have only one build in the game that makes only 1k damage, this players will find a away to still being better than you and they will be.
If you understand this you will have better discussions n here.
And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
Just my thoughts
Using exploits to stay alive isn't skill, its cheating. The devs first need to fix the game so players cannot exploit gear, skills, CP etc... to become god like. Secondly, it isn't about nerfing it is about adjusting things to be more inline with one another.
I personally would like the devs to simply fix the game so players cannot stack the same HoT or abuse exploits. Fixing these two items would greatly improve PVP and PVE.
Than the devs can go back to balancing the game out.
Every change they make we have a new unbalanced situation. And this will never end.
But at least we should play with a good performance.0 -
MEBengalsFan2001✭✭✭✭✭Commandment wrote: »MEBengalsFan2001 wrote: »UntouchableHunter wrote: »Sorry guys but a lot of people here asking to:
Nerf heals
Nerf werewolf
Nerf vamp stage 3
Nerf ball groups
Nerf solo players
Nerf tanks
Nerf nerf nerf nerf
I play this game since 2016 and I still "work on it" to try be S tier one day. But the learning curve in pvp is so huge that it is impossible a casual player be really good in pvp and pve in the same time.
I'm seeing people here complaining about unkillable players. But I guaranty you those players didn't come from nowhere. They play for years. You can get the same race, class, sets everything and you won't be able to do the same before years of dedication.
So please try to understand how this players got there before ask to nerf everything.
If we have only one build in the game that makes only 1k damage, this players will find a away to still being better than you and they will be.
If you understand this you will have better discussions n here.
And the most important, we have to make ZOS keep us updated about the pvp performance and where they are in the "work on it"
Just my thoughts
Using exploits to stay alive isn't skill, its cheating. The devs first need to fix the game so players cannot exploit gear, skills, CP etc... to become god like. Secondly, it isn't about nerfing it is about adjusting things to be more inline with one another.
I personally would like the devs to simply fix the game so players cannot stack the same HoT or abuse exploits. Fixing these two items would greatly improve PVP and PVE.
Than the devs can go back to balancing the game out.
So a person being able to stack x of this because he was able to gather a group is bad.. Hmmm. We should just ban teaming up in a MMORPG in general. It worked for ZOS when they did it for BG's. Play with friends? I don't think so. It's all about solo players like me. Forget purge, I just want them to not go against my build!
I run in 12 man groups regularly and I find that having 2-3 healers with one or two other players running Radiant Regen can keep a group fully healed without really running other heals, very sad that the game acts like that. Only having one radiant regen on a player is fair and would help balance out pve and pvp. Right now you can have 3-5 regen run at the same time. Instead if you get hit by the same skill it should simply refresh the HoT timer, not add another Radiant regen HoT.
1 -
WordsOfPower✭✭✭Agreed. Anyone defending more than one instance of Regen on a player is just asking for the skill ceiling to meet the floor0
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Didgerion✭✭✭✭✭
✭They are working on performance but it is a long shot. They keep us updated about it btw, read their posts, here it is if you missed it: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/595442/eso-pvp-update-january-2022/p1
But in meanwhile the game is badly unbalanced which hurts it.
Currently there are certain builds that are overperforming, which of course is rewarding for the authors of the build.
But the problem is it is getting adopted quite quickly especially by strong players and we are starting to see all strong players running same build leaving new players in dilemma when they get to face them.
Just look, at this "nerf magdk" post here:https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/603277/so-where-are-the-mdk-nerfs/p1
forget the numbers just look at how many DKs are in the BG of all the classes, well that's the effected of the [un]balance my friend. You will start to see the same build adopted by all players and the ones that don't jump ships will just quit when it becomes unbearable.
1