PVP Kiting

winged_tortoise · January 2022

What buttons do you use to kite when PvPing? The ‘W’, ‘A’ and ‘D’ keys? Buttons on your mouse?

I’m finding it challenging to simultaneously kite and use abilities. Keeping my fingers pressed on a movement key and selecting abilities is mechanically difficult.

Is that difficulty something I just need to get used to or do you do something different like use buttons on your mouse to move and keys on the keyboard for abilities?

Thanks!!

Casul · January 2022

I use my left analog stick.

Haha, I tried keyboard when I swapped over but found I had issues with movement and casting simultaneously. I wish gamepad had higher rotation sensitivity though.

VaranisArano · January 2022

What do you do for kiting in PVE? Do you stand still or do you circle around the boss as you fight?

I tend to circle clockwise in PVE using W+A.

In PVP, I'll strafe left and right with W+A or W+D. The big difference in Cyrodiil and BGs is there are frequently obstacles to maneuver around. If I'm defending myself, I want an obstacle covering at least one flank. If I'm attacking, I want to swing wide of obstacles so I get as many clear shots as I can without the enemy using line of sight to block attacks. That helps me determine where I need to go.

Now, admittedly, I don't do a whole lot of PVP dueling or open field 1v1 fights. That might be a friendly way for you to practice movement, if you have a friend who's willing to practice with you.

xDeusEJRx · January 2022

I use the analog sticks on my controller so not that big a deal. Usually I will strafe the opposite direction my enemies move then cast an ability once they don't have direct line of sight on me. Or what I do is: Jump, cast ability mid air, then speed buff to keep momentum and keep up kiting.
I'm not sure how those tips might translate to mouse and keyboard, but I hope it helps

Vevvev · January 2022

I'm always strafing around people holding either A or D. It's become so engrained in my muscle memory I even do it in PvE, which is a problem if you're a DPS or Tank being told to stay still and not move lol. It is a good tactic though because in melee it really helps with causing some enemy attacks to miss like Streak and other conal based AoEs that require aiming instead of ESO's sudo tab targeting.

winged_tortoise · January 2022

Thanks!

In answer to what do I do in PvE, in PvE my kiting is very minimal and un sophisticated. Mostly I just use ‘W’ and ‘S’ and have them mapped to the two buttons on my mouse.

PvP is different. I want to kite around difficult terrain to lose LOS and still want to keep up my buffs and HOTs.

I’m not sure if I need to get good at pressing multiple keys at once or if I just need to take my hand of the movement keys for a moment while I tap the ability keys.

Jierdanit · January 2022

I have my skills on Q,E,3,4,5,R so i can use all my skills and still always have my middle finger on 'W' so I am able to move and LOS the entire time while fighting.

worrallj · January 2022

I do keyboard. Middle finger on W for moving, and index or ring hits 1-4 for skills.

divnyi · January 2022

Jierdanit wrote: »

I have my skills on Q,E,3,4,5,R so i can use all my skills and still always have my middle finger on 'W' so I am able to move and LOS the entire time while fighting.

Same but also remapped winkey to be skill 1. So Winkey/1, 2, 3, Q, E. Ulti at 4.

Larcomar · January 2022

When i first started I had the same problem. Ive got an absolutely ancient two button mouse not one of these swanky gaming mice. I found the key was to map your main attack to mouse 2, so you could weave and move at the same time. And ofc you can map your mouse wheel into three different actions - its good for block, dodge, buffs etc

For the rest, I find the arrow keys much easier for movement- far less likely for your fingers to get lost. There are enough buttons around it to cover the rest - I use control for sprint, O for bar swap and the littl block of the delete, end, page down keys for abilities. Anythign else goes on the number pad.

Fennwitty · January 2022

I use a gamepad most of the time, but doesn't moving the mouse cursor at the same time as pressing the keyboard directional affect your character's actual movement.

If you don't touch the mouse, WASD is just straight lines. But if you move the mouse at the same time your character performs curving movements.

Or did I just wake up too short a time ago?

VaranisArano · January 2022

Fennwitty wrote: »

I use a gamepad most of the time, but doesn't moving the mouse cursor at the same time as pressing the keyboard directional affect your character's actual movement.

If you don't touch the mouse, WASD is just straight lines. But if you move the mouse at the same time your character performs curving movements.

Or did I just wake up too short a time ago?

Yes. In PVP, I'm typically centering my reticle on the opponent, so my strafing is curved.

exeeter702 · January 2022

Larcomar wrote: »

When i first started I had the same problem. Ive got an absolutely ancient two button mouse not one of these swanky gaming mice. I found the key was to map your main attack to mouse 2, so you could weave and move at the same time. And ofc you can map your mouse wheel into three different actions - its good for block, dodge, buffs etc

For the rest, I find the arrow keys much easier for movement- far less likely for your fingers to get lost. There are enough buttons around it to cover the rest - I use control for sprint, O for bar swap and the littl block of the delete, end, page down keys for abilities. Anythign else goes on the number pad.

The only people that believe gaming mice with 8+ buttons are objectively superior are those that have never played mmos back when said mice were extremely rare or they are newer players and never learned normal key bindings.

Just want to throw that out there.

winged_tortoise · February 2022

I agree with you that lots of buttons on mice isn’t helpful and yet I still want to know how other people do it.

At this point I’m resigned to the fact that I’m just going to have to do what everyone else does, train myself to kite and cast at the same time. I have been practicing by soloing easier world bosses. So far it feels very awkward to keep up my buffs, kite and stay alive, but Rome wasn’t built in a day.

Kwoung · February 2022

exeeter702 wrote: »

Larcomar wrote: »

When i first started I had the same problem. Ive got an absolutely ancient two button mouse not one of these swanky gaming mice. I found the key was to map your main attack to mouse 2, so you could weave and move at the same time. And ofc you can map your mouse wheel into three different actions - its good for block, dodge, buffs etc

For the rest, I find the arrow keys much easier for movement- far less likely for your fingers to get lost. There are enough buttons around it to cover the rest - I use control for sprint, O for bar swap and the littl block of the delete, end, page down keys for abilities. Anythign else goes on the number pad.

The only people that believe gaming mice with 8+ buttons are objectively superior are those that have never played mmos back when said mice were extremely rare or they are newer players and never learned normal key bindings.

Just want to throw that out there.

There are those of us that have played MMO's since their inception, but can't type. A couple extra buttons on the mouse and a Tartarus gamepad help a lot in my case. The thumb joystick for movement is great and the only time I really need my keyboard is for in-town stuff, like inventory management and chatting. Before that I used the arrow keys and fumbled around on my keyboard a lot, as well as missed a lot in game, since I have to look at my keyboard to use it.

Wish I could type, but manage without it. Both typing and home economic were classes boys weren't allowed to take in my school back then. I guess technically you could take the classes, but the advisors would shame you out of the idea if you tried.

mocap · February 2022

Obviously its W+A. No way you can smash numeric buttons with your ring finger while usin W+D.

Vevvev · February 2022

mocap wrote: »

Obviously its W+A. No way you can smash numeric buttons with your ring finger while usin W+D.

Unless you have an MMO gaming mouse, but before I got one I'd use my thumb to press D or my middle finger to cast the skills while my ring finger held W. I mapped my spammable to 4 as a result.

divnyi · February 2022

mocap wrote: »

Obviously its W+A. No way you can smash numeric buttons with your ring finger while usin W+D.

But I don't need to. Q/E/Winkey is 3 skills out of 5, that's generally enough for spammables. I very rarely get 4-5 action skills on one bar, generally you will have 4 or more buffs/passive buffs.

exeeter702 · February 2022

Kwoung wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Larcomar wrote: »

When i first started I had the same problem. Ive got an absolutely ancient two button mouse not one of these swanky gaming mice. I found the key was to map your main attack to mouse 2, so you could weave and move at the same time. And ofc you can map your mouse wheel into three different actions - its good for block, dodge, buffs etc

For the rest, I find the arrow keys much easier for movement- far less likely for your fingers to get lost. There are enough buttons around it to cover the rest - I use control for sprint, O for bar swap and the littl block of the delete, end, page down keys for abilities. Anythign else goes on the number pad.

The only people that believe gaming mice with 8+ buttons are objectively superior are those that have never played mmos back when said mice were extremely rare or they are newer players and never learned normal key bindings.

Just want to throw that out there.

There are those of us that have played MMO's since their inception, but can't type. A couple extra buttons on the mouse and a Tartarus gamepad help a lot in my case. The thumb joystick for movement is great and the only time I really need my keyboard is for in-town stuff, like inventory management and chatting. Before that I used the arrow keys and fumbled around on my keyboard a lot, as well as missed a lot in game, since I have to look at my keyboard to use it.

Wish I could type, but manage without it. Both typing and home economic were classes boys weren't allowed to take in my school back then. I guess technically you could take the classes, but the advisors would shame you out of the idea if you tried.

I feel it should go without saying that those who are physically limited are absolutely best off with any control scheme that allows them to play a given game comfortable and capably.

My point was was directed towards those that simply believe using a 8+ button mouse is the objectively superior control method over using keyboard binds. Anyone coming into the mmorpg space for the first time and being faced with upwards of 10+ keys will look at a gaming mouse and assume that is the right choice, and they will learn it, and become comfortable with it and then preach that there is no reason to ever not use one.

Eso specifically is pretty light on keybinds but other mmos not so much. For me, I have been using the following for the better part of 20 years of pc gaming...

12345QERFTZXCGVB m1&m2
SHIFT+ (all the above)

36 key binds that in no way feel difficult to reach and are about as natural to me as driving a car or typing a letter.

SippingPotions · February 2022

I really only use my left hand for movement and right does everything else. I Have have sprint mapped to shift, roll is A, jump is space, and I move with S E F and X. I play with a razer hex mouse that has 7 buttons on the side so I can use my right thumb for all 5 skills, ultimate, and quick slot. I also map bar swap to my mouse wheel.