This game NEEDS a class change token

Jeremy · January 2022

I just want to reemphasize this. My Templar as an example went from being able to comfortably hold his own against a team of skilled players (unless they were using Knight Slayer) to being free points for any well-played and coordinated attack team. In other words: he may as well have been deleted from the game he was so upended, and went from effective to literally non functioning.

If you (the developers) are going to make such drastic and gameplay altering changes, then giving players more freedom to explore other classes to compensate would help them adapt and temper frustrations. Because I believe that you owe this small favor to your customers. Even if the token is expensive it would still be worth it. Though honestly one should come free with any major change to the game that may heavily impact a player's character and play style.

Also: and just a heads up, but I will no longer be replying to comments on this board as I am incompatible with this forum's rules. So if you want to share thoughts or have me reply, please direct your comment to my personal inbox.

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO · January 2022

I completely agree.

kargen27 · January 2022

No it doesn't. You don't even need class change. You want class change. Big difference.

Araneae6537 · January 2022

I don’t know what negative changes were made to templar, especially not to an extent that would ruin a playstyle. Many say that templar is currently one of the best classes in PvP.

I do generally agree that a class change token would be a good addition, especially for those who prefer not to play any or many alts.

Haquor · January 2022

I just think that every individual player/class should be possible to take down by, as you say it, a 'well played and coordinated attack team'. That could imply some level of balance.

Im ok with people wanting the ability to change classes and experiment etc and if they want to do that with thier own money instead of time (ranking a character up), But the argument that your class used to be able to hold its own comfortably against several skilled players... well that just screams imbalance.

Regardless of the motivation for the class change token, its cash for ZOS if they do it, and and it doesnt affect anyone else.

This is coming from a guy that has spent a lot of time ranking up three of every class to have all roles and specs covered.

It takes a couple of days to grind up a new character so the end state for everyone else in game would be the same if they buy it or spend a couple of days grinding.

Take thier money ZOS.

kargen27 · January 2022

Ciotola wrote: »

[snip]

[snip] By the way my templar still does great in PvP because I adapted.
Asking for class change isn't exclusive to PvP. Other players would also like class change. Some simply because they want something fresh but don't want to start from scratch. Personally I think they should start a new character. I don't care it they introduce class change tokens. They would need to make it so your new class skills are all set as if you were a new character.

My point is that class change is not needed. It is wanted. There is a difference. It isn't even a want high up on most players lists especially PvP players. You ask most PvP'rs what the game needs and they will say performance upgrades and things like that.

[edited for baiting & to remove quote]

Tommy_The_Gun · January 2022

Class change token = a chance for an actual class balance.

huntgod_ESO · January 2022

Your argument for a class change is that the class you were playing can non longer hold off a TEAM of SKILLED players...that doesn't seem like a great argument for a class change. Especially since you have other character slots and can purchase more if you need them.

So pick the next imbalanced class and level it up, then when they eventually balance it, find another, rinse and repeat.

RUIWOLF · January 2022

kargen27 wrote: »

No it doesn't. You don't even need class change. You want class change. Big difference.

https://youtu.be/37NoyaNpv24

RUIWOLF · January 2022

Jeremy wrote: »

I just want to reemphasize this. My Templar as an example went from being able to comfortably hold his own against a team of skilled players (unless they were using Knight Slayer) to being free points for any well-played and coordinated attack team. In other words: he may as well have been deleted from the game he was so upended, and went from effective to literally non functioning.

If you (the developers) are going to make such drastic and gameplay altering changes, then giving players more freedom to explore other classes to compensate would help them adapt and temper frustrations. Because I believe that you owe this small favor to your customers. Even if the token is expensive it would still be worth it. Though honestly one should come free with any major change to the game that may heavily impact a player's character and play style.

Also: and just a heads up, but I will no longer be replying to comments on this board as I am incompatible with this forum's rules. So if you want to share thoughts or have me reply, please direct your comment to my personal inbox.

YEP! when I was first started in eso I struggled dramatically. Mostly due to Dyscalculia...Yep.
But anyways I actually got stronger making me one of the strongest if not the strongest in my guild and a well known foe in my little circle of influence in EU below level 50. The reason why is learning of other classes. What probably would of happened if we had this earlier is switched to templar than warden and then necromancer. This would of made me a lot stronger a lot faster. Learning things quicker instead of resetting my character every 20 levels. Not just that the benefits are skill trees staying like the psijic tree and crafting as well as quests progression. Not just that if you picked a base game class like me but then became better and got more comfy with a newer class but you really love the memories on your base character. You can also switch between meta classes for that session. Idk why ZOS haven't done this yet.

PvP_Exploiter · January 2022

You have 9 character slots for free.

Amottica · January 2022

While I can easily understand some may want a class change token, it does not seem the game actually needs it. Even myself, who has been in this game less than a year, has rolled two alts. I expect many others have rolled even more. So there is not such a need for a class change token.

I also saw someone note in a different thread that Zenimax stands to make bank from players rolling new characters. It seems Zenimax sells everything from mount training, class skill lines, sky shards, and more that make leveling a new character easy. The math shows that as much more than what I think we can expect a class change token to sell for. Revenue is the real name of the game.

Sylvermynx · January 2022

Actually, I don't really have a problem with a class change token any more. *shrug* I don't do group content due to mega ping and aged reflexes, so it's not going to be a problem for me.

Go for it.

Smith4HirePmMe2Order · January 2022

im all for anything that puts more options in the hands of the players. i dont even mind paying for the token.

ive got alot of motifs and recipes and progress on my DK, but ive grown so mind numbingly tired of the DK. I WILL NOT trash it for the above mentioned reasons, but at the same time i dont want to start over on a new charecter what took years to build up... so this is something id LOVE To have.

starlizard70ub17_ESO · January 2022

I have a lot of alts and after thinking about it, I would use a class change token if ESO had one. As an example, I have 3 NB and 3 DK characters. I like having both a stamina and magic version of each class. So when the new classes come out, this year or the next, I just buy 2 class change tokens and switch a DK and NB to the new class. Then I just level the new skills, since I done my time leveling characters

.

Ciotola · January 2022

kargen27 wrote: »

Ciotola wrote: »

[snip]

[snip] By the way my templar still does great in PvP because I adapted.
Asking for class change isn't exclusive to PvP. Other players would also like class change. Some simply because they want something fresh but don't want to start from scratch. Personally I think they should start a new character. I don't care it they introduce class change tokens. They would need to make it so your new class skills are all set as if you were a new character.

My point is that class change is not needed. It is wanted. There is a difference. It isn't even a want high up on most players lists especially PvP players. You ask most PvP'rs what the game needs and they will say performance upgrades and things like that.

unknown human, is a joke.

however, some games where class change exists: trove, EE, ffxiv, Aage, dnd, mali, Tsaga, Ssforge, nw, ds, albion etc

games where progress is so wide account that there are no class change problems: d3, wow2018, poe, anvil, bdo etc

notes that they are different titles in different fields, it demonstrates how the will to be able to give possibilities such as class change exist inside and outside the mmo landscape.

now, generally I am bored by homunculi who blab about things in their micro world and ignore the macrocontext, in this case I am bored by a pvp player who sees a feature only from the pvp side, this is why the pve tanks on eso are mistreated by zenimax itself: because it does not want to untie pve and pvp and does not know how to balance them.

and I speak to you as a player who does not like fights between frustrated, but this does not lead me to judge things only from the pve side

I am very opposed to class change if it is badly managed and leads to problems in the pvp ecosystem, and I do not affect the pvp, which could also be canceled in function of better pve quality.

so I ascertained that I am against bad implementations, and eso has several and already from the beta ...... weaving .... I am not at all against a class change token if done well, with the right restrictions, with the right balance and with the right prices, but yes, I have no problem pointing out as "intelligent alternatives" all those champions who lash out at a service such as class change: it is an optional service, it is not imposed on anyone. those who benefit from it do not alter the experience of others in any way (stop complaints such as "hordes of -insert meta-class in pvp thanks to the class change ruin the pvp) is a personal, individual choice and in which no one outside those who benefit from the service must interfere.

I'll make you a parallel: a human who wants to get a tattoo, even the most obscene repugnant with the symbolism of the most conservative moderator of the mmo forum, must not ask for anyone's approval, he must respect a social will. it is his space and the choices in his space do not affect others.

still zenimax do you have to censor everything that is not made for a 2 year old child? this is the reasoning: an innocent and pure child must read it so everything must be sugary and enchanted. grow up

kargen27 · January 2022

Ciotola wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Ciotola wrote: »

[snip]

[snip] By the way my templar still does great in PvP because I adapted.
Asking for class change isn't exclusive to PvP. Other players would also like class change. Some simply because they want something fresh but don't want to start from scratch. Personally I think they should start a new character. I don't care it they introduce class change tokens. They would need to make it so your new class skills are all set as if you were a new character.

My point is that class change is not needed. It is wanted. There is a difference. It isn't even a want high up on most players lists especially PvP players. You ask most PvP'rs what the game needs and they will say performance upgrades and things like that.

[snip]

however, some games where class change exists: trove, EE, ffxiv, Aage, dnd, mali, Tsaga, Ssforge, nw, ds, albion etc

games where progress is so wide account that there are no class change problems: d3, wow2018, poe, anvil, bdo etc

notes that they are different titles in different fields, it demonstrates how the will to be able to give possibilities such as class change exist inside and outside the mmo landscape.

[snip]

and I speak to you as a player who does not like fights between frustrated, but this does not lead me to judge things only from the pve side

I am very opposed to class change if it is badly managed and leads to problems in the pvp ecosystem, and I do not affect the pvp, which could also be canceled in function of better pve quality.

so I ascertained that I am against bad implementations, and eso has several and already from the beta ...... weaving .... I am not at all against a class change token if done well, with the right restrictions, with the right balance and with the right prices, but yes, I have no problem pointing out as "intelligent alternatives" all those champions who lash out at a service such as class change: it is an optional service, it is not imposed on anyone. those who benefit from it do not alter the experience of others in any way (stop complaints such as "hordes of -insert meta-class in pvp thanks to the class change ruin the pvp) is a personal, individual choice and in which no one outside those who benefit from the service must interfere.

I'll make you a parallel: a human who wants to get a tattoo, even the most obscene repugnant with the symbolism of the most conservative moderator of the mmo forum, must not ask for anyone's approval, he must not respect a social will. it is his space and the choices in his space do not affect others.

Nothing you typed had anything to do with what I typed. [snip] And sure do whatever you will with your body. Others might then decide to exclude you from their private spaces/property as that is their right.
There are restaurants/bars that require all tattoos be covered. Maybe were... been a while since I went to a place with a dress code.

[edited for baiting & to remove quote]

sarahthes · January 2022

I am not entirely sure I would trust a class change token to work as intended.

Nanfoodle · January 2022

No ty, if you want to be a warden. You will need to reroll. 😜

Brrrofski · January 2022

It's so easy to make a new character these days that it isn't warranted.

Both PvE endgame and pvp would just be everyone switching to the strongest class each patch. It would be so boring.

Account wide achievements would be a better solution to why most people seem to want a class change.

XxCaLxX · January 2022

Ciotola wrote: »

[snip]

Feels like I'm reading upside down.

[edited to remove quote]

Aardappelboom · January 2022

Brrrofski wrote: »

It's so easy to make a new character these days that it isn't warranted.

It's not really, you need to repeat quests, you've already done, need skillpoints, the mount training is pretty harsh and you need to reaquire bounded gear. Most of all I love playing my character, going through the content once is enough for me.

I don't know about you but I don't play this as a traditional grinding MMO, if ZOS markets this as "play how you want" then a class change token isn't that far fetched.

Blinx · January 2022

I never thought I'd have more than 1 character, but now I have 4.
The game was getting stale for me, so I said screw achievements, and rolled another toon, had so much fun, decided to do it again, and yet again.
I now have 4.
The absolute worse for me was releveling undaunted because I play solo for the most part, but it's doable, they 're all rank 10. Also horse training, still doing my Tanks atm
But that's it for me, altho if ther imperial edition goes on sale anytime soon, I'd prob roll an imp

MentalxHammer · January 2022

Leveling in this game is easy, make one alt and before you know it you’ll wind up with all classes leveled.

TelvanniWizard · January 2022

MentalxHammer wrote: »

Leveling in this game is easy, make one alt and before you know it you’ll wind up with all classes leveled.

The problem, as has been said many times, isn´t levelling, but the rest of character progression: skill lines, alliance rank, achievements, skyshards, riding skills, quests, etc. That´s why so many people want a race change token; you have a main character, with thousands of hours invested. If you play another character, you lose all of that, and face a new grind. Only to try a new class tha perhaps would suit you better.

Imo, both class change token and account-wide achivements should be present in game, but I´d happily settle for either of them.

PvP_Exploiter · January 2022

TelvanniWizard wrote: »

MentalxHammer wrote: »

Leveling in this game is easy, make one alt and before you know it you’ll wind up with all classes leveled.

The problem, as has been said many times, isn´t levelling, but the rest of character progression: skill lines, alliance rank, achievements, skyshards, riding skills, quests, etc. That´s why so many people want a race change token; you have a main character, with thousands of hours invested. If you play another character, you lose all of that, and face a new grind. Only to try a new class tha perhaps would suit you better.

Imo, both class change token and account-wide achivements should be present in game, but I´d happily settle for either of them.

You can fully level a character in a week if you put the time in.
Besides from mount training but that's not necessary and comes in time.

With a friend and 150% XP scroll you can do level 3-50 with a couple of weapon lines in an hour grinding in nBRP. Don't bother with passives, just buy skills and morphs.

Then go do Mages guild, Psijic & Overland skyshards at the same time, based of Psijic zone quest. Don't bother with delve skyshards. Takes a few hours but can easily be done in a week. Add in pledges to level undaunted and fighters guild.

Do Hard Mode, Speed run, No Death with friends in the base game Vet 1 dungeons for 60 undaunted a pop. Fungal 1, Wayrest 1 etc. Takes no time alongside pledges.

Facefister · January 2022

MentalxHammer wrote: »

Leveling in this game is easy, make one alt and before you know it you’ll wind up with all classes leveled.

Leveling a character to level 50 isn't hard. If you're motivated enough, you could do that in a day. It's about the other skill lines, the mount training, the crafting, skyshards, etc. etc. Not to mention the titles and achievements.

And some people have 100% completion in areas and quests, DLC included.

LordRukia · January 2022

I disagree , achievement should be acc wide no doubt but it's still an RPG and if you want to play that class you have to level it first. Might I introduce you to the many double XP events and no vertical progression stopping you from lvling an alt.. or should we go down the path of WoW because it worked out so well with lvl boosts you couldn't find another player in the world to save your life. Granted there are a few reasons for that but we've all seen what this path of least resistance leads to.

ZeroDPS · January 2022

Imho the best idea here is not to BIND character to anything!
Imagine this: we have created ork race character. When we first enter game we dont have 2 major things class skill lines and race passives. The question is “okay how do we get those”. Answer: race passives are obtained through the racial blessings from each corresponding city. And class skill line can be done like this. For example I wanna be a dragonknight, so I have to go to corresponding school and accept/learn (maybe through the quest) dragonknight technics. Thats it and of course changing thise will cost tokens. We are happy as well as ZOS

@ZOS_Kevin hey Kev, can you please share this idea with the responsible team?

Zephiran23 · January 2022

Jeremy wrote: »

I just want to reemphasize this. My Templar as an example went from being able to comfortably hold his own against a team of skilled players (unless they were using Knight Slayer) to being free points for any well-played and coordinated attack team. In other words: he may as well have been deleted from the game he was so upended, and went from effective to literally non functioning.

If you (the developers) are going to make such drastic and gameplay altering changes, then giving players more freedom to explore other classes to compensate would help them adapt and temper frustrations. Because I believe that you owe this small favor to your customers. Even if the token is expensive it would still be worth it. Though honestly one should come free with any major change to the game that may heavily impact a player's character and play style.

Also: and just a heads up, but I will no longer be replying to comments on this board as I am incompatible with this forum's rules. So if you want to share thoughts or have me reply, please direct your comment to my personal inbox.

So midpatch, your templar went from being overpowered to balanced? I'm struggling to see the problem here.

Also I'm not sure if skilled is supposed to be stronger than well played and coordinated. It's a shame we won't be getting any more details from you.

Pet · January 2022

PvP_Exploiter wrote: »

You have 9 character slots for free.

Achievements aren't accountwide, nor are skillpoints, skill line progress, etc.