Still some useless passives that need looking at

Brrrofski · January 2022

Does anyone else feel like there's still some useless passives floating about?

I don't want to get into class passives too much. I don't mean so much things like passives that only help a mag build, or a Stam build, as that would open a whole can of worms.

Take the weapon skill line passives for instance. Cost reduction being the main ones.

I get that when the game was new, and still for new players, things like "reduce cost of bow abilities by x amount" felt like progression.

As we levelled up the weapon and became more efficient with it, they felt nice, like a reward for grinding it out.

But for most players now, it's a bit lackluster.

Can't we just include that reduced cost into the skill and give it a new passive?

The last resto passive, that increases resto healing by x amount. Why not just bump those skills up the same percent, and give it a new passive?

I know I said I didn't want to get into class passives, but ones that should for sure be looked at is things like the Nightblade passive Dark Veil. It just increases time of skills. Again, why not just extend the length of those skills as default and replace it with a new passive.

The two new classes don't have passives like that, that feel a bit empty.

RNGeeze · January 2022

Racial passives still have room for improvement as once you cap the skill line (armor or weapon) you pretty much lose one completely.

Lysette · January 2022

From where do you know that veteran players are the majority?- We have quite a lot of new players around, for whom those skills are helpful, because they struggle with resource management, have often not even jewelry attached and their gear is white or green. Some have really terrible regeneration and no good way to manage their resources yet. Just let them have the experience, which you had, but which you find obsolete now - new players should have the same chance, don't you think?

Mushroomancer · January 2022

I think both OP and @Lysette are correct.
So here's an alternative, even though it has no doubt been proposed plenty of times already: what if we had some sort of "mastery" passive that we unlock once we get to level 50 into any weapon class? That way we get to keep the cost reduction passives that are useful for new players and lowbies, and we get new passives for those of us in the endgame. To make it more interesting, each weapon could even have a specific quest tied to obtaining this mastery passive.

Lysette · January 2022

Mushroomancer wrote: »

I think both OP and @Lysette are correct.
So here's an alternative, even though it has no doubt been proposed plenty of times already: what if we had some sort of "mastery" passive that we unlock once we get to level 50 into any weapon class? That way we get to keep the cost reduction passives that are useful for new players and lowbies, and we get new passives for those of us in the endgame. To make it more interesting, each weapon could even have a specific quest tied to obtaining this mastery passive.

that is a quite interesting idea actually. It should not be based on player level though, but on the specific weapon or armor skill levels. Like when you focus on a specific armor type, you will get quicker to mastery than when you are wearing a mix of light, medium and heavy armor.

Brrrofski · January 2022

Lysette wrote: »

From where do you know that veteran players are the majority?- We have quite a lot of new players around, for whom those skills are helpful, because they struggle with resource management, have often not even jewelry attached and their gear is white or green. Some have really terrible regeneration and no good way to manage their resources yet. Just let them have the experience, which you had, but which you find obsolete now - new players should have the same chance, don't you think?

I agree.

But you can just code that into each level of the skill. So it reduces the cost as that skill ranks up. I know some do this, but do it widely across the skill linea and increase the cost reduction, so you can then free up a passive.

New players still have that experience of working on a skill, and other player don't feel like it's an empty passive.

I don't mean "make the skills more expensive". Just bake it into the skills and free up more passives to add something extra.

Lysette · January 2022

Brrrofski wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

From where do you know that veteran players are the majority?- We have quite a lot of new players around, for whom those skills are helpful, because they struggle with resource management, have often not even jewelry attached and their gear is white or green. Some have really terrible regeneration and no good way to manage their resources yet. Just let them have the experience, which you had, but which you find obsolete now - new players should have the same chance, don't you think?

I agree.

But you can just code that into each level of the skill. So it reduces the cost as that skill ranks up. I know some do this, but do it widely across the skill linea and increase the cost reduction, so you can then free up a passive.

New players still have that experience of working on a skill, and other player don't feel like it's an empty passive.

I don't mean "make the skills more expensive". Just bake it into the skills and free up more passives to add something extra.

what do you think about this mastery idea - this could be quite interesting, acquiring a new passive skill line after having maxed out that skill line?

spartaxoxo · January 2022

Snakeblood

francesinhalover · January 2022

Brrrofski wrote: »

Does anyone else feel like there's still some useless passives floating about?

I don't want to get into class passives too much. I don't mean so much things like passives that only help a mag build, or a Stam build, as that would open a whole can of worms.

Take the weapon skill line passives for instance. Cost reduction being the main ones.

I get that when the game was new, and still for new players, things like "reduce cost of bow abilities by x amount" felt like progression.

As we levelled up the weapon and became more efficient with it, they felt nice, like a reward for grinding it out.

But for most players now, it's a bit lackluster.

Can't we just include that reduced cost into the skill and give it a new passive?

The last resto passive, that increases resto healing by x amount. Why not just bump those skills up the same percent, and give it a new passive?

I know I said I didn't want to get into class passives, but ones that should for sure be looked at is things like the Nightblade passive Dark Veil. It just increases time of skills. Again, why not just extend the length of those skills as default and replace it with a new passive.

The two new classes don't have passives like that, that feel a bit empty.

Ruffian from dual wield a skill line focused on pve.
Ruffian is useless on pve and theres barely any reason to use dw now has a main skill bar

Dragonlord573 · January 2022

Imperial racial passive. 15% exp gain for 1 hand and shield, really? It's a useless perk. If it was rather increase 1 hand and shield abilities and passives by 15% it would be more worthwhile.

Mushroomancer · January 2022

francesinhalover wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Does anyone else feel like there's still some useless passives floating about?

I don't want to get into class passives too much. I don't mean so much things like passives that only help a mag build, or a Stam build, as that would open a whole can of worms.

Take the weapon skill line passives for instance. Cost reduction being the main ones.

I get that when the game was new, and still for new players, things like "reduce cost of bow abilities by x amount" felt like progression.

As we levelled up the weapon and became more efficient with it, they felt nice, like a reward for grinding it out.

But for most players now, it's a bit lackluster.

Can't we just include that reduced cost into the skill and give it a new passive?

The last resto passive, that increases resto healing by x amount. Why not just bump those skills up the same percent, and give it a new passive?

I know I said I didn't want to get into class passives, but ones that should for sure be looked at is things like the Nightblade passive Dark Veil. It just increases time of skills. Again, why not just extend the length of those skills as default and replace it with a new passive.

The two new classes don't have passives like that, that feel a bit empty.

Ruffian from dual wield a skill line focused on pve.
Ruffian is useless on pve and theres barely any reason to use dw now has a main skill bar

That's still a dps increase for add pulls, as most of them are still susceptible to cc, although I will say, I think it should just be an increase in damage to targets under any debuff.

Dragonlord573 wrote: »

Imperial racial passive. 15% exp gain for 1 hand and shield, really? It's a useless perk. If it was rather increase 1 hand and shield abilities and passives by 15% it would be more worthwhile.

That's how all the base racial passives are. It's still underwhelming, since you have a pretty much useless passive once you get to max level in that weapon skill, but it's not a problem strictly for Imperials, it's for all the races.

Seraphayel · January 2022

Lysette wrote: »

From where do you know that veteran players are the majority?- We have quite a lot of new players around, for whom those skills are helpful, because they struggle with resource management, have often not even jewelry attached and their gear is white or green. Some have really terrible regeneration and no good way to manage their resources yet. Just let them have the experience, which you had, but which you find obsolete now - new players should have the same chance, don't you think?

After 8 years of live service I think it’s time to stop catering to new players altogether. Brand new players are a minority. This game needs more stuff for long-term players and less catering to players that can’t tell the difference between a Templar and a Dragon Knight.

MindOfTheSwarm · January 2022

The weapon exp stuff is understandable but it’s not really game breaking. I like that High Elf has bonus exp on Destro Staff. Takes ages to get that juicy ult.

For a passive that I personally want improving it is Icy Aura for Warden. The snare reduction isn’t very useful, since in PVE it’s a non issue and in PvP I can simply cleanse it or outlive it.

I would change it to this.

Icy Aura:
While you have a Winter’s Embrace skill active you deal X Frost Damage every second to enemies within 4 meters. This damage scales with your Max Health or your Max Magicka or your Max Stamina whichever is higher. This damage has 20% increased chance to apply the Chilled status.

estelrandir · January 2022

I'm fairly new here, so take what I have to say with a noobish grain of salt:

From what I've read of the passives, many of them don't seem useful. Like, to the point where I'm checking guides to see if I need to take something or not because it really doesn't sound helpful -- or, at least, not worth a skill point.

Vevvev · January 2022

Vampire stage 2 passive is pretty niche in what it can do. Feels more like something to boost healing out of Mistform or boost your damage by a little bit when starting a gank. Not really all that impressive and not utilizable most of the time.

estelrandir wrote: »

I'm fairly new here, so take what I have to say with a noobish grain of salt:

From what I've read of the passives, many of them don't seem useful. Like, to the point where I'm checking guides to see if I need to take something or not because it really doesn't sound helpful -- or, at least, not worth a skill point.

I found all passives are worth taking except with things like the passive that gives ice staves better blocking but make them block with magicka. Still useful, but not everyone wants that. I can't count a single other passive like that with all the rest giving very useful buffs.

Amottica · January 2022

Brrrofski wrote: »

Take the weapon skill line passives for instance. Cost reduction being the main ones.

Are you suggesting you want to increase the cost for those weapon skill lines?

Brrrofski · January 2022

Amottica wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Take the weapon skill line passives for instance. Cost reduction being the main ones.

Are you suggesting you want to increase the cost for those weapon skill lines?

If you actually read on, you'd be able to answer that yourself.