Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

PvE Ratings System.

Upon forming a group, even if Random, have a UI window show everyone incoming to the group and a noticeable button that says something like: "Join" or "Cancel".

In the UI Window, there should be 3 or 4 lines showing either the Account Name or perhaps just the Character Name (whichever) and a rating of 1 to 5 Crowns per player. If they have opted out of the system, let it quickly reflect this otherwise let each player have a tag that quickly reflects general information about how other players have rated running with them as well as how many runs overall. This can be done in a safe, effective manner. The game can also auto-assign a rating like if the group finishes vDSA then everyone gets a 5 Crown rating.

Show # of times player has been kicked or has left the group early and not completed the run. (A few happenings are of course, excusable)

Allow other players to provide a short sentence describing their run experience with each player. Players can view these and if something inappropriate or inaccurate is listed they can ask for help in getting it removed.

Have each player also quickly confirm their role before clicking "Join". Allow players to have multiple roles. Allow incoming group members to quickly preview reviews for each player and decide if they want to join that group or if organizing the group, if they want to accept that player or not. (Could also quickly link their achievements also with date)

For this reason might want to attach the reviews to each character, not the account. We all make mistakes and if ppl mess up they can start over but then again someone joining a group without any history at all says something too.

Now I'm not saying it should be exactly like this, but this will straighten out things fairly hard and fast. In a straightforward manner you will have an idea who you are running with and what to expect. Then its on you. I fully endorse this or a similar system so that people who excel may shine and everyone can see where exceptions might be and focus attn on helping them or watching for any trouble rather than finding out 45 min to an 1.5 hr in to the run.

And if you don't like or want the overhead of managing actual comments, it may make things easier to be able to show simple easy to understand statistics of how each character has done per dungeon run. So if its someone who is more comfortable with normal, which is fine, then let it show that so we know they might be at Risk on something like vDSA or vAS. Again, the idea is not to keep people out of content however identifying such a person out right may help prepare for problems in advance rather than getting a Hollywood Story with lots of memorable actors and characters.

It seems to me if people need to have all this information upfront about everyone else just to do a mere random daily dungeon, then they either need to join a guild or need to stop doing randoms period if they refuse to join one. Good grief.

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

PvE Ratings System.

Upon forming a group, even if Random, have a UI window show everyone incoming to the group and a noticeable button that says something like: "Join" or "Cancel".

In the UI Window, there should be 3 or 4 lines showing either the Account Name or perhaps just the Character Name (whichever) and a rating of 1 to 5 Crowns per player. If they have opted out of the system, let it quickly reflect this otherwise let each player have a tag that quickly reflects general information about how other players have rated running with them as well as how many runs overall. This can be done in a safe, effective manner. The game can also auto-assign a rating like if the group finishes vDSA then everyone gets a 5 Crown rating.

Show # of times player has been kicked or has left the group early and not completed the run. (A few happenings are of course, excusable)

Allow other players to provide a short sentence describing their run experience with each player. Players can view these and if something inappropriate or inaccurate is listed they can ask for help in getting it removed.

Have each player also quickly confirm their role before clicking "Join". Allow players to have multiple roles. Allow incoming group members to quickly preview reviews for each player and decide if they want to join that group or if organizing the group, if they want to accept that player or not. (Could also quickly link their achievements also with date)

For this reason might want to attach the reviews to each character, not the account. We all make mistakes and if ppl mess up they can start over but then again someone joining a group without any history at all says something too.

Now I'm not saying it should be exactly like this, but this will straighten out things fairly hard and fast. In a straightforward manner you will have an idea who you are running with and what to expect. Then its on you. I fully endorse this or a similar system so that people who excel may shine and everyone can see where exceptions might be and focus attn on helping them or watching for any trouble rather than finding out 45 min to an 1.5 hr in to the run.

And if you don't like or want the overhead of managing actual comments, it may make things easier to be able to show simple easy to understand statistics of how each character has done per dungeon run. So if its someone who is more comfortable with normal, which is fine, then let it show that so we know they might be at Risk on something like vDSA or vAS. Again, the idea is not to keep people out of content however identifying such a person out right may help prepare for problems in advance rather than getting a Hollywood Story with lots of memorable actors and characters.

It seems to me if people need to have all this information upfront about everyone else just to do a mere random daily dungeon, then they either need to join a guild or need to stop doing randoms period if they refuse to join one. Good grief.

I know it seems like alot. And it doesn't quite have to be exactly this.

But I've seen this same thing from other games and again, I'm not sure how deep we could go regarding Privacy concerns.

However if we even had half of this I think that would matter. Cause right now for random groups you are completely in the Dark with who you're dealing with. If you see someone with a profile that's fleshed out, this generates street cred and provides confidence in people to do their role. Could also serve other purposes as well if taken a little further you can advertise your profile to Guilds or others in zone too without having to dig thru a bunch of different screens and paste elements into zone window.

My point here is that guilds are the place to do this, and they do it already. Most vet trials guilds I am in for example, will have you post your clears publicly in their discord for all to see, along with parses, gear, etc. which is totally where this type of stuff is needed.

Nobody needs all that just to do a random dungeon, come on. Total overkill.

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

PvE Ratings System.

Upon forming a group, even if Random, have a UI window show everyone incoming to the group and a noticeable button that says something like: "Join" or "Cancel".

In the UI Window, there should be 3 or 4 lines showing either the Account Name or perhaps just the Character Name (whichever) and a rating of 1 to 5 Crowns per player. If they have opted out of the system, let it quickly reflect this otherwise let each player have a tag that quickly reflects general information about how other players have rated running with them as well as how many runs overall. This can be done in a safe, effective manner. The game can also auto-assign a rating like if the group finishes vDSA then everyone gets a 5 Crown rating.

Show # of times player has been kicked or has left the group early and not completed the run. (A few happenings are of course, excusable)

Allow other players to provide a short sentence describing their run experience with each player. Players can view these and if something inappropriate or inaccurate is listed they can ask for help in getting it removed.

Have each player also quickly confirm their role before clicking "Join". Allow players to have multiple roles. Allow incoming group members to quickly preview reviews for each player and decide if they want to join that group or if organizing the group, if they want to accept that player or not. (Could also quickly link their achievements also with date)

For this reason might want to attach the reviews to each character, not the account. We all make mistakes and if ppl mess up they can start over but then again someone joining a group without any history at all says something too.

Now I'm not saying it should be exactly like this, but this will straighten out things fairly hard and fast. In a straightforward manner you will have an idea who you are running with and what to expect. Then its on you. I fully endorse this or a similar system so that people who excel may shine and everyone can see where exceptions might be and focus attn on helping them or watching for any trouble rather than finding out 45 min to an 1.5 hr in to the run.

And if you don't like or want the overhead of managing actual comments, it may make things easier to be able to show simple easy to understand statistics of how each character has done per dungeon run. So if its someone who is more comfortable with normal, which is fine, then let it show that so we know they might be at Risk on something like vDSA or vAS. Again, the idea is not to keep people out of content however identifying such a person out right may help prepare for problems in advance rather than getting a Hollywood Story with lots of memorable actors and characters.

It seems to me if people need to have all this information upfront about everyone else just to do a mere random daily dungeon, then they either need to join a guild or need to stop doing randoms period if they refuse to join one. Good grief.

I know it seems like alot. And it doesn't quite have to be exactly this.

But I've seen this same thing from other games and again, I'm not sure how deep we could go regarding Privacy concerns.

However if we even had half of this I think that would matter. Cause right now for random groups you are completely in the Dark with who you're dealing with. If you see someone with a profile that's fleshed out, this generates street cred and provides confidence in people to do their role. Could also serve other purposes as well if taken a little further you can advertise your profile to Guilds or others in zone too without having to dig thru a bunch of different screens and paste elements into zone window.

My point here is that guilds are the place to do this, and they do it already. Most vet trials guilds I am in for example, will have you post your clears publicly in their discord for all to see, along with parses, gear, etc. which is totally where this type of stuff is needed.

Nobody needs all that just to do a random dungeon, come on. Total overkill.

And my point is... that's not where the problem exists. Everyone is not a member of a Trials Guild -and- add to that some Guilds will only allow people to join who demonstrate conditional merit (aside from being exceptionally exclusive in their recruiting). While this is 'their' system of checks and balances, majority of the player base cannot and likely will not ever belong to such a Guild with these kinds of measures in place.

So, we cannot count on that can we? At least not for the vast majority of the player base.

Thus, we could use something else optional to help provide guidance outside of an organized Trials Guild, subject to privacy concerns as well as future refinement yet fulfilling its intended purpose. Come to think of it this would also be a good thing because if the Devs wish they can weigh in on what the standards shall be which may actually make content more readily available to people vs trying to clash with what each Trial Guild's 'individual standards' are currently, which could leave some players behind.

Consider this as me addressing... the other side of the issue as one main reason many players go Random is its the fastest way to find a group, also because they are neither in a Guild nor know anyone or maybe players they know are not online or something. It is simply -not- overkill for wanting to know some basic information about who you are running with. Its the lack of community for why people go random and its for lack of knowledge that chaos ensues on some of these runs.

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

PvE Ratings System.

Upon forming a group, even if Random, have a UI window show everyone incoming to the group and a noticeable button that says something like: "Join" or "Cancel".

In the UI Window, there should be 3 or 4 lines showing either the Account Name or perhaps just the Character Name (whichever) and a rating of 1 to 5 Crowns per player. If they have opted out of the system, let it quickly reflect this otherwise let each player have a tag that quickly reflects general information about how other players have rated running with them as well as how many runs overall. This can be done in a safe, effective manner. The game can also auto-assign a rating like if the group finishes vDSA then everyone gets a 5 Crown rating.

Show # of times player has been kicked or has left the group early and not completed the run. (A few happenings are of course, excusable)

Allow other players to provide a short sentence describing their run experience with each player. Players can view these and if something inappropriate or inaccurate is listed they can ask for help in getting it removed.

Have each player also quickly confirm their role before clicking "Join". Allow players to have multiple roles. Allow incoming group members to quickly preview reviews for each player and decide if they want to join that group or if organizing the group, if they want to accept that player or not. (Could also quickly link their achievements also with date)

For this reason might want to attach the reviews to each character, not the account. We all make mistakes and if ppl mess up they can start over but then again someone joining a group without any history at all says something too.

Now I'm not saying it should be exactly like this, but this will straighten out things fairly hard and fast. In a straightforward manner you will have an idea who you are running with and what to expect. Then its on you. I fully endorse this or a similar system so that people who excel may shine and everyone can see where exceptions might be and focus attn on helping them or watching for any trouble rather than finding out 45 min to an 1.5 hr in to the run.

And if you don't like or want the overhead of managing actual comments, it may make things easier to be able to show simple easy to understand statistics of how each character has done per dungeon run. So if its someone who is more comfortable with normal, which is fine, then let it show that so we know they might be at Risk on something like vDSA or vAS. Again, the idea is not to keep people out of content however identifying such a person out right may help prepare for problems in advance rather than getting a Hollywood Story with lots of memorable actors and characters.

It seems to me if people need to have all this information upfront about everyone else just to do a mere random daily dungeon, then they either need to join a guild or need to stop doing randoms period if they refuse to join one. Good grief.

I know it seems like alot. And it doesn't quite have to be exactly this.

But I've seen this same thing from other games and again, I'm not sure how deep we could go regarding Privacy concerns.

However if we even had half of this I think that would matter. Cause right now for random groups you are completely in the Dark with who you're dealing with. If you see someone with a profile that's fleshed out, this generates street cred and provides confidence in people to do their role. Could also serve other purposes as well if taken a little further you can advertise your profile to Guilds or others in zone too without having to dig thru a bunch of different screens and paste elements into zone window.

My point here is that guilds are the place to do this, and they do it already. Most vet trials guilds I am in for example, will have you post your clears publicly in their discord for all to see, along with parses, gear, etc. which is totally where this type of stuff is needed.

Nobody needs all that just to do a random dungeon, come on. Total overkill.

And my point is... that's not where the problem exists. Everyone is not a member of a Trials Guild -and- add to that some Guilds will only allow people to join who demonstrate conditional merit (aside from being exceptionally exclusive in their recruiting). While this is 'their' system of checks and balances, majority of the player base cannot and likely will not ever belong to such a Guild with these kinds of measures in place.

So, we cannot count on that can we? At least not for the vast majority of the player base.

Thus, we could use something else optional to help provide guidance outside of an organized Trials Guild, subject to privacy concerns as well as future refinement yet fulfilling its intended purpose. Come to think of it this would also be a good thing because if the Devs wish they can weigh in on what the standards shall be which may actually make content more readily available to people vs trying to clash with what each Trial Guild's 'individual standards' are currently, which could leave some players behind.

Consider this as me addressing... the other side of the issue as one main reason many players go Random is its the fastest way to find a group, also because they are neither in a Guild nor know anyone or maybe players they know are not online or something. It is simply -not- overkill for wanting to know some basic information about who you are running with. Its the lack of community for why people go random and its for lack of knowledge that chaos ensues on some of these runs.

Will just have to completely disagree because it is overkill to demand details of this level for something that takes literally 10 minutes to run. I couldn't care less who has done what in my random. You would spend more time reading everything than actually playing, good grief.

You can also count on a guild if you bother to join one that is a match for your needs. I gave only an example of mine, that doesn't mean it's the only kind for heaven's sake. There are literally hundreds of guilds in guild finder, same with discords, where people share information like this all the time. If you just don't want to use tools already available, that's on you, not the developers.

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

So, if I’m wearin Aegis of Galenwe, Drakes Rush and the Spaulder of ruin, with a taunt on both bars BUT I use a greatsword and inferno staff, is this adequate? Just trying to get my head around it, I like tanking normal modes but even then the DPS can be just so disappointingly low

• First and foremost, I wouldn't bother optimising for random normals, but;
• Damage as a tank in mostly-heavy armour will be abysmal when compared to speccing specifically to damage. As a DK spamming Stone Giant, for example, you'll be hitting around 8k-10k single target damage if you have damage increasing CP slotted. A little more if using Maelstrom staff, assuming you're weaving.
• Since, as a tank, you would normally spec to both magicka and stamina instead of one or the other, or into a mix and use tri-stat glyphs on armour, effectiveness of both will decrease; your resource pools generally won't be as high as the average DD
• I assume you're using Stampede/Critical Rush, along with perhaps Carve/Brawler, which scale with max stamina
• Flip side, you're also using Destruction Staff, in which skills will scale with max magicka, Blockade/Unstable Wall and maybe Force Pulse/Crushing Shock?
• Speccing more exclusively towards magicka or stamina would see higher damage output from their respective skills, but damage isn't really your primary concern as a tank
  • If speccing more towards magicka, remember you still need stamina to block and dodge heavy attacks; be mindful of your resources, especially as Galenwe requires blocking which prevents stamina recovery, and Drake's Rush which consumes stamina to bash
  • If using one-hand and shield, block cost is reduced
  • If using ice staff, you get more block mitigation than using an inferno staff
  • Bear in mind destruction staff passives where you can consume magicka for blocking with ice staff instead of stamina, allowing stamina to regenerate while you're still blocking
  • I'm not going to dig into things like Brittle with ice staff as a bullet point, but this is also something you could look at if you so desired
• With Greatsword and Inferno staves, you won't have a "natural" source of both Major and Minor Breach (e.g. from Pierce Armour)
  • You would ideally slot Elemental Drain for consistent Major Breach, or a class alternative such as DK's Noxious Breath or Nightblade's Mark, and hope your two-hander procs Sundered for Minor Breach (inconsistent), or be a Templar with Power of the Light (in which you're taking up two slots for something you can get with one skill from one-hand and shield).
• If you're not using consistent debuffs like Major and Minor Breach, debuffs will change from fight to fight, meaning you may do more damage in some fights than in others, even though you're doing exactly the same thing
• What you might be better off doing is going dual staff, like a typical magicka DD with Maelstrom staff back bar, or two-hander and Maelstrom bow if playing more towards stamina

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

PvE Ratings System.

Upon forming a group, even if Random, have a UI window show everyone incoming to the group and a noticeable button that says something like: "Join" or "Cancel".

In the UI Window, there should be 3 or 4 lines showing either the Account Name or perhaps just the Character Name (whichever) and a rating of 1 to 5 Crowns per player. If they have opted out of the system, let it quickly reflect this otherwise let each player have a tag that quickly reflects general information about how other players have rated running with them as well as how many runs overall. This can be done in a safe, effective manner. The game can also auto-assign a rating like if the group finishes vDSA then everyone gets a 5 Crown rating.

Show # of times player has been kicked or has left the group early and not completed the run. (A few happenings are of course, excusable)

Allow other players to provide a short sentence describing their run experience with each player. Players can view these and if something inappropriate or inaccurate is listed they can ask for help in getting it removed.

Have each player also quickly confirm their role before clicking "Join". Allow players to have multiple roles. Allow incoming group members to quickly preview reviews for each player and decide if they want to join that group or if organizing the group, if they want to accept that player or not. (Could also quickly link their achievements also with date)

For this reason might want to attach the reviews to each character, not the account. We all make mistakes and if ppl mess up they can start over but then again someone joining a group without any history at all says something too.

Now I'm not saying it should be exactly like this, but this will straighten out things fairly hard and fast. In a straightforward manner you will have an idea who you are running with and what to expect. Then its on you. I fully endorse this or a similar system so that people who excel may shine and everyone can see where exceptions might be and focus attn on helping them or watching for any trouble rather than finding out 45 min to an 1.5 hr in to the run.

And if you don't like or want the overhead of managing actual comments, it may make things easier to be able to show simple easy to understand statistics of how each character has done per dungeon run. So if its someone who is more comfortable with normal, which is fine, then let it show that so we know they might be at Risk on something like vDSA or vAS. Again, the idea is not to keep people out of content however identifying such a person out right may help prepare for problems in advance rather than getting a Hollywood Story with lots of memorable actors and characters.

It seems to me if people need to have all this information upfront about everyone else just to do a mere random daily dungeon, then they either need to join a guild or need to stop doing randoms period if they refuse to join one. Good grief.

I know it seems like alot. And it doesn't quite have to be exactly this.

But I've seen this same thing from other games and again, I'm not sure how deep we could go regarding Privacy concerns.

However if we even had half of this I think that would matter. Cause right now for random groups you are completely in the Dark with who you're dealing with. If you see someone with a profile that's fleshed out, this generates street cred and provides confidence in people to do their role. Could also serve other purposes as well if taken a little further you can advertise your profile to Guilds or others in zone too without having to dig thru a bunch of different screens and paste elements into zone window.

My point here is that guilds are the place to do this, and they do it already. Most vet trials guilds I am in for example, will have you post your clears publicly in their discord for all to see, along with parses, gear, etc. which is totally where this type of stuff is needed.

Nobody needs all that just to do a random dungeon, come on. Total overkill.

And my point is... that's not where the problem exists. Everyone is not a member of a Trials Guild -and- add to that some Guilds will only allow people to join who demonstrate conditional merit (aside from being exceptionally exclusive in their recruiting). While this is 'their' system of checks and balances, majority of the player base cannot and likely will not ever belong to such a Guild with these kinds of measures in place.

So, we cannot count on that can we? At least not for the vast majority of the player base.

Thus, we could use something else optional to help provide guidance outside of an organized Trials Guild, subject to privacy concerns as well as future refinement yet fulfilling its intended purpose. Come to think of it this would also be a good thing because if the Devs wish they can weigh in on what the standards shall be which may actually make content more readily available to people vs trying to clash with what each Trial Guild's 'individual standards' are currently, which could leave some players behind.

Consider this as me addressing... the other side of the issue as one main reason many players go Random is its the fastest way to find a group, also because they are neither in a Guild nor know anyone or maybe players they know are not online or something. It is simply -not- overkill for wanting to know some basic information about who you are running with. Its the lack of community for why people go random and its for lack of knowledge that chaos ensues on some of these runs.

Will just have to completely disagree because it is overkill to demand details of this level for something that takes literally 10 minutes to run. I couldn't care less who has done what in my random. You would spend more time reading everything than actually playing, good grief.

You can also count on a guild if you bother to join one that is a match for your needs. I gave only an example of mine, that doesn't mean it's the only kind for heaven's sake. There are literally hundreds of guilds in guild finder, same with discords, where people share information like this all the time. If you just don't want to use tools already available, that's on you, not the developers.

Subjective. Of course there will be situations where the information is not needed as much as in other instances. Same thing applies to other concepts such as GPS. I don't need GPS to find my way to the grocery store, that's overkill. But I would trust GPS over the word of total strangers on the interstate.

With respect, Guilds are all different and we simply cannot count on them to provide quality measures for everyone, or to match everyone's interest or appetite, as these are concepts that exist only within each Guilds collective interest. I'm not certain I would provide such confidence in assuring people that a Guild will match their needs. Yes, in keeping with the spirit of this argument for the here and now, joining a PvE Guilds (or PvE Trials Guild) is the only real alternative although I think we can do better. It is also not fair to assume these same Guilds will exist to any standard or motive other than what they have chosen for themselves.

Again, this is all Subjective. The product I am describing is solid, our scope is broad at the start of development but that is how it should be. Yet as I said previously, it is open to refinement and further testing to ensure the right information would be captured and people's privacy respected. First steps are always the hardest but even with a select few Guilds helping along in their own way, even today, the problems described in this thread are still occurring very frequently and no solution cannot be our final answer to this problem.

We must embrace change we must learn to collaborate and keep our minds open for fresh ideas because doing nothing or suggesting everyone just look for a guild as the solution to all the issues mentioned here, is actually worse than taking minor, calculated risks on new ideas which could quite possibly provide solution(s) over time, solutions that may also be useful to Guilds themselves.

Thank you everyone for your time and consideration of this concept

And who is deciding what "the right information" is here? Give us a break please. The "change" you want everyone to "embrace" here is nothing more than a weeding-out system.

If you want to "learn to collaborate" then I would suggest opening your own mind and realize that a random --- again by definition -- means unspecified; no method; no conscious decision.

The suggestions here being made, none too subtle I might add, are to impose more controls so that you can "collaborate" only with the people you want to collaborate with - so obviously there are no "calculated risks" to be taken whatsoever in your suggestions.

I have been here since beta and seen this subject beaten to death. It always boils down to the same issue: people cannot accept the fact that if they step into a random, they cannot pick and choose who is doing what in the run. The tool has never been meant for anything other than facilitating groups. Imposing restrictions on who and how groups get formed beyond them being 4 people with damage, healing, and tanking represented, is all the developers have ever done with the tool.

If you want to impose even more variables, you will create not only more bottle-necking in the queue, but even more division among the players who want nothing more than to hop in and hop out and be done with it.

As for the guild system, you get exactly what you put into it. If you are expecting to find a match you have to make some effort - just as in the real world, making friends online takes some time and a modicum of investment on your part to discover what works and what doesn't.
No tool from the developers is ever going to guarantee you that it be all smooth sailing, no matter how many restrictions you build into it to weed out people you don't want to deal with.

It was said several times the player can choose to participate or opt out. The crux of the concept is for the player to be able to setup their own profile and then that profile will be scored over time using various methods. In essence, you will get what you put in and other players can see this also. This would be for people who have nothing to hide and so, I would think these are the people you want to be running with because they have gone the extra mile to stand out for this purpose.

Anyone who feels the same could step up or opt out. If you disagree feel free, you can always just opt out and go the Guild route instead, no one should think less of you and there is absolutely nothing wrong with your reason for doing so. However, I think that ultimately the answer though is a little of both. A system where players can showcase their accomplishments and a Guild to help organize runs without needing to go Random as often. Opting out is fine but you're never going to get recognized for the work you have done unless people can view these merits and dare I say, judge them for themselves.

I still think a personal profile that can be customized and easily recognized in game where I can list achievements and find basic statistics is a must have. Other games do something similar which is very useful without being intrusive. It would go a galactic mile in helping to eliminate confusion and provide information people need to help prepare for runs without generating confusion as to who has what or what you parse is. It could help inform players about what they need before asking to join a group too.

This is an opportunity I humbly and very respectfully encourage the devs to please consider when time and resources permit. It does not need to be a priority for now. Def worth looking into. And for players who opt-out, maybe a lite version could be made available to at least show off some of their achievements, if they want to use it, so they don't totally miss out on this great opportunity.

Thinly veiled examples again, of weeding people out.

What you are describing by repeatedly throwing around a lot of verbiage still doesn't change the fact it's just a set up for an exclusionary tactic being introduced into a game that was meant from inception to be inclusive.

And NO - it's not up to other people in a random group to judge me and my accomplishments in the game before I can or cannot do a stupid random. I don't need to be recognized for what I have done in the game, just to play it.

And most especially NO - when obviously there are already literally hundreds of players who buy their achievements left and right. They mean little at this point.

Troodon80 wrote: »

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

So, if I’m wearin Aegis of Galenwe, Drakes Rush and the Spaulder of ruin, with a taunt on both bars BUT I use a greatsword and inferno staff, is this adequate? Just trying to get my head around it, I like tanking normal modes but even then the DPS can be just so disappointingly low

There's nothing inherently wrong with this setup, and if it works for you then... fair play? You don't have to play one-hand and shield to be a "tank." However, there are a couple points to be made if you are referring to your own personal DPS, and even the group DPS, and I'm certainly not telling you to go play a certain way, just to point out some on-the-surface stuff:

• First and foremost, I wouldn't bother optimising for random normals, but;
• Damage as a tank in mostly-heavy armour will be abysmal when compared to speccing specifically to damage. As a DK spamming Stone Giant, for example, you'll be hitting around 8k-10k single target damage if you have damage increasing CP slotted. A little more if using Maelstrom staff, assuming you're weaving.
• Since, as a tank, you would normally spec to both magicka and stamina instead of one or the other, or into a mix and use tri-stat glyphs on armour, effectiveness of both will decrease; your resource pools generally won't be as high as the average DD
• I assume you're using Stampede/Critical Rush, along with perhaps Carve/Brawler, which scale with max stamina
• Flip side, you're also using Destruction Staff, in which skills will scale with max magicka, Blockade/Unstable Wall and maybe Force Pulse/Crushing Shock?
• Speccing more exclusively towards magicka or stamina would see higher damage output from their respective skills, but damage isn't really your primary concern as a tank
  • If speccing more towards magicka, remember you still need stamina to block and dodge heavy attacks; be mindful of your resources, especially as Galenwe requires blocking which prevents stamina recovery, and Drake's Rush which consumes stamina to bash
  • If using one-hand and shield, block cost is reduced
  • If using ice staff, you get more block mitigation than using an inferno staff
  • Bear in mind destruction staff passives where you can consume magicka for blocking with ice staff instead of stamina, allowing stamina to regenerate while you're still blocking
  • I'm not going to dig into things like Brittle with ice staff as a bullet point, but this is also something you could look at if you so desired
• With Greatsword and Inferno staves, you won't have a "natural" source of both Major and Minor Breach (e.g. from Pierce Armour)
  • You would ideally slot Elemental Drain for consistent Major Breach, or a class alternative such as DK's Noxious Breath or Nightblade's Mark, and hope your two-hander procs Sundered for Minor Breach (inconsistent), or be a Templar with Power of the Light (in which you're taking up two slots for something you can get with one skill from one-hand and shield).
• If you're not using consistent debuffs like Major and Minor Breach, debuffs will change from fight to fight, meaning you may do more damage in some fights than in others, even though you're doing exactly the same thing
• What you might be better off doing is going dual staff, like a typical magicka DD with Maelstrom staff back bar, or two-hander and Maelstrom bow if playing more towards stamina

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

PvE Ratings System.

Upon forming a group, even if Random, have a UI window show everyone incoming to the group and a noticeable button that says something like: "Join" or "Cancel".

In the UI Window, there should be 3 or 4 lines showing either the Account Name or perhaps just the Character Name (whichever) and a rating of 1 to 5 Crowns per player. If they have opted out of the system, let it quickly reflect this otherwise let each player have a tag that quickly reflects general information about how other players have rated running with them as well as how many runs overall. This can be done in a safe, effective manner. The game can also auto-assign a rating like if the group finishes vDSA then everyone gets a 5 Crown rating.

Show # of times player has been kicked or has left the group early and not completed the run. (A few happenings are of course, excusable)

Allow other players to provide a short sentence describing their run experience with each player. Players can view these and if something inappropriate or inaccurate is listed they can ask for help in getting it removed.

Have each player also quickly confirm their role before clicking "Join". Allow players to have multiple roles. Allow incoming group members to quickly preview reviews for each player and decide if they want to join that group or if organizing the group, if they want to accept that player or not. (Could also quickly link their achievements also with date)

For this reason might want to attach the reviews to each character, not the account. We all make mistakes and if ppl mess up they can start over but then again someone joining a group without any history at all says something too.

Now I'm not saying it should be exactly like this, but this will straighten out things fairly hard and fast. In a straightforward manner you will have an idea who you are running with and what to expect. Then its on you. I fully endorse this or a similar system so that people who excel may shine and everyone can see where exceptions might be and focus attn on helping them or watching for any trouble rather than finding out 45 min to an 1.5 hr in to the run.

And if you don't like or want the overhead of managing actual comments, it may make things easier to be able to show simple easy to understand statistics of how each character has done per dungeon run. So if its someone who is more comfortable with normal, which is fine, then let it show that so we know they might be at Risk on something like vDSA or vAS. Again, the idea is not to keep people out of content however identifying such a person out right may help prepare for problems in advance rather than getting a Hollywood Story with lots of memorable actors and characters.

It seems to me if people need to have all this information upfront about everyone else just to do a mere random daily dungeon, then they either need to join a guild or need to stop doing randoms period if they refuse to join one. Good grief.

I know it seems like alot. And it doesn't quite have to be exactly this.

But I've seen this same thing from other games and again, I'm not sure how deep we could go regarding Privacy concerns.

However if we even had half of this I think that would matter. Cause right now for random groups you are completely in the Dark with who you're dealing with. If you see someone with a profile that's fleshed out, this generates street cred and provides confidence in people to do their role. Could also serve other purposes as well if taken a little further you can advertise your profile to Guilds or others in zone too without having to dig thru a bunch of different screens and paste elements into zone window.

My point here is that guilds are the place to do this, and they do it already. Most vet trials guilds I am in for example, will have you post your clears publicly in their discord for all to see, along with parses, gear, etc. which is totally where this type of stuff is needed.

Nobody needs all that just to do a random dungeon, come on. Total overkill.

And my point is... that's not where the problem exists. Everyone is not a member of a Trials Guild -and- add to that some Guilds will only allow people to join who demonstrate conditional merit (aside from being exceptionally exclusive in their recruiting). While this is 'their' system of checks and balances, majority of the player base cannot and likely will not ever belong to such a Guild with these kinds of measures in place.

So, we cannot count on that can we? At least not for the vast majority of the player base.

Thus, we could use something else optional to help provide guidance outside of an organized Trials Guild, subject to privacy concerns as well as future refinement yet fulfilling its intended purpose. Come to think of it this would also be a good thing because if the Devs wish they can weigh in on what the standards shall be which may actually make content more readily available to people vs trying to clash with what each Trial Guild's 'individual standards' are currently, which could leave some players behind.

Consider this as me addressing... the other side of the issue as one main reason many players go Random is its the fastest way to find a group, also because they are neither in a Guild nor know anyone or maybe players they know are not online or something. It is simply -not- overkill for wanting to know some basic information about who you are running with. Its the lack of community for why people go random and its for lack of knowledge that chaos ensues on some of these runs.

Will just have to completely disagree because it is overkill to demand details of this level for something that takes literally 10 minutes to run. I couldn't care less who has done what in my random. You would spend more time reading everything than actually playing, good grief.

You can also count on a guild if you bother to join one that is a match for your needs. I gave only an example of mine, that doesn't mean it's the only kind for heaven's sake. There are literally hundreds of guilds in guild finder, same with discords, where people share information like this all the time. If you just don't want to use tools already available, that's on you, not the developers.

Subjective. Of course there will be situations where the information is not needed as much as in other instances. Same thing applies to other concepts such as GPS. I don't need GPS to find my way to the grocery store, that's overkill. But I would trust GPS over the word of total strangers on the interstate.

With respect, Guilds are all different and we simply cannot count on them to provide quality measures for everyone, or to match everyone's interest or appetite, as these are concepts that exist only within each Guilds collective interest. I'm not certain I would provide such confidence in assuring people that a Guild will match their needs. Yes, in keeping with the spirit of this argument for the here and now, joining a PvE Guilds (or PvE Trials Guild) is the only real alternative although I think we can do better. It is also not fair to assume these same Guilds will exist to any standard or motive other than what they have chosen for themselves.

Again, this is all Subjective. The product I am describing is solid, our scope is broad at the start of development but that is how it should be. Yet as I said previously, it is open to refinement and further testing to ensure the right information would be captured and people's privacy respected. First steps are always the hardest but even with a select few Guilds helping along in their own way, even today, the problems described in this thread are still occurring very frequently and no solution cannot be our final answer to this problem.

We must embrace change we must learn to collaborate and keep our minds open for fresh ideas because doing nothing or suggesting everyone just look for a guild as the solution to all the issues mentioned here, is actually worse than taking minor, calculated risks on new ideas which could quite possibly provide solution(s) over time, solutions that may also be useful to Guilds themselves.

Thank you everyone for your time and consideration of this concept

And who is deciding what "the right information" is here? Give us a break please. The "change" you want everyone to "embrace" here is nothing more than a weeding-out system.

If you want to "learn to collaborate" then I would suggest opening your own mind and realize that a random --- again by definition -- means unspecified; no method; no conscious decision.

The suggestions here being made, none too subtle I might add, are to impose more controls so that you can "collaborate" only with the people you want to collaborate with - so obviously there are no "calculated risks" to be taken whatsoever in your suggestions.

I have been here since beta and seen this subject beaten to death. It always boils down to the same issue: people cannot accept the fact that if they step into a random, they cannot pick and choose who is doing what in the run. The tool has never been meant for anything other than facilitating groups. Imposing restrictions on who and how groups get formed beyond them being 4 people with damage, healing, and tanking represented, is all the developers have ever done with the tool.

If you want to impose even more variables, you will create not only more bottle-necking in the queue, but even more division among the players who want nothing more than to hop in and hop out and be done with it.

As for the guild system, you get exactly what you put into it. If you are expecting to find a match you have to make some effort - just as in the real world, making friends online takes some time and a modicum of investment on your part to discover what works and what doesn't.
No tool from the developers is ever going to guarantee you that it be all smooth sailing, no matter how many restrictions you build into it to weed out people you don't want to deal with.

It was said several times the player can choose to participate or opt out. The crux of the concept is for the player to be able to setup their own profile and then that profile will be scored over time using various methods. In essence, you will get what you put in and other players can see this also. This would be for people who have nothing to hide and so, I would think these are the people you want to be running with because they have gone the extra mile to stand out for this purpose.

Anyone who feels the same could step up or opt out. If you disagree feel free, you can always just opt out and go the Guild route instead, no one should think less of you and there is absolutely nothing wrong with your reason for doing so. However, I think that ultimately the answer though is a little of both. A system where players can showcase their accomplishments and a Guild to help organize runs without needing to go Random as often. Opting out is fine but you're never going to get recognized for the work you have done unless people can view these merits and dare I say, judge them for themselves.

I still think a personal profile that can be customized and easily recognized in game where I can list achievements and find basic statistics is a must have. Other games do something similar which is very useful without being intrusive. It would go a galactic mile in helping to eliminate confusion and provide information people need to help prepare for runs without generating confusion as to who has what or what you parse is. It could help inform players about what they need before asking to join a group too.

This is an opportunity I humbly and very respectfully encourage the devs to please consider when time and resources permit. It does not need to be a priority for now. Def worth looking into. And for players who opt-out, maybe a lite version could be made available to at least show off some of their achievements, if they want to use it, so they don't totally miss out on this great opportunity.

Thinly veiled examples again, of weeding people out.

What you are describing by repeatedly throwing around a lot of verbiage still doesn't change the fact it's just a set up for an exclusionary tactic being introduced into a game that was meant from inception to be inclusive.

And NO - it's not up to other people in a random group to judge me and my accomplishments in the game before I can or cannot do a stupid random. I don't need to be recognized for what I have done in the game, just to play it.

And most especially NO - when obviously there are already literally hundreds of players who buy their achievements left and right. They mean little at this point.

The point missing here is many of us don't need and don't really want any Guild to feel they have to represent us. For those of us inclined, we should just have a standard platform to represent ourselves. Show the things we had done and what we're capable of. No one else has to participate, unless you want to step up and earn some street cred for yourself. That's what this is for, that's what it's about. If implemented everyone can choose to participate or not, ie to opt out. I welcome any criticism of the idea as I've said it would need to be vetted appropriately however, I think this is something that could help many people.

Especially if you talk about inclusion... I'm sure everyone here knows that many times you don't get picked for a group or invited to do certain kinds of content unless you know someone or are in a Guild and pass their quality assurance, which again, I have no problem with that. But this is also a limiting factor because in order to 'ride' with them, I must jump thru all kinds of hoops and conform my method to theirs. Again, this is not terrible and sometimes is necessary, but sometimes it also goes to ridiculous lengths just to prove what I've done, when a central platform, with standardized approach in a manner blessed by the Devs should act as kind of a Ticket in game to quickly tell any Guild or Group what they need to know.

It would be nice to have a tool (as described) to help people get into runs easier as well as giving us some information about where the group is at maturity wise even IF it's not needed for every situation. While I certainly welcome criticism, I respect people's right to opt out or not agree with me, even still, experience has led me to this conclusion. And don't be surprised if one day you see this implemented in some way, because due to this as well as some other problems which we have not discussed on this thread, there are reasons why this will almost certainly eventually happen. Rather than resist what is inevitable, my hope is that in discussing this, the concept may be received in a more tempered manner, with us assessing objections as well as furthering possible ideas for implementation along the way.