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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8098811/#Comment_8098811
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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8098811/#Comment_8098811
Consuming darkness completley pointless in all situation vs Soul Syphon? PVE dicussion
Foxtrot39
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From a tank perspective
Consuming darkness and its morphs :
-Everyone in the zone get major protection (-10% damage taken) while inside and all but the caster can use a synergy, it last 20s top with passive/max level
-Ally can use a synergy to become invisible, get a burst heal while inside of the AOE (5m radius) and a unique speed bonus while snaring enemies
-You can get some damage using veil of blade morph, as a tank its rather useless
-Bolstering darkness allow to keep the major protection buff even after leaving the AOE
Problem :
-The tank only get acces to the major protection buff, for a 200 ult cost thats abysmall utility that don't give any percievable breathing space for the tank
-You get much better result with a potion + block wich litteraly outclass the entire ult utility for the tank using it
-Is usualy used where you DON'T want ally to go making the synergy nigh useless and more of a death trap, beside, no one tend to stand close enough to you to even use it
-Effectively a much worser tanking tool than the shield ult wich reduce a lot of pressure and allow ressource gain
Soul Syphon :
-8m range
-Cost 50 less ult
-Safe range synergy for ally
-Grant a single use strong lifesteal synergy on enemies
-Burst heal followed by a even bigger burst heal while granting major vitality so you burst heal on a burst heal while getting bonus heal received ( insert "yo dawg I heard ya like healing" meme here) making it a powerfull tanking tool as you can regen your entire health by stacking it with another heal or two on top of fully healing all ally in range
To compare both skill
-Soul syphon : You heal for a truck load wich reduces pressure and give ally a lifesteal synergy they can use at safe distance even when having nothing put into increasing offensive stats wich the skill scale from
Consuming darkness and morphs : -10% damage taken for 20s and a bit of damage with veil of blade combined with a ally only synergy that is barely usable due to where the cast point is located at
So question :
Why is the class's healer ult better in every possible way compared to any of the class's tank ult skill + morphs for the purpose of tanking and why has consumming darkness not been updated after being made completely irrelevent for a tank to run despite being a tank focused ultimate?
I heard that before it granted a whooping 30% mitigation before major protection got nerfed hard, thing is thats the only usefull thing the entire skill had to offer to a tank
The synergy is completely counter intuitive, asking for ally to go into the most dangerous area in a fight to gain damage reduction, it can be summed up by "avoiding danger by exposing yourself to even more danger ", something only Sheogorath would approve of
You can find morphs of ult that are considered useless in any class depending if its for PVE or PVP but here the entire ability as a concept is useless as a whole and doesn't even has utility
Want to protect allies when healer can't spam fast enough ? Out heal the damage they take with soul syphon
In a bad spot and low on health? Soul syphon basicaly put you back to full health in 4s
And thanks to Soul syphon lowered cost compared to consumming darkness you can even spam it more often
Right now its more of a fancy looking snare AOE with a build in heal synergy wich caltrop does way better since you can spam it while slotting a more useful ultimate
DK for the same cost get a litteral god mod for 10s wich also give damage shield equal to allies max health
Necro gets 30k extra HP + AOE lifesteal for 20s but cost more
Warden for the same cost get a much larger damage AOE wich snare and debuff enemies while also granting major protection
NB get a small 20s snare AOE granting major protection and thats basicaly it
Sorcerer and Templar don't really have a true tank oriented ultimate
Edited by Foxtrot39 on October 11, 2021 12:41AM Consuming darkness and its morphs :
-Everyone in the zone get major protection (-10% damage taken) while inside and all but the caster can use a synergy, it last 20s top with passive/max level
-Ally can use a synergy to become invisible, get a burst heal while inside of the AOE (5m radius) and a unique speed bonus while snaring enemies
-You can get some damage using veil of blade morph, as a tank its rather useless
-Bolstering darkness allow to keep the major protection buff even after leaving the AOE
Problem :
-The tank only get acces to the major protection buff, for a 200 ult cost thats abysmall utility that don't give any percievable breathing space for the tank
-You get much better result with a potion + block wich litteraly outclass the entire ult utility for the tank using it
-Is usualy used where you DON'T want ally to go making the synergy nigh useless and more of a death trap, beside, no one tend to stand close enough to you to even use it
-Effectively a much worser tanking tool than the shield ult wich reduce a lot of pressure and allow ressource gain
Soul Syphon :
-8m range
-Cost 50 less ult
-Safe range synergy for ally
-Grant a single use strong lifesteal synergy on enemies
-Burst heal followed by a even bigger burst heal while granting major vitality so you burst heal on a burst heal while getting bonus heal received ( insert "yo dawg I heard ya like healing" meme here) making it a powerfull tanking tool as you can regen your entire health by stacking it with another heal or two on top of fully healing all ally in range
To compare both skill
-Soul syphon : You heal for a truck load wich reduces pressure and give ally a lifesteal synergy they can use at safe distance even when having nothing put into increasing offensive stats wich the skill scale from
Consuming darkness and morphs : -10% damage taken for 20s and a bit of damage with veil of blade combined with a ally only synergy that is barely usable due to where the cast point is located at
So question :
Why is the class's healer ult better in every possible way compared to any of the class's tank ult skill + morphs for the purpose of tanking and why has consumming darkness not been updated after being made completely irrelevent for a tank to run despite being a tank focused ultimate?
I heard that before it granted a whooping 30% mitigation before major protection got nerfed hard, thing is thats the only usefull thing the entire skill had to offer to a tank
The synergy is completely counter intuitive, asking for ally to go into the most dangerous area in a fight to gain damage reduction, it can be summed up by "avoiding danger by exposing yourself to even more danger ", something only Sheogorath would approve of
You can find morphs of ult that are considered useless in any class depending if its for PVE or PVP but here the entire ability as a concept is useless as a whole and doesn't even has utility
Want to protect allies when healer can't spam fast enough ? Out heal the damage they take with soul syphon
In a bad spot and low on health? Soul syphon basicaly put you back to full health in 4s
And thanks to Soul syphon lowered cost compared to consumming darkness you can even spam it more often
Right now its more of a fancy looking snare AOE with a build in heal synergy wich caltrop does way better since you can spam it while slotting a more useful ultimate
DK for the same cost get a litteral god mod for 10s wich also give damage shield equal to allies max health
Necro gets 30k extra HP + AOE lifesteal for 20s but cost more
Warden for the same cost get a much larger damage AOE wich snare and debuff enemies while also granting major protection
NB get a small 20s snare AOE granting major protection and thats basicaly it
Sorcerer and Templar don't really have a true tank oriented ultimate
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Ksariyu✭✭✭✭I think the real issue is just how bad melee is in the current meta. Realistically, if you had melee DPS with you, Consuming Darkness would actually be kinda great. Major protection for you and your buddies, and if any of them are taking too much heat they can dip with the synergy, giving them a heal and the ability to quickly back out. The radius is arguably a little on the small side, especially for an ult, but the design makes sense. As a tank ultimate, additional defenses and the ability to remove aggro for a short time should be incredibly beneficial, and it has the added bonus of keeping mobs in one place with the snare.
As far as Soul Siphon, it is a support ultimate, so it makes sense that it heals for a ton. It is a lot easier to use, admittedly, but again, that's more of a symptom of the general combat design rather than the skill itself being explicitly better. But you also only have 4 seconds of that bonus healing, compared to 10 seconds of extra protection with Consuming Darkness (At base, 16 seconds at max).
In general though, it doesn't really matter. Warhorn + Shield Wall are the only tank ultimates anyone ever uses in PvE, because they both are actually THAT much better.0 -
Foxtrot39✭✭✭✭An ult that only benefit allies, and that if they stick to you wich is by far one of the riskiest location at any given moment isn't all that great for a tank even more so in trial where no one even go near you to avoid the boss frontal AOE
The tank itself barely get anything from it so a tank skill that has no real use for the tank seems just wrong
Make as much sens as if magma armor only gave allies near you the ridiculous 97% mitigation while you only get a 20% max hp damage shield, as tank if you die so are likely your allies
So the minimum is having the tank ult always help the tank doing its job, snare doesn't affect large enemies and there is enough caltrops going around to make it redundant
The skill needs to give something more to the tank that actually make a difference in tanking, major protection shoudl by defautl remain active when you leave the area and the AoE get extended to make using the synergy less dangerous for allies while making the snare more usefull
Bolsetring darkness needs to assist the tank (or anyone else) in survivability either via heal, ressource gain or other mean, major protection alone is simply not worth the ult
Veil of blade should be a damage focused buff area of some sort, the damage itself isn't all that great though decent
Would give an ult usable for off tank and main tank alike
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