Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Like telling an alcoholic not to drink, like telling someone with an eating disorder to just "eat properly" and so.

Well.. yes of course that's the correct reply!

If you are an alcoholic, get help and stay away from the booze. If you have an eating disorder, seek help and sort it out.

What you don't do is ask the government to take you and everyone else by the hand by prohibiting pubs and fast food joints because some people are unable to handle their addiction. Everyone is responsible for their actions and their lives. The society can help those people, but it does not help anyone if we prophylactically shut down everything that might possibly have an influence on people with a tendency to excessive usage.

kratier wrote: »

i just dumped 40 bucks worth of crowns

This, and only this is the reason why. A lot of people complain about the odds, but too much people buy those crates anyway.

Jura23 wrote: »

Ppl should buy crates primarily to support the game they want to play, not to get pixels. Those are included only so that you get "something" for your money, but its not the point.

I'm on eso+, and I buy additional crowns when they're on sale, but I only buy things directly from the crown store. No more support needed imo.

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

thorwyn wrote: »

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Like telling an alcoholic not to drink, like telling someone with an eating disorder to just "eat properly" and so.

Well.. yes of course that's the correct reply!

If you are an alcoholic, get help and stay away from the booze. If you have an eating disorder, seek help and sort it out.

What you don't do is ask the government to take you and everyone else by the hand by prohibiting pubs and fast food joints because some people are unable to handle their addiction. Everyone is responsible for their actions and their lives. The society can help those people, but it does not help anyone if we prophylactically shut down everything that might possibly have an influence on people with a tendency to excessive usage.

Well ... No.

Your post encapsulates the point i was making. The lack of understanding about the subject you're commenting on. If only it was as easy as "seeking help". Don't you think these people don't know the damage they are doing to themselves? You seriously think any straight thinking individual would drink themselves to death, gamble away everything they have worked for and so on if it was so simple. The reasons behind such destructive behaviour are complex and often multifaceted. If you're willing to destroy your life through destructive actions, you're also unlikely to seek that help any time soon. That usually happens at rock bottom.

If someone has a "gambling addiction" that gets triggered off these loot boxes, they should definitely be totally avoiding any games with random loot (doing Baal runs in Diablo, running vma over & over looking for your perfected <whatever>, opening treasure chests looking for Ancient Motif leads, doing delve dailies to get the rare drops from the reward pack..) because that's triggering those same impulses. Just avoid all "loot" games entirely.

And that stuff has been the basis of nearly all "RPG" style games for a 2-3 decades. Long before cash shops, gacha games, f2p mobile trash...

TheEndBringer wrote: »

I find it pretty funny that there are people in this thread bashing people who maybe, just maybe, would only just appreciate a little better chance at getting something they actually want from these crates. Especially when it's the people who buy the crates that are helping fund the game you enjoy playing.

I have no issue with loot crates when they aren't filled with 75% garbage.

"Oh well that's how they get you to buy more!"

Exactly. It's predatory. Maybe you have no desire to waste money trying to get that polymorph or mount. Then you see 20 people riding around with it and they look awesome. It preys on a weakness we all have to one degree or another: envy.

If they don't want to increase the chances of getting the cool stuff, at least get rid of the garbage that you could just put up for sale for crowns. Head dresses. Markings. Hairstyles that you can't even change the color of without buying an appearance change token. It's all bs they used to water down the crates.

I don't think it is bashing people who want a better chance of getting something so much as pointing out they know how low the chance is and they do it anyway. By all means complain that the good drops should be increased. But don't complain because things happened just like you expected them to happen when you purchased the crates.

kratier wrote: »

you got the gems, but like, i just dumped 40 bucks worth of crowns and got jack from it. Its been years, like can you move past this awful crap already? I know you want to weasel money from loyal players but , make them better, they are the worst aspect of this game. You only did endeavors because microsoft forced you to. If you want to see an area of the game you can drastically improve, thats one of them. Your loot crates feel like a complete scam and rip off. I've played gacha games with better odds and doesn't feel like a complete rip off.

It's why I finally stopped buying the crates.

In the beginning, they were fine. If you bought a pack of 15, you were sure to get some nice stuff - mounts, pets etc.
Now, all you get are potions, stones and other stuff no one needs.

So... by trying to 'cheat' the customer out of the money, ZOS has really achieved the opposite, at least with me. I'm no longer buying.

Stuff I like that pops up in the store, I buy if the cost is not to outrageous. But ZoS can count on the fact I will not buy loot boxes, ever..

Your post encapsulates the point i was making. The lack of understanding about the subject you're commenting on. If only it was as easy as "seeking help". Don't you think these people don't know the damage they are doing to themselves? You seriously think any straight thinking individual would drink themselves to death, gamble away everything they have worked for and so on if it was so simple. The reasons behind such destructive behaviour are complex and often multifaceted. If you're willing to destroy your life through destructive actions, you're also unlikely to seek that help any time soon. That usually happens at rock bottom.

Believe me, I do understand the complexity and the destructive elements of addictions. But we can not counter addictions by eliminating any triggers. You illustrated that point in your very own post when you mentioned alcoholism and food addiction. Pubs exist, Burger King exists, gambling exists and so do a gazillion of other thigns that people are addcted to. Expecting the society to shape the world accordingly and create an environment where everyone is safe and sound and without any triggers is naive. Such a world does not and will never exist. And it is naive to expect that banning loot boxes will save ANY gambling addict from his/her problems.
What we can and should do is offer help and support to those who are affected by addictions and hint them into the right direction. But at the end of the day, they have to reach the point whrere they realize that they need help and ask for it. Up to that point, everything they do is covered by their freedom of choice and if it takes rock bottom to reach that point, then it is how it is. And until then, all we are entitled (and qualified) to do is to say "stay off the crap buddy".

The costs to Apex Mount ratio should be posted for each Crown Crate iteration.

You should know as a consumer it is roughly $25, $50, $100, or $150 by design.

You might get lucky and you might get unlucky but on average the expected cost to apex ration is "X"

Hiding the cost behind a gambling mechanic is just a tactic to hide the real cost to the consumer.