Vateshran Weapon Adjustments Please

Solariken · August 2021

2h -

Make the PBAOE burst proc on 2h heavy/medium attacks only. There is no reason the explosion needs to be able to proc on DW or any other weapon. This will keep the item's power intact while partially addressing the ability for certain builds to stack an incredible amount of damage in a very fast DW medium attack and follow up with an unavoidable spin2win.
Change the stat bonus to either weapon damage, crit, or penetration; stop giving my resource pools whiplash.

DW -

Remove the requirement to stand behind the target. Nobody is using this set (mostly because Hidden Blade itself sucks as a skill) and this change would make the skill viable by virtue of the set's effects being more reliable.

Destro -

Remove the cooldown. 100% uptime is already possible with no LOS, and it costs a GCD to refresh anyway. This change would simply allow target switching.
Reduce the damage by ~ 10%.
Please make the damage type and VFX match the staff you are wielding. Can you please let us RP pure element mages and stop putting all 3 elemental types into so many destro skills. (see also Wild Impulse).

Resto -

Remove the cooldown. 100% uptime is already possible with no LOS, and it costs a GCD to refresh anyway.
Change the stat bonus to either weapon damage, crit, or penetration; stop giving my resource pools whiplash.

1h/S -

Change the stat bonus to either resists, %mitigation, or healing received; stop giving my resource pools whiplash.

YandereGirlfriend · August 2021

I like these changes.

As a further pet adjustment, I would love to see the hit box of the Resto tether slightly enlarged and/or to provide its effects in a radius around the caster a la Braided Tether. It would also be nice to have the range extended to 28 meters to match the skill that it is paired with. That would have no impact on PvP but would do wonders for quality of life in PvE.

vesselwiththepestle · August 2021

To Vateshran 2h I would like to add:

Change heavy/medium attack in such way, that you can't do a medium attack while you are in the uppercut animation. (You can start a medium attack during the uppercut animation. As soon as Uppercut ends and deals damage, you can let go of the button and you will execute a medium attack, which will proc Vateshran 2h and let's you animation cancel into an Executioner, of course.) That you can actually prepare a medium attack while you are casting a skill with a cast time seems wrong.

I like your proposed change to Vateshran DW. I am very sad I can't properly use this weapon in solo content.

Sluggy · August 2021

Yeah, I can agree with most of these changes except probably the DW. That's a bit weird since it is basically useless in a lot of solo content like you said. However, in PvP that thing can hit some insane numbers (I've seen it go as high as 50k) when ganking so I dunno that I'd want it just working all of the time with basically no effort to get involved in the fight.

Also to add to the 2-hand suggestions. Maybe let's also go back to the way it was originally when casting non-stam skills like Bull Netch didn't build stacks.

zvavi · August 2021

vesselwiththepestle wrote: »

To Vateshran 2h I would like to add:

Change heavy/medium attack in such way, that you can't do a medium attack while you are in the uppercut animation. (You can start a medium attack during the uppercut animation. As soon as Uppercut ends and deals damage, you can let go of the button and you will execute a medium attack, which will proc Vateshran 2h and let's you animation cancel into an Executioner, of course.) That you can actually prepare a medium attack while you are casting a skill with a cast time seems wrong.

I never understood how to counter vate 2h. I don't know if it is this combo but vate always seemed to proc without any counter play, people using medium attacks that keep their skill usage on 1 gcd, and even of you manage to dodge the medium attack a moment later another is coming at you. How do you counter vate 2h? Do you just eat that damage and outheal?

GRXRG · August 2021

zvavi wrote: »

vesselwiththepestle wrote: »

To Vateshran 2h I would like to add:

Change heavy/medium attack in such way, that you can't do a medium attack while you are in the uppercut animation. (You can start a medium attack during the uppercut animation. As soon as Uppercut ends and deals damage, you can let go of the button and you will execute a medium attack, which will proc Vateshran 2h and let's you animation cancel into an Executioner, of course.) That you can actually prepare a medium attack while you are casting a skill with a cast time seems wrong.

I never understood how to counter vate 2h. I don't know if it is this combo but vate always seemed to proc without any counter play, people using medium attacks that keep their skill usage on 1 gcd, and even of you manage to dodge the medium attack a moment later another is coming at you. How do you counter vate 2h? Do you just eat that damage and outheal?

Nowadays in my recap I see vate2h proc for 2-3k at best, and I am not running pariah.

It is used for the extra weapon damage and of course extra added damage in your combos and because there isn't a valid arena 2h alternative. Lately I'm trying out master2h again with brawler because dizzy get stuck on air 50% of the times due to lag. It's decent, but not nearly as good.

Just sidestep during fights and the proc will miss a lot more times then you think.

Before this patch 7k vate2h in my recaps were so common, now not even close and next patch with more mitigation will be even less relevant.

As for vate destro the only thing i would do is fixing the permanent *** beam who doesn't go away from you even after you died or at 3k range.

Rest of the weapons i don't care, i dont use them and there are better skills of arena weapons to use.

GrumpyDuckling · August 2021

100% agree about removing the cooldowns on the Staves. I'd love to be able to switch targets.

Dual Wield is an absolute trash. I have no desire to burn 2 pieces on it.

Andre_Noir · August 2021

GRXRG wrote: »

Nowadays in my recap I see vate2h proc for 2-3k at best, and I am not running pariah.
...
Before this patch 7k vate2h in my recaps were so common, now not even close and next patch with more mitigation will be even less relevant.

It's all proc's scaling nothing else changed

Merforum · August 2021

The 2 hand vat should require full charged heavy with any weapon. But if medium is allowed to proc it the damage should be cut in half or more. BTW when people stack 8+K WD the proc is even more insane than it used to be. And also they are using assassin, cryst wpn and maybe ashen grip so that single medium attack is procing 4 procs all with insane tooltips, all at once. No need for ultimates. Just 1 medium attack and maybe 1 spin to win.

Stx · August 2021

I haven't experienced many deaths due to vateshran 2 hander so I don't think its really that bad but I tend to agree with the logic that when something is overused it tends to also be overperforming.

I wouldn't mind it if they made the requirement a full heavy or kept it at medium but reduced the burst and added a dot or slightly increased the damage buff.

EF321 · August 2021

SnB needs either a range increase, smart target furthest enemies, to have cooldown per target or lower general cooldown. Something out of this.

Jackey · August 2021

The destro needs to get a reduced visual effect. That massive beam tends to get stuck which is quite annoying.

Zekka · August 2021

Solariken wrote: »

2h -
Make the PBAOE burst proc on 2h heavy/medium attacks only. There is no reason the explosion needs to be able to proc on DW or any other weapon. This will keep the item's power intact while partially addressing the ability for certain builds to stack an incredible amount of damage in a very fast DW medium attack and follow up with an unavoidable spin2win.

Change the stat bonus to either weapon damage, crit, or penetration; stop giving my resource pools whiplash.

I would go one step further with this weapon: make the proc activate on fully charged heavies only, and only on the 2h bar.
And for good measure I would also change Deadlands Assassin, it's way too stat dense right now. Either convert the 2 first lines of weapon damage to crit chance or completely remove the 5 pieces 200 weapon damage.

Then I would go back in time and completely drop this game before all this *** was added in the game.