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Is Jabs a direct damage or AOE skills?
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Jabbs_Giggity✭✭✭✭✭Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »Oakmontowls_ESO wrote: »Direct damage and AoE aren't mutually exclusive.
They are not, actually. There are two types of damage: 1. Direct Damage 2. Damage over Time.
Biting Jabs and Puncturing Sweeps are Direct Damage.
There are two types of damage skills: 1. Area of Effect 2. Single Target.
Biting Jabs and Puncturing Sweeps are a combination of both (while mostly considered a Channeled AOE) where the closest target is considered Single Target with the greatest damage multiplier, non-closest target(s) are struck by the AOE portion of each skills at a reduced damage multiplier.
The skills is dodge-able (and very easily at that) and block-able. The skill's effectiveness is also still reduced by Major Evasion.
Care to enlighten us all how to dodge jabs so easily? And no "dodging out of the aoe radius of jabs" does not mean dodgeable
Actually, to strafe outside of the radius is, by definition, dodging...SMH.
1. Dodge-roll
2. Walk-through
3. Walk-around
Ways to mitigate Jabs/Sweeps:
1. Major Evasion
2. CP (If applicable)
3. Block
4. Skills/Gear that offer Major Protection/Damage reduction
5. Roots
6. CC's
7. Don't engage if you are unsure how to do the above...3 -
SodanTok✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »Oakmontowls_ESO wrote: »Direct damage and AoE aren't mutually exclusive.
They are not, actually. There are two types of damage: 1. Direct Damage 2. Damage over Time.
Biting Jabs and Puncturing Sweeps are Direct Damage.
There are two types of damage skills: 1. Area of Effect 2. Single Target.
Biting Jabs and Puncturing Sweeps are a combination of both (while mostly considered a Channeled AOE) where the closest target is considered Single Target with the greatest damage multiplier, non-closest target(s) are struck by the AOE portion of each skills at a reduced damage multiplier.
The skills is dodge-able (and very easily at that) and block-able. The skill's effectiveness is also still reduced by Major Evasion.
Care to enlighten us all how to dodge jabs so easily? And no "dodging out of the aoe radius of jabs" does not mean dodgeable
Actually, to strafe outside of the radius is, by definition, dodging...SMH.
1. Dodge-roll
2. Walk-through
3. Walk-around
Ways to mitigate Jabs/Sweeps:
1. Major Evasion
2. CP (If applicable)
3. Block
4. Skills/Gear that offer Major Protection/Damage reduction
5. Roots
6. CC's
7. Don't engage if you are unsure how to do the above...
No, being able to avoid attack by issuing dodge roll even if not changing location marks it as dodgeable attack by very clear albeit game specific Dev and Players embraced definition. Jabs are therefore not dodgeable attack.
Hell in ESO strafing outside of radius is not even way to avoid many AoE attacks as player position is not updated till roll is finished. Be it bug or (un)intended behavior further causing definition you are going by as very much false in this game.
//EDIT:
Feel free to reeducate yourself here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4820516/#Comment_4820516Edited by SodanTok on April 6, 2020 12:52PM0 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Theres a third type in single target with splash that is not clean and consistent. . Jabs, One morph of 2 hand execute, onslaught, force pulse, etc. Jabs and onslaught are the only ones effected by evasion and treated like true AOE, yet onslaught can be dodged by its main target to where there is no AOE then done to 2ndary targets, and jabs cannot be dodged but 2ndary damage is quite small.0 -
Jabbs_Giggity✭✭✭✭✭Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »Oakmontowls_ESO wrote: »Direct damage and AoE aren't mutually exclusive.
They are not, actually. There are two types of damage: 1. Direct Damage 2. Damage over Time.
Biting Jabs and Puncturing Sweeps are Direct Damage.
There are two types of damage skills: 1. Area of Effect 2. Single Target.
Biting Jabs and Puncturing Sweeps are a combination of both (while mostly considered a Channeled AOE) where the closest target is considered Single Target with the greatest damage multiplier, non-closest target(s) are struck by the AOE portion of each skills at a reduced damage multiplier.
The skills is dodge-able (and very easily at that) and block-able. The skill's effectiveness is also still reduced by Major Evasion.
Care to enlighten us all how to dodge jabs so easily? And no "dodging out of the aoe radius of jabs" does not mean dodgeable
Actually, to strafe outside of the radius is, by definition, dodging...SMH.
1. Dodge-roll
2. Walk-through
3. Walk-around
Ways to mitigate Jabs/Sweeps:
1. Major Evasion
2. CP (If applicable)
3. Block
4. Skills/Gear that offer Major Protection/Damage reduction
5. Roots
6. CC's
7. Don't engage if you are unsure how to do the above...
No, being able to avoid attack by issuing dodge roll even if not changing location marks it as dodge able attack by very clear albeit game specific Dev and Players embraced definition. Jabs are therefore not dodge able attack.
Hell in ESO strafing outside of radius is not even way to avoid many AoE attacks as player position is not updated till roll is finished. Be it bug or (un)intended behavior further causing definition you are going by as very much false in this game.
//EDIT:
Feel free to reeducate yourself here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4820516/#Comment_4820516
Not sure where in your edit link it refers to this topic...Jabs/Sweeps is not even listed in that link as either Non-dodgeable nor Non-blockable...What am I supposed to re-educate myself on?
By very definition, avoiding damage that would otherwise be taken is considered dodging. However, in ESO it is correct to state that avoiding damage via dodge roll will grant temporary immunity to secondary effects of enemy abilities like snares, stuns and other crowd control effects.0 -
MashmalloMan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »Oakmontowls_ESO wrote: »Direct damage and AoE aren't mutually exclusive.
They are not, actually. There are two types of damage: 1. Direct Damage 2. Damage over Time.
Biting Jabs and Puncturing Sweeps are Direct Damage.
There are two types of damage skills: 1. Area of Effect 2. Single Target.
Biting Jabs and Puncturing Sweeps are a combination of both (while mostly considered a Channeled AOE) where the closest target is considered Single Target with the greatest damage multiplier, non-closest target(s) are struck by the AOE portion of each skills at a reduced damage multiplier.
The skills is dodge-able (and very easily at that) and block-able. The skill's effectiveness is also still reduced by Major Evasion.
Care to enlighten us all how to dodge jabs so easily? And no "dodging out of the aoe radius of jabs" does not mean dodgeable
Actually, to strafe outside of the radius is, by definition, dodging...SMH.
1. Dodge-roll
2. Walk-through
3. Walk-around
Ways to mitigate Jabs/Sweeps:
1. Major Evasion
2. CP (If applicable)
3. Block
4. Skills/Gear that offer Major Protection/Damage reduction
5. Roots
6. CC's
7. Don't engage if you are unsure how to do the above...
No, being able to avoid attack by issuing dodge roll even if not changing location marks it as dodge able attack by very clear albeit game specific Dev and Players embraced definition. Jabs are therefore not dodge able attack.
Hell in ESO strafing outside of radius is not even way to avoid many AoE attacks as player position is not updated till roll is finished. Be it bug or (un)intended behavior further causing definition you are going by as very much false in this game.
//EDIT:
Feel free to reeducate yourself here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4820516/#Comment_4820516
Not sure where in your edit link it refers to this topic...Jabs/Sweeps is not even listed in that link as either Non-dodgeable nor Non-blockable...What am I supposed to re-educate myself on?
By very definition, avoiding damage that would otherwise be taken is considered dodging. However, in ESO it is correct to state that avoiding damage via dodge roll will grant temporary immunity to secondary effects of enemy abilities like snares, stuns and other crowd control effects.
You guys are arguing about nothing. Both of you understand what each other are trying to say. The attack is not dodgeable (roll dodge), you can obviously avoid it via line of sight because it's a channel ability, luckily it also adds a snare making that more difficult to accomplish.
He's right in pointing out you saying it's "dodgeable" will be taken in the wrong way. In ESO context, dodge/dodgeable is synonymous with dodge rolling. Your comments just further confuse people when you say something is dodgeable when you can't use dodge roll to negate the damage.PC Beta - 2200+ CP
Stam Sorc Khajiit PvE/PVP Main || Stam Sorc Dark Elf PvP ||
Stam Templar Dark Elf || Stam Warden Wood Elf || Stam DK Nord || Stam Necro Orc || Stam Blade Khajiit
Mag Sorc High Elf || Mag Templar High Elf || Mag Warden Breton || Mag Necro Khajiit || Mag Blade Khajiit1 -
MashmalloMan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Theres a third type in single target with splash that is not clean and consistent. . Jabs, One morph of 2 hand execute, onslaught, force pulse, etc. Jabs and onslaught are the only ones effected by evasion and treated like true AOE, yet onslaught can be dodged by its main target to where there is no AOE then done to 2ndary targets, and jabs cannot be dodged but 2ndary damage is quite small.
Yeah people have pointed out that some of this doesn't make sense.
In my opinion, abilities that require a single target to activate, but also include extra aoe damage beyond the first enemy hit should have the initial damage counted as Single Target damage(dodgeable) and the splash damage counted as AoE damage (non dodgeable). Something seems to have stopped ZOS from coding these types of skills in 2 different ways.
Splash/Cleave Damage skills that should fit this category include Silver Shards, Onslaught, Reverse Slice, Lotus Fan, etc. None of these can be cast without a target, they all do damage to the first target with aoe damage afterwards.
Jabs/Sweeps I would not consider a part of this category because It does not require a single target to cast, the tooltip simply states the closest target takes 100% damage while all other targets in its cone take 40% damage. Crescent Sweep is handled the exact same way. Brawler/Cleave for 2H, Dawnbreaker, Necro Sythe. They're all just conal aoes, the damage distinction on "closest target" is just a part of how the aoe damage is calculated.
Only recently did they update channels like Flurry/Jabs/Sweeps to be considered direct damage instead of dot. I mean this makes sense, it's not damage over time that you apply and forget. It's multiple direct damage hits in quick succession. I'd imagine since this was only done recently, we could see these other "splash" type abilities altered to match the games predefined rules for these damage types.
The oddest category would be abilities that DO require a single target to cast, but the damage is entirely aoe. This includes Necro Blast Bones, Sorc Curse, Meteor, Inevitable Detonation, etc. I'm pretty sure you can dodge BB, but it is considered aoe and is mitigated by evasion which as many have pointed out, breaks the rules of their game.Edited by MashmalloMan on April 7, 2020 2:53AMPC Beta - 2200+ CP
Stam Sorc Khajiit PvE/PVP Main || Stam Sorc Dark Elf PvP ||
Stam Templar Dark Elf || Stam Warden Wood Elf || Stam DK Nord || Stam Necro Orc || Stam Blade Khajiit
Mag Sorc High Elf || Mag Templar High Elf || Mag Warden Breton || Mag Necro Khajiit || Mag Blade Khajiit0 -
Strasa.VozaSoul ShrivenSo, on reading this thread, it appears that Biting Jabs is simultaneously Direct Damage, AoE, Single Target, DoT, Channeled, AND Physical? Is that correct?
In terms of CP, that means that ANY node on the tip of the spear will boost it, correct?
Is there any other attribute assigned to Biting Jabs that I should know about? I read somewhere that it's not quite melee?0 -
Amerises✭✭✭✭Strasa.Voza wrote: »So, on reading this thread, it appears that Biting Jabs is simultaneously Direct Damage, AoE, Single Target, DoT, Channeled, AND Physical? Is that correct?
In terms of CP, that means that ANY node on the tip of the spear will boost it, correct?
Is there any other attribute assigned to Biting Jabs that I should know about? I read somewhere that it's not quite melee?
As others have said, Direct Damage and AoE. Not single target, nor a DoT. It is also a CHANNELED ability, which matters for how its used, as well as certain sets. Also, ANY ability that uses stam is physical and ANY ability that uses Magika is magic. So if you use the magika morph of biting jabs, it's magic.1 -
Ippokrates✭✭✭✭✭If you have any doubts, just switch stars in CP window and you will see how dmg of your skills is changing.1
