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What changes would you like to see to the visuals of armor?
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Varana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It baffles the mind that they actually do have the hide options coded, but don't allow us to use them. Why on earth?
To be fair, all these screenshots show is that they have an interface for these options in place, not necessarily that they actually work.
The Hide Shoulders option, or the option to hide any actual armour piece, is probably actually there.
But for hip and crotch flaps, these screens show that they started working on that at some point. Whether they actually got around doing it, is another question. Because this would require defining what the flaps are on individual armour pieces, and possibly reworking some pieces because simply hiding the flap would leave holes or bad textures, I think this is much more time-consuming than just hiding complete pieces.
So while I'd be glad to be wrong, I wouldn't get my hopes up, and the screenshots or the variables don't mean they just have to switch it on to work.0 -
Tesman85✭✭✭✭It baffles the mind that they actually do have the hide options coded, but don't allow us to use them. Why on earth?
To be fair, all these screenshots show is that they have an interface for these options in place, not necessarily that they actually work.
The Hide Shoulders option, or the option to hide any actual armour piece, is probably actually there.
But for hip and crotch flaps, these screens show that they started working on that at some point. Whether they actually got around doing it, is another question. Because this would require defining what the flaps are on individual armour pieces, and possibly reworking some pieces because simply hiding the flap would leave holes or bad textures, I think this is much more time-consuming than just hiding complete pieces.
So while I'd be glad to be wrong, I wouldn't get my hopes up, and the screenshots or the variables don't mean they just have to switch it on to work.
Yes, you might be right. On second thought, the flap hiding options could still be under development. It's probably the best explanation. Still, it does get my hopes up that there're already places for them. That might mean we'll get those options some day.0 -
tenryuta✭✭✭1. No more armor that deforms your body (like inflated boobs, distended bellies, shrunken hips and legs)
2. Less crotch flaps - make better designed leg armors that don't need to be hidden.
3. Less floaty thigh flap, floaty shoulders, floaty belts, make it fit better.
4. Less of the '3D-printed plastic' look that looks nothing like real material (that some of the new styles have).
when did they add the pso2 accessory fake boobs(costume piece), or is there an armor that gives more 'room' than the cc sliders can give us0 -
DreamyLu✭✭✭✭✭
✭Personally, I would love if they would create some armors with less "middle age" look (more modern, hard to explain what I mean), with lighter mats and most of all, mats allowing for colors to reflect true selves. Generally, to my eyes, no matter the material, the colors never look what they are: they're always sort of faded/greyed out. Matter of taste of course.
I'm out of my mind, feel free to leave a message... PC/NA1 -
NotaDaedraWorshipper✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The tasset/flappy thing should go completely or be on both sides like older motifs imo
This is really annoying me regarding the Ancestral Imperial style. The Imperial chests are one of the few styles that actually look pretty good with their flaps, but the Ancestral version has removed them except the crotch flap so it looks awful.[Lie] Of course! I don't even worship Daedra!2 -
NotaDaedraWorshipper✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'll never understand what the problem with the flaps is, I think it looks good. Take, for example, the Roman pteryges, metal-studded leather strips that hung from the belt in the crotch region. They also had no real function and were only there mainly for decoration.
@Lugaldu If only they could give us those kind of nice flaps. But nah, they just add other weird stuff and put pteruges on helmets and other random places. Or on the rare occations they do place them in the right area, then it is just a few of them glued to the side of some leggings or somesuch.[Lie] Of course! I don't even worship Daedra!1 -
Morgha_Kul✭✭✭✭✭
✭Seems there's a consensus on the floating bits... I'll add weapons to that. I find it discouraging that my sword is floating about a foot away from my hip... or that my greatsword is floating about a foot off of my back.
As an aside, I'd love to have some BACK equipment... specifically, I'd love to be able to put a backpack on the character (or a cloak, but that's been suggested before).
Oh, and I'll add my voice to the hoods with masks in them. There are SO many hoods that look great, except that you can't see the character's FACE. Hazardous Alchemy, for example. Great looking hood, but I want to see my face in it! They have alternate appearances for robes and jerkins, how about doing the same with the hoods, so there's a variant with and without mask.Edited by Morgha_Kul on May 19, 2021 4:51PMExploring Tamriel since 1994.1 -
Lugaldu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »If only they could give us those kind of nice flaps. But nah, they just add other weird stuff and put pteruges on helmets and other random places. Or on the rare occations they do place them in the right area, then it is just a few of them glued to the side of some leggings or somesuch.
Yes, good intent, but bad execution. The designers take part of historical examples and then make something new out of them, sometimes it goes well and sometimes the result looks just weird.
I've now studied the matter with the flaps a little more and when I look at a larger number of armor and costumes, I slowly understand what bothers a lot of people. The most annoying thing seems to me when something hangs down from all four sides, thus the hip flaps and then additionally flaps in the front and back.
1 -
Nyladreas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭scorpius2k1 wrote: »
Believe it or not, there is already the option to hide tassets and loin cloth. Interestingly enough, if you look in the ESO API, the option is there. The tassets/loin cloth is (hidden) under Settings-> Gameplay in the same spot where you can hide mount appearance features and polymorph helm. The ability to hide other armor pieces like shoulders, etc are in the same spot as the "Hide Helm" option at dye stations but they as well are still hidden/locked out (shoulders, etc). All of these options have been there for years.Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »Get rid of hip flaps and crotch flaps (or at least provide a toggle to hide them).
Case and point, it's there, it's just not enabled for players. I would have to guess one big reason "why" we don't have these options yet is the endless controversy of hiding armor pieces other than a helmet. Some of the same people that boast "let people enjoy things" are the same ones that double-standard it because of the potential to inconvenience their ideal "standard" since people might just end up running around in their digital underwear.
Thing is, people already do this anyway by taking their armor off. Personally, I have a feeling extending more options with character customization design to how anyone personally wants their character to appear would FAR outweigh the latter worries in a positive way and benefit everyone in the longrun.
Tassets/Loin Cloth setting via API TXT Documentation
These variables have been in there way back to at least August 2017 (Horns of the Reach v100020)
Still there, Flames of Ambition v100034
https://esoui.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1345&d=1611861988h5. HiddenItemValues * HIDDEN_ITEM_LOIN_CLOTH * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_INVENTORY_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_SPEED_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_STAMINA_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_POLYMORPH_HELM * HIDDEN_ITEM_TASSETS
Hide different armor types (shoulders, etc) from ESO Live in 2018
Somebody please open a separate thread with this post as an OP... This needs to be visible to everybody and remind ZOS... If it's already ingame then it's EZ as hell for ZOS to turn it on for us...
I've been wanting an option to turn the shoulders and flaps (loin cloths) off for ages... These two parts completely ruined some of the most beautiful and interesting outfit combinations I've ever created...
I can't stress this enough!!!1 -
Morgha_Kul✭✭✭✭✭
✭Morgha_Kul wrote: »Seems there's a consensus on the floating bits... I'll add weapons to that. I find it discouraging that my sword is floating about a foot away from my hip... or that my greatsword is floating about a foot off of my back.
As an aside, I'd love to have some BACK equipment... specifically, I'd love to be able to put a backpack on the character (or a cloak, but that's been suggested before).scorpius2k1 wrote: »
Believe it or not, there is already the option to hide tassets and loin cloth. Interestingly enough, if you look in the ESO API, the option is there. The tassets/loin cloth is (hidden) under Settings-> Gameplay in the same spot where you can hide mount appearance features and polymorph helm. The ability to hide other armor pieces like shoulders, etc are in the same spot as the "Hide Helm" option at dye stations but they as well are still hidden/locked out (shoulders, etc). All of these options have been there for years.Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »Get rid of hip flaps and crotch flaps (or at least provide a toggle to hide them).
Case and point, it's there, it's just not enabled for players. I would have to guess one big reason "why" we don't have these options yet is the endless controversy of hiding armor pieces other than a helmet. Some of the same people that boast "let people enjoy things" are the same ones that double-standard it because of the potential to inconvenience their ideal "standard" since people might just end up running around in their digital underwear. Thing is, people already do this anyway by taking their armor off. Personally, I have a feeling extending more options with character customization design to how anyone personally wants their character to appear would FAR outweigh the latter worries in a positive way and benefit everyone in the longrun.
Tassets/Loin Cloth setting via API TXT Documentation
These variables have been in there way back to at least August 2017 (Horns of the Reach v100020)
Still there, Flames of Ambition v100034
https://esoui.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1345&d=1611861988h5. HiddenItemValues * HIDDEN_ITEM_LOIN_CLOTH * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_INVENTORY_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_SPEED_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_STAMINA_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_POLYMORPH_HELM * HIDDEN_ITEM_TASSETS
Hide different armor types (shoulders, etc) from ESO Live in 2018
If all that is already there, perhaps an addon could enable it?Exploring Tamriel since 1994.0 -
Everyone i met that plays ESO ABOSULETELY HATE the hip flaps. Please ZOS stop *** add em to cool looks sets and styles. They go out of their way to patch *** players like to do in game like the emote/weapon glitch that people used to take cool screenshots but can't fix *** people actually want removed smh,1 -
SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Everyone i met that plays ESO ABOSULETELY HATE the hip flaps.
I agree.
The hip flaps (tassets) are the single most disgusting feature, and we have been begging since beta to remove them. I have no idea why they are so hell bent on continuing them because there is no way they can think these look good. And they make zero sense on light and medium armor in the first place.
The front flaps (cod pieces) also make no sense and they include them on so many pieces. They offer no protection and ruin the look of every outfit.
Shoulders are also completely unnecessary, especially on light and medium armor, and are particularly ugly on robes.
I like to change my look now and then and have spent 3 days trying to find decent outfits for my 3 characters, but all these hideous features are making it next to impossible.
Please... no more.PCNA2 -
Imperial1995✭✭✭On the Imperial motifs: Imperial Style, Order of the Hour, Shields of Senchal (technically a mix but I’ll allow it), Cyrodiil Champion, Dragonguard, I’d like the option to rethink the use of pteruges, as well as a weird distancing from the segmenta, and shoulder crests that define it as a unique racial style.
The upcoming Ivory Brigade motif has, once again, made absolutely no logical use of these features. AT BEST, the Order Hour style hits so close, yet so far, and it’s honestly frustrating IMO. The Ancestral Imperial motif has no logic put into it, merely random bits chopped off and maybe a retexture/release of some weapon skins.
I’d like to see an Imperial motif that has at least these:
• Something like a mix between the Order Hour, Imperial, and Akaviri shoulders.
• A proper segmenta chest piece
• Legs/Greaves with actual leather flaps. The Akaviri Potentate did this, but I’d like it swapped around is all.
• Bracers without any gloves pls
• More breeches styled like the Celestial Light/Outlaw type
* More hoods with armor around the front (see light Order Hour for inspiration)
• PROPER USEAGE OF PTERUGES
I’m aware not everyone would want these, and such looks can be done already by combining armor pieces already found in the game. I’d just like more logic/consistency used pls ZOS2 -
Kadraeus✭✭✭✭Give us our boob armor back.
No, I'm not kidding. I'm not a prepubescent male with a pixel fetish.
Please no. Boob armor just looks ridiculous. Male armor isn't designed to look like a man's chest, so why is it that female armor has to look like a woman's chest? Never understood that about these games. Armor can be shaped in a way that better fits a woman's proportions, but that doesn't mean there needs to be boob pockets on the cuirass. I'll still use armor that has boobs on it but only if the rest of it looks cool enough. ZOS should just make the female versions of armor look as close to the male versions as reasonably possible while still maintaining female proportions (with exceptions). It's a little annoying when the male version looks so cool in the thumbnail but when you put it on as a female character it's so different since they tried to make it look more "feminine." The exception would be armor that is meant to appear more masculine or feminine or whatever, or ones that mimic the shape of a human torso (such as the Doctrine Ordinator). I love that they aren't just putting boobs on everything now. I think it's fine now.
Edited by Kadraeus on May 20, 2021 5:44AM2 -
NWah✭✭Dye consistency.
I tried to make a costume earlier using a mixture of Morag Tong and Ashlander, but it's virtually impossible to get the tones matching. Even mix/matching light, medium and heavy Morag Tong proved difficult.4 -
Morgha_Kul✭✭✭✭✭
✭Give us our boob armor back.
No, I'm not kidding. I'm not a prepubescent male with a pixel fetish.
Please no. Boob armor just looks ridiculous. Male armor isn't designed to look like a man's chest, so why is it that female armor has to look like a woman's chest? Never understood that about these games. Armor can be shaped in a way that better fits a woman's proportions, but that doesn't mean there needs to be boob pockets on the cuirass. I'll still use armor that has boobs on it but only if the rest of it looks cool enough. ZOS should just make the female versions of armor look as close to the male versions as reasonably possible while still maintaining female proportions (with exceptions). It's a little annoying when the male version looks so cool in the thumbnail but when you put it on as a female character it's so different since they tried to make it look more "feminine." The exception would be armor that is meant to appear more masculine or feminine or whatever, or ones that mimic the shape of a human torso (such as the Doctrine Ordinator). I love that they aren't just putting boobs on everything now. I think it's fine now.
Some people find it attractive. I'm all for making armour that accentuates attractive features, as long as it's not done gratuitously or nonsensically (eg. a cleavage window in a full place cuirass would be absurd).Exploring Tamriel since 1994.3 -
fakingfocused✭✭✭Mud, blood, scared/worn type of skin/effect that overlays armor instead of actual skin. Just not as covered as a mudball or pies of missrule. But same type of concept just more of a permanent toggle option.2 -
ArchangelIsraphel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭1. A hide tassets/loincloth/shoulders option so that others can hide them, but I can keep them because I like them and don't want them removed from my armor. I like the look of them on some armors and would prefer that they remain. Especially since many of the pants under armors narrows the characters hips far too much for my liking, especially on males.
2.
NEVER ever do this ^ limiting assassin type armors to assassins only is a horrible idea. That's just absurdly limiting in a game that offers extreme freedom in expressing your personal tastes and character style. Just because it's the way its been in older titles doesn't mean it needs to be in this one. Also...there are mods that fix this issue in older titles. Why? Because most people hate it. Any "Class specific style" rules where you are forced to wear a style specific to your armor or class when it comes to motifs should never, ever be considered in this game. I appreciate the freedom it offers and want it to remain that way. There's no reason to follow arbitrary rules to suit ancient gaming stereotypes when we don't have to in this game.the only characters that should have access to anything that covers the face to look like an assassin should only be allowed to be worn by assassin type characters that go into sneak, and stealth, and invisibility.
at no time should that look be allowed to be worn by tanks, healers, nor sorcerers.
please remove that assassin look from all armor and outfits and costumes unless only worn by nightblades.
thats the way it has been in elderscrolls titles since over 30 years.
3. An accessory slot on the back of our characters to add things like backpacks, or other more elaborate accessories such as the wings from those skeleton crow mobs >>; I've always wanted a set of nicer looking wings to add to armor than what is offered by Welkynar.
4. I really liked the detail and style of motifs like Pyre Watch, Shield of Senchal, and many of the new event armors like Doctrine Ordinator- more styles like these (but not the same) incorporating cool elements like scarfs and highly detailed chest pieces are much appreciated.
Legends never die
They're written down in eternity
But you'll never see the price it costs
The scars collected all their lives
When everything's lost, they pick up their hearts and avenge defeat
Before it all starts, they suffer through harm just to touch a dream
Oh, pick yourself up, 'cause
Legends never die3 -
Kadraeus✭✭✭✭ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »
2.
NEVER ever do this ^ limiting assassin type armors to assassins only is a horrible idea. That's just absurdly limiting in a game that offers extreme freedom in expressing your personal tastes and character style. Just because it's the way its been in older titles doesn't mean it needs to be in this one. Also...there are mods that fix this issue in older titles. Why? Because most people hate it. Any "Class specific style" rules where you are forced to wear a style specific to your armor or class when it comes to motifs should never, ever be considered in this game. I appreciate the freedom it offers and want it to remain that way. There's no reason to follow arbitrary rules to suit ancient gaming stereotypes when we don't have to in this game.the only characters that should have access to anything that covers the face to look like an assassin should only be allowed to be worn by assassin type characters that go into sneak, and stealth, and invisibility.
at no time should that look be allowed to be worn by tanks, healers, nor sorcerers.
please remove that assassin look from all armor and outfits and costumes unless only worn by nightblades.
thats the way it has been in elderscrolls titles since over 30 years.
I agree with you. That's a strange suggestion that ZOS definitely wouldn't change anyway. I main a nightblade, so I wear hoods/assassin type motifs as often as I can, but I wouldn't take the option away from non-nightblades. I also like to mix things up and use light and heavy motifs since sometimes those look better than the medium ones. Limiting Fashion Scrolls is a bad idea.
2 -
Sue_D_Nim✭✭✭Morgha_Kul wrote: »Give us our boob armor back.
No, I'm not kidding. I'm not a prepubescent male with a pixel fetish.
Please no. Boob armor just looks ridiculous. Male armor isn't designed to look like a man's chest, so why is it that female armor has to look like a woman's chest? Never understood that about these games. Armor can be shaped in a way that better fits a woman's proportions, but that doesn't mean there needs to be boob pockets on the cuirass. I'll still use armor that has boobs on it but only if the rest of it looks cool enough. ZOS should just make the female versions of armor look as close to the male versions as reasonably possible while still maintaining female proportions (with exceptions). It's a little annoying when the male version looks so cool in the thumbnail but when you put it on as a female character it's so different since they tried to make it look more "feminine." The exception would be armor that is meant to appear more masculine or feminine or whatever, or ones that mimic the shape of a human torso (such as the Doctrine Ordinator). I love that they aren't just putting boobs on everything now. I think it's fine now.
Some people find it attractive. I'm all for making armour that accentuates attractive features, as long as it's not done gratuitously or nonsensically (eg. a cleavage window in a full place cuirass would be absurd).
Thanks. I agree.
I probably shouldn't have used the term "boob armor." I seem to remember that that was the term used back when they first removed it and there was such an uproar on the forums about it. I was mostly referring to armor with a "cleavage window". It was unrealistic and revealing, but it looked good as long as it wasn't outrageous slutty. When the anger began erupting on the forums, I started paying attention, and I didn't think it was too extreme or too slutty. The consensus back then was that a surprising number of females as well as males liked it and never wanted it taken away.
I do happen to feel the same way about the "boob armor". I always thought it looked stupid in other games, but I thought it looked good in ESO. One I got over the "Hey, this isn't how real armor would look!" cringe, I realized that it was just a style. A little bit Frazetta-esque, maybe, but I then I always liked his art."If danger doesn't find her, she'll seek it out and invite it home to dinner." ~ Prince Naemon
"Such despair! Richer than a cheese sorbet!" ~ Sheogorath0 -
Hexi✭✭✭✭✭I would like some armor and clothing styles form before the Todd era of Elder Scrolls.
The style went from "stylish fantasy" to "potato sack"
Just look up images from the Daggerfall game and weep.
Edited by Hexi on May 20, 2021 3:27PM0 -
Juomuuri✭✭✭✭✭I'd want my fat characters to not look deformed in certain (read: almost all) armor pieces/costumes (it looks like they swallowed tiles). Like, you allow us to have varying body types, but you make the armor not fit? Tch, tch.PC-EU (Steam) - Roleplayer, Quester, Crafter, Furnisher, Dungeoneer - Fashion Scrolls - CP 2300+
I tank on each class, my favorite is tanksorc!1 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Interesting, know back loincloth is default disabled for Khajiit and Argonians as it will clip a lot with the tail.scorpius2k1 wrote: »
Believe it or not, there is already the option to hide tassets and loin cloth. Interestingly enough, if you look in the ESO API, the option is there. The tassets/loin cloth is (hidden) under Settings-> Gameplay in the same spot where you can hide mount appearance features and polymorph helm. The ability to hide other armor pieces like shoulders, etc are in the same spot as the "Hide Helm" option at dye stations but they as well are still hidden/locked out (shoulders, etc). All of these options have been there for years.Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »Get rid of hip flaps and crotch flaps (or at least provide a toggle to hide them).
Case and point, it's there, it's just not enabled for players. I would have to guess one big reason "why" we don't have these options yet is the endless controversy of hiding armor pieces other than a helmet. Some of the same people that boast "let people enjoy things" are the same ones that double-standard it because of the potential to inconvenience their ideal "standard" since people might just end up running around in their digital underwear. Thing is, people already do this anyway by taking their armor off. Personally, I have a feeling extending more options with character customization design to how anyone personally wants their character to appear would FAR outweigh the latter worries in a positive way and benefit everyone in the longrun.
Tassets/Loin Cloth setting via API TXT Documentation
These variables have been in there way back to at least August 2017 (Horns of the Reach v100020)
Still there, Flames of Ambition v100034
https://esoui.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1345&d=1611861988h5. HiddenItemValues * HIDDEN_ITEM_LOIN_CLOTH * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_INVENTORY_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_SPEED_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_STAMINA_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_POLYMORPH_HELM * HIDDEN_ITEM_TASSETS
Hide different armor types (shoulders, etc) from ESO Live in 2018
But the Tassets setting is interesting.
Now this might not work on all items I guess but the back loincloth is for all outfits and has been in since beta and is also active for tabards.
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
Braggar✭✭✭✭scorpius2k1 wrote: »
Believe it or not, there is already the option to hide tassets and loin cloth. Interestingly enough, if you look in the ESO API, the option is there. The tassets/loin cloth is (hidden) under Settings-> Gameplay in the same spot where you can hide mount appearance features and polymorph helm. The ability to hide other armor pieces like shoulders, etc are in the same spot as the "Hide Helm" option at dye stations but they as well are still hidden/locked out (shoulders, etc). All of these options have been there for years.Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »Get rid of hip flaps and crotch flaps (or at least provide a toggle to hide them).
Case and point, it's there, it's just not enabled for players. I would have to guess one big reason "why" we don't have these options yet is the endless controversy of hiding armor pieces other than a helmet. Some of the same people that boast "let people enjoy things" are the same ones that double-standard it because of the potential to inconvenience their ideal "standard" since people might just end up running around in their digital underwear. Thing is, people already do this anyway by taking their armor off. Personally, I have a feeling extending more options with character customization design to how anyone personally wants their character to appear would FAR outweigh the latter worries in a positive way and benefit everyone in the longrun.
Tassets/Loin Cloth setting via API TXT Documentation
These variables have been in there way back to at least August 2017 (Horns of the Reach v100020)
Still there, Flames of Ambition v100034
https://esoui.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1345&d=1611861988h5. HiddenItemValues * HIDDEN_ITEM_LOIN_CLOTH * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_INVENTORY_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_SPEED_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_MOUNT_STAMINA_UPGRADE * HIDDEN_ITEM_POLYMORPH_HELM * HIDDEN_ITEM_TASSETS
Hide different armor types (shoulders, etc) from ESO Live in 2018
Thank you for sharing this.0 -
Feljax✭✭✭✭Jumping on the "hide certain parts" bandwagon here. Very happy we're getting the "hide shoulders" option coming up but I would argue that equally important would be the hiding of other options. Especially considering those options are all in the game already but just not enabled as stated above.
So, in order of importance (imho) I'd love to see the following "hide" options added as well:
1. Belts
2. Gloves (including "bracers" that are built-in to chest pieces)
3. Tassets
4. Crotch/butt flaps
5. Boots (including "socks" that are built-in to leg pieces)
6. Chest pieces (This one gets controversial, I could accept this as a non-starter. This is why I keep it to the last.)
I won't bother to suggest the pants. That, at the very least, keeps people from being completely in their underwear.
And these of course are options. More choice is always better.1 -
ZOS_IcymodGreetings,
We have closed this topic as it was originally created in May 2021. In many cases, it's better to create a new thread on a topic that you want to discuss as opposed to bumping one that is rather old.
Thank you for your understanding.0
This discussion has been closed.