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Crate haters rejoice!
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Abelon✭✭✭✭✭I really don't like the fact that a game I purchased, subscribed to and repeatedly purchased full priced DLCs for every year still manages to have a cash shop, it's nice there is an alternative for those who would rather grind than spend cash.
Don't know a single mmo that doesn't do this. FFXIV, WOW, GW2, Destiny 2, SWTOR (expansions do come with sub), etc all have dlcs you have to pay for, offer some sort of sub, still have a cash shop, all used to be b2p as well, though some did go "free base game" at some point.Edited by Abelon on April 15, 2021 4:50PM8 -
allhailskippy✭✭✭✭✭I really don't like the fact that a game I purchased, subscribed to and repeatedly purchased full priced DLCs for every year still manages to have a cash shop, it's nice there is an alternative for those who would rather grind than spend cash.
Don't know a single mmo that doesn't do this. FFXIV, WOW, GW2, Destiny 2, SWTOR, etc all have dlcs you have to pay for, offer some sort of sub, still have a cash shop, all used to be b2p as well, though some did go "free base game" at some point.
Might have something to do with the fact that unlike an offline game, there are things like keeping the servers running and creating new content to pay for?
If they don't have a way to get some sort of MRR, they'll just end up shutting the whole thing down.Hireling Wanted! - An Elder Scrolls Tale https://hirelingwanted.com6 -
virtus753✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It sounds like very good news, but I'm curious about how it's going to work in practice, in particular how long it takes to get any given item. If doing endeavours every day up to the cap means that once a year you'll be able to afford 1 legendary (100 gem) item then it's not going to be a practical alternative to buying crates. But even if that's the case it's better than nothing.
I'm also curious about whether all endeavours award seals and if any combination of endeavours which take you up to the cap will award the same number of seals or if people who specifically want to get seals might need to be careful about which ones they do first.
And yes I suspect this is an example of ZOS trying to get ahead of the increasing trend of loot boxes being included in gambling legislation. I've also heard Microsoft don't like loot boxes in their games, but I'm not sure of the specifics there. (The only game I've played recently which I know is by Microsoft is Ori and the Blind Forest - great game but not really helpful in this case.)
But it's also a nice fix to the problem of the majority of mounts and a lot of costumes, mementos, etc. being restricted to crown crates with fewer options to earn interesting cosmetic rewards (aside from motifs) in-game.
Microsoft doesn’t have an anti-loot box policy, but they do have rules for loot boxes in any XBox Game Studios games created in 2019 or later:
https://www.xbox.com/en-US/community/for-everyone/responsible-gaming/loot-boxes
While they don’t promise to apply that more broadly, it’s nice to see ZOS seems to be implementing some of these ideas in ESO.1 -
RedMuse✭✭✭✭✭
✭allhailskippy wrote: »Dragonnord wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »I have a few radiants. Why would it matter if someone else had a chance to also get them? It doesn't take any of mine away.
Remove "chance", add "free manner".
Again. Why would I care?
Anyone who gets upset because somebody has something they also have is EXTREMELY selfish.
Especially as these items will not be free except in the most loose sense of the word. Yes no actual, real world money will have traded hands but my guess is that it will take a LOT of time to earn enough seals to earn a radiant apex mount. In fact, possibly so long that it would be quicker to have just put in some extra hours at work, got some extra $$$, then bought crates and either gotten lucky or earned enough gems to buy it that way.6 -
Malthorne✭✭✭✭✭
✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »Nice. I am delighted to see this happen.
However, I wonder why they do this. Could it be to somehow bypass some laws on gambling or the likes? I mean with ZOS in-your-face crownstore attitude this is a rather unexpected move.
https://www.xbox.com/en-US/community/for-everyone/responsible-gaming/loot-boxes
I think this is Microsoft bringing crown crates in line with their internal loot box policy.4 -
Goregrinder✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭allhailskippy wrote: »Dragonnord wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »I have a few radiants. Why would it matter if someone else had a chance to also get them? It doesn't take any of mine away.
Remove "chance", add "free manner".
Again. Why would I care?
Anyone who gets upset because somebody has something they also have is EXTREMELY selfish.
Especially as these items will not be free except in the most loose sense of the word. Yes no actual, real world money will have traded hands but my guess is that it will take a LOT of time to earn enough seals to earn a radiant apex mount. In fact, possibly so long that it would be quicker to have just put in some extra hours at work, got some extra $$$, then bought crates and either gotten lucky or earned enough gems to buy it that way.
I could grind it out in a week in game, OR work an extra hour or two and just buy it from the crown store. 2 hours of my time vs 7 days of my time. That's the scale at which I decide what I buy and don't, and it's dependent on how long something takes. At the end, if something that takes more than an hour to do, but costs less than what an hour of my time is worth and gets it to me immediately, I'm going to just pay for it. My time isn't free.5 -
allhailskippy✭✭✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »Nice. I am delighted to see this happen.
However, I wonder why they do this. Could it be to somehow bypass some laws on gambling or the likes? I mean with ZOS in-your-face crownstore attitude this is a rather unexpected move.
https://www.xbox.com/en-US/community/for-everyone/responsible-gaming/loot-boxes
I think this is Microsoft bringing crown crates in line with their internal loot box policy.
Interseting.
Wonder how they're gonna comply with this one:
"Players will receive a fair minimum value for all loot box purchases in our games. Every loot box will provide a virtual item that has an in-game worth or value equal to or greater than the amount paid."
Cause I've definitely got a bucketload of crates that were 100% trash.Hireling Wanted! - An Elder Scrolls Tale https://hirelingwanted.com4 -
allhailskippy✭✭✭✭✭Goregrinder wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »Dragonnord wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »I have a few radiants. Why would it matter if someone else had a chance to also get them? It doesn't take any of mine away.
Remove "chance", add "free manner".
Again. Why would I care?
Anyone who gets upset because somebody has something they also have is EXTREMELY selfish.
Especially as these items will not be free except in the most loose sense of the word. Yes no actual, real world money will have traded hands but my guess is that it will take a LOT of time to earn enough seals to earn a radiant apex mount. In fact, possibly so long that it would be quicker to have just put in some extra hours at work, got some extra $$$, then bought crates and either gotten lucky or earned enough gems to buy it that way.
I could grind it out in a week in game, OR work an extra hour or two and just buy it from the crown store. 2 hours of my time vs 7 days of my time. That's the scale at which I decide what I buy and don't, and it's dependent on how long something takes. At the end, if something that takes more than an hour to do, but costs less than what an hour of my time is worth and gets it to me immediately, I'm going to just pay for it. My time isn't free.
And that's your prerogative. Now there's more options.Hireling Wanted! - An Elder Scrolls Tale https://hirelingwanted.com2 -
Abelon✭✭✭✭✭Goregrinder wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »Dragonnord wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »I have a few radiants. Why would it matter if someone else had a chance to also get them? It doesn't take any of mine away.
Remove "chance", add "free manner".
Again. Why would I care?
Anyone who gets upset because somebody has something they also have is EXTREMELY selfish.
Especially as these items will not be free except in the most loose sense of the word. Yes no actual, real world money will have traded hands but my guess is that it will take a LOT of time to earn enough seals to earn a radiant apex mount. In fact, possibly so long that it would be quicker to have just put in some extra hours at work, got some extra $$$, then bought crates and either gotten lucky or earned enough gems to buy it that way.
I could grind it out in a week in game, OR work an extra hour or two and just buy it from the crown store. 2 hours of my time vs 7 days of my time. That's the scale at which I decide what I buy and don't, and it's dependent on how long something takes. At the end, if something that takes more than an hour to do, but costs less than what an hour of my time is worth and gets it to me immediately, I'm going to just pay for it. My time isn't free.
Which makes this a win-win scenario. You get to buy crates, because you value your time more. Others get to grind for crates because they value their money more. Well, that... or they just despise the practice of loot boxes.1 -
robertthebard✭✭✭✭✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »Gee, what a great thing - they're introducing mind-numbing grind alternative to gambling. Amazing how shamelessly they introduce f2p mechanics into a fully priced game that has separately sold DLCs, microtransactions and premium subscription.
Just proof that you can't please all people all the time.
Well anytime they worry more about cash grabs from people rather than I do t know....... Actually fixing bugs/exploits/major glitches just proves their only motive........
Well, this is certainly the first time I've seen "getting CS items for playing the game" defined as a cash grab. I must be way behind the times.8 -
Destai✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Goregrinder wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »Dragonnord wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »I have a few radiants. Why would it matter if someone else had a chance to also get them? It doesn't take any of mine away.
Remove "chance", add "free manner".
Again. Why would I care?
Anyone who gets upset because somebody has something they also have is EXTREMELY selfish.
Especially as these items will not be free except in the most loose sense of the word. Yes no actual, real world money will have traded hands but my guess is that it will take a LOT of time to earn enough seals to earn a radiant apex mount. In fact, possibly so long that it would be quicker to have just put in some extra hours at work, got some extra $$$, then bought crates and either gotten lucky or earned enough gems to buy it that way.
I could grind it out in a week in game, OR work an extra hour or two and just buy it from the crown store. 2 hours of my time vs 7 days of my time. That's the scale at which I decide what I buy and don't, and it's dependent on how long something takes. At the end, if something that takes more than an hour to do, but costs less than what an hour of my time is worth and gets it to me immediately, I'm going to just pay for it. My time isn't free.
While I can't speak for everyone, I don't care if things can be bought. I care if they're a gamble to get with real world money. That's where their practices border on predatory. I myself would buy more things in the crown store if they'd actually leave them in there. This new system is good, and hopefully more systems like it are introduced in the future. Giving players a daily carrot on a stick keep us paying and playing - win-win for both parties.3 -
FangOfTheTwoMoons✭✭✭✭✭Wouldn't be surprised if they nerf drop rates for the free crates.
Maybe every now and again they'll drop something. Say every 10 you get a specific tier, just to get the dopamine flowing, which will lead you into the crown store to buy more lol.
Don't get me wrong, I'll never complain about free stuff/earning things l, but this is ZOS we're talking about. They're a business.3 -
scorpius2k1✭✭✭✭✭
✭Wow. I'm actually speechless. This was unexpected and is a MAJOR QoL improvement to ESO and if you don't want to do daily/weekly events then go ahead and buy it as before. The option and incentivization to actually EARN better content in-game is now there that has been missing for far too long, and this is what counts. I truly feel we ALL should rejoice at this regardless of which side of the fence you prefer. There is literally zero disadvantage to any player with this imho.
For me personally, a HUGE thank you to ZOS!🌎 PC/NA
🐧 Linux (Arch)
🧑💻 ESO Addon Dev
⚔️ Stamplar | Magplar | Stamcro | Magsorc | Magcro Healer7 -
vivisectvib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Gee, what a great thing - they're introducing mind-numbing grind alternative to gambling. Amazing how shamelessly they introduce f2p mechanics into a fully priced game that has separately sold DLCs, microtransactions and premium subscription.
How is playing the games usual tasks mind numbing? You don't like it, don't do it.0 -
RedMuse✭✭✭✭✭
✭vivisectvib16_ESO wrote: »Gee, what a great thing - they're introducing mind-numbing grind alternative to gambling. Amazing how shamelessly they introduce f2p mechanics into a fully priced game that has separately sold DLCs, microtransactions and premium subscription.
How is playing the games usual tasks mind numbing? You don't like it, don't do it.
Yeah this one I don't get. If we're to take their word for it and right now we have no evidence to the contrary and thus no reason not to, then we will gain this currency from basically playing the game. And as it will be awarded from every possible play style, from doing trials and dailies, over pvp to just using certain skill to kill monsters so basically any gameplay at all there. Put that along with the weekly cap on seals so you can only do so much each day... I wonder how bad any grind will be.
Lengthy? Possibly, but I'm not so sure it'll take up all that much extra time each day even if you go all in. And that's only if you're totally committed to this.2 -
Ackwalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Depends on the grind vs reward ratio. If you have to grind for 300 hours to get 10 tokens, and need 100 tokens to buy something, this will sour quickly.2 -
Jaimeh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭They are just covering their rears legally speaking to have them earn-able via in-game means as well, but like the radiant apex gem prices, I bet these endeavours will be also ridiculously high. Still, it will be an option, and even if it takes ages, it's better than not having the option at all.3 -
Moonsprite✭✭✭This is a great change. I’m interested to see what the costs will be. I wonder if it will actually be a better method to getting items. The becoming a vampire costs crowns but takes very little time to do in game for free. 🤔 I hope this system will be the same 🥰0 -
Crazyprophet✭✭✭Man finally! A way of getting these items without gambling! Grind or no, I'm pretty keen!1 -
kargen27✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Goregrinder wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »Dragonnord wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »I have a few radiants. Why would it matter if someone else had a chance to also get them? It doesn't take any of mine away.
Remove "chance", add "free manner".
Again. Why would I care?
Anyone who gets upset because somebody has something they also have is EXTREMELY selfish.
Especially as these items will not be free except in the most loose sense of the word. Yes no actual, real world money will have traded hands but my guess is that it will take a LOT of time to earn enough seals to earn a radiant apex mount. In fact, possibly so long that it would be quicker to have just put in some extra hours at work, got some extra $$$, then bought crates and either gotten lucky or earned enough gems to buy it that way.
I could grind it out in a week in game, OR work an extra hour or two and just buy it from the crown store. 2 hours of my time vs 7 days of my time. That's the scale at which I decide what I buy and don't, and it's dependent on how long something takes. At the end, if something that takes more than an hour to do, but costs less than what an hour of my time is worth and gets it to me immediately, I'm going to just pay for it. My time isn't free.
This is for items found in crown crates not items found throughout the crown store. So no way of knowing what your real money cost will be. Or that is how I read it.and then the parrot said, "must be the water mines green too."3 -
LanteanPegasus✭✭✭✭✭I fully expect the bigger stuff to take really long to acquire. Like, if you want a Radiant Apex you have to save up for a year.
And I have no problem with that! I play the game because I like to play the game, and now I can earn currency to buy crown crate stuff while doing it. Of course I don't expect ZOS to drop said currency in a way that lets you get everything from crates without buying crates - those things would be obsolete for the company if that were the case.
But as with the gems now I can go and acquire the things from crates that I really, really want to have. Without buying crates. Just like I've done so far, only more often! (Well, except if they completely stop the gems, or the dropping of gems from streams and the occasional other crate you get for free. But even then it just won't change anything/will probably still give a little more than now.)
So Huzzah to ZOS for dropping this thing, I can't wait to see it in action!!!
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furiouslog✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The old Crown Crates had everyone squealing
So ZOS solved it with something appealing
We'll now come together
To grind out Endeavors
(though it won't be called grinding, but sealing)2 -
Sheezabeast✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The art from the article showed the woman holding a green glass bottle, which to me, forebodes the amount of the currency you need to buy anything but the junk poisons and potions...it may be a long, arduous grind, and they are cosmetics, but at this point, based on the art, I am cautious and not excited.Grand Master Crafter, Beta baby who grew with the game. PC/NA. @Sheezabeast if you have crafting needs!1 -
Goregrinder✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Goregrinder wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »Dragonnord wrote: »allhailskippy wrote: »I have a few radiants. Why would it matter if someone else had a chance to also get them? It doesn't take any of mine away.
Remove "chance", add "free manner".
Again. Why would I care?
Anyone who gets upset because somebody has something they also have is EXTREMELY selfish.
Especially as these items will not be free except in the most loose sense of the word. Yes no actual, real world money will have traded hands but my guess is that it will take a LOT of time to earn enough seals to earn a radiant apex mount. In fact, possibly so long that it would be quicker to have just put in some extra hours at work, got some extra $$$, then bought crates and either gotten lucky or earned enough gems to buy it that way.
I could grind it out in a week in game, OR work an extra hour or two and just buy it from the crown store. 2 hours of my time vs 7 days of my time. That's the scale at which I decide what I buy and don't, and it's dependent on how long something takes. At the end, if something that takes more than an hour to do, but costs less than what an hour of my time is worth and gets it to me immediately, I'm going to just pay for it. My time isn't free.
This is for items found in crown crates not items found throughout the crown store. So no way of knowing what your real money cost will be. Or that is how I read it.
So like mount training books? Those are available to buy directly from the store, but don't they also drop when opening crates? I think they are priced at about $1usd per book.0 -
Starlock✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭To add, I'll be impressed when basic functions that should have been available in the game (or available as a feature for a one-time purchase) get accessibility outside of the overpriced macrotransaction cash shop.
Just as an example, we should have had actual barbers in Tamriel! Places you could go and pay some gold to change your character's hair style and hair color. And actual body artists, where you could do the same for your body art! Let's not forget the Face Sculptor in Skyrim that let you change everything. They'd be the premium in terms of gold cost, but you could actually do it in game! Oblivion, they could make this part of a mini-DLC you could buy as a one-time purchase or make it a subscription-only thing and it would still be an order of magnitude better than the $10+ macrotransaction crap we have right now. That kind of bad deal nonsense that really frustrates me and this game is too damn good for it, blast it! It should not cost freaking $10 to change your character's hair color. Or tweak their nose or height. Each. And every. Time. Nor should it cost $100s of dollars for cash shop cheat codes that let customers do a NewGame+ mode. It's Clavicus Vile level of bad deal crap.
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Danikat✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭To add, I'll be impressed when basic functions that should have been available in the game (or available as a feature for a one-time purchase) get accessibility outside of the overpriced macrotransaction cash shop.
Just as an example, we should have had actual barbers in Tamriel! Places you could go and pay some gold to change your character's hair style and hair color. And actual body artists, where you could do the same for your body art! Let's not forget the Face Sculptor in Skyrim that let you change everything. They'd be the premium in terms of gold cost, but you could actually do it in game! Oblivion, they could make this part of a mini-DLC you could buy as a one-time purchase or make it a subscription-only thing and it would still be an order of magnitude better than the $10+ macrotransaction crap we have right now. That kind of bad deal nonsense that really frustrates me and this game is too damn good for it, blast it! It should not cost freaking $10 to change your character's hair color. Or tweak their nose or height. Each. And every. Time. Nor should it cost $100s of dollars for cash shop cheat codes that let customers do a NewGame+ mode. It's Clavicus Vile level of bad deal crap.
That might be ok for changing your hair colour, face etc. but for me having to visit and NPC and pay gold to change your hair style would be a massive step back.
A few years ago I bought the basic hair style pack from the crown store, since then it hasn't cost me anything and I can change any character's hair style whenever I want, instantly and for free. Considering one of the main ways I use it is to put their hair into a pony tail or braid when going into a delve or dungeon and then let it down again afterwards being restricted to going to an NPC in town to change it would be annoying.
(By comparison in other games I've played which have that option I just don't bother. I might occasionally change a characters hair style if a new one comes out which I really like but I don't swap them around all the time like I do in ESO because it's not worth the trouble of seeking out the NPC and paying, even paying gold, to do it.)PC EU player | She/her/hers | PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
"Remember in this game we call life that no one said it's fair"1 -
adriant1978✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Dragonnord wrote: »Wow! The people that invested REAL money to get Radiant Apex mounts will be REALLY p*s*ed since everyone can get everything now wihout spending a cent.
It's only free if your time has no value.5 -
Katahdin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Good move, Bravo
I expect it to be a bit of a grind to get enough for a radiant mount.
Thats fine. At least it is something you can work toward instead of relying in gambling crates and RNG alone.
The crates are still there for those who like to play them.
But there will be a way to earn things if you dont want to play them.
I think this is a direct result of Microsoft's policy toward things like this.
I read somewhere that they dont like to have things in RNG crates without some way to earn them in game.
As I said, I expect it to be a grind, but if its something where youll have to grind for 100 years, well none of us will live long enough to see it and it will be as if nothing changedEdited by Katahdin on April 15, 2021 11:34PMBeta tester November 20131
