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let us sell our crowns in guildtraders pls
MalEducado
✭✭✭
let us sell crowns in guild traders , there are a great offer of 40% in crowns and it will be a good idea to can sell them in guild store... like other games...
2
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ThorianB✭✭✭✭✭
✭They should have set it up so crowns could be sold this way from the beginning. This type of transaction in other games is good for well to do players that can afford to buy premium currency regularly, poorer players that struggle to afford premium currency, and the developer who benefits from increased sales. I can't believe they are not taking advantage of this income stream fully. It also improves the happiness of the player population in general and happy players play more and buy more.11 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭They should have set it up so crowns could be sold this way from the beginning. This type of transaction in other games is good for well to do players that can afford to buy premium currency regularly, poorer players that struggle to afford premium currency, and the developer who benefits from increased sales. I can't believe they are not taking advantage of this income stream fully. It also improves the happiness of the player population in general and happy players play more and buy more.
Not sure how I see this increasing Crown Sales, which ZOS does a ton of already. There is a pretty simple system in place by players to buy/sell crowns either through reputable website brokers, as well as the many guilds offer the service as well to members.
The only things I see this suggestion doing, is tanking the value of crowns and protecting the folks that currently try to buy from the cheapest zone spammers, who a percentage of the time are going to rip you off. But that's a buyer beware issue, if you want to cheap out and risk buying off the back of that truck instead of through a legitimate outlet, that's on the buyer. Also, the crown market would pretty much dry up, costing ZOS sales once the Crown to Gold value dropped to a particular level, as no one would buy crowns to sell if it wasn't worth their time. If every Tom, *** & Harry with ESO+ dumped their 1500 crowns per month on traders, there would be almost no sales left for ZOS. Under the current system, you have to "buy" the full amount from one person, who gifts you the item, not piecemeal together enough crowns at discounted prices to buy that 15,000 crown home.
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.0 -
joerginger✭✭✭✭✭
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
Huh? This had nothing whatsoever to do with gold sellers. In addition, your post is the first time I see the claim that "selling crowns" is against the TOS. That's not even possible at all. Only the indirect transaction of making someone gift you a crown store item. Which part of the TOS do you mean?
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Nagastani✭✭✭✭They should have set it up so crowns could be sold this way from the beginning. This type of transaction in other games is good for well to do players that can afford to buy premium currency regularly, poorer players that struggle to afford premium currency, and the developer who benefits from increased sales. I can't believe they are not taking advantage of this income stream fully. It also improves the happiness of the player population in general and happy players play more and buy more.
Not sure how I see this increasing Crown Sales, which ZOS does a ton of already. There is a pretty simple system in place by players to buy/sell crowns either through reputable website brokers, as well as the many guilds offer the service as well to members.
The only things I see this suggestion doing, is tanking the value of crowns and protecting the folks that currently try to buy from the cheapest zone spammers, who a percentage of the time are going to rip you off. But that's a buyer beware issue, if you want to cheap out and risk buying off the back of that truck instead of through a legitimate outlet, that's on the buyer. Also, the crown market would pretty much dry up, costing ZOS sales once the Crown to Gold value dropped to a particular level, as no one would buy crowns to sell if it wasn't worth their time. If every Tom, *** & Harry with ESO+ dumped their 1500 crowns per month on traders, there would be almost no sales left for ZOS. Under the current system, you have to "buy" the full amount from one person, who gifts you the item, not piecemeal together enough crowns at discounted prices to buy that 15,000 crown home.
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
Incorrect.
Exchanging Crowns for Gold is *not* against TOS and has never been considered the same as Gold Selling.
There is a forum post out there that explains that selling Crowns is allowed, just the buyer/seller should beware.
Ticket for ZOS if you get scammed. Try to have a screen capture of the transaction in zone chat if you can.Edited by Nagastani on April 6, 2021 8:05PM1 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭joerginger wrote: »
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
Huh? This had nothing whatsoever to do with gold sellers. In addition, your post is the first time I see the claim that "selling crowns" is against the TOS. That's not even possible at all. Only the indirect transaction of making someone gift you a crown store item. Which part of the TOS do you mean?
It is exactly like selling gold, you pay someone cash, not in-game gold, they send you the item. Making Crowns actually tradeable would make this a huge issue, as now your farm bots can pool their free monthly crown allotments and they can be sold for cash or simply converted to gold easily and then sell the gold. Neither of which would be good for the game and would create all sorts of new issues for ZOS to deal with.
Before you ask why would someone pay cash for crowns, as you can do it from the crown store yourself. It is not really that active a market currently, because you would need to make a huge investment in crowns while they are on sale, then sell slightly under the crown store price at other times. Which is already done legally by legit sellers with the official 500 or 3000 crown packs you can get from a lot of places and you would need to undercut them, which would still profitable, but not by a huge margin.
But basically, exchanging any ESO item for cash is against the TOS. Currently selling crown gifts is allowed, because both are considered in-game items, gold & the crown items.1 -
FaylenSol✭✭✭✭I agree, this would eliminate the risk of scams and also clear the chat up a small amount.
A little less of: WTS/WTB 5000 Crowns 300:13 -
Emmagoldman✭✭✭✭✭
✭joerginger wrote: »
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
Huh? This had nothing whatsoever to do with gold sellers. In addition, your post is the first time I see the claim that "selling crowns" is against the TOS. That's not even possible at all. Only the indirect transaction of making someone gift you a crown store item. Which part of the TOS do you mean?
Agree here, also ZoS writes their own tos. If they allow crowns sold from traders then its allowed.
Also not sure why someone wants to go through a 3rd party website or broker over selling through in Game traders.
Good idea overall3 -
RedMuse✭✭✭✭✭
✭They should have set it up so crowns could be sold this way from the beginning. This type of transaction in other games is good for well to do players that can afford to buy premium currency regularly, poorer players that struggle to afford premium currency, and the developer who benefits from increased sales. I can't believe they are not taking advantage of this income stream fully. It also improves the happiness of the player population in general and happy players play more and buy more.
Not sure how I see this increasing Crown Sales, which ZOS does a ton of already. There is a pretty simple system in place by players to buy/sell crowns either through reputable website brokers, as well as the many guilds offer the service as well to members.
The only things I see this suggestion doing, is tanking the value of crowns and protecting the folks that currently try to buy from the cheapest zone spammers, who a percentage of the time are going to rip you off. But that's a buyer beware issue, if you want to cheap out and risk buying off the back of that truck instead of through a legitimate outlet, that's on the buyer. Also, the crown market would pretty much dry up, costing ZOS sales once the Crown to Gold value dropped to a particular level, as no one would buy crowns to sell if it wasn't worth their time. If every Tom, *** & Harry with ESO+ dumped their 1500 crowns per month on traders, there would be almost no sales left for ZOS. Under the current system, you have to "buy" the full amount from one person, who gifts you the item, not piecemeal together enough crowns at discounted prices to buy that 15,000 crown home.
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
If you mean for real world cash then yes. But they have stated that trading crowns for in-game money (ie, gold) is not against the TOS.
But just because it's not against the TOS and thus can't get you banned (unless perhaps you scam someone) that doesn't mean it is supported by the game, nor that they want to do so.0 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Personally I'd rather they just made crown and gold selling bannable offences and took extremely firm action against all forms of botting. I know a lot of players generally wouldn't agree, but I bet a lot of those who've been scammed would do along with a lot of those who constantly complain about botting.2 -
hafgood✭✭✭✭✭
✭Just make crown store gifts CODable. Then no one can get scammed as the buyer pays when the seller sends6 -
ThorianB✭✭✭✭✭
✭They should have set it up so crowns could be sold this way from the beginning. This type of transaction in other games is good for well to do players that can afford to buy premium currency regularly, poorer players that struggle to afford premium currency, and the developer who benefits from increased sales. I can't believe they are not taking advantage of this income stream fully. It also improves the happiness of the player population in general and happy players play more and buy more.
Not sure how I see this increasing Crown Sales, which ZOS does a ton of already. There is a pretty simple system in place by players to buy/sell crowns either through reputable website brokers, as well as the many guilds offer the service as well to members.
The only things I see this suggestion doing, is tanking the value of crowns and protecting the folks that currently try to buy from the cheapest zone spammers, who a percentage of the time are going to rip you off. But that's a buyer beware issue, if you want to cheap out and risk buying off the back of that truck instead of through a legitimate outlet, that's on the buyer. Also, the crown market would pretty much dry up, costing ZOS sales once the Crown to Gold value dropped to a particular level, as no one would buy crowns to sell if it wasn't worth their time. If every Tom, *** & Harry with ESO+ dumped their 1500 crowns per month on traders, there would be almost no sales left for ZOS. Under the current system, you have to "buy" the full amount from one person, who gifts you the item, not piecemeal together enough crowns at discounted prices to buy that 15,000 crown home.
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
The current crown for gold exchange system makes it easy for one party or the other to get scammed. I don't consider any guild or website to be reputable sellers even if they are. There is still a chance of getting scammed from another player in either case and a chance i can lose my crowns or gold in the process.
Personally i am a big advocate of a crown voucher system. Party A buys a crown voucher in predetermined amounts say 100 crowns each from the crown store. This voucher is similar to a motif page or style page in function. You can bank it, mail it, pass it around, etc etc...but most importantly you can sell it on the guild store. Party B can then shop for crown vouchers just like they would a motif for example. They buy it and then they use it just like a motif page except instead of adding a style to a collection it adds 100 crowns to their account. THAT is the way this should operate not on a trust based system with strangers.
In other games it increased sales significantly. Player A may make a lot of real money but not have a lot of time. Player B may have a lot of time but don't have a lot of free funds to spend on the game. Player A buys vouchers and lists them on the guild store. Player B buys them from player A. Player B gets crowns they normally wouldn't be able to get and player A gets gold to spend on things they want buy but don't have the money for. Furthermore, i would make subs something you could buy this way. A lot of non plus players would have plus if they could earn crowns and buy it.
I won't do the crown for gold exchange myself because i don't consider the system to be safe or reliable and this is a common concern both from the crown seller and crown buyers.
There have a been a few games that have added this feature while i have played them and premium currency sales increased by multiples. All those whales that want to run end game content but cant put the effort into all the prep that would be required of them buying carries, people buying prints, motifs, and sticker book gear.
Especially with all the new players and old money in this game. There are players sitting on tens and hundreds of millions of gold with nothing to do with it. But if they could just convert it safely and conveniently into crowns then that wealthy would get redistributed.3 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭They should have set it up so crowns could be sold this way from the beginning. This type of transaction in other games is good for well to do players that can afford to buy premium currency regularly, poorer players that struggle to afford premium currency, and the developer who benefits from increased sales. I can't believe they are not taking advantage of this income stream fully. It also improves the happiness of the player population in general and happy players play more and buy more.
Not sure how I see this increasing Crown Sales, which ZOS does a ton of already. There is a pretty simple system in place by players to buy/sell crowns either through reputable website brokers, as well as the many guilds offer the service as well to members.
The only things I see this suggestion doing, is tanking the value of crowns and protecting the folks that currently try to buy from the cheapest zone spammers, who a percentage of the time are going to rip you off. But that's a buyer beware issue, if you want to cheap out and risk buying off the back of that truck instead of through a legitimate outlet, that's on the buyer. Also, the crown market would pretty much dry up, costing ZOS sales once the Crown to Gold value dropped to a particular level, as no one would buy crowns to sell if it wasn't worth their time. If every Tom, *** & Harry with ESO+ dumped their 1500 crowns per month on traders, there would be almost no sales left for ZOS. Under the current system, you have to "buy" the full amount from one person, who gifts you the item, not piecemeal together enough crowns at discounted prices to buy that 15,000 crown home.
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
The current crown for gold exchange system makes it easy for one party or the other to get scammed. I don't consider any guild or website to be reputable sellers even if they are. There is still a chance of getting scammed from another player in either case and a chance i can lose my crowns or gold in the process.
Personally i am a big advocate of a crown voucher system. Party A buys a crown voucher in predetermined amounts say 100 crowns each from the crown store. This voucher is similar to a motif page or style page in function. You can bank it, mail it, pass it around, etc etc...but most importantly you can sell it on the guild store. Party B can then shop for crown vouchers just like they would a motif for example. They buy it and then they use it just like a motif page except instead of adding a style to a collection it adds 100 crowns to their account. THAT is the way this should operate not on a trust based system with strangers.
In other games it increased sales significantly. Player A may make a lot of real money but not have a lot of time. Player B may have a lot of time but don't have a lot of free funds to spend on the game. Player A buys vouchers and lists them on the guild store. Player B buys them from player A. Player B gets crowns they normally wouldn't be able to get and player A gets gold to spend on things they want buy but don't have the money for. Furthermore, i would make subs something you could buy this way. A lot of non plus players would have plus if they could earn crowns and buy it.
I won't do the crown for gold exchange myself because i don't consider the system to be safe or reliable and this is a common concern both from the crown seller and crown buyers.
There have a been a few games that have added this feature while i have played them and premium currency sales increased by multiples. All those whales that want to run end game content but cant put the effort into all the prep that would be required of them buying carries, people buying prints, motifs, and sticker book gear.
Especially with all the new players and old money in this game. There are players sitting on tens and hundreds of millions of gold with nothing to do with it. But if they could just convert it safely and conveniently into crowns then that wealthy would get redistributed.
I know how the whole system works. But until ZOS decides to remove the 1500 crowns a month from ESO+, which would *** off a lot more players than would be made happy, it can't happen. The market would be flooded with 1500 crown vouchers and there would be zero reason for anyone to buy crowns from ZOS ever again. Those other games you mention, don't give out their game store currency as part of their sub, ESO does.0 -
Araneae6537✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Personally I'd rather they just made crown and gold selling bannable offences and took extremely firm action against all forms of botting. I know a lot of players generally wouldn't agree, but I bet a lot of those who've been scammed would do along with a lot of those who constantly complain about botting.
That would hurt many people and help no one. You don’t have to buy or sell Crowns from anyone or can choose to do so only under whatever terms you set. And no, I would not agree even if I had been scammed. I realize that I am taking a risk when dealing with someone I don’t know if I’m the one fulfilling my part of the trade first. And has been stated, there are other options too, such as the Discord channel middlemen. Honestly, I can’t see any reason anyone would want to make it against ToS unless you have money yourself and want fewer people in game to have nice things. I certainly don’t think that of you, but I am at a loss to think of why you would be against it.2 -
cynicalbutterfly✭✭✭✭In a previous game I had played they had a whole separate trader for selling store gems. You put up how much you're selling and at what price. A buyer comes along and can buy how much they want for in game gold. It was completely anonymous so no one could stalk or harass you. Each seller was a different listing as well to keep track of who had what.
It could be do-able in ESO. There would have to be restrictions put in place probably though. To keep the botters at bay.2 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Let me put it in perspective for everyone. ZOS sells crowns for about .007 a crown. They also give out 1500 crowns a month to about half their players, which is what, about a half million people? Currently a very small percentage of those people sell their monthly crown allotment, mostly because it isn't worth their time, although some do.
If however, you made it dead easy for those folks to sell their 1500 crowns, that could put as many as 750 million extra crowns A MONTH on the market that previously were not traded. Which translates into $5,250,000 dollars worth of crowns a month no one needs to buy now. Do you really think they are going to give up $5.2 mil a month of pure profit?0 -
ThorianB✭✭✭✭✭
✭They should have set it up so crowns could be sold this way from the beginning. This type of transaction in other games is good for well to do players that can afford to buy premium currency regularly, poorer players that struggle to afford premium currency, and the developer who benefits from increased sales. I can't believe they are not taking advantage of this income stream fully. It also improves the happiness of the player population in general and happy players play more and buy more.
Not sure how I see this increasing Crown Sales, which ZOS does a ton of already. There is a pretty simple system in place by players to buy/sell crowns either through reputable website brokers, as well as the many guilds offer the service as well to members.
The only things I see this suggestion doing, is tanking the value of crowns and protecting the folks that currently try to buy from the cheapest zone spammers, who a percentage of the time are going to rip you off. But that's a buyer beware issue, if you want to cheap out and risk buying off the back of that truck instead of through a legitimate outlet, that's on the buyer. Also, the crown market would pretty much dry up, costing ZOS sales once the Crown to Gold value dropped to a particular level, as no one would buy crowns to sell if it wasn't worth their time. If every Tom, *** & Harry with ESO+ dumped their 1500 crowns per month on traders, there would be almost no sales left for ZOS. Under the current system, you have to "buy" the full amount from one person, who gifts you the item, not piecemeal together enough crowns at discounted prices to buy that 15,000 crown home.
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
The current crown for gold exchange system makes it easy for one party or the other to get scammed. I don't consider any guild or website to be reputable sellers even if they are. There is still a chance of getting scammed from another player in either case and a chance i can lose my crowns or gold in the process.
Personally i am a big advocate of a crown voucher system. Party A buys a crown voucher in predetermined amounts say 100 crowns each from the crown store. This voucher is similar to a motif page or style page in function. You can bank it, mail it, pass it around, etc etc...but most importantly you can sell it on the guild store. Party B can then shop for crown vouchers just like they would a motif for example. They buy it and then they use it just like a motif page except instead of adding a style to a collection it adds 100 crowns to their account. THAT is the way this should operate not on a trust based system with strangers.
In other games it increased sales significantly. Player A may make a lot of real money but not have a lot of time. Player B may have a lot of time but don't have a lot of free funds to spend on the game. Player A buys vouchers and lists them on the guild store. Player B buys them from player A. Player B gets crowns they normally wouldn't be able to get and player A gets gold to spend on things they want buy but don't have the money for. Furthermore, i would make subs something you could buy this way. A lot of non plus players would have plus if they could earn crowns and buy it.
I won't do the crown for gold exchange myself because i don't consider the system to be safe or reliable and this is a common concern both from the crown seller and crown buyers.
There have a been a few games that have added this feature while i have played them and premium currency sales increased by multiples. All those whales that want to run end game content but cant put the effort into all the prep that would be required of them buying carries, people buying prints, motifs, and sticker book gear.
Especially with all the new players and old money in this game. There are players sitting on tens and hundreds of millions of gold with nothing to do with it. But if they could just convert it safely and conveniently into crowns then that wealthy would get redistributed.
I know how the whole system works. But until ZOS decides to remove the 1500 crowns a month from ESO+, which would *** off a lot more players than would be made happy, it can't happen. The market would be flooded with 1500 crown vouchers and there would be zero reason for anyone to buy crowns from ZOS ever again. Those other games you mention, don't give out their game store currency as part of their sub, ESO does.
Or they could just make the cost of sub bought with crowns 3500 crowns and subs bought with crowns don't get the free crowns. It's normal for GTCs to be less bang for the buck than a monthly sub. People would still eat up the 3500 crown subs for 1-2 mil gold a month. You can make a million a month just off doing crafting dailies on 9 characters and doesn't include selling any of the rewards from those.
0 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭They should have set it up so crowns could be sold this way from the beginning. This type of transaction in other games is good for well to do players that can afford to buy premium currency regularly, poorer players that struggle to afford premium currency, and the developer who benefits from increased sales. I can't believe they are not taking advantage of this income stream fully. It also improves the happiness of the player population in general and happy players play more and buy more.
Not sure how I see this increasing Crown Sales, which ZOS does a ton of already. There is a pretty simple system in place by players to buy/sell crowns either through reputable website brokers, as well as the many guilds offer the service as well to members.
The only things I see this suggestion doing, is tanking the value of crowns and protecting the folks that currently try to buy from the cheapest zone spammers, who a percentage of the time are going to rip you off. But that's a buyer beware issue, if you want to cheap out and risk buying off the back of that truck instead of through a legitimate outlet, that's on the buyer. Also, the crown market would pretty much dry up, costing ZOS sales once the Crown to Gold value dropped to a particular level, as no one would buy crowns to sell if it wasn't worth their time. If every Tom, *** & Harry with ESO+ dumped their 1500 crowns per month on traders, there would be almost no sales left for ZOS. Under the current system, you have to "buy" the full amount from one person, who gifts you the item, not piecemeal together enough crowns at discounted prices to buy that 15,000 crown home.
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
The current crown for gold exchange system makes it easy for one party or the other to get scammed. I don't consider any guild or website to be reputable sellers even if they are. There is still a chance of getting scammed from another player in either case and a chance i can lose my crowns or gold in the process.
Personally i am a big advocate of a crown voucher system. Party A buys a crown voucher in predetermined amounts say 100 crowns each from the crown store. This voucher is similar to a motif page or style page in function. You can bank it, mail it, pass it around, etc etc...but most importantly you can sell it on the guild store. Party B can then shop for crown vouchers just like they would a motif for example. They buy it and then they use it just like a motif page except instead of adding a style to a collection it adds 100 crowns to their account. THAT is the way this should operate not on a trust based system with strangers.
In other games it increased sales significantly. Player A may make a lot of real money but not have a lot of time. Player B may have a lot of time but don't have a lot of free funds to spend on the game. Player A buys vouchers and lists them on the guild store. Player B buys them from player A. Player B gets crowns they normally wouldn't be able to get and player A gets gold to spend on things they want buy but don't have the money for. Furthermore, i would make subs something you could buy this way. A lot of non plus players would have plus if they could earn crowns and buy it.
I won't do the crown for gold exchange myself because i don't consider the system to be safe or reliable and this is a common concern both from the crown seller and crown buyers.
There have a been a few games that have added this feature while i have played them and premium currency sales increased by multiples. All those whales that want to run end game content but cant put the effort into all the prep that would be required of them buying carries, people buying prints, motifs, and sticker book gear.
Especially with all the new players and old money in this game. There are players sitting on tens and hundreds of millions of gold with nothing to do with it. But if they could just convert it safely and conveniently into crowns then that wealthy would get redistributed.
I know how the whole system works. But until ZOS decides to remove the 1500 crowns a month from ESO+, which would *** off a lot more players than would be made happy, it can't happen. The market would be flooded with 1500 crown vouchers and there would be zero reason for anyone to buy crowns from ZOS ever again. Those other games you mention, don't give out their game store currency as part of their sub, ESO does.
Or they could just make the cost of sub bought with crowns 3500 crowns and subs bought with crowns don't get the free crowns. It's normal for GTCs to be less bang for the buck than a monthly sub. People would still eat up the 3500 crown subs for 1-2 mil gold a month. You can make a million a month just off doing crafting dailies on 9 characters and doesn't include selling any of the rewards from those.
Sorry, I don't follow. So now instead of selling ESO+ subs for cash, a huge profit center for them, a sub-par version of ESO+ (no crowns included) will be able to be bought with in-game gold, which they make zero off of? And all those people buying the ESO+ sub for just the craft bag that don't care about the 1500 crowns, would convert over to buying subs with gold, costing ZOS a huge portion of their monthly ESO+ sales?
In what way would that motivate ZOS to change to that system, or did I completely misunderstand what you meant?Edited by Kwoung on April 6, 2021 9:51PM1 -
codierussell✭✭✭✭Let me put it in perspective for everyone. ZOS sells crowns for about .007 a crown. They also give out 1500 crowns a month to about half their players, which is what, about a half million people? Currently a very small percentage of those people sell their monthly crown allotment, mostly because it isn't worth their time, although some do.
If however, you made it dead easy for those folks to sell their 1500 crowns, that could put as many as 750 million extra crowns A MONTH on the market that previously were not traded. Which translates into $5,250,000 dollars worth of crowns a month no one needs to buy now. Do you really think they are going to give up $5.2 mil a month of pure profit?
You are going under the assumption that people don't use their ESO+ crowns. Personally, I would spend a lot of gold buying crown items if it was safer to do. Things like skill lines, skyshards and mount lessons would not be uncommon if given the chance to buy with gold. Not to mention other things like race changes every other patch, alliance changes and the occasional other item.
The answer is obviously some things can be bought with crowns and others have to be really money. DLC's, chapters and ESO+ obviously should not be available to buy with crowns. The other items it would 100% push more crown sales. Right now I have probably 10+ characters I wouldn't mind having mages guild and psjic order skill lines maxed out, but you cannot gift these, which is a huge missed market for ZOS. If I can go to the trader and spend 300k gold on 3k crowns I 100% would be poor in game. I think you are missing the fact that QOL items in the store cannot be gifted, and people like myself will just make due without them. Sure you get the ESO+ crowns out there but those are already out there, it just may take people longer to use them to save up for something worth while. Maybe you make it so the crowns from ESO+ have to be spent by you and are separated somehow.1 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭codierussell wrote: »Let me put it in perspective for everyone. ZOS sells crowns for about .007 a crown. They also give out 1500 crowns a month to about half their players, which is what, about a half million people? Currently a very small percentage of those people sell their monthly crown allotment, mostly because it isn't worth their time, although some do.
If however, you made it dead easy for those folks to sell their 1500 crowns, that could put as many as 750 million extra crowns A MONTH on the market that previously were not traded. Which translates into $5,250,000 dollars worth of crowns a month no one needs to buy now. Do you really think they are going to give up $5.2 mil a month of pure profit?
You are going under the assumption that people don't use their ESO+ crowns. Personally, I would spend a lot of gold buying crown items if it was safer to do. Things like skill lines, skyshards and mount lessons would not be uncommon if given the chance to buy with gold. Not to mention other things like race changes every other patch, alliance changes and the occasional other item.
The answer is obviously some things can be bought with crowns and others have to be really money. DLC's, chapters and ESO+ obviously should not be available to buy with crowns. The other items it would 100% push more crown sales. Right now I have probably 10+ characters I wouldn't mind having mages guild and psjic order skill lines maxed out, but you cannot gift these, which is a huge missed market for ZOS. If I can go to the trader and spend 300k gold on 3k crowns I 100% would be poor in game. I think you are missing the fact that QOL items in the store cannot be gifted, and people like myself will just make due without them. Sure you get the ESO+ crowns out there but those are already out there, it just may take people longer to use them to save up for something worth while. Maybe you make it so the crowns from ESO+ have to be spent by you and are separated somehow.
You don't understand, I did not say people don't use those crowns ZOS gives them with ESO+, I said they don't sell them, so people have to buy more crowns if they want something. Let me break it down again, using your scenerio where you want a skill line.
Currently, you need to spend $25 to buy 3,000 crowns which you will then use to buy the skill line. Profit to ZOS = $25!
Under your system:- Player A & B put their monthly 1,500 crowns on the guild store. Net profit to ZOS = 0 as no one bought extra crowns
- You make 300,000 gold say a 200:1 rate and purchase both player A & B's crowns. Net profit to ZOS = 0, as gold is created out of thin air.
- You buy said skill line from the crown store with those 3,000 crowns, net profit for ZOS = 0
Keep in mind it doesn't matter to ZOS if you have that skill line or not, they only care that you may pay $25 to get it, if you don't, no skin off their back. Why would they give it to you for free? A market that doesn't create profit, is *not* a missed market, it is a purposefully avoided one.Edited by Kwoung on April 6, 2021 10:31PM0 -
ThorianB✭✭✭✭✭
✭They should have set it up so crowns could be sold this way from the beginning. This type of transaction in other games is good for well to do players that can afford to buy premium currency regularly, poorer players that struggle to afford premium currency, and the developer who benefits from increased sales. I can't believe they are not taking advantage of this income stream fully. It also improves the happiness of the player population in general and happy players play more and buy more.
Not sure how I see this increasing Crown Sales, which ZOS does a ton of already. There is a pretty simple system in place by players to buy/sell crowns either through reputable website brokers, as well as the many guilds offer the service as well to members.
The only things I see this suggestion doing, is tanking the value of crowns and protecting the folks that currently try to buy from the cheapest zone spammers, who a percentage of the time are going to rip you off. But that's a buyer beware issue, if you want to cheap out and risk buying off the back of that truck instead of through a legitimate outlet, that's on the buyer. Also, the crown market would pretty much dry up, costing ZOS sales once the Crown to Gold value dropped to a particular level, as no one would buy crowns to sell if it wasn't worth their time. If every Tom, *** & Harry with ESO+ dumped their 1500 crowns per month on traders, there would be almost no sales left for ZOS. Under the current system, you have to "buy" the full amount from one person, who gifts you the item, not piecemeal together enough crowns at discounted prices to buy that 15,000 crown home.
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
The current crown for gold exchange system makes it easy for one party or the other to get scammed. I don't consider any guild or website to be reputable sellers even if they are. There is still a chance of getting scammed from another player in either case and a chance i can lose my crowns or gold in the process.
Personally i am a big advocate of a crown voucher system. Party A buys a crown voucher in predetermined amounts say 100 crowns each from the crown store. This voucher is similar to a motif page or style page in function. You can bank it, mail it, pass it around, etc etc...but most importantly you can sell it on the guild store. Party B can then shop for crown vouchers just like they would a motif for example. They buy it and then they use it just like a motif page except instead of adding a style to a collection it adds 100 crowns to their account. THAT is the way this should operate not on a trust based system with strangers.
In other games it increased sales significantly. Player A may make a lot of real money but not have a lot of time. Player B may have a lot of time but don't have a lot of free funds to spend on the game. Player A buys vouchers and lists them on the guild store. Player B buys them from player A. Player B gets crowns they normally wouldn't be able to get and player A gets gold to spend on things they want buy but don't have the money for. Furthermore, i would make subs something you could buy this way. A lot of non plus players would have plus if they could earn crowns and buy it.
I won't do the crown for gold exchange myself because i don't consider the system to be safe or reliable and this is a common concern both from the crown seller and crown buyers.
There have a been a few games that have added this feature while i have played them and premium currency sales increased by multiples. All those whales that want to run end game content but cant put the effort into all the prep that would be required of them buying carries, people buying prints, motifs, and sticker book gear.
Especially with all the new players and old money in this game. There are players sitting on tens and hundreds of millions of gold with nothing to do with it. But if they could just convert it safely and conveniently into crowns then that wealthy would get redistributed.
I know how the whole system works. But until ZOS decides to remove the 1500 crowns a month from ESO+, which would *** off a lot more players than would be made happy, it can't happen. The market would be flooded with 1500 crown vouchers and there would be zero reason for anyone to buy crowns from ZOS ever again. Those other games you mention, don't give out their game store currency as part of their sub, ESO does.
Or they could just make the cost of sub bought with crowns 3500 crowns and subs bought with crowns don't get the free crowns. It's normal for GTCs to be less bang for the buck than a monthly sub. People would still eat up the 3500 crown subs for 1-2 mil gold a month. You can make a million a month just off doing crafting dailies on 9 characters and doesn't include selling any of the rewards from those.
Sorry, I don't follow. So now instead of selling ESO+ subs for cash, a huge profit center for them, a sub-par version of ESO+ (no crowns included) will be able to be bought with in-game gold, which they make zero off of? And all those people buying the ESO+ sub for just the craft bag that don't care about the 1500 crowns, would convert over to buying subs with gold, costing ZOS a huge portion of their monthly ESO+ sales?
In what way would that motivate ZOS to change to that system, or did I completely misunderstand what you meant?
You don't understand.
* Sub bought with real money = you get 1650 crowns and cost current sub fee
* Sub bought with crowns = cost is 3500 crowns and you don't get crowns with that sub.
Either way, the only way to introduce more crowns into the system is to buy those crowns with real money. From a financial standpoint it doesn't really matter to ZOS if someone is buying crown packs or subs. The end result is more sales for ZOS and happier customers( which also encourages them to spend more).
1 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
I have been scammed. I don't want to lose the ability to buy crown items with coin and continue to do so after being scammed. It's just next time I'll trust my gut that something is wrong instead of ignoring it because the person is in my guild.Personally I'd rather they just made crown and gold selling bannable offences and took extremely firm action against all forms of botting. I know a lot of players generally wouldn't agree, but I bet a lot of those who've been scammed would do along with a lot of those who constantly complain about botting.
The net benefit I have gained far, far outweighs the amount of coins that was taken.2 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭They should have set it up so crowns could be sold this way from the beginning. This type of transaction in other games is good for well to do players that can afford to buy premium currency regularly, poorer players that struggle to afford premium currency, and the developer who benefits from increased sales. I can't believe they are not taking advantage of this income stream fully. It also improves the happiness of the player population in general and happy players play more and buy more.
Not sure how I see this increasing Crown Sales, which ZOS does a ton of already. There is a pretty simple system in place by players to buy/sell crowns either through reputable website brokers, as well as the many guilds offer the service as well to members.
The only things I see this suggestion doing, is tanking the value of crowns and protecting the folks that currently try to buy from the cheapest zone spammers, who a percentage of the time are going to rip you off. But that's a buyer beware issue, if you want to cheap out and risk buying off the back of that truck instead of through a legitimate outlet, that's on the buyer. Also, the crown market would pretty much dry up, costing ZOS sales once the Crown to Gold value dropped to a particular level, as no one would buy crowns to sell if it wasn't worth their time. If every Tom, *** & Harry with ESO+ dumped their 1500 crowns per month on traders, there would be almost no sales left for ZOS. Under the current system, you have to "buy" the full amount from one person, who gifts you the item, not piecemeal together enough crowns at discounted prices to buy that 15,000 crown home.
Plus, selling actual Crowns or Gold, is against their TOS.
The current crown for gold exchange system makes it easy for one party or the other to get scammed. I don't consider any guild or website to be reputable sellers even if they are. There is still a chance of getting scammed from another player in either case and a chance i can lose my crowns or gold in the process.
Personally i am a big advocate of a crown voucher system. Party A buys a crown voucher in predetermined amounts say 100 crowns each from the crown store. This voucher is similar to a motif page or style page in function. You can bank it, mail it, pass it around, etc etc...but most importantly you can sell it on the guild store. Party B can then shop for crown vouchers just like they would a motif for example. They buy it and then they use it just like a motif page except instead of adding a style to a collection it adds 100 crowns to their account. THAT is the way this should operate not on a trust based system with strangers.
In other games it increased sales significantly. Player A may make a lot of real money but not have a lot of time. Player B may have a lot of time but don't have a lot of free funds to spend on the game. Player A buys vouchers and lists them on the guild store. Player B buys them from player A. Player B gets crowns they normally wouldn't be able to get and player A gets gold to spend on things they want buy but don't have the money for. Furthermore, i would make subs something you could buy this way. A lot of non plus players would have plus if they could earn crowns and buy it.
I won't do the crown for gold exchange myself because i don't consider the system to be safe or reliable and this is a common concern both from the crown seller and crown buyers.
There have a been a few games that have added this feature while i have played them and premium currency sales increased by multiples. All those whales that want to run end game content but cant put the effort into all the prep that would be required of them buying carries, people buying prints, motifs, and sticker book gear.
Especially with all the new players and old money in this game. There are players sitting on tens and hundreds of millions of gold with nothing to do with it. But if they could just convert it safely and conveniently into crowns then that wealthy would get redistributed.
I know how the whole system works. But until ZOS decides to remove the 1500 crowns a month from ESO+, which would *** off a lot more players than would be made happy, it can't happen. The market would be flooded with 1500 crown vouchers and there would be zero reason for anyone to buy crowns from ZOS ever again. Those other games you mention, don't give out their game store currency as part of their sub, ESO does.
Or they could just make the cost of sub bought with crowns 3500 crowns and subs bought with crowns don't get the free crowns. It's normal for GTCs to be less bang for the buck than a monthly sub. People would still eat up the 3500 crown subs for 1-2 mil gold a month. You can make a million a month just off doing crafting dailies on 9 characters and doesn't include selling any of the rewards from those.
Sorry, I don't follow. So now instead of selling ESO+ subs for cash, a huge profit center for them, a sub-par version of ESO+ (no crowns included) will be able to be bought with in-game gold, which they make zero off of? And all those people buying the ESO+ sub for just the craft bag that don't care about the 1500 crowns, would convert over to buying subs with gold, costing ZOS a huge portion of their monthly ESO+ sales?
In what way would that motivate ZOS to change to that system, or did I completely misunderstand what you meant?
You don't understand.
* Sub bought with real money = you get 1650 crowns and cost current sub fee
* Sub bought with crowns = cost is 3500 crowns and you don't get crowns with that sub.
Either way, the only way to introduce more crowns into the system is to buy those crowns with real money. From a financial standpoint it doesn't really matter to ZOS if someone is buying crown packs or subs. The end result is more sales for ZOS and happier customers( which also encourages them to spend more).
You are missing the point where people don't currently sell their monthly crown allotment very often, but if you made it dead easy to do so, they would. Also, many folks only buy the sub for the craft bag and don't overly care about the extra crowns, and would happily give them up, meaning they would buy the sub for crowns you are proposing instead of using cash, costing ZOS a huge portion of their sub for cash business.
So here you have a huge new supply of easily sold/purchased crowns floating around in game from players that kept the sub for cash and are now easily turning those crowns into gold. Those crowns already existed in-game, they just weren't being traded for gold, but as soon as they can be, ZOS loses a ton of both their crown and sub for cash sales.0 -
codierussell✭✭✭✭You don't understand, I did not say people don't use those crowns ZOS gives them with ESO+, I said they don't sell them, so people have to buy more crowns if they want something. Let me break it down again, using your scenerio where you want a skill line.
I don't think you understand. I buy crowns from ESO+ members all the time. Those crowns go somewhere. They are both spent and sold. You also must have missed when I said that they could easily make the crowns you get through ESO+ cannot be sold. It would also be easy to just make it like the writ vouchers and you can sell the item itself not the crowns. Skill lines and skyshards become books like motifs that could be sold. There are a lot of options that zos can do to make more money.2 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Araneae6537 wrote: »Personally I'd rather they just made crown and gold selling bannable offences and took extremely firm action against all forms of botting. I know a lot of players generally wouldn't agree, but I bet a lot of those who've been scammed would do along with a lot of those who constantly complain about botting.
That would hurt many people and help no one. You don’t have to buy or sell Crowns from anyone or can choose to do so only under whatever terms you set. And no, I would not agree even if I had been scammed. I realize that I am taking a risk when dealing with someone I don’t know if I’m the one fulfilling my part of the trade first. And has been stated, there are other options too, such as the Discord channel middlemen. Honestly, I can’t see any reason anyone would want to make it against ToS unless you have money yourself and want fewer people in game to have nice things. I certainly don’t think that of you, but I am at a loss to think of why you would be against it.
Thanks, I certainly don't have any gold, not being a trader, and I have no problem with other people having nice things. However, this kind of system isn't one I'm naturally comfortable with in a game, and it causes a lot of grief. It came about as an unintended consequence of the introduction of gifting Crown Store items (which was originally requested by guild leaders for raffle prizes and for kind-hearted players wanting to help out friends less financially secure than themselves and as such was eminently worthwhile), and so far as being either officially supported or banned sits uncomfortably between the two with no dependable cover for those scammed through it nor any action against those doing the scamming.
However many times people mention buying at your own risk, using reputable guilds and Discord etc, players continue to get scammed and seemingly ZOS continue to turn a blind eye. Every time the subject comes up with ways of improving it I look at the suggestions but still end up thinking I'd rather just get rid of it altogether.0 -
codierussell✭✭✭✭
However many times people mention buying at your own risk, using reputable guilds and Discord etc, players continue to get scammed and seemingly ZOS continue to turn a blind eye. Every time the subject comes up with ways of improving it I look at the suggestions but still end up thinking I'd rather just get rid of it altogether.
They will never get rid of it because they make a lot of money from it. The more people that sell crowns the more money they make.1 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭codierussell wrote: »You don't understand, I did not say people don't use those crowns ZOS gives them with ESO+, I said they don't sell them, so people have to buy more crowns if they want something. Let me break it down again, using your scenerio where you want a skill line.
I don't think you understand. I buy crowns from ESO+ members all the time. Those crowns go somewhere. They are both spent and sold. You also must have missed when I said that they could easily make the crowns you get through ESO+ cannot be sold. It would also be easy to just make it like the writ vouchers and you can sell the item itself not the crowns. Skill lines and skyshards become books like motifs that could be sold. There are a lot of options that zos can do to make more money.
I did miss the part where you said make the ESO+ crown unsellable, didn't see that bit. But then wouldn't they have to create a new type of crown to keep them separate? Would I be able to buy stuff from the crown store with a partial payment of ESO+ crowns and the crowns I bought off a guild trader from a random player if I didn't have enough of either? Seems like a lot of work on ZOS's part to implement, but if the amount of crown sales would increase to the point where it would be worth the hassle, they might. Keep in mind though, they are probably currently happy with the status quo and any change they make would be a complete gamble based on what some players are saying they want or would do, which historically holds no water... as players are very fickle and as soon as you give them what they want, they want something else.Edited by Kwoung on April 6, 2021 11:16PM0 -
Katahdin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think a system that would allow you to sell crowns on your account directly to a buyer would be the best thing.
Something where once you receive the gold, the crowns get transferred automatically from one account to another or gifted from the crown store. Maybe with some kind of agreement for the number of crowns or the item with a checkbox or something. The current system is too risky for the most part. Putting crowns in a guild store though? No Id rather not see that.Edited by Katahdin on April 6, 2021 11:16PMBeta tester November 20130 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I think a system that would allow you to sell crowns on your account directly to a buyer would be the best thing.
Something where once you receive the gold, the crowns get transferred automatically from one account to another or gifted from the crown store. Maybe with some kind of agreement for the number of crowns or the item with a checkbox or something. The current system is too risky for the most part. Putting crowns in a guild store though? No Id rather not see that.
That is probably the best solution I have seen. It could be implemented by simply adding a crown store item selection menu to the current in-game trade window, where the buyer drops in their gold and the seller could drop in the crown item that will be transferred, so both could see what will be exchanged when they hit accept.3