I am just happy more people on forum are complaining about hyper inflation

ForzaRammer · April 2021

Unlike people who claim it is just 'supply and demand shift', I was right all along

I understand zos want to sell crown houses and stuff.

Here is my original solution, lower all gold gain.
Remove treasure in antique, remove daily quest gold.
Half the pvp campaign reward, half the trial plunder.

And here was another person's suggestion.
Remove transmute crystal for reconstruction, change it to gold.

mobicera · April 2021

Do you actually believe anything will happen with this?
You think zos will police the economy?
You think a forum post will stop the greed of those already with so much gold they have nothing else to do but control the market?

ForzaRammer · April 2021

mobicera wrote: »

Do you actually believe anything will happen with this?
You think zos will police the economy?
You think a forum post will stop the greed of those already with so much gold they have nothing else to do but control the market?

zos added campaign alliance lock, solo bg que
so yeah it worked in the past

Kiralyn2000 · April 2021

ForzaRammer wrote: »

Remove treasure in antique, remove daily quest gold.

And why should they remove my only income?

Not everyone does the guild trader thing.

And there's this massive gold sink called the luxury furniture vendor (and housing in general)

ForzaRammer · April 2021

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

ForzaRammer wrote: »

Remove treasure in antique, remove daily quest gold.

And why should they remove my only income?

Not everyone does the guild trader thing.

And there's this massive gold sink called the luxury furniture vendor (and housing in general)

massive gold sink is not 100k furniture only once a few weeks.

LalMirchi · April 2021

Please no, no no OK thanks.

Kiralyn2000 · April 2021

ForzaRammer wrote: »

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

ForzaRammer wrote: »

Remove treasure in antique, remove daily quest gold.

And why should they remove my only income?

Not everyone does the guild trader thing.

And there's this massive gold sink called the luxury furniture vendor (and housing in general)

massive gold sink is not 100k furniture only once a few weeks.

When I'm not earning more than 30-40k per week, it is.

edit: I'm pretty sure the majority of players aren't multi-million-seller Uber Traders.

mobicera · April 2021

ForzaRammer wrote: »

mobicera wrote: »

Do you actually believe anything will happen with this?
You think zos will police the economy?
You think a forum post will stop the greed of those already with so much gold they have nothing else to do but control the market?

zos added campaign alliance lock, solo bg que
so yeah it worked in the past

Neat you do believe it.
Well don't nerf my gold gain, don't nerf trial plunder(do you actually think that makes much difference?)
I'm going to tell you the plunder I get from trials doesn't cover my costs of tri pots I use for progression trials.
In fact my gold income is so low as of late as zos put dlc dungeon motifs in the crown store that I was forced to sell trial carry runs just to keep my consumable costs covered.
Please think through things, the guild mafias that controls the market isn't the same people making gold in the manner you have suggested.

simox · April 2021

Game could use some new gold sinks. Havent been any major ones introduced since launch of Homestead.

nukk3r · April 2021

So people who sit on millions will stay rich and new players won't even have the chance to get rich. And everyone will have to farm their own mats. Thanks, Clavicus Vile

VaranisArano · April 2021

Are those really the ways most players gain gold?

When I think of quick ways to gain lots of gold through gameplay, I don't ever recommend "Yo, play PVP so if your alliance wins you too can make 19,000 gold every month!" I think my personal "Thanks for participating!" Reward from the Grand Warlord is usually around 3,000 gold a month?

Just saying.

The_Old_Goat · April 2021

ForzaRammer wrote: »

Unlike people who claim it is just 'supply and demand shift', I was right all along

I understand zos want to sell crown houses and stuff.

Here is my original solution, lower all gold gain.
Remove treasure in antique, remove daily quest gold.
Half the pvp campaign reward, half the trial plunder.

And here was another person's suggestion.
Remove transmute crystal for reconstruction, change it to gold.

Those suggestions are very fascist in nature, so I'm going to say no to them.

Tandor · April 2021

mobicera wrote: »

Do you actually believe anything will happen with this?
You think zos will police the economy?
You think a forum post will stop the greed of those already with so much gold they have nothing else to do but control the market?

What economy? A relative handful of traders (that's relative to the overall population) exchanging some of their gold with other traders and banking the rest doesn't make an economy. The trading system is so restrictive that it's irrelevant to most players, and its deficiencies certainly shouldn't result in everyone else having their limited gold receipts from other activities being reduced.

carly · April 2021

That's a 'no' from me as well. Not all of us have been playing for years and are drowning in money. Also many of us don't belong to guilds so we don't sell on the guild trader. I get my money from quests, crafting and dailies and that enables me to fund my 'housing' addiction so I will thank you not to call for a nerf to the meager cash intake I have.

mobicera · April 2021

Tandor wrote: »

mobicera wrote: »

Do you actually believe anything will happen with this?
You think zos will police the economy?
You think a forum post will stop the greed of those already with so much gold they have nothing else to do but control the market?

What economy? A relative handful of traders (that's relative to the overall population) exchanging some of their gold with other traders and banking the rest doesn't make an economy. The trading system is so restrictive that it's irrelevant to most players, and its deficiencies certainly shouldn't result in everyone else having their limited gold receipts from other activities being reduced.

I do believe you should reread what I wrote.
I'm not defending the current system.
However it is the economic system we do have in the game, regardless that it's controlled by the few.
Nor did I once state I was ok with the reduction of gold for people who don't care less about the trading system.

Vermintide · April 2021

Regardless of your feelings about the in game libertarian economy, it is a gameplay oversight that these players with millions of milions of gold don't have anything to spend it on. That's what leads to these trends and behaviours.

In real life, the millionaires and billionaires control the economy in much the same way, but they also have to at least contribute to the economy in order to keep their wealth. Progressive taxes, market fluctuations, lifestyle expenses... Rich people in the real world can't just sit on a bi pile of money, they have to spread it around at least a little to ensure they still have a source of income.

Restricting people's income is not the solution. The real question is what could ZOS implement as a gold-sink for the hyper rich players?

I propose players above a certain level of wealth become unrestricted targets for open PVP, and we have the ability to attempt an assassination on them to take their money. They could use their gold to pay other players as bodyguards if they don;t want to be killed and have all their gold stolen.

(I'm joking but wouldn't that be fun?)

Araneae6537 · April 2021

What “hyper inflation”??? Certain changes drove very predictable increases in the price of some items:
New Meta -> Improvement Mats increase in price
House Gifting -> Demand for Crowns goes up
CP Cap Increased -> Demand for Perfect Roe and other ingredients for XP potions increase

I haven’t seen the price of motifs or furnishing plans increase, not that I’ve kept careful track, but these are items that I frequently shop for.

At least some materials peaked and are coming back down — chromium plating for instance.

As for Crowns, I’ve bought at 200:1 and below through zone the past few months.

The suggestion to nerf gold rewards is, frankly, a terrible one, as it will hurt most those who have the least, newer players whose major income are crafting writs, etc. Those who are already wealthy and playing the markets will not be negatively impacted.

Auth3nticGlitch · April 2021

VaranisArano wrote: »

Are those really the ways most players gain gold?

When I think of quick ways to gain lots of gold through gameplay, I don't ever recommend "Yo, play PVP so if your alliance wins you too can make 19,000 gold every month!" I think my personal "Thanks for participating!" Reward from the Grand Warlord is usually around 3,000 gold a month?

Just saying.

Haha right? Whenever I need to make gold I’ll go farming mats, overland sets, daily quests which provide motifs, recipes etc and sell all of it. Not to mention deconstruction and refining jewellery mats so I get the grains/plating I can sell.
The last resort is fishing for perfect roe or psijic satchels but fishing is hardly rewardable especially considering I can filet 600 fish and due to rngesus sometimes only get 2 perfect roe, which takes hours of fishing to get.
Ngl, I hate the prices being so high when I go to purchase something but the prices I can sell the items I farm is starting to balance everything out for me.

DinoZavr · April 2021

Wait a minute, wait a minute...

Do you know Eyjólfur Guðmundsson consulting EVE Online economy in 2014 holds the PhD in Environmental and Natural Resource Economics?
MMOs economies are that complex matter.

Inflation is the result gold sinks prevail over gold faucets.
Sinks are, basically, generating gold out of thin air. Like you do quest and get gold as a reward.
Faucets are mostly gold transactions going to NPCs, like mail tax, sales tax, housing, vendors goods, repair costs and so on.
Crowns are not the sink, as real cash is not a thin air.

Offering a simple solutions, like "lets make a revolution and thieve the theft" or "double the taxes" are hardly good ideas.
Blind increasing faucets might affect "poor" players way more than "rich" ones, so any economy changes really really require an expert analysis. Like in the real world.

I could only suggest ZOS to hire a professional economist to analyze the contemporary TESO economy trends and offer some balanced solution balancing sinks and faucets, if game makers perceive inflation is the serious issue affecting players influx/churn. It might be not, yes?

I am not an economist, apparently i cannot judge and advise. This is THE case requiring the professional expertise. Srsly.

LalMirchi · April 2021

mobicera wrote: »

However it is the economic system we do have in the game, regardless that it's controlled by the few.

This is something often stated that I would like some really concrete evidence to actually countenance these statements to be factual. Who are these few?

ForzaRammer · April 2021

DinoZavr wrote: »

Wait a minute, wait a minute...

Do you know Eyjólfur Guðmundsson consulting EVE Online economy in 2014 holds the PhD in Environmental and Natural Resource Economics?
MMOs economies are that complex matter.

Inflation is the result gold sinks prevail over gold faucets.
Sinks are, basically, generating gold out of thin air. Like you do quest and get gold as a reward.
Faucets are mostly gold transactions going to NPCs, like mail tax, sales tax, housing, vendors goods, repair costs and so on.
Crowns are not the sink, as real cash is not a thin air.

Offering a simple solutions, like "lets make a revolution and thieve the theft" or "double the taxes" are hardly good ideas.
Blind increasing faucets might affect "poor" players way more than "rich" ones, so any economy changes really really require an expert analysis. Like in the real world.

I could only suggest ZOS to hire a professional economist to analyze the contemporary TESO economy trends and offer some balanced solution balancing sinks and faucets, if game makers perceive inflation is the serious issue affecting players influx/churn. It might be not, yes?

I am not an economist, apparently i cannot judge and advise. This is THE case requiring the professional expertise. Srsly.

Notice the problem is the 1st step of solving it.
Also I believe the definition of sink and faucets are reversed

ForzaRammer · April 2021

Auth3nticGlitch wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Are those really the ways most players gain gold?

When I think of quick ways to gain lots of gold through gameplay, I don't ever recommend "Yo, play PVP so if your alliance wins you too can make 19,000 gold every month!" I think my personal "Thanks for participating!" Reward from the Grand Warlord is usually around 3,000 gold a month?

Just saying.

Haha right? Whenever I need to make gold I’ll go farming mats, overland sets, daily quests which provide motifs, recipes etc and sell all of it. Not to mention deconstruction and refining jewellery mats so I get the grains/plating I can sell.
The last resort is fishing for perfect roe or psijic satchels but fishing is hardly rewardable especially considering I can filet 600 fish and due to rngesus sometimes only get 2 perfect roe, which takes hours of fishing to get.
Ngl, I hate the prices being so high when I go to purchase something but the prices I can sell the items I farm is starting to balance everything out for me.

Gaining mats or motif is not gaining gold directly.
It does not contribute to inflation.
Only direct gold gain out of thin air cause inflation.

JKorr · April 2021

So...prices are too high for item x. Gee, whatever shall I do?

Easiest option, don't buy item x until prices drop to reasonable. Would I like to get ancestral reach motifs? Yes, I would. But I'll wait until the prices are less than 125k and up.

Second option; farm it myself. Cheap in gold maybe, but costly in time and effort. Judgement call whether it is worth the cost for me.

No one is forcing anyone to pay hyper prices. If items don't sell, sellers will relist. If they are so greedy, they won't hold on to items until prices are high again.

But by all means screw up other players sources of income because you're annoyed.

DinoZavr · April 2021

ForzaRammer wrote: »

Notice the problem is the 1st step of solving it.
Also I believe the definition of sink and faucets are reversed

Oh. Sure. I'm dumb. Sorry for that.
I wanted to say inflation might be NOT a serious issue for the game makers point of view, unless it starts affecting number of subscribed players. And we know nothing about ESO demographics and economy as no official reports were ever published.

ForzaRammer · April 2021

mobicera wrote: »

ForzaRammer wrote: »

mobicera wrote: »

Do you actually believe anything will happen with this?
You think zos will police the economy?
You think a forum post will stop the greed of those already with so much gold they have nothing else to do but control the market?

zos added campaign alliance lock, solo bg que
so yeah it worked in the past

Neat you do believe it.
Well don't nerf my gold gain, don't nerf trial plunder(do you actually think that makes much difference?)
I'm going to tell you the plunder I get from trials doesn't cover my costs of tri pots I use for progression trials.
In fact my gold income is so low as of late as zos put dlc dungeon motifs in the crown store that I was forced to sell trial carry runs just to keep my consumable costs covered.
Please think through things, the guild mafias that controls the market isn't the same people making gold in the manner you have suggested.

Monopoly may or may not exist, may or may not add or reduce inflation.
I yet to have a conclusion on that.
If your direct gold income is low, it would be in your best interest to lower it more.
Then the gold u get from carry runs buy more pots.
The people who gain the most from the current system, are the people scry in artaeum all the time.

spartaxoxo · April 2021

I haven't noticed much inflation on console.

Crowns are 100 coin each and have been for years. Gold mats did increase with the cp rework but they are still reasonably priced and tend to go back down after such things. Pricey housing plans have been continued to range from a few hundred k to a mil depending on the rarity of the plan. Motifs are still 10-15k for stuff found in daily quests and the dungeon and trial motifs alongside a small amount of rare and highly desired and rare daily motifs still have a reasonable range in price depending on difficult to attain. Or did prior to the anniversary.

Like what inflation? It's not an ESO problem, it's a PC problem because of add-ons and outside trading. And that's not a zos problem.

ZoS has the current gold gain to gold sink values perfectly tuned for people not using anything external. That's the only responsibility they have as far as faucets and sinks.

Tsar_Gekkou · April 2021

ForzaRammer wrote: »

Remove transmute crystal for reconstruction, change it to gold.

Lol no. Some of us actually use specific gear in this game instead of just running whatever we pick up off the ground. All this would do is make reconning gear hard for people who aren't rich. We already have to spend upgrade materials to reconstruct most things, and adding gold into that mix just locks people out who want to try a build but aren't sitting on a pile of gold to pull from.

mobicera · April 2021

LalMirchi wrote: »

mobicera wrote: »

However it is the economic system we do have in the game, regardless that it's controlled by the few.

This is something often stated that I would like some really concrete evidence to actually countenance these statements to be factual. Who are these few?

Lol pm me if you want ps4 evidence
I'm not opening that can of worms

Tandor · April 2021

mobicera wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

mobicera wrote: »

Do you actually believe anything will happen with this?
You think zos will police the economy?
You think a forum post will stop the greed of those already with so much gold they have nothing else to do but control the market?

What economy? A relative handful of traders (that's relative to the overall population) exchanging some of their gold with other traders and banking the rest doesn't make an economy. The trading system is so restrictive that it's irrelevant to most players, and its deficiencies certainly shouldn't result in everyone else having their limited gold receipts from other activities being reduced.

I do believe you should reread what I wrote.
I'm not defending the current system.
However it is the economic system we do have in the game, regardless that it's controlled by the few.
Nor did I once state I was ok with the reduction of gold for people who don't care less about the trading system.

I quoted your comment because of the reference to policing the economy, so I asked "what economy"? I then dealt with how I see the economy (or lack of it) and objected to the OP's suggestion to remove gold from the non-trading part of the game. Apologies for not putting the last sentence by way of a separate paragraph.

Lumenn · April 2021

While I'm certain a monopoly exists(I've yet to see a system that SOMEONE with the brains, talent, and willingness to work at it can't control in time) it isn't what it's made out to be. One pays for convenience. If the prices are too high one can take the time to farm the items on their own. Or develop their own income to finance their shortcut of buying mats etc. Why should everyone's income be reduced(which will not hurt the established rich, only the average or poor players) so one can get a cheaper shortcut to their goals? Time equals money, at least here one gets to choose what currency they wish to pay with.

SeaGtGruff · April 2021

The thing that "gets me" about the "supply and demand" explanation excuse for pricing is that if you search for a given item on TTC, or simply go straight to the guild traders to search, you can see vast, incredible gaps between the lowest prices and the highest prices-- in some cases, hundreds of thousands of gold. No one is ever going to convince me that these insane variances in pricing are being dictated by "supply and demand."

Also, telling players to just go out and "get more gold" is not a "reasonable" answer. Yes, players can work harder to acquire more gold. But it could take a player a long time to acquire the gold to pay some of the outrageously high prices I've seen, and it's just plain stupid for anyone to actually support those high prices by blithely paying those large sums of gold being asked for. These types of excuses are just skirting the real culprit-- human greed.

I don't think there's a "conspiracy," although it does seem like certain guilds have a monopoly on guild traders. And the system does seem to be designed to encourage trading guilds to encourage their members to price everything as high as possible, so the members can make their "weekly sales quota" and generate more gold for the guild. But it's greedy sellers who want to charge outrageous prices, and rich buyers who are willing to pay those prices, who are the real engineers of this situation.

Personally, I just walk away from anything that's outrageously overpriced, and shop around for the lowest price. And if I can't find a price that I think is reasonable, I just walk away and check back for the item some other day. Sure, I've got lots of gold I can spend. And sure, I will happily spend huge amounts of gold on high-priced items if their prices are fixed-- for example, a large house that can be purchased with in-game gold. But I'm not going to support players' greed by paying millions, or even "just" hundreds of thousands, for items that don't have fixed prices, which can be bought for much, much, much less gold if I shop around and wait patiently for it to be offered at more reasonable prices.