thinking of switching from stam to magicka, have reasons and need advice

Wing · March 2021

this is on DK btw.

i have struggled my way through patch after patch on this class as its my OG character and main, when i would be better of playing a class you pay for or something like sorc. i realize im starting at a disadvantage because of this but have pushed on regardless.

with that being said, tools of my survival pre patch have been things like fitting in timely block's or dodge rolls to augment my complete lack of competitive heals on a stam DK compared to other classes and their options.

however.

post patch i find that the costs for dodge rolling and blocking are so extreme that even with more stam regen and cost reduction compared to pre patch, im often out of stamina very quick. and most targets just blanket heal through my damage, not due so much to my lack of damage but due to their strength of healing. im unable to augment my survivability with tools i previously had effectively.

so im considering going mag DK and doing the same thing as other mag classes. relying less on tools like dodge roll and blocking to help augment my survivability and just brute force it with better self heals and HoTs.

i would kind of like some opinions or thoughts of my overall feelings post patch from you my fellow PvP players.

twing1_ · March 2021

Stam dk has arguably the best access to heals through cauterize, resolving vigor, and rally which can all be boosted by fragmented shield.

Wing · March 2021

twing1_ wrote: »

Stam dk has arguably the best access to heals through cauterize, resolving vigor, and rally which can all be boosted by fragmented shield.

i knew these comments were coming, i tend to try and be vague to avoid them or use specific wording such as "comparative" to denote that while not crap, it is worse then the competition.

only one heal, cauterize, on that list is unique to the DK, so lets not pretend that rally and vigor are "great DK heals" when they are more correctly "great stamina heals".

the only one class has worse heals as a stamina class then DK, that would be NB, who makes up for it by having access to skills like cloak and shadow image to maintain initiative over the fight.

so thank you for telling me a couple tid bits i already know.

hopefully i can get a bit more info on what i was asking about and thats the meta overall post CP 2.0 and the consideration to switch over to magicka to take advantage of the ever shifting meta.

wheem_ESO · March 2021

I've always thought CP-enabled PvP was bad, for multiple reasons, and therefore don't play it. But if you plan to do any BGs, or no-CP PvP more generally, I think you're going to be pretty disappointed. Being completely or nearly one-shotted in no-CP is very much a thing, and Stamina classes are generally better suited to recovering from borderline insta-death than Magicka builds are; you need some dodge spam with simultaneous healing, and hope you don't end up eating any Spin to Win in the process.

A Magicka DK is going to be dealing with the same dodge roll cost increases that everyone else is facing, unless you mix in some light armor...which is going to increase your incoming Stamina-based damage both through inferior resistances and the new % modifier. You can probably do a bit of spam-rolling nonsense, especially with CP-enabled, and potato mash with such a setup, but against good Stamina players? Have fun with the first unblockable CC that comes your way.

PvP is probably more Stamina-favored than it ever has been, with possible exception for Magicka Sorcerer in open world and non-premade BGs.

Wing · March 2021

i actually did change over to magicka and it has been pretty nice, stamina management has been fine because im not using it for damage so break free and dodge roll have been no problem.

and i admit to being a little shocked to how much coag blood heals for, its been very nice to have such a massive burst heal after never having one.

im not a fan of magicka gameplay but im kinda stuck with it for the time being i guess.

fred4 · March 2021

I do not play stamden nor stamcro and always thought my stam DK pretty nice in the healing department. You forgot to mention the +12% healing simply from having the armor buff active. That said I've been struggling sometimes, landing on Willow's Path + Alessian eventually or the Agility / Endurance thing in current Cyrodiil, e.g. health and stamina active on both bars, +weapon damage on front bar, +health regen on back bar. A key strategy for my defense has been pushing down magicka requirements, meaning I use Health + Stamina + Physical Resistance potions. A DK has naturally less physical than spell resistance, so this fills a gap and boosts Alessian, if not at cap already. With the new CP system you take Strategic Reserve, by which means health regen sits at 3K to 6K (varies with potion and ulti status) outside Cyro and with Artaeum gold food. I can see you switched to magicka, but anyway, for what it's worth.

LightYagami · March 2021

I'm considering the opposite, to re-build my magdk into a stamdk.

Please see below my reply on another DK thread...: and

I've been playing magdk as my main over a long time, CP1000+, PvE flawless conquer (on VMA leaderboard a few times), PvP warlord (on Cyrodiil leaderboard a few times), solo's vet dungeons.

I always say that the COMBINED effect of the following problems makes magdk terribly bad in PvP:

1. Lack of burst (burst is very important in PvP, we all know)

2. Most DoT can be purged (can't even land all the slow DoT.

3. Lack of range (especially bad in open area)

4. Lack of mobility (unable to reach opponents or flee quickly. Don't forget they're basically a melee class)

5. No class execution (very difficult to kill opponents under the current high health high recovery meta)

6. Very high cost skills (you may use ultimates to recover resources but that means you are more difficult to control the time of using ultimate with other skills to burst people down)

7. Overly nerfed skills: wings, spike, cc, leap (basically makes magdks illegal to have any special advantages like all other classes have)

I don't think any other classes have ALL the above problems Together. It's fine to have one or two problems, but magdks have ALL the problems. The synergy of ALL the problems makes them bad in PvP.

I don't play group PvE often and I won't oppose that magdks may work as PvE tanks, but they're really bad apart from being PvE tanks.

If there's a class change token, I'll immediately change my magdk to another class.

If someone still complain magdks are too strong, Please, ZOS, Please let me swap the class with the person. I'll change it to any other classes happily.

fred4 · March 2021

LightYagami wrote: »

If someone still complain magdks are too strong, Please, ZOS, Please let me swap the class with the person. I'll change it to any other classes happily.

Want to trade with a magblade? Hehehehe.

3. Lack of range (especially bad in open area).

It's a minor point, but DK has that +2m melee attack range passive, I believe. This is quite nasty. I have occasionally been caught out by skills like Dizzying and Executioner due to that passive. Mag DKs are rarer, but I think the same goes for whip. It makes (stam) DK quite nice to play among the melee classes honestly.

In general flat speed may be underrated. Not sprint speed and not out-of-combat speed, but in-combat speed. I particularly notice this on templar. Having Swift jewelry and / or Wild Hunt makes it easier to keep targets in your jabs.

This is not to disagree with your summary as you clearly point out it is the combination of various factors which makes mag DK a troublesome class. I couldn't say. It's a class I don't like and don't play, although I like my stam DK quite a bit. Was watching a build video and the guy pointed out we've lost a bit of resistance on 1H+Shield, due to CP changes (it is now a slottable no one will ever take). He therefore switched to a bow back bar for the Major Expedition after dodge roll. That might be another reason to favor stam DK.

Canned_Apples · March 2021

@fred4 stamdk is fine. Theyre tanky, have burst and an execute.
Magdk has none of that.
You can try to set up burst with flames of oblivion molten whip, fossilize, and leap, but you’ll have zero survivability...and it’s far from the most reliable burst combo.

If you want a mag class, you’ll have to go sorc. It’s what all the 1vNoobs “pros” are doing to show off their l33t “skills.”

It doesn’t compare.

Vetixio · March 2021

MagSorc is the only viable mag class in PvP atm all other Mag classes and Stamplar need major buffs to be competitive with how insane Stam classes are atm.

Animus-ESO · March 2021

As a former mag main. My advice is don't. Stam is wildly stronger then mag. Unless ur a sorc.