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The definitive answer on ESO pricing.
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SuperScrubby✭✭✭Except the difference is with this game that they're already charging $15 a month so they're recouping the cost of their development with that fee on top of the $60 per game.
I believe this is the first MMO that I've seen charge at the $60 price point. Most companies charge less for MMO's because over the long run they'll make more money from sub fee's than the up front cost of the game. A lower price point usually allows higher penetration into the market since more people are willing to try a $30-$40 mmo with a free month than they are a $60 game.
So Zenimax probably knew that enough fan boys would play this game that they could get away with the $60 per game. If it wasn't for the coupons that were floating around making this game cheaper, I wouldn't have bothered playing the game. While I do enjoy this game, spending $60-80 for an MMO that's always evolving (not always in the best direction) isn't the biggest gamble. But over time with multiple mmo's per year and having to invest time to play them is a cost that $'s don't properly reflect.0 -
jamesharv2005ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭SuperScrubby wrote: »Except the difference is with this game that they're already charging $15 a month so they're recouping the cost of their development with that fee on top of the $60 per game.
I believe this is the first MMO that I've seen charge at the $60 price point. Most companies charge less for MMO's because over the long run they'll make more money from sub fee's than the up front cost of the game. A lower price point usually allows higher penetration into the market since more people are willing to try a $30-$40 mmo with a free month than they are a $60 game.
So Zenimax probably knew that enough fan boys would play this game that they could get away with the $60 per game. If it wasn't for the coupons that were floating around making this game cheaper, I wouldn't have bothered playing the game. While I do enjoy this game, spending $60-80 for an MMO that's always evolving (not always in the best direction) isn't the biggest gamble. But over time with multiple mmo's per year and having to invest time to play them is a cost that $'s don't properly reflect.
LOTRO is free and the last update was either $60 or $100 depending on what perks you want.1 -
Thunder✭✭✭Bugs are not a factor of pricing. Furthermore, bugs are a part of every MMO I've ever played, day one, day fifty, day one thousand. ESO has its share, but no more than its share I'd say. From my experience, aside from the bugs where you can't click on what you need to progress the quest, ESO would be one of the most polished game launches I've ever seen.
When it comes down to it, you either enjoy a game, bugs and all, enough to continue playing it or you do not, If you do not enjoy the game, for whatever reason, then it's over priced at any price. If you research your purchases ahead of time, then you should have a pretty good idea if you will like it or not.
None of that changes the fact that ESO is exactly inline with standard industry pricing. The initial purchase price is the same as every other AAA new release title, the subscription fee is exactly the same as the industry leader in the MMORPG genre, and the DLC Imperial Edition doesn't provide anything you can't get another way in game so you certainly aren't forced to buy it.0 -
@BigDumbViking you must have not bought Skyrim 11/11/11 like I did. So many bugs... but hey it's an Elder Scrolls game, bugged at release was "tradition" at that point (re: Oblivion). And no I'm not excusing the bugs in ESO, but I have to say, it didn't break with "tradition".
Point is certainly conceded.. I did not play Skyrim at launch so my experience here is different. However, with Skyrim you paid $60 and eventually got a working game (4-6mo's) without a monthly fee tacked on top of the purchase price.1 -
knaveofengland✭✭✭I got it from green man gaming when it was on special offer , it was a bit over priced but its cheaper with subs than small payments , look at some games 50 bucks for a tank so its not all that bad ,
I mean with the bugs can use them for fishing ,
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Thunder✭✭✭BigDumbViking wrote: »Point is certainly conceded.. I did not play Skyrim at launch so my experience here is different. However, with Skyrim you paid $60 and eventually got a working game (4-6mo's) without a monthly fee tacked on top of the purchase price.
Sure, you're absolutely correct, Skyrim did not have a monthly fee. It was a single player game and like most single player games there aren't any servers or monthly fees.
ESO is an MMO, and like all MMO's it has servers. Like all MMOs it has to continuously generate revenue in order to keep the servers running. Like most top MMOs it has a subscription, and like most subscriptions it's $15/month with a discount for extended subscriptions.
There is absolutely nothing extraordinary, strange, or even slightly odd about ESO's subscription. It is exactly inline with the industry standards.1 -
dolmen✭✭✭BigDumbViking wrote: »@BigDumbViking you must have not bought Skyrim 11/11/11 like I did. So many bugs... but hey it's an Elder Scrolls game, bugged at release was "tradition" at that point (re: Oblivion). And no I'm not excusing the bugs in ESO, but I have to say, it didn't break with "tradition".
Point is certainly conceded.. I did not play Skyrim at launch so my experience here is different. However, with Skyrim you paid $60 and eventually got a working game (4-6mo's) without a monthly fee tacked on top of the purchase price.
Correct, at release I paid for a "buggy" game. Oh and I was aggravated with it for some months as you point out. Learned more console commands than I cared to know about
I'm glad that your experience was different, at some point Bethesda cleaned up the release so you had the no bug experience.
Here is the thing with me, I never expect a new piece of software on release to be bug free. I have never seen this happen. And not with just games either. Large (not to be named) companies that produce engineering analysis software can't seem to get it "right" the first time on release either. I have spent quite a bit of my "IT career" working out the kinks in engineering software. So, I have been desensitized to there being bugs in general in new releases (or for that matter in version 10.0...)
As for the subject at hand. The game cost what it costs. Since I don't really expect it to be bug free, I only get annoyed a bit and move on. Over time through betas, both weekend sessions and on PTS I watched bugs get fixed, or sort of fixed then fixed again. So I know ZOS is working on them. Do I feel the game in its current state is NOT worth the money? Me no. Others obviously yes. For myself, this may be a case of "A fool and there money are soon parted".
In the mean time, my chief concern is how to beat Angnof.
The Sidekick Order0 -
Requiemslove✭✭✭BUT OTHER GAMES ARE FREE! No they are not. There's no such thing as a free lunch, or a free MMO for that matter. F2P MMO's either only allow you access to certain parts of the game, or they make the game excruciatingly painful to play unless you buy upgrades. Every F2P game I've really gotten into has cost me at least $15/month and usually even more. I saw someone in a F2P thread the other day say they don't want ESO to go F2P because, "I can't afford to play free to play games!"
Furthermore, in nearly every F2P game I've played, grouping with others was always a huge pain because not everyone in the group had access to the content others wanted to do, so often you'd end up not being able to do the content you actually paid 2 play!
A subscription to ESO grants you access to everything the game has to offer, OR DOES IT? What about Imperial Edition?
Sorry, I must intrude at this specific point. When you said no mmo is free, you were a tad off the mark. Sometimes, in the dark recesses of MMO folklore, some companies offered what came to be known as LIFETIME SUBS Which grant the player a lifetime pass to a game. This means you get EVERYTHING new for the game that is not classed as an EXPANSION pack. New updates? Free, new regions, free. NEW CLASSES free. As for the expansion pack, all you pay for [if you want] is for the specific main quest line to be opened to you for that expansion, because, predictably quest packs and other things that come with an mmos big changes are YOURS free. I have not paid a dime for one mmo I play, which I have a lifetime sub for, since autumn LAST YEAR [when its latest expansion came out] and hell, I had the game store currency [which I get 500 of from the company each month, free] to purchase that...but I paid for it, out of support for the MMO...only as I said, because of the game store currency the game gives me, I didn't have to do so. So there you have it, an example of an MMO that is free. I tell you one thing, back in 2009, that was the best £80 I ever did spend.
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Trouvo✭✭✭So, mmos that were $60 at launch that I have played and paid for - SWTOR, GW2, EQ2, EQ1, SWG, WOW, ESO, WILDSTAR..
of those that also have or had a sub fee at some point
SWTOR, EQ1, EQ2, SWG, WOW, ESO
so what was that about mmo's charging less on average at launch?Bloodline|RP Guild|Ebonheart Pact0 -
Shimond✭✭✭✭Requiemslove wrote: »Sorry, I must intrude at this specific point. When you said no mmo is free, you were a tad off the mark. Sometimes, in the dark recesses of MMO folklore, some companies offered what came to be known as LIFETIME SUBS Which grant the player a lifetime pass to a game. This means you get EVERYTHING new for the game that is not classed as an EXPANSION pack. New updates? Free, new regions, free. NEW CLASSES free. As for the expansion pack, all you pay for [if you want] is for the specific main quest line to be opened to you for that expansion, because, predictably quest packs and other things that come with an mmos big changes are YOURS free. I have not paid a dime for one mmo I play, which I have a lifetime sub for, since autumn LAST YEAR [when its latest expansion came out] and hell, I had the game store currency [which I get 500 of from the company each month, free] to purchase that...but I paid for it, out of support for the MMO...only as I said, because of the game store currency the game gives me, I didn't have to do so. So there you have it, an example of an MMO that is free. I tell you one thing, back in 2009, that was the best £80 I ever did spend.
So this lifetime sub you're talking about, was this free?1 -
Chili✭✭rawne1980b16_ESO wrote: »You're saying a new PC game is 30-40 pounds and ESO is 50 pounds. I can't speak for places that use pounds for currency, but here in the US, most new first rate titles are 60 bucks, just the same as ESO. There are new releases for less, but not with the scale of content you get in ESO. Every game with anything near the content ESO has is 60 bucks. Therefore I imagine when you say new games average between 30 and 40 pounds over there, you might be leaving out the part where AAA titles cost the same 50 pounds ESO does. Are there new release PC titles where you're from that sell for 50 pounds?
Nope.
The only games that cost £50 are console games.
PC games cost between £29.99 and £39.99
That's for brand new AAA games.
Batman Arkham Origins on release £29.99
Titanfall £34.99
SWTOR on release £29.99
Thief £34.99
This is the first game in a damn long time i've paid more than £40 for.
Console games tend to be around £49.99 brand new but it's very, very rare to see a PC game priced that high.
Gamestop has Titanfall still @ $60.
Wildstar is $60
Watchdogs is $60
Rome Total War II is $60
So...
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Requiemslove✭✭✭Requiemslove wrote: »Sorry, I must intrude at this specific point. When you said no mmo is free, you were a tad off the mark. Sometimes, in the dark recesses of MMO folklore, some companies offered what came to be known as LIFETIME SUBS Which grant the player a lifetime pass to a game. This means you get EVERYTHING new for the game that is not classed as an EXPANSION pack. New updates? Free, new regions, free. NEW CLASSES free. As for the expansion pack, all you pay for [if you want] is for the specific main quest line to be opened to you for that expansion, because, predictably quest packs and other things that come with an mmos big changes are YOURS free. I have not paid a dime for one mmo I play, which I have a lifetime sub for, since autumn LAST YEAR [when its latest expansion came out] and hell, I had the game store currency [which I get 500 of from the company each month, free] to purchase that...but I paid for it, out of support for the MMO...only as I said, because of the game store currency the game gives me, I didn't have to do so. So there you have it, an example of an MMO that is free. I tell you one thing, back in 2009, that was the best £80 I ever did spend.
So this lifetime sub you're talking about, was this free?
For some people actually they won theirs in a raffle or as part of a lottery. Let me break this down for you. Some, when they got theirs, it was £200. Some, like me jumped upon the very same thing, when they did it for the price I stated. So, the short answer is if you pay for something its NOT free. But then, when you figure the long term. I have not paid a sub fee for that game since 2009, and this was before it went f2p. [as it has which is ultimately destroying it in my view] and before you say wrongly that's what I am, I am not, not for that game, its a life time sub, I have VIP status, with the whole game world free including everything I said, plus 500 game store currency every month. [which means I can purchase game expansions with what THEY give me] Seeing as I have EVERYTHING which f2p people would either have to buy from the store, or spend months getting the game currency to afford, [because by doing what the game calls deeds, you can acquire store points] already at my disposal, and have not paid a single subscription charge since 2009, surely you can see my view?
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rawne1980b16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
As I said, our prices are different.
And I repeat myself ....
ESO cost me £49.99
PC games generally cost between £29.99 and £39.99
So, for us, it's above the average.
That is the one and only point I was trying to make.........0 -
Trouvo✭✭✭rawne1980b16_ESO wrote: »
As I said, our prices are different.
And I repeat myself ....
ESO cost me £49.99
PC games generally cost between £29.99 and £39.99
So, for us, it's above the average.
That is the one and only point I was trying to make.........
Yeah that is a fair point, prices overseas do suckBloodline|RP Guild|Ebonheart Pact0 -
knightblaster✭✭✭
ESO is an MMO, and like all MMO's it has servers. Like all MMOs it has to continuously generate revenue in order to keep the servers running. Like most top MMOs it has a subscription, and like most subscriptions it's $15/month with a discount for extended subscriptions.
Almost no MMOs are able to sustain a subscription over the long term. The two main examples are EVE and WoW. The other "top MMOs" that have released in the last several years all dropped the sub model eventually, and in most cases within the first year, if not sooner than that. It has to do with the competition in the market. Every new release has to have a Plan B to fall back on, and this one does as well, you can be sure of that.
That doesn't mean that they are not justified in trying to make it into a sub model game. The odds are heavily, heavily against that working, however, based on what we have seen in recent years with other games.0 -
Requiemslove✭✭✭rawne1980b16_ESO wrote: »
As I said, our prices are different.
And I repeat myself ....
ESO cost me £49.99
PC games generally cost between £29.99 and £39.99
So, for us, it's above the average.
That is the one and only point I was trying to make.........
I can back up what this guy is saying. Most console games are between £40-£50 while most PC games tend to come in the region of £30-£40. For the record I have spent.....£83 on ESO...which equates to MANY dollars.
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SDZald✭✭✭I do get a chuckle out of people getting so uptight about this issue. When I go into a store to buy hamburger there are different grades of meat at different prices. I don't throw a fit because I can't get the better grade at a lower price. I just decide if I am willing to pay the money for the better grade or even if I really need the better grade. Why should it be any different for a game?
If you think the game is over priced then fine just don't play, but coming unglued over a company's pricing scheme seems silly to me.0 -
Saihung423✭✭✭I see nothing out of the ordinary with the pricing and sub fees.
As far as "there are no free lunches"....Star Trek Online. As free as a bird.
You can mine dilithium and sell it for the cash currency. STO is pretty much the greatest thing in FTP games with the Dil exchange...if you're into that genre.0 -
Requiemslove✭✭✭knightblaster wrote: »
ESO is an MMO, and like all MMO's it has servers. Like all MMOs it has to continuously generate revenue in order to keep the servers running. Like most top MMOs it has a subscription, and like most subscriptions it's $15/month with a discount for extended subscriptions.
Almost no MMOs are able to sustain a subscription over the long term. The two main examples are EVE and WoW. The other "top MMOs" that have released in the last several years all dropped the sub model eventually, and in most cases within the first year, if not sooner than that. It has to do with the competition in the market. Every new release has to have a Plan B to fall back on, and this one does as well, you can be sure of that.
That doesn't mean that they are not justified in trying to make it into a sub model game. The odds are heavily, heavily against that working, however, based on what we have seen in recent years with other games.
Game Subscription remains a viable path for many MMOs actually. They address competition in the market by opening up different payment schemes, f2p is just one of those schemes as anyone going down that route gets a specific amount [usually the initial game content] for free, and that's it. They still have to pay for the lions share of content in the areas they get for free, as in quest packs, and game additions. [like EQ2s additional craft techniques] Which essentially means you end up paying the most over time, as compared to a subscription payer, who tends to get access to everything for a monthly fee. So your summation that monthly subs don't ever work and fade out, is wrong. The only thing you are right about is that MMO companies have to be flexible in how they get income from players.
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knightblaster✭✭✭Requiemslove wrote: »knightblaster wrote: »
ESO is an MMO, and like all MMO's it has servers. Like all MMOs it has to continuously generate revenue in order to keep the servers running. Like most top MMOs it has a subscription, and like most subscriptions it's $15/month with a discount for extended subscriptions.
Almost no MMOs are able to sustain a subscription over the long term. The two main examples are EVE and WoW. The other "top MMOs" that have released in the last several years all dropped the sub model eventually, and in most cases within the first year, if not sooner than that. It has to do with the competition in the market. Every new release has to have a Plan B to fall back on, and this one does as well, you can be sure of that.
That doesn't mean that they are not justified in trying to make it into a sub model game. The odds are heavily, heavily against that working, however, based on what we have seen in recent years with other games.
Game Subscription remains a viable path for many MMOs actually. They address competition in the market by opening up different payment schemes, f2p is just one of those schemes as anyone going down that route gets a specific amount [usually the initial game content] for free, and that's it. They still have to pay for the lions share of content in the areas they get for free, as in quest packs, and game additions. [like EQ2s additional craft techniques] Which essentially means you end up paying the most over time, as compared to a subscription payer, who tends to get access to everything for a monthly fee. So your summation that monthly subs don't ever work and fade out, is wrong. The only thing you are right about is that MMO companies have to be flexible in how they get income from players.
Again, show me the AAA MMO that has released in the last ten years and has a flat sub model in place.
FFXIV ARR has it, not yet at one year,but it may make it. Anyone else?
Yes, I know there are hybrids of various types -- hybrids are not straight sub model games like this one.0 -
Finagill✭I have a problem with how these games are priced in general. Either charge me a monthly fee or charge me for the game. Doing both seems greedy even though it is common place. This is especially true for the digital version since there are no addional costs in manufactering the game.
I think it also hurts sales. There have been many games I chose not to play because they had upfront and re-occuring costs. If they game went free to play I sometimes would download it. If I liked the game then they would get my money. To be clear, I do not want microtransactions!!! I would prefer this game switch to free to download but require a subscription. An ideal situation for me would be if players could PvE up until level 30 for free with the current content and then require a subscription after that. This way ESO would be attracting more players and by the time they hit level 30 they would know if they liked the game enough to sub.1 -
SDZald✭✭✭...
To be clear, I do not want microtransactions!!! I would prefer this game switch to free to download but require a subscription.
...
I think that within 6 months that is what you will see, or at least very cheap, like say $15 for the game. They are taking advantage of their single player game fan base, which is very dedicated and willing to pay that money up front. Once that runs dry you can count on a drastic reduction in game price. At least that is my guess.
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Orizuru✭✭✭Requiemslove wrote: »BUT OTHER GAMES ARE FREE! No they are not. There's no such thing as a free lunch, or a free MMO for that matter. F2P MMO's either only allow you access to certain parts of the game, or they make the game excruciatingly painful to play unless you buy upgrades. Every F2P game I've really gotten into has cost me at least $15/month and usually even more. I saw someone in a F2P thread the other day say they don't want ESO to go F2P because, "I can't afford to play free to play games!"
Furthermore, in nearly every F2P game I've played, grouping with others was always a huge pain because not everyone in the group had access to the content others wanted to do, so often you'd end up not being able to do the content you actually paid 2 play!
A subscription to ESO grants you access to everything the game has to offer, OR DOES IT? What about Imperial Edition?
Sorry, I must intrude at this specific point. When you said no mmo is free, you were a tad off the mark. Sometimes, in the dark recesses of MMO folklore, some companies offered what came to be known as LIFETIME SUBS Which grant the player a lifetime pass to a game. This means you get EVERYTHING new for the game that is not classed as an EXPANSION pack. New updates? Free, new regions, free. NEW CLASSES free. As for the expansion pack, all you pay for [if you want] is for the specific main quest line to be opened to you for that expansion, because, predictably quest packs and other things that come with an mmos big changes are YOURS free. I have not paid a dime for one mmo I play, which I have a lifetime sub for, since autumn LAST YEAR [when its latest expansion came out] and hell, I had the game store currency [which I get 500 of from the company each month, free] to purchase that...but I paid for it, out of support for the MMO...only as I said, because of the game store currency the game gives me, I didn't have to do so. So there you have it, an example of an MMO that is free. I tell you one thing, back in 2009, that was the best £80 I ever did spend.
Lifetime subs are a terrible business model. It generates fast revenue when a game is new, and then kills the game later when your core customer base is no longer paying a fee while the bulk of the game's revenues are dependent upon customers that are fickle and unreliable as subscribers.
I think lifetime subs are the quickest way to kill an MMO. The game will eventually go f2p because the core group of players that the studio can rely on to support the game are not paying for the game any longer.0
