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How long till we can purchase the Antiquities skill line in the store?
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ck37090✭✭✭✭VampireLordLover99 wrote: »
Lol... So it's ok to give them money for a class change because that's what you want? How about I could care less about a class change and would much prefer to spend the crowns I get from subscribing on skill lines or skill points on alt characters rather than regrind. Likewise, I could care less about useless outfits and houses. To me these are the only worthwhile things to purchase in the crown store.Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on January 17, 2021 4:01PM1 -
Sylvermynx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭There are as many ways to play and love this game as there are players. How about we don't argue over what each person is interested in?0 -
Starlock✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Tsar_Gekkou wrote: »Hush, don't encourage them to make skill line more of a grind with an easy solution in the crown store.
No kidding. NONE of the skill lines should have cash shop shortcuts and it was a new low when the company decided that was an acceptable practice. Doubly a new low when they offered no equivalent in-game alternative. Gods forbid they do something like a NewGame+ like a proper game would do...
I just think it sucks that they made sure to make it so you can't gift it. I haven't spent my crowns on loot crates in ages since crown store gifting came out because I can do some skin runs every now and then and buy 15 crates here and there by trading the gold. But since they couldn't add in achievement checks to make sure the person wanting skyshards/skill lines has them unlocked, we have to dig into our pockets and spend real money for skill lines instead of farming in-game gold to trade others willing to part with their crowns.
I'd be happy if they offered this like they should have to begin with - as something customers purchase on alternate characters for a significant sum of in-game gold (similar to NewGame+ but a variation on the theme). Not only would this add a major new gold sink to the game, it is a vastly fairer way of offering the benefit of instant skill progression. There's simply no denying that in certain contexts, paying to unlock skill lines and skyshards provides a competitive gameplay advantage. While that's not my litmus test for calling out unethical monetization of video games, it's a really bad sign. If they'd allowed this with in-game gold too that at least would have made it a bit of a grey area, but as it is now it's just rubbish especially in a game that isn't free-to-play.3 -
Ishtarknows✭✭✭✭✭
✭Zos have made the grind deliberately harder for subsequent characters by removing the basic purple zone leads.
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Jaimeh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I've never bought a skill line or skyshards from the store, but if I were ever tempted to get one, it'd be the antiquity, I hated the grind for it
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ck37090✭✭✭✭I am curious... The subject of the post is listed clearly in the title, they will for sure be releasing the skill line for purchase at some point in the store. Why did the majority of the people that replied to the post bother to even click on this? Literally there are only a couple replies that even addressed the question. [snip]
[Edited to remove Rude Comments and Baiting]Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on January 17, 2021 5:35PM1 -
ErMurazor✭✭✭✭✭Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »Hush, don't encourage them to make skill line more of a grind with an easy solution in the crown store.
No kidding. NONE of the skill lines should have cash shop shortcuts and it was a new low when the company decided that was an acceptable practice. Doubly a new low when they offered no equivalent in-game alternative. Gods forbid they do something like a NewGame+ like a proper game would do...
The ingame equivalent is doing it yourself....
Also you have to already have done it at least once to be able to pay2skip
Time is money
So where do I go in the game to instantly maximize my skill line just like you can do with the cash shop? Where's the NPC that does that? Tell me please.
If you can't (and you can't - this doesn't exist in the game right now) [snip] I like this game - parts of their team do fantastic work that is quite praiseworthy - but the monetization is very egregious. There's no excusing it.
[Edited to remove Baiting and Bashing]
You can buy it too. Pay2skip is for everyone that completed the content before.0 -
Vlad9425✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I don’t get why you would need it on multiple characters anyway? I’m happy enough having it fully levelled on just my main.1 -
Sylvermynx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I don’t get why you would need it on multiple characters anyway? I’m happy enough having it fully levelled on just my main.
As I said before, because I don't want to swap to my main all the time just to do leads. When I'm leveling lowbies, I like to just do things like leads as I go, on whichever character I'm currently on. Not to mention that getting them out leveling antiquities is great for grabbing skyshards and finding wayshrines, treasure chests, fun little quests etc.0 -
cyberjanet✭✭✭✭✭Here is what I do with Antiquities. I have ONE character who has done the full thing, levelling Scrying and Excavation. After that, he does the scrying. I hunt down gold leads, which give you 10 points for digging them up. My other characters are armed with a level 1 trowel (and I resent spending that single skillpoint) but they go around dig everything up. No need to waste time or skill points scrying, and you only level both skill lines mostly with excavation.
You can dig up gold items just just a level 1 trowel. If you're unlucky with your first augurs, you may run out of time. You can break stuff with a simple trowel. But mostly, it's going just fine, and and I've taken three other characters to level 7 excavation for the see hidden chests skill. Busy with the 4th, my thief. It is challenging yes, but actually a lot of fun. Every so often I stream it.Edited by cyberjanet on January 18, 2021 3:36PMFavourite NPC: Wine-For-All
Mostly PC-EU , with a lonely little guy on NA.0 -
caperb✭✭✭✭✭
✭VampireLordLover99 wrote: »You can buy it too. Pay2skip is for everyone that completed the content before.
[Quoted post was removed]
Obviously he means you can buy them with Euro's.
Not sure if it already available for antiquities though.Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on January 18, 2021 6:30PM0 -
cyberjanet✭✭✭✭✭I don’t get why you would need it on multiple characters anyway? I’m happy enough having it fully levelled on just my main.
Level 7 excavation allows you to unlock a skill that lets you see treasure chests more easily. I thought this was an entirely useless skill when I first unlocked it, but changed my mind pretty rapidly while doing dungeons and other content and a chest behind a wall, or in a dark corner, or in some water, or any other weird place was suddenly visible. That's when I decided I need it on all characters I play regularly.Favourite NPC: Wine-For-All
Mostly PC-EU , with a lonely little guy on NA.0 -
Jaxious79✭✭✭✭Ishtarknows wrote: »Zos have made the grind deliberately harder for subsequent characters by removing the basic purple zone leads.
It takes 8 hours to get to level 7 how on earth is that hard? Plus its not hard at all its super simple and you can gain about 100,000 gold by just getting to level 7.1 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Hehe... people don't even know what PTW means, they just toss the term out there. There are ZERO items in the Crown store that would qualify as PTW. Even the skill lines, you have to EARN them before they give you the right to use them on another character.
It's funny, because you are guilty of the exact same thing you are complaining about. You have your definition of P2W, and you think others definitions are laughable. Here is the thing, "winning" is going to have a different definition to almost everyone in an MMO. No you cant buy with a cash a super powerful combat item that can't be obtained in other ways, but that is a pretty darn narrow definition of P2W. Now, I don't think these types of things are particularly high on the spectrum of p2W, but they are certainly on it.
For fun, lets take a purely hypothetical example:
Lets say there is the very competitive trial guild, let's call them Schmodor. Schmodor prides themselves on being world firsts for new content, in other words, that's how they "win" in ESO. Let's say ZOS releases a new class and new trial with the next chapter. Let's also say that the magic version of the new class is the new Meta for mag DPS, but it requires say a few mages guild skills and the psijic spammable to be optimal. Well, on patch day, all 8 DPS of Schmodor buy the new chapter and then buy the two skill lines needed. They then proceed to get the trifecta on patch day before anyone else. Blatant P2W? Maybe not, but its on the spectrum, and that hypothetical aint all that hypothetical...2 -
Starlock✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭VampireLordLover99 wrote: »You can buy it too. Pay2skip is for everyone that completed the content before.
[Quoted post was removed]
Obviously he means you can buy them with Euro's.
Not sure if it already available for antiquities though.
And that also obviously wasn't what I was asking about. I'm asking where the in-game NPC vendor is that we can pay-to-skip with in-game gold. Which doesn't exist - it's a cash shop only cheat code, and that's the problem. In a game that already requires paying for the game and paying for the expansion and paying for a sub (aka, that isn't free-to-play) that's excessive. And customers are barely allowed to even point out this out around here without getting censored.2 -
RunForTheHills✭✭✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »It's funny, because you are guilty of the exact same thing you are complaining about. You have your definition of P2W, and you think others definitions are laughable. Here is the thing, "winning" is going to have a different definition to almost everyone in an MMO. No you cant buy with a cash a super powerful combat item that can't be obtained in other ways, but that is a pretty darn narrow definition of P2W. Now, I don't think these types of things are particularly high on the spectrum of p2W, but they are certainly on it.
For fun, lets take a purely hypothetical example:
Lets say there is the very competitive trial guild, let's call them Schmodor. Schmodor prides themselves on being world firsts for new content, in other words, that's how they "win" in ESO. Let's say ZOS releases a new class and new trial with the next chapter. Let's also say that the magic version of the new class is the new Meta for mag DPS, but it requires say a few mages guild skills and the psijic spammable to be optimal. Well, on patch day, all 8 DPS of Schmodor buy the new chapter and then buy the two skill lines needed. They then proceed to get the trifecta on patch day before anyone else. Blatant P2W? Maybe not, but its on the spectrum, and that hypothetical aint all that hypothetical...
You can be a competitive cyclist without buying a $10,000 bike. Most cyclists don't ride on $10,000 bikes. A few untalented wealthy cyclists do. A cyclist who trains several hours a day can wipe the floor with them on an old Huffy. You aren't going to the Olympics without spending a ton of money on coaches and equipment (or at least your sponsors spending a ton of money). At the elite levels of most sports, it is a game of inches and seconds where equipment and money can make a difference. At the lower levels, where most of us play, it makes almost no difference. Meta gear doesn't give you skills you haven't practiced.0 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭RunForTheHills wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »It's funny, because you are guilty of the exact same thing you are complaining about. You have your definition of P2W, and you think others definitions are laughable. Here is the thing, "winning" is going to have a different definition to almost everyone in an MMO. No you cant buy with a cash a super powerful combat item that can't be obtained in other ways, but that is a pretty darn narrow definition of P2W. Now, I don't think these types of things are particularly high on the spectrum of p2W, but they are certainly on it.
For fun, lets take a purely hypothetical example:
Lets say there is the very competitive trial guild, let's call them Schmodor. Schmodor prides themselves on being world firsts for new content, in other words, that's how they "win" in ESO. Let's say ZOS releases a new class and new trial with the next chapter. Let's also say that the magic version of the new class is the new Meta for mag DPS, but it requires say a few mages guild skills and the psijic spammable to be optimal. Well, on patch day, all 8 DPS of Schmodor buy the new chapter and then buy the two skill lines needed. They then proceed to get the trifecta on patch day before anyone else. Blatant P2W? Maybe not, but its on the spectrum, and that hypothetical aint all that hypothetical...
You can be a competitive cyclist without buying a $10,000 bike. Most cyclists don't ride on $10,000 bikes. A few untalented wealthy cyclists do. A cyclist who trains several hours a day can wipe the floor with them on an old Huffy. You aren't going to the Olympics without spending a ton of money on coaches and equipment (or at least your sponsors spending a ton of money). At the elite levels of most sports, it is a game of inches and seconds where equipment and money can make a difference. At the lower levels, where most of us play, it makes almost no difference. Meta gear doesn't give you skills you haven't practiced.
What does that have to do with anything a wrote? Did I suggest that meta gear gives you skills (we arent even talking about gear)?
No, I outlined a very realistic scenario were purchasing a skill line via the crown store could give you an edge on "world firsts" on new content, and to some people, that is how they "win" at ESO. And therefore, to some, they are arguably pay 2 win. You of course still have to actually play the game and do the deed, but if you have two evenly matched raid groups from a player skill standpoint, skill line purchases could be what determines the "winner" if one group does it on patch day and the other does not.
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RunForTheHills✭✭✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »What does that have to do with anything a wrote? Did I suggest that meta gear gives you skills (we arent even talking about gear)?
No, I outlined a very realistic scenario were purchasing a skill line via the crown store could give you an edge on "world firsts" on new content, and to some people, that is how they "win" at ESO. And therefore, to some, they are arguably pay 2 win. You of course still have to actually play the game and do the deed, but if you have two evenly matched raid groups from a player skill standpoint, skill line purchases could be what determines the "winner" if one group does it on patch day and the other does not.
That is not pay to win. Paying to win guarantees you a world first buy just buying the title. I bought Daggerfall Overlook and I am now a Lord. That is pay to win. Almost all hobbies cost money including ESO. Some cost more than others. If you play tennis you might buy an expensive racket to give you an edge. It won't make you a better player and no one will think you are a winner just because you have an expensive racket. On the other hand, you might spend an extra hour a day on the courts practicing and beat the players with expensive rackets and no time to practice. Everyone will think you are a winner because, well, you won.
Elite athletes buy the expensive equipment because they have to to compete at the highest levels. No one is going to win a professional tennis match with a wooden racket these days, although I have seen my wife beat some pretty good players with one (I don't agree with it, but she likes to sandbag). "Elite" ESO players that want that world first are going to spend the money to get the new content. That is not pay to win. That is pay to play.0 -
caperb✭✭✭✭✭
✭VampireLordLover99 wrote: »You can buy it too. Pay2skip is for everyone that completed the content before.
[Quoted post was removed]
Obviously he means you can buy them with Euro's.
Not sure if it already available for antiquities though.
And that also obviously wasn't what I was asking about. I'm asking where the in-game NPC vendor is that we can pay-to-skip with in-game gold. Which doesn't exist - it's a cash shop only cheat code, and that's the problem. In a game that already requires paying for the game and paying for the expansion and paying for a sub (aka, that isn't free-to-play) that's excessive. And customers are barely allowed to even point out this out around here without getting censored.
Yeh I agree with the prices being ridiculous, though I can't say too much about it because someone reported me for baiting.2 -
barney2525✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I always figured Antiquities would be like Crafting. I got One Master crafter who does that job. I got One antiquities person to do that job. Both require a large amount of skill points dedicated to doing the job well.
Although it would be kinda nice to have the glowy chest vision on all my characters.
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Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭RunForTheHills wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »What does that have to do with anything a wrote? Did I suggest that meta gear gives you skills (we arent even talking about gear)?
No, I outlined a very realistic scenario were purchasing a skill line via the crown store could give you an edge on "world firsts" on new content, and to some people, that is how they "win" at ESO. And therefore, to some, they are arguably pay 2 win. You of course still have to actually play the game and do the deed, but if you have two evenly matched raid groups from a player skill standpoint, skill line purchases could be what determines the "winner" if one group does it on patch day and the other does not.
That is not pay to win. Paying to win guarantees you a world first buy just buying the title. I bought Daggerfall Overlook and I am now a Lord. That is pay to win. Almost all hobbies cost money including ESO. Some cost more than others. If you play tennis you might buy an expensive racket to give you an edge. It won't make you a better player and no one will think you are a winner just because you have an expensive racket. On the other hand, you might spend an extra hour a day on the courts practicing and beat the players with expensive rackets and no time to practice. Everyone will think you are a winner because, well, you won.
Elite athletes buy the expensive equipment because they have to to compete at the highest levels. No one is going to win a professional tennis match with a wooden racket these days, although I have seen my wife beat some pretty good players with one (I don't agree with it, but she likes to sandbag). "Elite" ESO players that want that world first are going to spend the money to get the new content. That is not pay to win. That is pay to play.
Buying new content is absolutely pay 2 play. I wont argue that buying the new chapter in it of itself is pay 2 win.
Buying things that give you a competitive edge are are arguably pay 2 win. And skill lines could absolutely fall into that category, especially if going for a world first. Your definition is so narrow that almost nothing is pay 2 win. In your world, even a more powerful weapon that you could only be bought in the crown store would not be pay 2 win unless it guarantees a victory, which even if I could buy a staff that doubled my spell damage, would not do. A much better player could still beat me, but even the most narrow definitions of p2w would probably include an item like that.2 -
Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Ishtarknows wrote: »Zos have made the grind deliberately harder for subsequent characters by removing the basic purple zone leads.
this is what i am saying! why does the grind get harder for alts, it should get easier. it makes no sense"Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes1