I'm disappointed in you Verandis

Faiza · January 2021

Yes...why would I trust a vampire exactly? Oh wait -

spartaxoxo · January 2021

The very next dialogue you can talk about being vamps iirc and that's more a statement about how not all vamps gotta be bad right?

Faiza · January 2021

spartaxoxo wrote: »

The very next dialogue you can talk about being vamps iirc and that's more a statement about how not all vamps gotta be bad right?

Nope, it was straight to the dream walk sequence from this.

VaranisArano · January 2021

Yeah, ZOS has kinda struggled with basic immersion stuff like NPCs recognizing the player's obvious traits.

I derived great amusement from playing certain quests as a Necromancer. I mean, realistically, some NPCs should just nope out on a Necro, but hey, player character.

Like:
Tanval Indoril: Come with me to the Indoril tombs and I will appeal to my ancestors to help us awaken Balreth.

"Oooh, I get to watch real Dunmer necromancy!"

Tanval Indoril: What? No! No necromancing my sacred ancestors, you heathen!

Or:
"Hey, Ritemaster, thanks for letting me join the Psijic Order! I can't wait to rub it in Mannimarco's face that he got expelled, but you let me join even though I totally used necromancy in front of Valsirenn..."

Iachesis: *facepalms*

Faiza · January 2021

VaranisArano wrote: »

Yeah, ZOS has kinda struggled with basic immersion stuff like NPCs recognizing the player's obvious traits.

I derived great amusement from playing certain quests as a Necromancer. I mean, realistically, some NPCs should just nope out on a Necro, but hey, player character.

Like:
Tanval Indoril: Come with me to the Indoril tombs and I will appeal to my ancestors to help us awaken Balreth.

"Oooh, I get to watch real Dunmer necromancy!"

Tanval Indoril: What? No! No necromancing my sacred ancestors, you heathen!

Or:
"Hey, Ritemaster, thanks for letting me join the Psijic Order! I can't wait to rub it in Mannimarco's face that he got expelled, but you let me join even though I totally used necromancy in front of Valsirenn..."

Iachesis: *facepalms*

I know, the lack of pushback my necromancer (same character) gets in Elsweyr is downright disappointing lol.

I haven't taken him to Western Skyrim or the reach yet but I am holding out hope xD

SeaGtGruff · January 2021

But how is Verandis supposed to trust you? Yes, you look like a vampire. But you might be a vampire hunter who's disguised himself as a vampire in order to infiltrate groups of other vampires and kill them. After all, don't you think he's familiar with all of the vampires in Rivenspire? Just who are you, you stranger from outside of Rivenspire, you?

Ratzkifal · January 2021

I would already be happy if ZOS gave us 3 different ways our characters interacted with the world. Muscle, magic and wits/dexterity. I hate it when my character, a mage, stops a ritual by smashing something with a hammer. Or when my character uses magic in a quest even though they have not a single magicka ability.

If every quest had these 3 different ways to interact with the world, be it only as dialogue options and flavor animations when interacting, it would already be so much more immersive.

RaddlemanNumber7 · January 2021

To gain immersion I assumed that the Count was exerting some level of mind control over the Vestige (and everyone else too). Ancient Vampires are supposed to be good at that sort of thing. This is why the Count can get away with treating the Vestige like his small lady dog all the way through Rivenspire and Markarth, and not receive the wrath of Stendarr that he so justly deserves.

Lugaldu · January 2021

We just learned that Verandis is sometimes unable to recognize another vampire either.

Muizer · January 2021

Vampires. Whenever I get the option, if I can't cure them, I kill them. I don't like how certain dialogues and quest lines force me to pretend there is such a thing as a vampire that isn't evil, and even makes me treat some as if they are my friends. At least give us a dialogue that says "I'll work with you as long as I must, but the next time I see you I'll kill you". And an actual opportunity to do so (even if it's scripted to fail, because ZoS needs those characters for later).

Syldras · January 2021

Muizer wrote: »

I don't like how certain dialogues and quest lines force me to pretend there is such a thing as a vampire that isn't evil, and even makes me treat some as if they are my friends. At least give us a dialogue that says "I'll work with you as long as I must, but the next time I see you I'll kill you".

Oh, I have that with humans all the time.

Lugaldu · January 2021

We were also forced to work for Almalexia, I just met her again, uah...

Ryuvain · January 2021

Syldras wrote: »

Muizer wrote: »

I don't like how certain dialogues and quest lines force me to pretend there is such a thing as a vampire that isn't evil, and even makes me treat some as if they are my friends. At least give us a dialogue that says "I'll work with you as long as I must, but the next time I see you I'll kill you".

Oh, I have that with humans all the time.

Gray host did nothing wrong.

Syldras · January 2021

Lugaldu wrote: »

We were also forced to work for Almalexia, I just met her again, uah...

It's indeed a bit unpleasant for a time traveler from the 3rd era...

Lugaldu · January 2021

No longer source of compassion and sympathy.

Jaimeh · January 2021

VaranisArano wrote: »

I derived great amusement from playing certain quests as a Necromancer. I mean, realistically, some NPCs should just nope out on a Necro, but hey, player character.

Like:
Tanval Indoril: Come with me to the Indoril tombs and I will appeal to my ancestors to help us awaken Balreth.

"Oooh, I get to watch real Dunmer necromancy!"

Tanval Indoril: What? No! No necromancing my sacred ancestors, you heathen!

Also, playing the main quest with a Necro character, and reaching the part where Abnur Tharn says: 'We'll make a necromancer of you yet', and you're sitting there like 'Uhh...'

Syldras · January 2021

Yep, honestly, if they changed the dialogue just a little bit, it would be much more immersive. I'm really wondering why they didn't consider it with vampires and necromancers, as the people on Summerset do treat you differently if you're an Altmer. Same goes for being a Betmer on Vvardenfell.

Varana · January 2021

Adapting pre-Elsweyr content to the presence of necromancers: That's not going to happen.
It's the curse of voice-acted dialogue - you can't just change a few words and be done with it. You need to re-hire the original voice actors (if they're even still around), set up studio time, etc... it's a ton of work and money, way more complicated than when we just went into the text editor and changed a word here and there.

That said, the blindness towards your character's background is sometimes unintentionally hilarious even in recent content, I agree with that.

adriant1978 · January 2021

Verandis is known for not being the most observant.

StarOfElyon · January 2021

Yeah, my vampire necromancer is supposed to be evil (or only performing good acts if it benefits her) but stories make me feel like a self-less Saint. I regret not leaving Rivenspire in ruin. If only I had the option to help Montclair instead of Ravenwatch.

NotaDaedraWorshipper · January 2021

Not reacting to necromancers isn't that weird, because they were added in Elsweyr, so they not having a reaction in older contest is not strange at all.

But Rivenspire and vampirism is horrible. Especially since there are base game contest that react to werewolves, like Hircine in Bangkorai (There are also times when they don't react to you being a werewolf.)

This was a big issue in the base game. There's no racial recognition either. I remember how npcs insulted wood elves or talked like you didn't know what one was or like you were something else, while on my wood elf...

But in the dlcs and chapters they have become much better at this.

Syldras · January 2021

StarOfElyon wrote: »

Yeah, my vampire necromancer is supposed to be evil (or only performing good acts if it benefits her) but stories make me feel like a self-less Saint.

I guess that's an issue in most RPGs. It's mostly about being a helpful "hero" of some kind, and questing basically means "walking around helping people with something". How a necromancer class even fits in there? Good question.

adriant1978 · January 2021

NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »

But Rivenspire and vampirism is horrible. Especially since there are base game contest that react to werewolves, like Hircine in Bangkorai (There are also times when they don't react to you being a werewolf.)

It's because in the original base game, before One Tamriel, vampirism could only be obtained in your final alliance zone which would be Bangkorai for DC folks. They never wrote Verandis to react to player vampires because according to the strict zone progression the game used to have, it was considered impossible for the player to be a vampire as early as Rivenspire.

Now, since they bothered to go back and re-record all Verandis' dialogue with a new voice actor to match up with how he sounds in the Markarth DLC, it beats me why they couldn't have also tweaked it so that he recognises vampires. Missed opportunity.

VaranisArano · January 2021

NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »

Not reacting to necromancers isn't that weird, because they were added in Elsweyr, so they not having a reaction in older contest is not strange at all.

As a player who knows its older content that ZOS isn't going to pay money to redo the voice acting or to cut necro players off from certain questlines, its not strange.

As a lore enthusiast, yeah, it is pretty strange that pious Dunmer, Vanus Galerion, the whole Psijic Order, and a great number of other NPCs who should be aghast at working with a necromancer are sitting there like:

NotaDaedraWorshipper · January 2021

adriant1978 wrote: »

NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »

But Rivenspire and vampirism is horrible. Especially since there are base game contest that react to werewolves, like Hircine in Bangkorai (There are also times when they don't react to you being a werewolf.)

It's because in the original base game, before One Tamriel, vampirism could only be obtained in your final alliance zone which would be Bangkorai for DC folks. They never wrote Verandis to react to player vampires because according to the strict zone progression the game used to have, it was considered impossible for the player to be a vampire as early as Rivenspire.

Now, since they bothered to go back and re-record all Verandis' dialogue with a new voice actor to match up with how he sounds in the Markarth DLC, it beats me why they couldn't have also tweaked it so that he recognises vampires. Missed opportunity.

That, is a good point. Would be a perfect time to get rid off one of those weird things.

StarOfElyon · January 2021

VaranisArano wrote: »

NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »

Not reacting to necromancers isn't that weird, because they were added in Elsweyr, so they not having a reaction in older contest is not strange at all.

As a player who knows its older content that ZOS isn't going to pay money to redo the voice acting or to cut necro players off from certain questlines, its not strange.

As a lore enthusiast, yeah, it is pretty strange that pious Dunmer, Vanus Galerion, the whole Psijic Order, and a great number of other NPCs who should be aghast at working with a necromancer are sitting there like:

They're like: We know you'll be a good Psijic and make the world a better place.

My character: *leaves after stealing everything that wasn't tied down*

Faiza · January 2021

Varana wrote: »

Adapting pre-Elsweyr content to the presence of necromancers: That's not going to happen.
It's the curse of voice-acted dialogue - you can't just change a few words and be done with it. You need to re-hire the original voice actors (if they're even still around), set up studio time, etc... it's a ton of work and money, way more complicated than when we just went into the text editor and changed a word here and there.

That said, the blindness towards your character's background is sometimes unintentionally hilarious even in recent content, I agree with that.

But they went back and changed all of Verandis' lines, because his voice actor changed. They did it so the voice in Rivenspire would match the voice in the Reach.

If they can do that...

SammyKhajit · January 2021

Him and his cronies were supping on blood while this one had to save the lost souls at Crestshade, a town which can easily be helped by those lot.

So, yeah, Sammy is not exactly impressed with him.

Call_of_Red_Mountain · January 2021

I love him very much. Especially after The Reach main quest. But i was surprised why nobody in Skyrim and Markarth can't see that i'm a vampire too. Including Count, Fennorian, etc. I remember only one dialogue with Lyris when we can tell her "Hey, i'm a vampire." Looks like The Reach quests was created for mortals. As a vampires we're very weak, we can't use vamp abilities, mist form, etc in this quests. "Oh look i'm a vamp and i can go there super fast and you, silly hero, find another way."

Yeah. Who cares? I believe... we need a different scenarios for vamps/werwolves/necromants in some stories.

And... I miss you, Verandis.

Ghanima_Atreides · January 2021

Call_of_Red_Mountain wrote: »

But i was surprised why nobody in Skyrim and Markarth can't see that i'm a vampire too. Including Count, Fennorian, etc. I remember only one dialogue with Lyris when we can tell her "Hey, i'm a vampire." Looks like The Reach quests was created for mortals. As a vampires we're very weak, we can't use vamp abilities, mist form, etc in this quests. "Oh look i'm a vamp and i can go there super fast and you, silly hero, find another way." Yeah. Who cares? I believe... we need a different scenarios for vamps/werwolves/necromants in some stories.

I complained about this when Greymoor was released, and it was the reason my vampire dropped the quest after the first segment and I brought a mortal character instead. The game hardly ever acknowledges our vampirism, even in the case of characters who should see it straight away, and the very occasional reference only serves to bring into focus the fact that 99% of the time it's ignored completely.

And yes, we're made to feel weak and inferior, even though according to the lore we're a new strain of vampire turned by Lamae Bal herself and by all accounts quite powerful. We even get to turn into Vampire LordsBlood Scions, but when it comes to regular vampire abilities the average NPC has, we fall short.