I am reading these responses saying that it is not an issue, that there are more than enough....and that is true FOR FOCUSED CHARACTERS, but I can tell you for a fact there are not enough for hybrid and versatile characters. I wont even mention crafting skill lines here, because they don't even matter for what I am talking about...a versatile hybrid character needs ALL the weapon skill lines maxed out, ALL the armor skill lines maxed out, ALL the world skill lines like soul magic, vamp, werewolf, etc(vampire and werewolf I suppose you could choose one and juggle skill points back and forth as you cure one and swap to the other). On my tank for example, I have all those unlocked, and STILL find myself short of skill points for things that I usually dont use, but could find situationally useful like some of the mages guild skills, or certain alliance war skills(siege shield). You may say...oh, you dont need all the weapon lines as a tank...but that is false, I have equipped and used every single weapon on my tank at one time or another, and having them all unlocked makes you much more effective in the setups you can run with a simple press of a button.

In the end, the only people who say you dont need more skill points are those so min/max focused that they can't fathom others prefer to be more flexible in how they play the game. Sure...you can swap characters for that....or you can hit one button, I know what I prefer if I am not going for a score run.

SimonBelmont wrote: »

Wandering_Immigrant wrote: »

SimonBelmont wrote: »

Raideen wrote: »

SimonBelmont wrote: »

I have:

Two characters progressing the Blacksmithing craft (one for weapons & one for heavy armor).
Two characters progressing the Clothier craft (one for light armor & one for medium armor).
And one for each of the other craft, with the exception of Provisioning; which I do on my main (who has BS heavy armor).

I find this greatly reduces the Skill Point burden. Not to mention the obvious advantage, where research times are concerned.

Sounds like OP needs some alts? This game does not seem to be designed around players being able to achieve all things on a single character.

You are going to run into some EXTREMELY expensive issues when it comes time to craft or do crafting writs.

You are going to need to duplicate the amount of motifs you have on all 4 of those characters. The average price of a motif on the crown store is in the neighborhood of 45-50 US dollars.

When I acquire a motif, I only use it on the character who's version of the profession is suitable to craft it. If I get a writ that I can't craft, I just don't do it.

If you want to roleplay the crafting experience the best way to do it is through a dedicated crafting character. RP as a hunter/gatherer, a marchant, a tradesman, whatever suits you. I started off dividing it up like you, but soon realized it would cause issues down the road and I made a crafter, and she's great everything just filters through her like my account manager so the rest of my characters can just play in whatever weird way I want.

If you ever have a house that you want to place crafting stations, or a transmute station, or target dummies, or even chests and coffers in you'll regret it and likely be on the forums requesting motifs to be account-wide or some such. Save yourself the headache and just make a crafter.

I have a hard time following the logic of your first point... An individual, who will (given enough time passed) eventually master every craft in the entire world, hardly seems plausible. The suspension of disbelief required, in this case, collapses under its own weight.

Secondly, what does my house, and what I put in it, have to do with how many characters I spread my game-play across? You're not the first to suggest there is a connection. Nor the first to fail to tie it all together. It's as though people take for granted that certain critical knowledge is simply obvious to all. Well, where this game is concerned, it's not at all obvious.

Still regarding your second point; it is despicable that motifs are not account-wide. Especially if they are purchased via the financial aspect of my account.

I guess for me the head-cannon is in the idea that my character is not actually a master of every craft in the entire world, she's simply proficient in them all. There's a lot of sets in game that can't be crafted, dungeon and trial sets, overland gear, arena weapons. SOMEONE made those sets, my character cannot. She knows enough of each craft to put together some decent gear out of the mats she gathers, but the really good gear is out of her scope.

Housing comes up because a lot of useful housing items are purchased with writ vouchers, which are only gotten through master writs.

Anyway you can do how you want of course, it's just a suggestion.

PvXGamer wrote: »

Currently, we are roughly 100 skill points from being able to buy everything on our skills page. Yes I have every skyshard, yes I have every skill point minus the 27 I'm still missing from cyro ranks. Remember, Skyrim added antiquities that needs 27 skill points to max out and the latest DLC only added 6 new skill points between skyshards and both new dungeons iirc.

As far as I am aware, there are literally hundreds of skill points available in the game. More than enough to level every single skill line. I could be wrong I guess.

With that said, the issue can be that some skill points are locked behind certain content, such as those available from Cyrodiil... which isnt much good for someone who never players ESO, as an example. Or those available from overland question, which arnt much good for a pvp player. But this is kind of just part of the game, there are so many different content types and areas that reward skills points, the idea is that you dont have to do it all.

And additionally, we are supposed to have to make choices, to focus in some areas, it should not be easy to simply level every single skill tree.

Personally I do not see this as a major issue. I have a character for crafting. A character for provisioning. Characters for PVP, characters for PVE. etc etc. So I am splitting up the skill points needed to achieve any given role, each character focuses on their own thang rather than trying to be all things to all ESO.

Grianasteri wrote: »

PvXGamer wrote: »

Currently, we are roughly 100 skill points from being able to buy everything on our skills page. Yes I have every skyshard, yes I have every skill point minus the 27 I'm still missing from cyro ranks. Remember, Skyrim added antiquities that needs 27 skill points to max out and the latest DLC only added 6 new skill points between skyshards and both new dungeons iirc.

As far as I am aware, there are literally hundreds of skill points available in the game. More than enough to level every single skill line. I could be wrong I guess.

With that said, the issue can be that some skill points are locked behind certain content, such as those available from Cyrodiil... which isnt much good for someone who never players ESO, as an example. Or those available from overland question, which arnt much good for a pvp player. But this is kind of just part of the game, there are so many different content types and areas that reward skills points, the idea is that you dont have to do it all.

And additionally, we are supposed to have to make choices, to focus in some areas, it should not be easy to simply level every single skill tree.

Personally I do not see this as a major issue. I have a character for crafting. A character for provisioning. Characters for PVP, characters for PVE. etc etc. So I am splitting up the skill points needed to achieve any given role, each character focuses on their own thang rather than trying to be all things to all ESO.

SimonBelmont wrote: »

Raideen wrote: »

SimonBelmont wrote: »

Raideen wrote: »

SimonBelmont wrote: »

I have:

Two characters progressing the Blacksmithing craft (one for weapons & one for heavy armor).
Two characters progressing the Clothier craft (one for light armor & one for medium armor).
And one for each of the other craft, with the exception of Provisioning; which I do on my main (who has BS heavy armor).

I find this greatly reduces the Skill Point burden. Not to mention the obvious advantage, where research times are concerned.

Sounds like OP needs some alts? This game does not seem to be designed around players being able to achieve all things on a single character.

You are going to run into some EXTREMELY expensive issues when it comes time to craft or do crafting writs.

You are going to need to duplicate the amount of motifs you have on all 4 of those characters. The average price of a motif on the crown store is in the neighborhood of 45-50 US dollars.

When I acquire a motif, I only use it on the character who's version of the profession is suitable to craft it. If I get a writ that I can't craft, I just don't do it.

This is not how the game is designed though. As I stated, you are going to spend a LOT of gold and or real life money if you intend on making a different character for each profession.

Master writ drops are based on how many motifs you own (along with other things). The game is designed so that you have a greater chance of master writs dropping based on how many motifs you know. Master writs are one of the best ways to make money in game, as is harvesting/crafting in general. By separating everything up among different characters you are only doing yourself a huge disservice.

On some level (despite my opting to pay a subscription) the game is designed to incentivize making purchases in the crown store. Therefore certain aspects of this game's design run counter to my financial interest. Besides, how would anyone know any of that; about the motifs and how they affect master writs? It's not like this game explains any of that...or any of its mechanics, for that matter.

I only do master writs in the crafts to which the motif system does not apply. Unless, I just happen to have the specific motif required.

And...honestly...tying the master writ system, to the motif system, just comes across as one more attempt to lace free-to-play with yet another nod to the crown store. That crap get old...fast. Don't get me wrong; I spend crowns...when I feel like it. But I'm not going to be pressured to do so!

I'm not opposed to a game being shop-funded. But I am opposed to being badgered to head to said shop.

Crown store is the most expensive place to get motifs by far. Sell crowns to get gold and then buy the pages for gold.
5000*150-350= 750K to 1750K, now some of the most expensive ones might be economical to buy for crowns on console but buying them to get an higher chance of master writs is totaly pointless.

Master writs has also dropped a lot in price, on PC:EU you can pick up gold clothing, woodworking and blacksmitting ones for 2-5000 gold. Price might go up a bit because people want transmute stations.

Mike0987 wrote: »

I already carry 6-10 sets of armor/food/drinks.

I find this ridiculously excessive, the same way you find us wanting enough skill points for all the things we want to do excessive. Different playstyles "need" different things.

But the botton line is we started the game with a certain number of points available. Not enough for everything but enough to make wise choices about our skills. We gain more with new content, but if it's not enough to complete the new skill lines introduced, then this creates a deficit. They need to add enough skill points to keep it even.

tmbrinks wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

But the botton line is we started the game with a certain number of points available. Not enough for everything but enough to make wise choices about our skills. We gain more with new content, but if it's not enough to complete the new skill lines introduced, then this creates a deficit. They need to add enough skill points to keep it even.

They have. 54 attainable skill points added in the last 9 updates

27 new skill points that can be spent in the 2 new skill lines in the same 9 updates.

You have a net positive of 27 skill points more than you had before.

Have you taken into account every point added and every new skill line available from launch until now? And the complete skill line changes, like with Vampire? I haven't, because honestly it would take me forever to figure it out.

But we need to consider that some of these points aren't easy to obtain, like the Cyrodiil skyshards in enemy occupied areas. Or the ones locked behind PvP, or vet dungeons and trials. We all have different playstyles and things in game we enjoy. Because of this very few players will actually obtain every skill point available. They need to take this into consideration.

SilverBride wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

But the botton line is we started the game with a certain number of points available. Not enough for everything but enough to make wise choices about our skills. We gain more with new content, but if it's not enough to complete the new skill lines introduced, then this creates a deficit. They need to add enough skill points to keep it even.

They have. 54 attainable skill points added in the last 9 updates

27 new skill points that can be spent in the 2 new skill lines in the same 9 updates.

You have a net positive of 27 skill points more than you had before.

Have you taken into account every point added and every new skill line available from launch until now? And the complete skill line changes, like with Vampire? I haven't, because honestly it would take me forever to figure it out.

But we need to consider that some of these points aren't easy to obtain, like the Cyrodiil skyshards in enemy occupied areas. Or the ones locked behind PvP, or vet dungeons and trials. We all have different playstyles and things in game we enjoy. Because of this very few players will actually obtain every skill point available. They need to take this into consideration.

I have not done the math on it.

But I've been playing since launch.

I had to respec my characters much more often earlier because there were less skill points.

They've only added in a few skill lines that were not available at launch in the past 5 years.

Undaunted, Dark Brotherhood, Thieves Guild, Psijic Order, Jewelry, Antiquities I think that's it. (I'm on a short break at work so can't check for sure)

You've gotten that 2 + 11 + 2 + 11 pattern each year for the past 5 years for new skill points

I can guarantee that the difference between the total number of skill points that you need to unlock every skill MINUS the number of skill points available is smaller today than it was 5 years ago

Wut ? I've all skill point and I'm able to Tank, DD, Heal, PvP + solo buld with the same char + all maxed antiquity + craft, and some point / passive here and there.

How is that an issue ?

SilverBride wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

But we need to consider that some of these points aren't easy to obtain, like the Cyrodiil skyshards in enemy occupied areas. Or the ones locked behind PvP, or vet dungeons and trials. We all have different playstyles and things in game we enjoy. Because of this very few players will actually obtain every skill point available. They need to take this into consideration.

You mean ZOS should cater to your playstyle because you don't want to participate in PvP, vet dungeons, and Trials?

Really??

You choosing not to participate in that content is totally fine ... just don't expect special consideration because of that choice.

Where did I say that? What I said was we all (not just me) have different playstyles and this needs to be considered.

I don't PvP or run vet dungeons or trials, but I do complete all the storyline quests. Someone who does PvP may not do storyline quests, and may not run vet dungeons or trials. Someone who runs vet dungeons or trials may not PvP or do storyline quests. So it is doubtful that many players, if any, have every single skill point available in game.

Players that don't PvP don't need to put skill points into those two lines. If you don't do a lot of pickpocketing or stealing you don't need points in that skill line. There are a lot of different ways to play the game and we can assign our points accordingly. We just have to decide how we want to play and where the points we have work best for that style of play.

SilverBride wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Players that don't PvP don't need to put skill points into those two lines. If you don't do a lot of pickpocketing or stealing you don't need points in that skill line. There are a lot of different ways to play the game and we can assign our points accordingly. We just have to decide how we want to play and where the points we have work best for that style of play.

That is what we do. But they need to be careful when adding new skill lines that they don't create a deficit in the total.

For example, if we start with 100 skill points, they add content that adds 10 new skill points, and a skill line that needs 12 to max, we have lost 2 skill points. Those points have to come from somewhere, so some other skill line has to lose 2 points to make up for it.

But if we start with 100 skill points, they add content that adds 10 new skill points, and a skill line that needs 10 to max, then we come out even. We still don't have enough points to max every skill line possible, but we aren't creating deficits that add up over time.

I notice how the multiple times I have shown that you have gained FAR more (potential) skill points over the last 5 years than have been gained through the addition of skill lines, that you have not acknowledged in any way shape or form.

Your entire premise of "losing" skill points has been debunked, so why are you bringing that up in every subsequent post?

tmbrinks wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

I notice how the multiple times I have shown that you have gained FAR more (potential) skill points over the last 5 years than have been gained through the addition of skill lines, that you have not acknowledged in any way shape or form.

Your entire premise of "losing" skill points has been debunked, so why are you bringing that up in every subsequent post?

I don't feel that my opinion has been debunked, because no one has shown concrete proof that it is wrong.

whatever dude... I've done so twice in this thread already. I honestly have no clue what else you want. So, I'm disengaging. Bye.

Just to clarify, I'm not a dude. And I concur that we should just accept that we don't agree.