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[Templar Suggestion] Give Solar/Dark Flare the Crystal Fragments Treatment
ealdwin
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During the Stonethorn patch (6.1.5), Crystal Fragments saw the following changes:
Since these changes, I have noticed that the base ability (not the special proc) has become easier to weave in rotations with the shorter cast time. This, compounded with the ability for the special proc to proc off of the ability itself, has brought Crystal Frags into increased viability as a ranged spammable for the Sorcerer class. In short, it feels great.
And my Templar is jealous.
Prior to the reduced cast time, Crystal Shard (base ability) and Solar Flare (base ability) operated in a similar fashion, being ranged spammables with high damage due to the 1 second cast time, that because of their cast times were hardly used. But when Stonethorn came and went, Crystal Shard saw a change that helped alleviate that issue, the shorter cast time. And Solar Flare was ignored, left forgotten. Outside of niche uses, Dark Flare is largely an unused skill in the Templar Toolkit, that remains too clunky to use in PVE rotations and with the cast time is too hard to land in PVP. It's time to change that.
I am by no means the first to suggest this, as this idea has been suggested plenty of times by others before in the [Class Rep] Templar Feedback Thread. But, seeing as the deficient Templar abilities rarely get the attention they so desperately need, decided it needed to be echoed.
What I would propose for Solar Flare/Dark Flare is the following to bring the base ability and the Dark Flare morph in level with Crystal Shard:
Optionally:
Please let me know what you all think.
Edited by ealdwin on October 24, 2020 3:12AM - Reduced the cast time of this ability and its morphs to 800ms, down from 1 second.
- Reduced the damage done from these abilities by approximately 21%.
- Reduced the cost to 2700, down from 2970.
- This ability can now proc off itself.
Since these changes, I have noticed that the base ability (not the special proc) has become easier to weave in rotations with the shorter cast time. This, compounded with the ability for the special proc to proc off of the ability itself, has brought Crystal Frags into increased viability as a ranged spammable for the Sorcerer class. In short, it feels great.
And my Templar is jealous.
Prior to the reduced cast time, Crystal Shard (base ability) and Solar Flare (base ability) operated in a similar fashion, being ranged spammables with high damage due to the 1 second cast time, that because of their cast times were hardly used. But when Stonethorn came and went, Crystal Shard saw a change that helped alleviate that issue, the shorter cast time. And Solar Flare was ignored, left forgotten. Outside of niche uses, Dark Flare is largely an unused skill in the Templar Toolkit, that remains too clunky to use in PVE rotations and with the cast time is too hard to land in PVP. It's time to change that.
I am by no means the first to suggest this, as this idea has been suggested plenty of times by others before in the [Class Rep] Templar Feedback Thread. But, seeing as the deficient Templar abilities rarely get the attention they so desperately need, decided it needed to be echoed.
What I would propose for Solar Flare/Dark Flare is the following to bring the base ability and the Dark Flare morph in level with Crystal Shard:
- Reduce the cast time to 800ms
- Reduce the damage appropriately
- Reduce the cost to 2700 from 2920 Magicka
Optionally:
Change around the additional effects for the base ability and each morph (a la @Cinbri 's suggestion here):
- Solar Flare:
- This ability and its morphs grant Empower for 3 seconds after cast (reflecting Empower changes from Markarth pts cycle)
- Dark Flare:
- Now, casting a Magicka ability has a 35% chance to make this morph to be instant, and deal 66% more damage.
- Consider renaming this morph
- Solar Barrage:
- This morph continues to grant Empower for 3 seconds after cast
- This morph now deals delayed burst in a radius around caster after 3 seconds (Damage adjusted appropriately)
- This morph now applies Major Defile to all enemies hit by the blast for 4 seconds
- Consider renaming this morph
Please let me know what you all think.
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ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭That makes dark flare legitimately just crystal frags for templars. And major defile on solar barrage looks like it'll be annoying af in pvp, while reducing it's damage in pve isn't desireable. No thanks.PvE Frost Warden Main and teacher for ESO-U. Frost Warden PvE Build Article: https://eso-u.com/articles/nightingales_warden_dps_guide__frost_knight. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX1 -
ealdwin✭✭✭✭✭
✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »That makes dark flare legitimately just crystal frags for templars. And major defile on solar barrage looks like it'll be annoying af in pvp, while reducing it's damage in pve isn't desireable. No thanks.
Edited the original post for clarity.
Probably should have been a bit more clear in my intent. The second point was intended to be more of an "if you want to go further", optional suggestion. Looking at it further, I can see how it could be oppressive in PVP, while less desirable in PVE.
My main suggestion that I wanted to get across is to bring Solar Flare/Dark Flare more in line with other similar ranged cast time spammables in order to improve an often unused skill, following the first suggestion.
Perhaps I was being a bit ambitious with the second point...0 -
Hotdog_23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Quicker cast time seems only fair. With the changes to major defile next patch Dark Flare could do with another 2nd effect. If not, Dark flare becomes weaker overall and see even less use.
I know it would be nice to have it work “casting a Magicka ability has a 35% chance to make this morph to be instant and deal 66% more damage.” but then that would just be a copycat of Crystal Fragments.
If we are copying skill I would much rather it be change into some version of blastbones then crystal fragments. Remove the cast time and have the ability go off after 2.5 seconds at the nearest target and damage everything in a 5 meters radius and keep the aoe major defile as well.
Be safe and have fun
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Drdeath20✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yeah sure why not?!? Would make things interesting to play sword and board/resto and have a spammable in pvp.
Thing is, I imagine templars are nearing a complete overhaul as evidence by the AoE cooldowns on most of the used templar class skills during testing. The class is in shambles and its only sustaining bcz of 3 templar skills. Rune, sweeps/jabs, and BoL/HTD.0 -
ealdwin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yeah sure why not?!? Would make things interesting to play sword and board/resto and have a spammable in pvp.
Thing is, I imagine templars are nearing a complete overhaul as evidence by the AoE cooldowns on most of the used templar class skills during testing. The class is in shambles and its only sustaining bcz of 3 templar skills. Rune, sweeps/jabs, and BoL/HTD.
Yeah, the fact that the testing in Cyrodiil continues to take aim at AoEs only gives reason to believe that ZOS's vision for Cyrodiil in the future is very much focused on less AOEs. At this point it seems like the question isn't if Templar gets an overhaul, but when.
I'm at the point where I'd rather start throwing ideas out for them to see and maybe take inspiration from than just wait to see what happens. (Though the DK poopfist instead of poison whip situation doesn't give me too much hope.)1 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The problem with these abilities is that the game changed and now they are super niche.
At Launch, very strict resource limitations made the pace of combat slower and thus cast-times not nearly so hazardous to cast.
At Launch empower strengthened your next skill rather than a light attack so it was potentially stronger.
At Launch, Solar Barrage was basically a better version of Impulse, which itself was a strong skill.
Now combat and damage is way to faced paced to mess around with cast times, especially as Flare's damaged was nerfed and empower is meh. Solar Barrage is now just a low damage AoE, which is not very threatening to PvP players.
The OP's suggestion makes Flare more useful, but it's still pretty lackluster considering it's so easy to avoid and the damage would be even less.
Even when this skill hit hard, defiled, and empowered anything, is was pretty borderline as far as whether or not to slot it.3 -
Firstmep✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭IMHO for dark flare, what they should do:
When in combat, casting any dawns wrath ability reduces the cast time of your next dark flare by 33% and increases its damage by 10%.
That way it's not a copy of frags, doesn't give you huge upfront burst, but instead encourages to use other ranged abilities first like Backlash and sun fire.
Solar barrage just needs to hit harder or tick more often, it's far too weak in its current state IMHO.
I started running reflective light instead of it, at least It can proc burning and I can use a different pot from the standard spell power/crit ones.2 -
ApolloCentauriSoul ShrivenI must be one the only few to use Dark Flare as a damage spammable. I didn't realize it was so underused! It hits hard in PvE, but I've found it's pretty useless in PvP as mentioned. I definitely think any of the above suggestions would be an improvement.0
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Firstmep✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭ApolloCentauri wrote: »I must be one the only few to use Dark Flare as a damage spammable. I didn't realize it was so underused! It hits hard in PvE, but I've found it's pretty useless in PvP as mentioned. I definitely think any of the above suggestions would be an improvement.
Unfortunately there are simply better ranged spammables even for pve, than dark flare.
Cast times dont tend to fare well, as any mechanic in pve that requires you to dodge/block will make you lose dmg on the big time.
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UppGRAYxDD✭✭✭✭✭
✭Just un-nerf the damage... it’s was way better being a risk/reward skill then it’s current state. Personally the whole Templar class needs a rework."Stendarr's mercy be upon you, for the vigil has none to spare."2