DTStormfox wrote: »This is just a message to those believing that tanking is useful in Battlegrounds:
it is not
So, if you only have 40+ hp 'block build' and cannot do any damage or heal your teammates, please don't join the Battlegrounds queue.
Thank you in advance.
If those builds just switched things up slightly, they could be obscenely overpowered. There's a particular Stamina (of course) Necromancer that runs with Sellistrix + 2h Maelstrom, and can hold block for longer than anyone I've seen in no-CP since the days of permablocking Templar healers a few years ago. Still managed to get something like 872k damage in a game a little bit ago, where 2nd and 3rd place were around 640k. The Dizzy Swing spam was only hitting for around 3k or so, but when you've got Major Defile up permanently, and are spammed with procs and off-GCD stuns, it's still a nightmare to try and fight against. And if you start to get the upper hand, out comes the permablocking.
I've seen some of the type of player that the OP is referring to in PC-NA BGs. It seems that at least some are basically in PvE tanking builds with 40k+ HP and no damage (not even from proc sets). They'll often just chill while blocking or mist forming, and don't really contribute anything to their team. As I said above, with some modifications to their build, those players could actually have some pretty ridiculous damage through procs.DTStormfox wrote: »This is just a message to those believing that tanking is useful in Battlegrounds:
it is not
So, if you only have 40+ hp 'block build' and cannot do any damage or heal your teammates, please don't join the Battlegrounds queue.
Thank you in advance.
u never crossed paths with decimushd for example ?
I see quite a few proc set wearers on PC-NA that also have very high HP, but I've never seen anyone else able to hold block for nearly as long as a particular Stamina Necromancer.If those builds just switched things up slightly, they could be obscenely overpowered. There's a particular Stamina (of course) Necromancer that runs with Sellistrix + 2h Maelstrom, and can hold block for longer than anyone I've seen in no-CP since the days of permablocking Templar healers a few years ago. Still managed to get something like 872k damage in a game a little bit ago, where 2nd and 3rd place were around 640k. The Dizzy Swing spam was only hitting for around 3k or so, but when you've got Major Defile up permanently, and are spammed with procs and off-GCD stuns, it's still a nightmare to try and fight against. And if you start to get the upper hand, out comes the permablocking.
there are many ppl in eupc healthstacking with still good dmg. its pretty easy on the warden too.
DTStormfox wrote: »This is just a message to those believing that tanking is useful in Battlegrounds:
it is not
So, if you only have 40+ hp 'block build' and cannot do any damage or heal your teammates, please don't join the Battlegrounds queue.
Thank you in advance.
Why this discussion?
I experience a lot of random teaming up with 'block builds' and 'tanks' in Battlegrounds lately. Today, two of my random teams consisted of me (damage) and three randoms running 'tanks' or 'block builds'. It was a complete waste of my time because such builds add nothing to the team or playing the objectives.
The fact is, 'block builds' or 'tanks' in PvP serve no function. Eventually, you will run out of HP or Stamina (to block) and you will have achieved nothing. Yes, it may create a short period of the enemies wasting time on you but they will soon ignore your 'block build' or 'tank' because you are not a threat to them anyways.
Waffennacht wrote: »@Jeremy there is a Thews tank that loves to block and is no CP BG viable. Typically Warden or Necro (ive only seen necros in BGs tho)
There's other health builds, but they dont block nearly as much as a thews in no CP
Waffennacht wrote: »@Jeremy there is a Thews tank that loves to block and is no CP BG viable. Typically Warden or Necro (ive only seen necros in BGs tho)
There's other health builds, but they dont block nearly as much as a thews in no CP
Yeah I've heard of them and I think I've fought them a few times. But don't they block to do more damage? I don't think they are blocking as a way to tank others. So I don't think that's what the OP is referring to here. But maybe it is.
Sounds like they would be very good at chaosball
Sounds like they would be very good at chaosball
Waffennacht wrote: »@Jeremy My knowledge of how the build is made is OLD but RouDer was:
Skoria
Thews
Armor Master
At the time Degeneration increased max HP and so did Defensive posture so he slotted both on bars
He had all max health enchantments and max health attributes all healthy traits, Nord
All sturdy trait and posture to reduce block cost, netch for stam return while blocking
Ran Artic Wind, Gripping Shards because both scale to max health
Today id trade in skoria for one of the new monster sets or Zaan; id be Vampire for the ult to gain an additional 10k health
With such a set up youre hitting insane HP numbers, may change the armor around for today's world
But thats what it was.
Waffennacht wrote: »@Jeremy My knowledge of how the build is made is OLD but RouDer was:
Skoria
Thews
Armor Master
At the time Degeneration increased max HP and so did Defensive posture so he slotted both on bars
He had all max health enchantments and max health attributes all healthy traits, Nord
All sturdy trait and posture to reduce block cost, netch for stam return while blocking
Ran Artic Wind, Gripping Shards because both scale to max health
Today id trade in skoria for one of the new monster sets or Zaan; id be Vampire for the ult to gain an additional 10k health
With such a set up youre hitting insane HP numbers, may change the armor around for today's world
But thats what it was.
It looks interesting. It's a shame it's probably Warden exclusive though since they have more abilities that scale to max health. So it would probably be a lost cause to try something like this on Templar since we only have one ability that scales with health and it sucks.
I've also been thinking... but maybe it would be possible to keep unstoppable going to help you keep up the block. That might would stop them from simply CCing you through block and bursting you down. It looks like Thews doesn't have a range limit so perhaps the snare from the armor ultimate wouldn't be such a deal breaker.
Exactly the OP is only correct for deathmatch where a tank is useless but in Chaosball the tank is the best option. Even in domination where you need someone to just hold a flag for a long time it is great, that way the other 3 can take the other flags. Even in capture relic if you can tank 1-2 people and not die guarding your relic that is essential. So in 3 out of 5 games 1 tank is excellent. 3 tanks is not good though.
Wait I take that back, a tank can be OK in deathmatch too if used correctly like if the other teams waste time beating on him and the rest of the team can just spam attacks on the guy. And you would think most people would just avoid a tank but it is amazing how many will focus on a tank over and over, cuz they can't understand why they can't kill them.
DTStormfox wrote: »Exactly the OP is only correct for deathmatch where a tank is useless but in Chaosball the tank is the best option. Even in domination where you need someone to just hold a flag for a long time it is great, that way the other 3 can take the other flags. Even in capture relic if you can tank 1-2 people and not die guarding your relic that is essential. So in 3 out of 5 games 1 tank is excellent. 3 tanks is not good though.
Wait I take that back, a tank can be OK in deathmatch too if used correctly like if the other teams waste time beating on him and the rest of the team can just spam attacks on the guy. And you would think most people would just avoid a tank but it is amazing how many will focus on a tank over and over, cuz they can't understand why they can't kill them.
I don't fully agree.
In Domination or Crazy King, it is indeed useful to have high survivability whilst holding a flag. However, the flag will still flip if one team has more people on the flag than the other team. This means that a single tank may be able to survive while the other team 'steals' the flag and cannot counter that fact because this tank lacks damage.
In Capture the Relic, being tanky is useful if you have the enemy Relic in your possession. A tank is not useful in defending the Relic because one has to kill the enemy player to prevent them from taking your relic. Yes, you could interrupt but after the first interrupt, the enemy player is immune for a short time, allowing them to take the relic anyways. After the enemy team takes your relic, the tank lacks damage to kill the enemy relic carrier.
In Deathmatch, you do not score any points for surviving. Deathmatch is all about killing other players. Yes, the tank may prevent players from killing the tank for a set duration of time and act as a distraction (due to tankiness this will take longer than a regular player). However, enemy players will quickly learn to ignore that player because the tank doesn't pose a threat either.