Nightblade LF for Help/Advise/Suggestions vs DK'S and Templars

cheesefome
cheesefome
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How to play against these classes, what are their weaknesses if any, what to look for, when should i play offensively and when should i play defensive?

I can almost always beat DK but if a good one comes around he ends up murdering me, i pretty much spend my time recovering my health and running and spamming clone from one end to another. I hardly if ever get to play offensively especially if he combo's nicely into a dawnbreaker. Don't get me wrong i combo into an ult but it just isn't enough to kill them, they recover so quickly and are to beefy to 1 combo so im left repeating above, running until i recover health which is often 90% of my time and 10% playing offensively, not because im scared but because I'm never given the opportunity to recover past 30% health from the poison and the burst.

Templars are my toughest match. At this point i just don't believe they have a counter unless you're a tank. Ive seen my friend fight templars easy but alll he does is block... and hes a DK's so templars aren't really that tough to him. I'm nightblade and my scenario usually goes something like this. Templar uses his yellow beam that appears above my character, dashes to me, knocks me down, bursts me down. All this is happening in less than 5 seconds. Once again i don' t have opportunity recover but in this case its much much worse. Even when i do manage some how to survive his first few jabs, i get up, try and recover, by the time im recovered, he rinses and repeats the combo, now im back to square one if not dead yet but more often than not by the 2nd time he attacks im dead. No time to recover, the few times ive landed my ulty they just get up like nothing and burst me down. Ive tried cloaking to play more defensively but i find its even worse then just staying and fighting because of his aoe's and his yellow beam thing that apears above my head, it takes me out of cloak. Are templars just OP because at this point i really believe they are.

I dont have anywhere near as much trouble against other classes in fact 99% of the time im killing every other class with ease unless it's some ridiculously good player which often lasts a solid 3-5 mins of just dodging and ulting and healing over and over until one of us gets a good crit//burst combo down. Those are fun fights because they seem somewhat balanced and it comes down to skill, at least thats what it seems like to me. Templars and DK's are just manhandling me as if im wearing my bare skin with a wooden sword and plastic toy bow.

For those of you guys who are curious, im using --

5 Venomous Smite,
5 Eternal Vigor,
Balorgh's Monster Set,
Poison potion on my 2H Maul.

Runnning your typical skill line --

Surprise Attack,
Executioner,
Rally,
Relenteless Focus,
Camoflouged Hunter


Backbar --

Poison Injection,
Clone,
Shadowy Disguise,
Leeching Strikes,
Resolving Vigor


I'm currently vamp.

I only play NoCP BTW. If there are any great or even good informative videos/clips that are relevant to my questions please don't hesitate to link or leave a title of the video. Been wanting to ask this forever but haven't had much time on my hands, today is friday and was able to put some time aside to be try and be precise with the parts of the fights im having difficulties countering.
Edited by cheesefome on October 2, 2020 11:39PM
  • cheesefome
    cheesefome
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    Sorry, left out the back bar.

    Poison Injection,
    Clone,
    Shadowy Disguise,
    Leeching Strikes,
    Resolving Vigor

  • Drdeath20
    Drdeath20
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    With any templar just pressure them. Templars have no defense.
  • cheesefome
    cheesefome
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    Drdeath20 wrote: »
    With any templar just pressure them. Templars have no defense.

    okay i'll just pressure them then.
  • hakan
    hakan
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    remove poison injection since its bad, use shuffle that both removes snares and give 25percent dmg reduction. great against templar.

    you need more bursty set to take them down. vigor is defensive and smite isnt really bursty, templar can also cleanse them. you may need your teammates help if they are too tanky.
  • erio
    erio
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    If youre having trouble with them knocking you over, block it/roll or use immovability pots
  • cheesefome
    cheesefome
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    hakan wrote: »
    remove poison injection since its bad, use shuffle that both removes snares and give 25percent dmg reduction. great against templar.

    you need more bursty set to take them down. vigor is defensive and smite isnt really bursty, templar can also cleanse them. you may need your teammates help if they are too tanky.

    Thanks for responding.its tough replacing the skills i already have, they are so good guess ill have to.

    I was using spriggans and new moon but was getting melted so i decided to go a bit tankier.
  • cheesefome
    cheesefome
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    erio wrote: »
    If youre having trouble with them knocking you over, block it/roll or use immovability pots

    I try but the server delays mixed with the lag makes it difficult. Been a lot of situations where i time those perfectly and i still get knocked down. Will have to refine the timing.

    Thanks for the suggestion
  • Alchimiste1
    Alchimiste1
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    From a dueling perspective:

    Fighting a magdk is probably one of the toughest fights if they have a lot of damage. You’ll want to play a hit and run style for a good portion of the fight this means surprise attack rolling and shading and cloaking. Basically try not to let them touch you. Only commit to your full combo after they have used their leap because it will save them and potentially kill you if you aren’t prepared.

    Fighting against a stamdk isn’t too bad imo unless they are in a really cheesy setup. Standard open world setup shouldn’t be a hard fight if you are the stamblade , just try to incap when they are on the 2h bar.

    If either are on some cheese mala dot build and are actually decent players you’re probably going to die no matter how you play.

    Fighting against a stamplar is really just watching your resources , try to get them to chase you a bit out of the purifying and just go for your combo when you see an opportunity. Shade when you are in danger

    Magplar with toppling is probably the toughest fight you are likely going to run into. Usually they like to toppling right after a purifying light so be ready to roll dodge or cloak. Try to put a lot of pressure into them but don’t overcommit and run out of resources. You’ll need to one shot the magplar or it’s going to recover, the good news is as a stamblade you do have the potential to do so and magplars see stamblades as free kills so they tend to let their guard down a lot. Capitalize on it. Bad news you’re dot setup makes this a tough matchup. You might not have the burst
    Edited by Alchimiste1 on October 14, 2020 6:31PM
  • fred4
    fred4
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    I don't know whether I can help. I play a melee / ranged magblade in CP. I think speed helps a lot, which in your case would come from rolling on the bow bar. Get into the habit of casting Vigor into dodge roll or Shuffle into dodge roll. I'll second the call for slotting Shuffle, probably in place of Leeching Strikes. You need the snare removal / immunity. I also use Immovable potions just prior to ganking, which mitigates an immediate Toppling Charge or Fossilize counterattack. Unfortunately these potions fit better into a magblade than a stamblade playstyle.

    You never want to turn your back on a templar or any PvPer. That's where they tend to have the most reach to keep hitting you. If you're dodge rolling, you want to move to the side or right through the player or dive for a line-of-sight opportunity. Momentarily sprinting through a player can also help.

    I run a speed build, e.g. Wild Hunt + all Swift, because it gives you the best chance to outrange players, not least templars, in melee fights. In the following clip you can see some odd side-by-side movements as both of us are trying to get position on each other:

    [EDIT: The footage to watch is 4 minutes and 25 seconds in, e.g. towards the end of the clip. It seems the forum does not support YouTube time-coded URLs.]

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FR0M7hlpFXk&t=265s

    If you want to see this guy Xv1ing and killing me, wind the clip back a bit. I did exactly what you shouldn't do. I dodge rolled in a straight line towards a tree that was a little too far away.
    Edited by fred4 on October 6, 2020 8:19PM
    PC EU: Magblade (PvP main), DK (PvE Tank), Sorc (PvP and PvE), Magden (PvE Healer), Magplar (PvP and PvE DD), Arcanist (PvE DD)
    PC NA: Magblade (PvP and PvE every role)
  • cheesefome
    cheesefome
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    Wow, you guys are legends. Thanks for the very detailed and informative reply, ill have to go through it tomorrow. Good stuff.
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