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The sure-fire way to police Stream Sniping is the same solution to all other open world PvP exploits

  • flubber77
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    Well, if u are so bad u need to watch a stream to find them and try killing them u should go play cabal. if u get killed by a streamer and want your revenge why not read how he play and find him by doing? buy detect pots if its a nb u chase. cant find or kill him? just leave and do something else and stop whining for less.

    Streamsnip is something u cant avoid if u play without delay and u cant clame people are "cheating" that way eather. There are to many option do find or see players. for me u predict movement after they sneak and most of the time i get lucky to find them but sometimes i dont and move on.

    Happy hunt everyone

    Nikki.
    Still a grudge, only to see false what u want and nothing less.
  • Daemons_Bane
    Daemons_Bane
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    rpa wrote: »
    Judging from the internet salt from other games the standard method of preventing PvP stream sniping is to ban everyone who the streamer reports as stream sniper.

    Now that's a system open for exploitation
  • TineaCruris
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    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    You can stop stream sniping.
    You can stop AP boosting in Cyrodiil.
    You can stop door camping to kill people in a load screen.
    As a bonus you can solve the problem of unbalanced faction population and PvDoor.

    By closing open world PvP entirely and putting all PvP into battlegrounds only.
    You can keep capture? Resource capture? Make them into BG maps.

    It's way past time they did that, just to limit how much players can exploit. Time and again they've proven they will try to exploit whatever they can and trust that ZOS won't actually do anything.

    No. Please no.

    What is wrong with just making things work as well as they did a few years ago?

    Stream sniping, ap boosting and door camping are not issues with the game, they are not issues the game devs should be dealing with. Their job is to fix the broken game.
    Edited by TineaCruris on September 9, 2020 10:33AM
  • npuk
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    Battlegrounds can't touch the fun that is Cyrodiil.
    The Sacrificial Warriors GMXbox One EU:18x CP Chars (2300+ CP)Xbox One NA: 3x CP Chars (800+ CP)Xbox One (alt) EU:5x CP Chars (1500+ CP)Xbox One (alt 2) EU:1x CP Chars (450+ CP)PC EU: 1x CP Char (400+ CP)
  • VaranisArano
    VaranisArano
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    People in this thread are intentionally misunderstanding what stream sniping actually is.

    It is NOT playing in the same campaign as a streamer and killing them in the normal course of PvP.

    It is NOT randomly getting matched with them in a BG.

    It IS watching their stream on your second monitor or phone and stalking them around the map with the intention of griefing them and trolling their stream.

    The people defending themselves in these threads know exactly what they are doing and that it is toxic. But the fact remains that it doesn't matter what their excuse is because their actions are now covered explicitly by the ToS.

    There's the actual instances of stream sniping which you describe.

    And then there's the colloquial "I died repeatedly on stream but I want an excuse to not look bad, so I'mma say they were stream sniping me" instances of stream sniping.

    It's possible to want the former punished, while not wanting the latter weaponized.
  • SpacemanSpiff1
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    el em ay oh. what a great idea
  • Reverb
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    You can stop all traffic accidents by banning cars and forcibly removing them from people!

    You can stop all steroid and performance enhancer violations in sports by banning all organized sports. No more professional sport teams, no more olympics, only informal neighborhood pickup games. That’s the solution, yah!!

    Let’s take it a step further, we can also stop all theft if we ban owning things. Everyone will be assigned a colorless bloc to live in, with identical furniture crafted into the block, and everyone will be given the exact same allotment of clothing and food and that’s it.
    Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you. ~Friedrich Nietzsche
  • TequilaFire
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    Reverb wrote: »
    You can stop all traffic accidents by banning cars and forcibly removing them from people!

    You can stop all steroid and performance enhancer violations in sports by banning all organized sports. No more professional sport teams, no more olympics, only informal neighborhood pickup games. That’s the solution, yah!!

    Let’s take it a step further, we can also stop all theft if we ban owning things. Everyone will be assigned a colorless bloc to live in, with identical furniture crafted into the block, and everyone will be given the exact same allotment of clothing and food and that’s it.

    Perfect balance! lmao
  • Gythral
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    ban live streaming

    by far the safest solution
    “Be as a tower, that, firmly set,
    Shakes not its top for any blast that blows!”
    Dante Alighieri, The Divine Comedy
  • Kalik_Gold
    Kalik_Gold
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    Stream sniping is utterly a waste of time thing for a company to manage on their end. If your customer who has the safety of just playing the game normally chooses to PvP live and gets killed that is their personal problem.

    For the record, I have never stream sniped.
    Main Character:
    Ras Kalik a Redguard Templar, the Vestige

    PvP Pure-class:
    Goliath of Hammerfell a Redguard Dragonknight
    Jux Blackheart a Redguard Nightblade
    Aurik Siet'ka a Redguard Necromancer
    Cacique the Sage of Ius a Redguard Warden
    Kaotik Von Dae'mon a Redguard* Sorcerer

    PvP: Subclassed or Specialty
    Movárth Piquine a Nord Vampiric Necromancer (Tank)
    Voa a Priest of Sep a Redguard* Necromancer (Healer)
    Tsar af-Bomba a Redguard Vampiric Nightblade (Bomber)
    Two-Big-Horns an Argonian Arcanist /Sorcerer
    Uri Ice-Heart the Twin a Nord Vampiric Warden (Ice-Theme)

    PvE:
    Cinan Tharn an Imperial Dragonknight (Tank)
    Herzog Zwei the Genesis an Akavari* Templar (Healer)
    Bates Vesuius of Dawnstar an Redguard** Dragonknight (Raid Damage) --- Name change needed

    PvE: Specialty
    Tyrus Septim an Imperial Sorcerer (Dungeon Damage)
    Tav'i at-Shinji a Redguard** Warden (Arenas)
    Lucky Hunch the Gambler - a Redguard Nightblade (Thief)

    Leveling...
    Styx of Akatosh a Goblin*** Arcanist --- Race change needed
    Zenovia at-Tura a Redguard** Lycan Sorcerer
    Yesi af-Kalik a Redguard Templar
    ======
    Passives of another race used:
    *Breton
    **Imperial
    ***Argonian




    __________________________Backstories:_________________________

    Ras Kalik the Vestige, a renown Redguard warrior; He has been blessed to save Tamriel from Molag Bal’s destructive Planemeld while reuniting the Five Companions. His further accomplishments after defeating Molag Bal, has been to stop the destruction of Morrowind, the Clockwork City, return order to the isle of Summerset and create a new king in Wrothgar and a queen in Elsywer. These events have made him a living legend and continue to lead him into new adventures throughout Tamriel, as well as into the hearts of many ladies including the Elf Queen, Aryenn. Over many years of adventurous travels, Ras Kalik had become a loner, until he re-visited his homeland of Alik'r.

    Alik'r and it's cities were overrun by the undead Ra-Netu and therefore he made an allegiance with Alik'r's own Ash'abah tribe. These Ash'abah with his help, cleansed the city of Sentinel in Alik'r desert and it's surrounding areas of the undead brought to life by the Withered Hand. After rescuing Sentinel from the undead zombies, King Fahara’jad’s personal bodyguard the Goliath of Hammerfell, who was given this name by Imperials in the region; was asked to assist the tribe after learning of the defeat of the Withered Hand to the Ash'abah. Kalik promised Goliath he would task him with fighting living enemies on the battlefield if he so desired. Goliath being a Yokudan warrior wields a massive sword in respect to the Ansei, a gift given by the Imperial, Cinan Tharn. Not many soldiers are able to wield double two handed weapons, but Goliath loves to get up and personal in a fight, so he also carries a giant maul, both weapons laced with magical flames.

    Jux Blackheart is a master thief that masquerades as a Bard at the Sisters of the Sands inn, with his younger sidekick Lucky Hunch for pilfering and gambling during this time. Jux was known to infiltrate any towns bank vault he came across and even delved into Ayelid ruins without detection. Kalik can vividly recall the night he met the famed thief. Jux found himself rummaging thru a slightly inebriated Kalik’s pocket for too long, on a full-mooned night and because of his greed and the glimmer of his golden armor in the moonlight. He lost his left pinky fingertip as a lesson! But in return, he gained a new friend, as it was his first time since a child being caught red-handed...

    Upon arrival back in the Alik'r after many moons of adventuring, Ras Kalik ventures to Bergama. Visiting The Winking Jackal, he runs into Jux Blackheart, who introduces him to the coin game Crowns vs Forebearers (Heads vs Tails) and Golden Dwemer (RBG).... Jux constantly takes gold from the unfortunate thru theft or gambling, his biggest gambling victim is actually his partner in crime known as Lucky Hunch the Gambler. Lucky doesn't mind losing any gold coins to Jux... as Jux saved him from Altmer slavers in Summerset, by stealing a key and sending him on a boat to the mainland years prior. Lucky spent years in slavery with Khajiits in Summerset and picked up the art of subterfuge, using illusion magic disguises and stealing there.

    Kaotik Von’Daemon an outcast, and a half-caste between a Breton mother and a Redguard father. Kaotik become a pariah due to his conjuration of Daedra pets. He was taught healing magic during his childhood years by his Breton mother. His father due to Redguard customs exiled him from the desert, sending him by wagon caravan to be a soldier in the war in Cyrodiil. He happened to meet Kalik while traveling from Alik'r, during this long caravan ride the caravan he was in was ambushed in Bangkorai by a group of bandits. Kalik by chance was also traveling thru this area on his Auridon Warhorse (which was bestowed to him by his friend, Darien Gautier). During this ambush, Kalik was able to rescue five hostages from the bandits. Kaotik was the first rescued, and Ras Kalik also recruited him to be in the Ash'abah tribe. These core Ash'abah tribesmen may never be seen together in travel as they partake in their own adventures but they always know what each other is doing; as they frequent a hideout in northern Bankorai. Their hideout an old Orc castle ruin, is kept watch by Nuzhimeh and she passes messages written between them, and frequently they also enjoy her company and her bed.

    The other men rescued were a Dunmer banker, an Imperial mercenary and two other soldiers, an Imperial and a Breton Knight, stating proudly he was an Akavir descendent. One of the Imperials, Cinan, claimed to be related to Abnur Tharn the Battlemage of the Imperial Elder Council (One of Ras Kalik's mentors in the Five Companions). Cinan Tharn was really Abnur's drunkard treasure hunting illegitimate son. He was caught smuggling artifacts out of the Ayleid ruins in Cyrodiil and the elder of the two Imperials was Tyrus Septim a retired Imperial navy battle-mage (now a Lycan mercenary living in the city of Rimmen) and guard to the Tharn family. As much as Abnur Tharn hated his half-sister Euraxia, he dislikes his bas†ard son Cinan more. Tyrus now a ruffian and privateer had been paid by Abnur Tharn to watch over Cinan as much as possible. Cinan Tharn a drunkard, loves to drink at least a quarter barrel of Nord mead before he raids various delves and dungeons for relics to sell on the black market. Cinan also plans to one day, run an illegal gambling ring... which he thinks will net him more gold for his wares.

    The Dunmer captive shackled to the Imperials looked familiar to Kalik from his time in Morrowind.... and he recognized him as Tythis Andromo a House Telvanni slave-owner and banker from Vvardenfell. During a rough interrogation to Tythis, Ras Kalik learnt why the bandits accosted him. The racist Dunmer was providing slaves as soldiers for the Three Banner War. The bandits were trying to negotiate a lucrative ransom for Andromo and the Imperials.... Kalik did not need any of this gold and he could never set Tythis free as he did with the two Imperial soldiers. His past involvement with slavery and war crimes, made Kalik's blood boil. He chose not to execute Tythis, as he figured the worse punishment for this former rich and opulent slave owner, is to now be an imprisoned servant for Ras Kalik and the tribe.

    Herzog Zwei the Genesis a reknown Imperial/Akavirri battle-mage. His roots going back to Akavir through his mother’s bloodline. (His mother is descended from the Akaviri, through Versidue-Shae, and his Imperial father met her in Hakoshae, while traveling) Herzog earned the nickname "the Genesis" from his father as a child, as he was his mother's first born child, and last, as she tragically died in child-birth.

    Herzog was seeking to purchase an artifact from Cinan Tharn, before their capture and was meeting Tyrus while in Rimmen, who introduced him to Cinan. This artifact being the Ayelid artifact; the sword Sinweaver. After their rescue and the exchange of gold to Cinan for the sword he decided to slip away before Ras Kalik could question who he was, and why the Akavir descendant really wanted that sword. Herzog was headed to Nagastani — An Ayleid ruin in eastern Cyrodiil. He had read in scrolls that the Sword would give him magical powers to meet his mothers spirit, if he performed an Ayleid ritual at an old shrine hidden there. Equipped with the artifact sword, he was off to start his own adventure but Ras Kalik, did indeed notice the sword however and instead sent a letter to Jux Blackheart (whom also was interested in Ayleid treasures), to attempt to find Herzog and acquire the sword. (*Azani Blackheart in Elder Scroll's Oblivion is Jux's descendant some 747 years later)

    And so the Redguard, Imperial and Akaviri men parted ways ... While Ras Kalik went off to Elsweyr to encounter the latest threat to Tamriel, with Abnur Tharn and Sai Sahan - - DRAGONS!! Little did Ras Kalik know a few people were awaiting him in Senchal besides Sai. A necromancer survived his attack on the Withered Hand, while in Alik'r. The necromancer known as Auriek Siet'ka is also following him to the land of the Khajiits and Cacique the Sage of Ius a Shaman mystic who has become attuned spiritually with Tu'whacca (a Redguard God) and Ius (the Animal God), after being burned severely by the escaped dragons in Elsywer, is awaiting his arrival also. Aurik is a soldier of the Daggerfall Covenant that was introduced to necromancy while in the military, even though this magicka art is not spoken of openly by most of the Military leaders. He came to Alik'r and worked with the Withered Hand before Ras Kalik intervened on their plans. After the defeat of the Withered Hand, he aligned with the Worm Cult, and is constantly adapting and perfecting his necromantic arts.

    After his journey to Rimmen, Kalik heads south to Senchal, in the southern regions of Elyswer. This new adventure will also put him on a path to meet a strange Redguard man. The stranger which was infected with an untreated Peyrite disease and also was the exiled from the Order of the New Moon cult, due to his sickness. He originally joined the cult to worship Laatvulon, the green dragon, mistakenly thinking it was the Daedric prince Peyrite. This confused and suffering cultist is known as Tsar al-Bomba and he is on a path to spread the disease. He was originally infected in Orccrest while recruiting members there. Can Ras Kalik and the shaman Cacique cure this poor soul, only time will tell. Little does Tsar al-Bomba know, that his infection is tied to Vampirism, and eventually the desire for blood will take over his mind. Senchal also offers Kalik his latest love interest... Aeliah. Whom he fondly led thru battles with the Dragonguard.

    After the trek thru the heat, tropical and desert climate of Northern and Southern Elyswer, Ras Kalik heads north to the cold mountain range of Skyrim. His companion friend Lyris beckons for him with a letter sent by crow...

    Movárth Piquine - a former vampire hunter (now infected), within the Fighter's Guild (and a secretive necromancer) was in Skyrim working with the Morthaal Guard. On a patrol mission he was caught in Frewien's ice curse outside of Morthaal with the frozen undead. Movárth's vampiric infection kept him from becoming an undead minion to the curse. He was able to use necromantic ice-magic to encase himself safely until he was freed with Freiwen, when the Vestige Ras Kalik broke the curse.

    Uri Ice-Heart - brother of Urfon Ice-Heart. The twin sons of Atli and Oljourn Ice-Heart. The Ice-Heart family are originally from Markarth but now reside on the Jerall Mountain range near Cyrodiil, with their younger sister Araki. The twins had joined the Winterborn Reachmen while living in Markarth. Urfon pushed west to Orsinium with the Winterborn Clan, leaving his family behind. Uri stayed behind with his parents and sister to live in the family cabin for safety, avoiding the Vampire plague infiltrating the Reach. After news reaches him and he hears of Urfon's death... Uri leaves and heads home and is seeking vengeance. Meanwhile, his sister has also moved on to Windhelm to join the Fighter's guild. He will visit his sister, once before going to seek vengeance and she will craft him armor mixed with ice, called Stalhrim armor. Uri fearing death, after his brother's passing, falls victim to the convincing talk of Movárth at a Nordic tavern, and will also becomes a vampire.

    {time moves forward through the hour-glass}
    PS5/NA - Ras Kalik a Redguard Templar - Daggerfall Covenant
  • Iamnuff
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    Well, that's the nuclear option. "Fixing" the problem by getting rid of ALL opportunity to cheat. Or, you know, play those game modes at all.

    There is such a thing as being so anti-cheating that it wraps around to anti-player.

    Seriously, I like playing in Cyrodiil. I would really dislike your vendetta against cheaters getting my option to play removed.

    Also, knowing where someone is during a battleground is very advantageous, so *all* pvp would need to be removed.

    Great idea. I love it.
  • MasterSpatula
    MasterSpatula
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    Woooooooow.

    If PVP at launch had been like Battlegrounds instead of like Cyrodiil, I doubt I would have lasted more than a couple of months. In fact, the fact that there wasn't anything like Battlegrounds in the game used to be something I considered one of ESO's strengths.

    Small-scale PVP feels like an Arcade Game. Cyrodiil feels like what PVP should be in an RPG, large in scale and tied into the overall story.

    This is a terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible idea, OP.
    "A probable impossibility is preferable to an improbable possibility." - Aristotle
  • zaria
    zaria
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    Woooooooow.

    If PVP at launch had been like Battlegrounds instead of like Cyrodiil, I doubt I would have lasted more than a couple of months. In fact, the fact that there wasn't anything like Battlegrounds in the game used to be something I considered one of ESO's strengths.

    Small-scale PVP feels like an Arcade Game. Cyrodiil feels like what PVP should be in an RPG, large in scale and tied into the overall story.

    This is a terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible idea, OP.
    This and Cyrodil is still more causal than normal trials as any fool can add an siege or heal on ram.
    Some of my best ESO memories is from Cyrodil because weird stuff happens like you are the sole defender of an keep while EP and DC fight on the ring wall. This one provides general artillery support. All kills was counted as solo as this one was the only AD in fight. So much AP :)
    Grinding just make you go in circles.
    Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.
  • Tolino
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    The amount of player who purposely misunderstand stream-sniping is insane!
    Magsorc: Tôlino (Wardless)
    Magden: Wa-Uller
    Stamsorc: Tolino Sturmfalke
  • YandereGirlfriend
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    @TequilaFire That's true, but I think that we can both spot the difference in these threads between the obvious stream snipers trying to rationalize and excuse their behavior versus the people with the honest questions.

    If a guy kills you with oils on the ram and then again with a Nova on a flag inside the keep then that's not stream sniping, it's normal PvP. On the other hand, if you're in three different battles over the course of an hour and the same stamBlade ganker kills you, and, more tellingly, only you, in every spot... then yep, that's very likely to be stream sniping.

    I doubt that Support would throw down the Permaban on the first offense but if you get multiple reports for the same type of behavior... you will eventually use up your benefit of the doubt when it comes to the ToS.

    @LadyNalcarya I honestly do not think that this is something that normal players have to worry about. There aren't even that many PvP streamers in the game to begin with and randomly killing one in large-scale or open combat isn't particularly note-worthy or offensive (and a report of that nature would likely be ignored by Support).

    Stream sniping is usually bow-ganking or bombing a streamer over and over again in multiple places across the map in a way that cannot be credibly explained by random chance. I don't do either of those those things--and neither do the overwhelming majority of ESO players--so I have no anxiety when it comes to these changes.

    And there is always going to be a record, at the very least the record of the stream that is saved by Twitch (and would likely be required as evidence for this type of complaint). It would be very easy to review the death recaps and see if it actually was a stream sniper's Lethal Arrow that killed the streamer half a dozen times in six different places scattered throughout the map or if, for whatever reason, it was a spurious complaint brought by the streamer (in which case, I would expect consequences for the streamer).
  • idk
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    First of all, Zos wanted an open world PvP design. I would go as far as saying Zenimax Media wanted an open world PvP zone as they hired Matt Firor to create ESO and I expect we all know what game he worked on before ESO. I doubt Zos would give any serious thought to eliminating Cyrodiil completely as suggested.

    OP has their solution though, mostly. They can BG all they want to and avoid Cyrodiil like the plague. They are welcome to it.
  • LadyNalcarya
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    @LadyNalcarya I honestly do not think that this is something that normal players have to worry about. There aren't even that many PvP streamers in the game to begin with and randomly killing one in large-scale or open combat isn't particularly note-worthy or offensive (and a report of that nature would likely be ignored by Support).

    Stream sniping is usually bow-ganking or bombing a streamer over and over again in multiple places across the map in a way that cannot be credibly explained by random chance. I don't do either of those those things--and neither do the overwhelming majority of ESO players--so I have no anxiety when it comes to these changes.

    And there is always going to be a record, at the very least the record of the stream that is saved by Twitch (and would likely be required as evidence for this type of complaint). It would be very easy to review the death recaps and see if it actually was a stream sniper's Lethal Arrow that killed the streamer half a dozen times in six different places scattered throughout the map or if, for whatever reason, it was a spurious complaint brought by the streamer (in which case, I would expect consequences for the streamer).

    One thing about pvp is that people tend to get unreasonably upset over it. I remember getting messages from people who were trying to report me for cheating and such (which was hilarious because I'm pretty bad at pvp). But unlike cheating accusations, this stream sniping thing seems extremely difficult to prove. Even if they contact twitch to collect evidence, stream sniper's ESO account might not be linked to twitch and their username might be different. So it's essentially streamer's word against yours, and since streamers are deemed as more important that regular players, this system is open to abuse.
    And no, following people of another alliance is not a proof of stream sniping. People can spy on other alliance with alt chars and tell their friends what's going on using voice chat. Not saying that this behavior is good, but I just don't see how you prove that a certain person is watching a stream to hunt someone down.
    And if this rule would only apply to extreme cases of stalking and harassment, then why even have a special rule for that if stalking and harassment are already prohibited?
    Edited by LadyNalcarya on September 10, 2020 5:37AM
    Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Voice of Reason

    PC/EU
  • YandereGirlfriend
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    @LadyNalcarya The evidence would come from the streamer's stream (supplied by said streamer if they want the accusation to stick against the sniper). The video would include the Death Recaps which would show the stream sniper's in-game name that could be used to discipline them. I'm sure that there are also archived combat logs and positional information that Support staff would have access to for further context and evidence in a claim.

    Also, following someone isn't stream sniping since by that definition you are taking no overt action (e.g. the "sniping" part of "stream sniping" which implies a hostile, aggressive act) against them. Following a streamer and repeatedly bow-ganking, bombing or otherwise griefing them is stream sniping since that is no longer a passive action but has crossed the line into a pattern intended to disrupt or otherwise troll the stream.

    The difference is crystal clear and normal players have nothing to worry about.
  • xshatox
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    What is stream snipping? I think I read it patch note but didnt understand what it is.
  • TX12001rwb17_ESO
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    What of the players being caught in a streamers livestream against their will? they did not give the streamer permission to record them, see it works both ways.
    Edited by TX12001rwb17_ESO on September 10, 2020 7:14AM
  • Nord_Raseri
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    The difference is crystal clear.

    No, it isn't. Never watched a stream and never will. Don't even have the technology to do so. But my friends and I actively go after a leader of a group/zerg with the leader always being the main target(take out the general first). It is not my business and nor do I care if they're a streamer or not. Also it is very easy to figure out where groups are moving, their next target, etc. Therefore we are repeatingly hounding that leader and their group, in order to stop them gaining my alliance's resource and keeps(The whole point of cyrodiil). Is it crystal clear that I am "stream sniping"? Because that'd be pretty hard to do if I don't even watch streams.
    Edited by Nord_Raseri on September 10, 2020 7:36AM
    Veit ég aðég hékk vindga meiði á nætr allar níu, geiri undaðr og gefinn Oðni, sjálfr sjálfum mér, á þeim meiði er manngi veit hvers hann af rótum rennr.
  • Minyassa
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    I don't do PvP anymore, but having played enough to know the prevailing attitudes re: "If you are there, everything is game, it's open season, expect to be killed in any way possible because that is the point". So with that in mind, I don't quite grasp why stream sniping is considered any worse than any other thing people do to kill people in Cyrodiil. If it's okay to camp the inner door in IC (and apparently it is, because the answers I've seen to people complaining about that were "you should just be geared for PvP if you're going to go there"), if it's considered PvEers' fault for being seen if they are killed doing PvE quests in PvP areas, if it is okay to shoot people from stealth at long bow range, then why is it not considered a streamer's fault for publicly broadcasting their location for all the world to see? If I was in Cyrodiil and I told people in guild chat that I was at a certain place and my guildies came and killed me because I stupidly told them my location, how is that different from going online and showing anyone who can log onto a website where I am? I'm not arguing against this ruling since I neither watch Twitch streams nor ever want to fight other players outside of actual dueling. I just want to understand why it's different if it's Twitch. Is it because there's money to be made for Bethesda/Zenimax from the streaming?
  • LadyNalcarya
    LadyNalcarya
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    @LadyNalcarya The evidence would come from the streamer's stream (supplied by said streamer if they want the accusation to stick against the sniper). The video would include the Death Recaps which would show the stream sniper's in-game name that could be used to discipline them. I'm sure that there are also archived combat logs and positional information that Support staff would have access to for further context and evidence in a claim.

    Also, following someone isn't stream sniping since by that definition you are taking no overt action (e.g. the "sniping" part of "stream sniping" which implies a hostile, aggressive act) against them. Following a streamer and repeatedly bow-ganking, bombing or otherwise griefing them is stream sniping since that is no longer a passive action but has crossed the line into a pattern intended to disrupt or otherwise troll the stream.

    The difference is crystal clear and normal players have nothing to worry about.

    I mean, I'm not streaming, but I've been focused by certain players for various reasons (maybe I'm a healer, maybe they know me, maybe they hate my class etc). It is not a proof of malicious intent, since killing players (and dying to them) is a part of pvp experience. And if you're a well-known player (emperor/grand overlord, known duelist, avid ganker, regular LFG leader etc), you'll always be focused more. Those who play a lot (like streamers) are easily recognized, that's just how things are.
    I just think it's not a good idea to give so much power to a specific group of people. There were already rules protecting them from harassment.
    Edited by LadyNalcarya on September 10, 2020 7:50AM
    Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Voice of Reason

    PC/EU
  • Gorilla
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    People in this thread are intentionally misunderstanding what stream sniping actually is.

    It is NOT playing in the same campaign as a streamer and killing them in the normal course of PvP.

    It is NOT randomly getting matched with them in a BG.

    It IS watching their stream on your second monitor or phone and stalking them around the map with the intention of griefing them and trolling their stream.

    The people defending themselves in these threads know exactly what they are doing and that it is toxic. But the fact remains that it doesn't matter what their excuse is because their actions are now covered explicitly by the ToS.

    Great post. I am avid PvPer and it is unfortunately toxic enough without this *** added in.
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