So after a week with the new Vampire, I can offer the following feedback.

Vevvev · June 2020

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

The Sorcerer is not really a Vampire themed class nor is Templar, Warden or Dragonknight for that matter, even the Necromancer is questionable, being a Vampire is very likely more intended for Nightblades from the matching color of abilities to the synergy with the class skills.

Hold up!

Magicka Dragonknights have a more vampiric play style than vampires do currently. While I'm taking advantage of the passives and weaving in mistform before a burst I have skills like Burning Embers and Flame Lash which are healing me in the fight. Burning Embers is a DOT that heals me when its effect ends and Flame Lash restores 14k+ health over 2 seconds when I strike an off balance or immobilized foe.

You could role play that Burning embers is a form of vampiric drain and that the Power Lash proc of Flame Lash is a combat bite due to the requirements for it and what it does. Sure everything is fire based but that just makes it even more fun!

Feizao · June 2020

Vevvev wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

The Sorcerer is not really a Vampire themed class nor is Templar, Warden or Dragonknight for that matter, even the Necromancer is questionable, being a Vampire is very likely more intended for Nightblades from the matching color of abilities to the synergy with the class skills.

Hold up!

Magicka Dragonknights have a more vampiric play style than vampires do currently. While I'm taking advantage of the passives and weaving in mistform before a burst I have skills like Burning Embers and Flame Lash which are healing me in the fight. Burning Embers is a DOT that heals me when its effect ends and Flame Lash restores 14k+ health over 2 seconds when I strike an off balance or immobilized foe.

You could role play that Burning embers is a form of vampiric drain and that the Power Lash proc of Flame Lash is a combat bite due to the requirements for it and what it does. Sure everything is fire based but that just makes it even more fun!

when i started playing this game i thought wings from dragon leap were vampire players

DT-ARR · June 2020

I also agree with most the OP has said. My problem with suggestions such as adding a gap closer though boils down to this: what is a nightblade?

I main one so forgive me. But wtf is the point of the nightblade class? Everything that made them unique has been nerfed into the ground and / or given to every other class via sub class skill lines.

Its absolutely ridiculous.

Bradyfjord · June 2020

@JMadFour Perhaps instead of a gap closer, give them a Stage 2~3 (Bloody Strikes?) passive that allows their crits to snare (30%)? That would be somewhat unique while staying in theme.

jlmurra2 · June 2020

JMadFour wrote: »

jlmurra2 wrote: »

I like that the new Vampire skill line provides an alternate way to play Magicka characters. I dislike that it does not provide the same option, with the exception of sneak bonus, for Stamina, and Tank Characters. Especially since the vampire skill line provided benefits to those types of builds until the Greymoor Update.

Eh...pre-Greymoor Vampire was basically just a regen passive...that was the extent of "benefits" for stamina and tank builds anyway.

For DPS builds extra regeneration yes, for tank builds the undeath passive without the 12% minimum increased regular ability cost was very beneficial. Though undeath was, and still is useful for many types of build.

The regular abilities cost increase of the new Vampire skill line is what nullifies the benefits, especially for tanks.

ScardyFox · June 2020

Again:

A vampire should be its own thing. It should have a timer on it like Werewolf but not as draconian so its flexible enough to allow sneaky/tactical gameplay.

The stages should be represented by a feed bar that dictates what level you are by how much blood you have ingested. Instead of sucking up souls like the necromancer ability, you drain a big globular of blood in the same fashion enhancing that bar. The more blood, the higher the level that slowly drains as time goes on forcing you to be active in finding victims to drain and kill/drain in combat.

Give a gap closer.

Vampiric Drain should be changed into an execute .

Blah blah, they don't care... all we can hope for is a tweak in numbers with what mediocrity is given.

soniku4ikblis · June 2020

I mean, Simmering Frenzy is pretty sick on Magplar, while using Puncturing Sweep in PVE.

Literally melting things left and right.

In PVP?

............ looooooooooooooooooooool

Nova_J · June 2020

soniku4ikblis wrote: »

I mean, Simmering Frenzy is pretty sick on Magplar, while using Puncturing Sweep in PVE.

Literally melting things left and right.

In PVP?

............ looooooooooooooooooooool

How long can u keep it up in pve?

Myyth · June 2020

I also really like all of the thematic things they have done for vampires, invisible running, mezzing NPC vendors, ect.

But if they were intending the Vampire to be like a class unto itself, they have failed.

I just got my Vampire to level 50 and I am struggling to find a use for any of the vampire skills on my weapon bars. I am worried about doing Vet dungeons due to my dps being low.

What I think is the biggest thing missing is there is no AOE or cone type attack. All you have is arterial burst single target melee. I am forced to use class or weapon skills to compensate. All with increased cost. Of the 10 available weapon bar slots, 8 of them are class/weapon skills with just 2 vampire skills being used. And one vampire ultimate. My vampire in combat is playing pretty much like my other non vampire characters, not as a unique class.

Deathlord92 · June 2020

I like the idea there going for with vampire and I’m going to make it work on my stamblade either way because I love playing as a vampire. But there seriously needs to be adjustments like blood for blood either should scale with stamina to doing physical and magic damage like they done with other skills or give stamina a morph ultimate could use a buff to because atm the vampire lord has nothing on werewolf in pvp I’m seeing 30k health builds hitting like trucks and there stupidly tanky at the same time.

JMadFour · June 2020

soniku4ikblis wrote: »

I mean, Simmering Frenzy is pretty sick on Magplar, while using Puncturing Sweep in PVE.

Literally melting things left and right.

In PVP?

............ looooooooooooooooooooool

But I mean....anything is sick with Sweeps.

Lord-Otto · June 2020

JMadFour wrote: »

soniku4ikblis wrote: »

I mean, Simmering Frenzy is pretty sick on Magplar, while using Puncturing Sweep in PVE.

Literally melting things left and right.

In PVP?

............ looooooooooooooooooooool

But I mean....anything is sick with Sweeps.

Except the floor. That one's clean if you sweep it hard enough.

JMadFour · June 2020

Lord-Otto wrote: »

JMadFour wrote: »

soniku4ikblis wrote: »

I mean, Simmering Frenzy is pretty sick on Magplar, while using Puncturing Sweep in PVE.

Literally melting things left and right.

In PVP?

............ looooooooooooooooooooool

But I mean....anything is sick with Sweeps.

Except the floor. That one's clean if you sweep it hard enough.

touche.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · June 2020

Tessitura wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

The Sorcerer is not really a Vampire themed class nor is Templar, Warden or Dragonknight for that matter, even the Necromancer is questionable, being a Vampire is very likely more intended for Nightblades from the matching color of abilities to the synergy with the class skills.

- Which class has siphoning abilities that heal them while dealing damage which would allow effective use of Blood Frenzy?
- Which class already has a gap-closer and does not need the one ability that gives them enough power to compete removed?
- Which class can make the most effective use of Dark Stalker and actually make use of it's effect while in a fight?
- Which class can keep strike from shadows active in an entire fight?

Passive healing from hots is more effective then healing on damage for blood frenzy.

A lot of classes have gap closers, DK, Temp, and Sorc all have effective gap closers.

I am not sure what you are getting at on the third point. No class can stealth in combat without invis, and invis lets you move at the same speed regardless. All classes have to break combat to crouch stealth.

All classes can with mistform, it's an easy toggle that can be canceled out of quickly.

I don't believe it was designed with only NB in mind at all. In fact, I have seen Necros, and sorcs get the most out of it recently. Which surprises me since I expected it to be Necros and Wardens. Thats not saying there is not a lot of NB vampires making good use of the kit, but it clearly was not designed for just that class.

Streak is not really a combat gap closer because you can rush right past the enemy, when I mean Gap Closer I mean something to bring you right in front of the enemy, not 5 feet behind them where you then have to turn around and Nightblades have cloak which gives them instant invisibility for 3 seconds whenever they want, this activates the Strike from Shadows passive on the Vampire skill-line which inturn is also boosted by the Nightblade passive that increases damage and applies 100% critical chance from attacks, Mist Form is significantly slower then Cloak given you need to press the button twice to use it.

JMadFour · June 2020

So I am giving more thought to my NB after doing a dungeon with my Sorc.

I am curious as to how you NBs are operating. Which Class skills are you using? The cost of skills is a lot more on my NB than on my Sorc. I barely feel the skill cost increase on my Sorc, but I kinda have sticker shock when it comes to my NB.

How are you offsetting the health cost of BfB and Blood Frenzy(if you are even using it). Is Siphoning Strikes/Assassin's Will enough?

BfB out of Shadowy Disguise hits kinda hard, I think. But I find myself a little bit panicky when using BfB too much.

JMadFour · June 2020

Further on NB.

That no health regen at Stage 4 is kinda rough without an on-demand heal when soloing. Didn't really bother me on my Sorc because I could just pop Dark Conversion at will and move on to the next fight. Gonna have to investigate other options for Stage 4 OOC health regen.

I haven't unlocked the full tree on my NB yet, but so far the combat flows very well imo, it feels much more natural on the NB than it did on the Sorc.

BraidasNM · June 2020

i just see no reason to use vamp in pvp, so ya disappointed

Nova_J · June 2020

JMadFour wrote: »

Further on NB.

That no health regen at Stage 4 is kinda rough without an on-demand heal when soloing. Didn't really bother me on my Sorc because I could just pop Dark Conversion at will and move on to the next fight. Gonna have to investigate other options for Stage 4 OOC health regen.

I haven't unlocked the full tree on my NB yet, but so far the combat flows very well imo, it feels much more natural on the NB than it did on the Sorc.

Scourge harvester when doing solo content, that will allow you to use BfB in peace lol. In 4man content your healer should be healing you so you can run a dps monster set instead.

exeeter702 · June 2020

You have to remeber that frenzy does not initiate the GCD on activation. This means you can toggle it right before firing a will proc at a target or healing someone with healthy offering for 600+ SD boosted tooltip. Deactivating frenzy can only be done (at the earliest) right when the GCD has refreshed so at worst you are eating two ticks of its health cost when used to augment single skills that benefit the most from a high tooltip value.

Argonian magblades that build and play around refreshing path, swallow soul, dark cloak, siphoning attacks, debilitating grasp and structured entropy while chugging spell power pots on cooldown can make decent use of either frenzy morph if careful and selective.

I have been a career magblade since launch and has never played around shadowy disguise and I'm having a decent time right now with vamp stage 4 in both cp and no cp. Healer build still works pretty well despite the nerfs. Pariah + riposte/transmutation and Egore/bogdan/malubeth depending on the scenario has been working very well. Frenzy buffed healthy offerings are critting for 9k in no cp.

YandereGirlfriend · June 2020

Blood Frenzy must remain in the tree as it provides another valuable (and rare) tool for hybrid and other off-meta builds.

Tweaking the health cost is fine (and welcomed) though. Lots of numbers could be tweaked in the tree for the better.

Spectral_Force wrote: »

To respond to your general sentiment, I also hold the opinion that the system in general is fine, but needs some tweaks and changes. In fact, I've been hounding Vampire threads since around... week 2 on PTS, and from what I've seen I'd argue that most vocal uh, vampire enthusiasts agree as well.

I see this gap closer idea pop up quite a lot (again, since the PTS), and I've been thinking about ways to implement it without just being a carbon copy of *insert generic 22m-range homing gap closer*. Since this discussion touches on that, I'll post my latest idea here.

I reckon it would be interesting to see a more short-ranged (7-12 metres), untargeted magicka-based dash ability in the Vampire toolkit that would propel you forward/sideways/backward based on your current direction of travel. To compensate for the shorter range, make it cheaper to use, give it higher travel speed and make it more chainable/spammable in general. Hell, it doesn't even need to do damage as long as the other effects are balanced accordingly. Finally, either make it provide invincibility frames or give you Elusive Mist's 75% damage reduction for the duration.

What you end up with is a very versatile ability - it can be used to close gaps (as long as spamming teleport is faster than sprinting) or for general travel, it's useful for getting out of AoEs/red, it can be used to keep your distance if you're a ranged character, or even as a Magicka alternative to dodging. And if this replaces the Elusive Mist morph, it can quickly and cheaply proc Strike from the Shadows without having to toggle on/off or toggle/bar swap Mist Form. And since its cost will be relatively low, it can even be slotted on stamina characters if needed.

This is a fantastic idea! Imagine dissolving into mist (or bats!) and then appearing at the target location. That would feel well and truly vampiric.

Stoltverd · June 2020

I'll add that it needs some stamina morphs.
Currently vampires are almost exclusive for magicka users.
However as we see in-game and in lore (and in past games) vampires are also powerful in melee fights.
I used to have a stam NB that benefited a lot from vampirism. Not anymore.
Would also love to try a vampire warrior, but currently that would be nerfing myself.

JMadFour · June 2020

Nova_J wrote: »

Scourge harvester when doing solo content, that will allow you to use BfB in peace lol. In 4man content your healer should be healing you so you can run a dps monster set instead.

That's definitely something to look into.

JMadFour · June 2020

I have spent the entire weekend thus far running my NB Vamp, and I miss playing my Sorc a good deal.

I've noticed the ways that I've had an easier time on my Sorc than on my NB. Not to say that NB isn't a good fit for Vampires.. The on command stealth and the stealth bonuses are really nice. Aesthetically the NB is the most similar to a Vampire.

But something about the Sorc just clicks for me. The lack of on-demand stealth for the Strike From Shadows proc is a downside. But that is outweighed, imo, by the on-command cheap Heal (Dark Conversion) and Criticial Surge, and the bursty Curse/Mages Fury combo. And the built-in skill cost reduction means that the non-vamp skill cost increase doesn't hit as hard.