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Which class for a spellsword?
I know a mag class using stam weapons on the frontbar is not as effective, but would it be worth it for the class fantasy of a spellsword?
Which class for a spellsword? 37 votes
Stamsorc, 2h/bow
64%
24 votes
Magblade, dw/destro
35%
13 votes
1
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Starlock✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You can make magicka classes work with the "wrong" weapon types and still do most types of content in the game. I have a character like this though he is neither of the two options you allowed for in your poll. Game mechanics wise he is a magicka dragonknight who uses dual wield and is also proficient in 1h+shield. Many DK magicka abilities are melee range already, so you are already going to be up close. Magicka recovery is an issue, but you find ways to make it work.
I do also have a magicka character who has a setup like your second poll option (though she currently uses a restoration staff instead of a destruction staff because of her evolving storyline). Works fine too, and as one might expect she has a lot less of a problem with magicka recovery because she has a magicka weapon on one of her bars. Even without that, though, between Debilitate and sometimes Siphoning Attacks she's fine (I don't usually slot Siphoning though).1 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭deLioncourt wrote: »You can make magicka classes work with the "wrong" weapon types and still do most types of content in the game. I have a character like this though he is neither of the two options you allowed for in your poll. Game mechanics wise he is a magicka dragonknight who uses dual wield and is also proficient in 1h+shield. Many DK magicka abilities are melee range already, so you are already going to be up close. Magicka recovery is an issue, but you find ways to make it work.
I do also have a magicka character who has a setup like your second poll option (though she currently uses a restoration staff instead of a destruction staff because of her evolving storyline). Works fine too, and as one might expect she has a lot less of a problem with magicka recovery because she has a magicka weapon on one of her bars. Even without that, though, between Debilitate and sometimes Siphoning Attacks she's fine (I don't usually slot Siphoning though).
[Quoted post was removed]
TBF most of the older content, including the first dlc dungeons, can very well be completed on good build hybrids. This is just a „meta or bust“ issue. At best you loose a tiny bit of time. In PvP hybrids can work as well.
Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on June 13, 2020 1:17PM1 -
MashmalloMan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Wait for Update 27 when they inevitably revisit the proposed Light/Heavy attack changes that were on the pre-pts back in March or so.. One of the only things everyone could agree on was allowing Light/Heavy attacks to dynamically scale based on highest damage stats.
This would of allowed for Dual Wielding Swords to make a comeback. They give +6% damage done, which is very comparable to staves that give +8 % single target damage or 8% aoe damage. 6% damage done for everything is arguably stronger. DW also has higher base damage than Staves. You do miss out on penetration though, but the point is, it's not that far behind. It's very viable if they scale properly in U27.
There is also a fair amount of Hybrid like sets now. Stuhn's Favour, New Moon Acolyte, Dragonguard, Plenty of double stat monster sets, tri regen glyphs, Hybrid Races like Khajiit and Dark Elf, Malacath Band of Brutality (also saves CP from crit nodes you can use to spread out between stam/mag related CP).
So traditionally, if you want a Spellsword, then a normal Stam Sorc build will be the closest thing. They use magic to boost their physical power with Hurricane, Crit Surge, Bound Armaments (literally "spell" swords (daggers)), Atro/Overload, etc. Edit: Oh and Streak is a teleport that does reasonable aoe stun damage and dynamically scales. It's not good for "dps", but for your power fantasy, it's fun AF.
But eventually, you could take a Stam Sorc out with DW and the many good hybrid sets and you should be able to use Magicka skills too like Crystal Frags, Curse, Endless Fury or the melee range vamp spammable Eviscerate/Blood for Blood.
As long as you learn your rotation properly, you will easily break 30k dps for overland and 4 man dungeons, thats unheard of for most people. A dps that can break 20k is pretty rare in my experience.
It should be noted, these are all comments related to PVE, in PVP, you can really make any build work since you don't only require straight DPS. You need defence, utility, sustain, etc. People already use Hybrid sorcs well, it covers the burst damage they don't have in their stam kit.Edited by MashmalloMan on June 12, 2020 9:25PM1 -
JinMori✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Used to be magplar, and i was really hopeful that they would bring the light and heavy attack scaling so it would be viable again. But they threw out the bad with the good.2 -
Major_Lag✭✭✭✭✭
✭On hybrid sorc you can use Dark Conversion to get magicka at the cost of stamina.
Then do a heavy attack to regain stamina.
Or maybe not, since if you build for magicka and use the "wrong" (stamina) weapon it's a bad idea to use weapon abilities in any case - and if you don't use weapon abilities, the base stam regen will be enough most of the time, unless you have to deal with a lot of CC.
This could work well when using some of the newer "hybrid" offensive sets, such as NMA, which give equal amounts of both stamina and magicka offensive stats.
Then you are still left with the sustain being trash tier, but there are ways around that (such as what I just suggested).0 -
lucky_Sage✭✭✭✭✭I honestly think zos will combine weapon and spell dmg pen and crit at some pointDC PC NA
Magdk - main
Stamcro - alt
AD PS4 NA -retired (PC runs way better to play on console)
magdk
magblade
stamplar
magden
magsorc0 -
JinMori✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭lucky_Sage wrote: »I honestly think zos will combine weapon and spell dmg pen and crit at some point
i don't know about that.0 -
MashmalloMan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭lucky_Sage wrote: »I honestly think zos will combine weapon and spell dmg pen and crit at some point
No evidence to suggest they would do ALL damage stats, but they're is actual confirmed evidence they will combine debuffs like Fracture and Breach AND set stat bonuses for physical and spell penetration into just "Penetration" the same way they did with Resolve and Ward as well as resistance into "Armor" on sets.
Update 24 Dragonhold:- Abilities and item sets that grant Physical and Spell Resistances now grant an equal amount of both as a singular stat – Armor – rather than 2 separate stats.
- Many item sets that granted X Spell or Physical Resistance now grant .5X Armor. This was done to ensure total power remains the same, with less variance in these stats.
- Passives that grant a unique source of one have not been adjusted.
- Major and Minor Resolve now grant an equal amount of Physical and Spell Resistance, and Major and Minor Ward have been discontinued.
- Note that this has not yet happened to Fracture and Breach or forms of Penetration.
This is also assuming ZOS hasn't forgotten about this important change.. They also made promises to class identity and CP, but "performance" improvements seemed to have put these important combat changes on hold.. This kinda opens up a can of worms that the change to Resolve and Ward didn't need to deal with which is why they're holding off for so long? Just speculating.- This would make skills like Razor Caltrops and Elemental Drain amazing.
- It would mean Pierce Armor gets a new morph effect since Ransack would do the same thing, but also add minor protection.
- It would mean Warden's Deep Fissure and Subterranean Assault would need new morph effects since the only thing the morphs do is change resource and add Major Breach or Fracture.
- Sets like Spriggan's and Spinners would stay as their specific penetration types, but a set like Night Mother's Gaze would provide Spell Penetration too, since Major Fracture would provide both.
Imo.. ZOS has been planning this redesign since they created Necromancers, which would of been worked on since at least 2018. Why? Look at Graveyard, all morphs provide Major Fracture and Breach even though all morphs are Magicka based. Necromancer passives even line up with the racial changes that moved away from % based bonuses to straight stat bonuses. If Necro was designed 6 years ago, instead of 1250 max hp, 200 stam/mag regen and 1500 penetration, they would of had 6% max hp, 20% stam/mag regen and 10% penetration or something like that anyway.
Still waiting on ZOS to update the rest of the classes in the same way, despite what people may think, mathematically, something like 10-20% regen is really quite low. To get 200 like Necro, you'd need to invest at least 2000 base regen, at that point your breaking 3000+ with all the modifiers from potions and cp which is FAR too much sustain. This isn't even considering that the 200 regen gets buffed to 300+ with modifiers. So classes like NB with 15% or Sorc with 10/20% really get like 25-100 out of those passives.Edited by MashmalloMan on June 13, 2020 12:49AM0 - Abilities and item sets that grant Physical and Spell Resistances now grant an equal amount of both as a singular stat – Armor – rather than 2 separate stats.
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ZOS_ConnorGmodGreetings all,
We had to remove a couple posts for Baiting. We understand that disagreements will happen when discussing different builds but please ensure that the discussion does not turn into a fight.
You are welcome to review the Community Rules here.0 -
Kadoin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Used a hybrid templar, hybrid DK, and hybrid sorc to clear vMA so it is possible. Yes, one even got through the arena at its buggiest this patch...
That doesn't mean the builds will be easy to use, though. But generally you will have to give up something to be able to run a hybrid, most of the time it's either one or more of these: crit, sustain, damage, healing, defense/damage reduction.
On live I was using a build that is actually stronger than my pure mag build, even in PvP, however it's not exactly the easiest to use since it took a hit in the sustain and defense section (but that would not have been the case had the arch-mage set not been changed to the garbage it is on live
Only set that can compare for effect is Senchal and it's not that great because it does not work with resto stave or any other stave reliably).
However I only used it solo and I am certain in group play it could be better...so yeah it is possible, just experiment and establish baselines for stats.
Around 35-38k mag w/ 2.8K spell damage is possible on a hybrid, with far more weapon damage and keeping crit over 50%.
Personally I stick to around 38k mag, 29k stam , 4.4k weapon damage, 2.9k spell damage for my hybrid or better. Not entirely done tweaking it to better and further stats, but I refuse to log into the game , so that's that
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tsaescishoeshiner✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I recommend using your outfit to feel like a spellsword. Slap on robes or mage-y looking armor, intricate or glowing weapons (the Opal weapon style pages are GREAT for this), and maybe use Crushing Weapon if you like to light attack weave. Works particularly well on Sorcerer, and Psijic/Sapiarch styles work well (among many others)PC-NA
in-game: @tsaescishoeshiner0