Heavy Armor Nerf in PvP

technohic · May 2020

It's funny because nerfing heavy is the buzz phrase to make people feel better about themselves as they know a nerf across the board in general tankiness, will impact them as well.

Then you have the ones who want more defined roles. Either short sided or zerg all the time because that would hammer solo players and small CASUAL groups would be forced to stack up or take on dedicated tank/healer/damage roles driving us even more to either zerg or ball groups.

Cure would be worse than any percieved issue. I say percieved as things look very different depending on where you go. They really need to figure out what they are doing with CP if not just as it applies to PVP so we all are talking about the same things when it comes to balance.

Chilly-McFreeze · May 2020

Sange13 wrote: »

Opalblade wrote: »

Only if light and medium armor get -20% hp or something similar. You know, to reflect their roles as DPS/healers or whatever. I don't want nerfs to any armor type, but if heavy isn't allowed to kill stuff, medium and light shouldn't be allowed to tank stuff.

That would literally result in exactly the situation we're in now. Think about it.

The clue is people ask for heavy armor to be weaker on the offensive and mobility spectrum. All while light and medium already enjoy offensive and mobility boons that heavy does not have. Plus medium can already be more tanky than heavy in pvp thanks to sets and racials.
All that yet another nerf to heavy would accomplish is to put it even more on the backburner and cause collateral damage to pve (tanks).

Keep in mind that heavy was nerfed on multiple occasions. From the top of my head (pls correct if numbers are wrong) it lost: 50% of it's heavy attack resource restore, 50% of it's resource return on hit, 200 weapon/spell dmg that accumulated from being hit and block cost reduction.

One could argue that the sneak passive in medium should go to ledgerdemain as sneaking in a bedsheat should be as easy as in full manowar-attire. And then add whatever boni to medium. But do we really need that for balance? I doubt it.

Lughlongarm · May 2020

Is this a 2018 post?

ATM it is probably easier to build damage+sustain+mitigation on the light/medium setups than it is on a heavy armor setup.
Too early to predict what changes next patch will bring.

A good sign to follow that may indicate that heavy armor is over performing in PvP, is to follow "meta"/popular setups for magicka builds. Whenever heavy was over-performing, megicka builds shifted toward heavy(not only DK).

Impotent to note that it could also be an heavy armor related issue and not heavy armor for itself. for example, the power of the "Fury set" or the power" Malacath's Band of Brutality" in the upcoming patch.

Banana · May 2020

I think the heavy folk will be able to make the most of that mythic ring that gives you 25% more damage as crit it usually very low anyway

ForzaRammer · May 2020

Why run heavy when u can use swift

Neoauspex · May 2020

SoixanteNeuf wrote: »

There aren't enough negative repercussions for running heavy armor in PvP. Heavy armor users can build a significant amount of weapon damage while widening their margin of error against incoming damage and have improved resource management via heavy's "tanky" passives.

Type of armor should be reflective of role.
Heavy = tanking

Medium = damage

Light = damage/healing

Suggestion : Battle spirit nerf for wearing heavy armor, -20% weapon damage.

Let's talk about this after the Bloodspawn nerf goes live

Stx · May 2020

Sange13 wrote: »

Opalblade wrote: »

Only if light and medium armor get -20% hp or something similar. You know, to reflect their roles as DPS/healers or whatever. I don't want nerfs to any armor type, but if heavy isn't allowed to kill stuff, medium and light shouldn't be allowed to tank stuff.

That would literally result in exactly the situation we're in now. Think about it.

What situation? Heavy armor is fine. Medium armor is fantastic. Light armor could maybe use a small buff but it's also fine currently.

People really need to think (as you put it) and understand that just because they cant kill someone, does not mean they are wearing heavy armor.

daemonor · May 2020

2016 sypherPK and blackrose called, they want this thread back.

Urzigurumash · May 2020

Neoauspex wrote: »

Let's talk about this after the Bloodspawn nerf goes live

Not to mention most Vampires curing and no longer having Undeath. Funny how that subject never comes up in these threads.

technohic · May 2020

Everyone will have more crit resist and in CP, if more of those rings show up, you can move some crit resist to the other mitigation and make up for a big chunk of what is lost with Bloodspawn.

It will be the added pen of stuhns or Balorgs that will make a difference and you'll have to make a choice

Healing nerf will hurt everyone though.

Sneaky-Snurr · May 2020

*looks at OP's join date: September 2019*

Lul..

Op, you haven't been around long enough to see the balancing of armour types in the past but now we see this? Holy mother of..
Armour types are the most balanced it has ever been at this point of time. No nerfs or buffs are actually needed now.

You just need to... (I'm sure most of you can finish my sentence)...

Sneaky-Snurr · May 2020

Joinovikova wrote: »

SoixanteNeuf wrote: »

There aren't enough negative repercussions for running heavy armor in PvP. Heavy armor users can build a significant amount of weapon damage while widening their margin of error against incoming damage and have improved resource management via heavy's "tanky" passives.

Type of armor should be reflective of role.
Heavy = tanking

Medium = damage

Light = damage/healing

Suggestion : Battle spirit nerf for wearing heavy armor, -20% weapon damage.

its not heavy armor is medium NORD armor I dont know every other race get bonus simlliar to Mundus Stone, but purchease power of Skyrim nords players... Go nord pvp or go mag class...

@Joinovikova
Actually, there are plenty of other racial passives that provide similar bonus as mundus. Take Dunmer's Ruination passive; increases 258 WD/SD. That's only a few 10s of difference. Don't forget about Altmer too.

The only race with the worst passives are Khajiit and the only worthwhile passive they have is the crit dmg increase.

MaxJrFTW · May 2020

Not the right way to do it imo. They need to make a new stat for healing. Spell dmg and weapon dmg should have no effect whatsoever on your healing.

With that said, i do agree heavy armor should be for defense and being able to get 600wd from Fury, 675 from Clever Alch, and a permanent 480 from NMA is absurd.

MaxJrFTW · May 2020

Sneaky-Snurr wrote: »

*looks at OP's join date: September 2019*

Lul..

Op, you haven't been around long enough to see the balancing of armour types in the past but now we see this? Holy mother of..
Armour types are the most balanced it has ever been at this point of time. No nerfs or buffs are actually needed now.

You just need to... (I'm sure most of you can finish my sentence)...

Forum account has nothing to do with your actual eso account. In fact there's plenty of people who have been playing since the beta and don't have a forum account or made it years later.

I know the OP has been around for a while because he has the same name in game.

[Edit to remove accusations of misconduct]

Joinovikova · May 2020

Sneaky-Snurr wrote: »

Joinovikova wrote: »

SoixanteNeuf wrote: »

There aren't enough negative repercussions for running heavy armor in PvP. Heavy armor users can build a significant amount of weapon damage while widening their margin of error against incoming damage and have improved resource management via heavy's "tanky" passives.

Type of armor should be reflective of role.
Heavy = tanking

Medium = damage

Light = damage/healing

Suggestion : Battle spirit nerf for wearing heavy armor, -20% weapon damage.

its not heavy armor is medium NORD armor I dont know every other race get bonus simlliar to Mundus Stone, but purchease power of Skyrim nords players... Go nord pvp or go mag class...

@Joinovikova
Actually, there are plenty of other racial passives that provide similar bonus as mundus. Take Dunmer's Ruination passive; increases 258 WD/SD. That's only a few 10s of difference. Don't forget about Altmer too.

The only race with the worst passives are Khajiit and the only worthwhile passive they have is the crit dmg increase.

.. The lady Increases Physical and Spell Resistance by 2752 nord get Increases your Physical and Spell resistance by 3960
... The warrior Increases Weapon Damage by 238 . and u get 258..

on most builds u just just one spell power or weapion damage...

I had Redguard Stamwarden, and my performance get 10% better when I switch to Nord.. on upcoming patch with all deff options nerf nord will be far far the best race for most of pvp stam Set up (its already the best now but with upcomifn ner will be m even more op). I prefer diversity not one spec best race no question neede ...like it was before murkmire balance changes..

If you do not see it okay just go to Alcast dottzgaming ... and see pvp stam set up on most of them u will find Nord (recommended) ...

Chilly-McFreeze · May 2020

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

Not the right way to do it imo. They need to make a new stat for healing. Spell dmg and weapon dmg should have no effect whatsoever on your healing.

With that said, i do agree heavy armor should be for defense and being able to get 600wd from Fury, 675 from Clever Alch, and a permanent 480 from NMA is absurd.

And? For none of that I have to wear heavy. Even the other way around, you don’t need to wear medium for eg briarheart. This has nothing to do with armor weight. In fact, all those weapon dmg buffs are still 15% better in medium.

Also on nord: with all the Overwhelmingly good offense sets + defensive nerfs (healing, armor stats, bloodspawn ult + armor) nord will get another boost in comparison, as it’s far easier to build for offense than it’s for defense now. It would make sense to adjust nords slightly. But whatever the spreadsheet dictates...

MartiniDaniels · May 2020

Joinovikova wrote: »

Sneaky-Snurr wrote: »

Joinovikova wrote: »

SoixanteNeuf wrote: »

There aren't enough negative repercussions for running heavy armor in PvP. Heavy armor users can build a significant amount of weapon damage while widening their margin of error against incoming damage and have improved resource management via heavy's "tanky" passives.

Type of armor should be reflective of role.
Heavy = tanking

Medium = damage

Light = damage/healing

Suggestion : Battle spirit nerf for wearing heavy armor, -20% weapon damage.

its not heavy armor is medium NORD armor I dont know every other race get bonus simlliar to Mundus Stone, but purchease power of Skyrim nords players... Go nord pvp or go mag class...

@Joinovikova
Actually, there are plenty of other racial passives that provide similar bonus as mundus. Take Dunmer's Ruination passive; increases 258 WD/SD. That's only a few 10s of difference. Don't forget about Altmer too.

The only race with the worst passives are Khajiit and the only worthwhile passive they have is the crit dmg increase.

.. The lady Increases Physical and Spell Resistance by 2752 nord get Increases your Physical and Spell resistance by 3960
... The warrior Increases Weapon Damage by 238 . and u get 258..

on most builds u just just one spell power or weapion damage...

I had Redguard Stamwarden, and my performance get 10% better when I switch to Nord.. on upcoming patch with all deff options nerf nord will be far far the best race for most of pvp stam Set up (its already the best now but with upcomifn ner will be m even more op). I prefer diversity not one spec best race no question neede ...like it was before murkmire balance changes..

If you do not see it okay just go to Alcast dottzgaming ... and see pvp stam set up on most of them u will find Nord (recommended) ...

Well, for stamcro orc is also good because you have a lot of % mitigation anyway and sustain is easy on stamcro so all you want is more Weapon Damage.

olsborg · May 2020

Id be fine with HA having -10% movement speed and -10% weapon dmg.

Bashev · May 2020

olsborg wrote: »

Id be fine with HA having -10% movement speed and -10% weapon dmg.

What?

Then light and medium should have -20% healing received in order to compensate for their mobility and damage?

Moonsorrow · May 2020

Ahh, one of these threads again.. not enough "i have spoken" type of arguments yet. I shall come back later to see if this developes to something new and fruitful.

Until then, I shall keep using Medium and Light Armor at PVP and hope my Heavy armor using tanks at PVE do not get yet again NurFffeD dUrFed due to some not understanding that the survivability of those builds they meet at pvp comes from entirely other things than Heavy Armor.

Sneaky-Snurr · May 2020

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

Sneaky-Snurr wrote: »

*looks at OP's join date: September 2019*

Lul..

Op, you haven't been around long enough to see the balancing of armour types in the past but now we see this? Holy mother of..
Armour types are the most balanced it has ever been at this point of time. No nerfs or buffs are actually needed now.

You just need to... (I'm sure most of you can finish my sentence)...

Forum account has nothing to do with your actual eso account. In fact there's plenty of people who have been playing since the beta and don't have a forum account or made it years later.

I know the OP has been around for a while because he has the same name in game.

@MaxJrFTW
Been around for a while? Since when? As long as you have? 2ish years?
The point I'm raising about that is because the many, many update cycles on armour updates have proven how clueless people can be for calling armour nerfs now. Saying that heavy armour users do more dmg, healing and boasts tankiness is outright wrong when really, armour types are not at all the main problem. You have not seen what other people who've been around since launch have. *hint: look at my other thread regarding the healing nerf in PvP*

Again, armour types are the most balanced now and needs no tweaking but if you really want a game with heavy emphasis on armour types, I suggest you pick up Gloria Victis or Runescape that really just forces you to wear certain armour types to be the best at a specific role.

Legendry · May 2020

Bro, are you really asking for more nerfs in this game?

MaxJrFTW · May 2020

Sneaky-Snurr wrote: »

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

Sneaky-Snurr wrote: »

*looks at OP's join date: September 2019*

Lul..

Op, you haven't been around long enough to see the balancing of armour types in the past but now we see this? Holy mother of..
Armour types are the most balanced it has ever been at this point of time. No nerfs or buffs are actually needed now.

You just need to... (I'm sure most of you can finish my sentence)...

Forum account has nothing to do with your actual eso account. In fact there's plenty of people who have been playing since the beta and don't have a forum account or made it years later.

I know the OP has been around for a while because he has the same name in game.

@MaxJrFTW
Been around for a while? Since when? As long as you have? 2ish years?
The point I'm raising about that is because the many, many update cycles on armour updates have proven how clueless people can be for calling armour nerfs now. Saying that heavy armour users do more dmg, healing and boasts tankiness is outright wrong when really, armour types are not at all the main problem. You have not seen what other people who've been around since launch have. *hint: look at my other thread regarding the healing nerf in PvP*

Again, armour types are the most balanced now and needs no tweaking but if you really want a game with heavy emphasis on armour types, I suggest you pick up Gloria Victis or Runescape that really just forces you to wear certain armour types to be the best at a specific role.

Forum account has nothing to do with how long someone has been playing the game, and playing a game for a long time also means nothing. There's plenty of scrubs who have been playing the game forever and think bg leaderboards or being 5 starts in cyrodiil mean something, just like you think forum account and game account have any sort of correlation, or that you have to play a video game for a decade to understand it.

Crixus8000 · May 2020

Adding a negetive affect is honestly so dumb, but If you wan't add negetive affects then make medium and light also make you take 50% more damage, it makes sense since they would give less protection that heavy right.

dhboy123 · May 2020

So you list Light as Damage/healing yet heavy isn't allowed to be Damage/Tank?

MindOfTheSwarm · May 2020

Sange13 wrote: »

Opalblade wrote: »

Only if light and medium armor get -20% hp or something similar. You know, to reflect their roles as DPS/healers or whatever. I don't want nerfs to any armor type, but if heavy isn't allowed to kill stuff, medium and light shouldn't be allowed to tank stuff.

That would literally result in exactly the situation we're in now. Think about it.

Yep, pretty much. Although in BG's I think if you queue as a specific role you should get bonuses and nerfs to certain aspects. Tired of people that queue as a healer then don't do their job.