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ESO is two games, one that works (PvE) and one that doesn't (PvP)
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Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Veteran player who’s poured time and money into the game to reach the end? Sorry. Not the target demographic.
Come on now, there's housing and the crown store, what more do you want?@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Banana Squad (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Roleplay Circle)1 -
Princess_Ciri✭✭✭✭✭imagine thinking PvE in this game works. Are you a ZOS developer? They seem to be under that impression too....GM and raid leader of Hot Girls Play DPS, the cutest guild EU3 -
ThePedge✭✭✭✭✭When people say PvP is broken, don't they mean just Cyrodiil? I don't see as many comments about Imperial City, Battlegrounds or Dueling. Moreover, when they say Cyrodiil, don't they mean the one campaign everyone wants to join? I have seen people mentioning other campaigns not having problems but for some reason people don't spread out between the campaigns and I don't understand why PvP guilds don't organise that. Note that is just the impression I get from reading the forums, as I don't PvP I do stand to be corrected!
I do also get that endgame PvE also has problems, and I personally find that overland PvE including delves, dolmens and world bosses is fine - including on PC EU.
Delves, dolmens and WBs are not end-game 🤣2 -
colossalvoids✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well if gambling for a moderate instance for an hour is working then yeah1 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Tamriel with one or two friends works pretty well as long as one stays away from other people. At this stage I doubt that the game can be fixed in it's large groups content - and that is not just a technical problem, but a design flaw at the heart of the combat system. No one is willing to address it and pvp players don't want it to be addressed - so not much will change to the better in these regards. If you want to play Tamriel with a friend - as in with one or two friends - you are fine as long as you stay away from other players, but if you look for large group content and expect it to work, you better move on.
i mean, seriously - they introduced by far longer loading screens last monday and aren't able to fix this within a week - and you expect them to fix performance - be serious - this is never going to happen.
Or even something really simple - like keeping a connnection alive - I play other games across the globe and all of them but ESO is able to keep the connection without to drop it - not even these basic things ZOS can do or even fix them in years - so what do you expect.Edited by Lysette on April 20, 2020 10:28AM1 -
Scarkii✭✭✭
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPZNlkY8_TQ
PvE also doesnt work though"Even the slightest amount of courage can change the tides of War"
Former DK main
Characters - Templar - Sharaji EP/ DK - S'avira EP1 -
Kikazaru✭✭✭✭✭
✭A triple-A company like ZOS that makes who knows how much a year can just leave their servers in such a neglected state for so long is utterly appalling and baffling. I wonder how other game companies would handle this...Edited by Kikazaru on April 20, 2020 10:34AMMizaru
“Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”5 -
BoloBoffin✭✭✭✭✭I have crashed 6 times this morning and the only thing I'm trying to do is daily crafting writs (on one character) and loading up my guild store slots.
At this point the Craft Bag is a barrier because every time I crash, I have to get my items out of the bag again so I can list them in the store. But by the time I get to the store, I've crashed again.
Oh, there's seven. In the time it took to write this out, I've crashed again. This was not a time out for inactivity.
If we can't even do writs, ZOS....Now let's dig on the Dirt Mound... (never gonna get it, never gonna get it, NEEEEver gonna get it, never gonna it)1 -
Major_Lag✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I was levelling my alts recently in Alik'r at primetime - and actually, with 2+ full raids (48+ players) stacked on the dolmen, performance was just about as bad as it usually is in Cyrodiil.Dusk_Coven wrote: »20 players and their pets at a dolmen or dragon and it works fine. DoT AoEs all over the place, especially at an Alik'r Dolmen. I definitely think something is suspicious in PvP.
I couldn't even see any of the enemies (they never loaded nor spawned for me), so all I could do was run in a circle trying to cast heals. Fun times.0 -
Altyrann✭✭✭✭✭ESO is currently two games. Neither works.Edited by Altyrann on April 20, 2020 2:33PM2 -
Gythral✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭“Be as a tower, that, firmly set,
Shakes not its top for any blast that blows!”
Dante Alighieri, The Divine Comedy0 -
krachall✭✭✭✭✭
✭Looks like my previous post was removed. Odd as it didn't violate any terms...but I'll try rewording.
I think ESO is three different games and part of the reason the developers seem so out of touch with the players is that they are putting too much emphasis on the third of the three games.
Game 1: PVP: Clearly broken
Game 2: Endgame PVE: Partially broken
Game 3: Low-skill PVE/Housing/Fashion/trading: Working perfectly
Read any thread on this board that complains about a broken feature, skill, class, system, process, or performance and that thread will be flooded by people posting that the game "works fine for them." Those are the Game 3 people who don't PVP, don't run vet dungeons, don't run trials, and don't run arenas. They don't LA weave, animation cancel, burst, or utilize the vast majority of game mechanics. They don't care about class and skill nerfs because they don't use or need most of these things anyway. I know these people because I'm in guilds with 1200+ of them.
They don't post complaints on this board because the few things they do in game are light on resources and work fine. Instead they post threads praising the artwork, design, writing, and voice acting in the game. They post screenshots of their outfit or their house or some quirky NPC interaction. And, if you'll notice, those threads almost always get a ZOS response like "That's awsome! Thanks for posting."
It seems ZOS is catering to those folks. Maybe that's where the revenue is? Maybe that's why they spend so much time rolling out new, simple-to-complete quests with loads of non-combat pets, outfits, houses, and furnishings. There are people who literally do nothing harder than a delve in this game for years and years and are perfectly happy with the outfitting stations, pets, and decorating houses.Edited by krachall on April 20, 2020 3:47PM3 -
Mancombe_Nosehair✭✭✭✭✭Looks like my previous post was removed. Odd as it didn't violate any terms...but I'll try rewording.
I think ESO is three different games and part of the reason the developers seem so out of touch with the players is that they are putting too much emphasis on the third of the three games.
Game 1: PVP: Clearly broken
Game 2: Endgame PVE: Partially broken
Game 3: Low-skill PVE/Housing/Fashion/trading: Working perfectly
Read any thread on this board that complains about a broken feature, skill, class, system, process, or performance and that thread will be flooded by people posting that the game "works fine for them." Those are the Game 3 people who don't PVP, don't run vet dungeons, don't run trials, and don't run arenas. They don't LA weave, animation cancel, burst, or utilize the vast majority of game mechanics. They don't care about class and skill nerfs because they don't use or need most of these things anyway. I know these people because I'm in guilds with 1200+ of them.
They don't post complaints on this board because the few things they do in game are light on resources and work fine. Instead they post threads praising the artwork, design, writing, and voice acting in the game. They post screenshots of their outfit or their house or some quirky NPC interaction. And, if you'll notice, those threads almost always get a ZOS response like "That's awsome! Thanks for posting."
It seems ZOS is catering to those folks. Maybe that's where the revenue is? Maybe that's why they spend so much time rolling out new, simple-to-complete quests with loads of non-combat pets, outfits, houses, and furnishings. There are people who literally do nothing harder than a delve in this game for years and years and are perfectly happy with the outfitting stations, pets, and decorating houses.
Whilst I don't do anything but random normals from the third group, you are probably pretty near to the truth about how Zos act. If 90 to 95% fits into the third group plus a bit more, why wouldn't they?0 -
tomofhyrule✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Looks like my previous post was removed. Odd as it didn't violate any terms...but I'll try rewording.
I think ESO is three different games and part of the reason the developers seem so out of touch with the players is that they are putting too much emphasis on the third of the three games.
Game 1: PVP: Clearly broken
Game 2: Endgame PVE: Partially broken
Game 3: Low-skill PVE/Housing/Fashion/trading: Working perfectly
Read any thread on this board that complains about a broken feature, skill, class, system, process, or performance and that thread will be flooded by people posting that the game "works fine for them." Those are the Game 3 people who don't PVP, don't run vet dungeons, don't run trials, and don't run arenas. They don't LA weave, animation cancel, burst, or utilize the vast majority of game mechanics. They don't care about class and skill nerfs because they don't use or need most of these things anyway. I know these people because I'm in guilds with 1200+ of them.
They don't post complaints on this board because the few things they do in game are light on resources and work fine. Instead they post threads praising the artwork, design, writing, and voice acting in the game. They post screenshots of their outfit or their house or some quirky NPC interaction. And, if you'll notice, those threads almost always get a ZOS response like "That's awsome! Thanks for posting."
It seems ZOS is catering to those folks. Maybe that's where the revenue is? Maybe that's why they spend so much time rolling out new, simple-to-complete quests with loads of non-combat pets, outfits, houses, and furnishings. There are people who literally do nothing harder than a delve in this game for years and years and are perfectly happy with the outfitting stations, pets, and decorating houses.
This is a true statement, and I'll say that as someone who's definitely in the 'Game 3' category.
ZOS probably has data on how many people play in each of these gamestyles, but I bet there's a large percentage of people who are in Game 3. And with Greymoor, they're definitely expecting an influx of new players drawn by Skyrim nostalgia and the fact that TES hasn't had another game in the past 8.5 years. I was one of them.
I don't play MMOs. I'd prefer to do everything solo. I'm trying to learn some mechanics, but I'm here to enjoy life in Tamriel, not try to get a full time job as a data cruncher to get best-in-show gear. I'll leave that for the people who care about it.
Now most of these incoming characters will be 'Game 3.' And I'm sure 90+% or so of Crown Store sales are from this group as well. That's where they're seeing revenue, so of course they're going to care more about it. And I'm sure that when TES6 finally comes out, most of Game 3 will be dropping ESO like a hot potato to head over there, since that's what they like. When that day comes, it would be nice if ZOS were able to keep some of the Game 1 or Game 2 people around, so absolutely they should be trying to work with that, but they have to balance the fact that there are so many more Game 3 people they're expecting to have in the next few months.
It seems that they also want people to do the newest content, so things tend to get nerfed as time goes along in order to push people to the newest stuff, if Iceheart vs. Mother Ciannit is any indication.
Obviously the ideal would be to get people to do everything, but there's no magic button for that. PvP and PvE are inherently different beasts - iirc people said that PvP took a huge drop in quality once most of the calculations were moved from client to server to avoid cheating, but that subjected most of the calcs to ping. Also, there are several things that you'll never encounter if you PvE (crit resitance), which makes the builds inherently different. And in terms of the casual vs. endgame PvE, I've noticed that on the whole the 'Game 1' and 'Game 2' people as a whole tend to look down on the 'Game 3' crowd. Everyone reads 'play as you want' a different way, and some people prefer the relaxing stuff whereas others are striving to be the best of the best. I'm not gonna pretend that all of the casual gamers are blameless - there are plenty of people who are dismissive of the concerns of endgame players or PvPers since they're never going to do that content. But the casuals don't like to be dismissed as "princess Barbie dreamland," as I've seen some forum members put it, just because we don't feel like dedicating months to grinding Maelstrom Arena. Both hardcore endgame and casual solo play are legit ways to play.
There are some attempts to get people to step outside their comfort zones: Midyear Mayhem, or any of the trial/arena events like Orsinium celebration. This change they're doing with the vMA weapons may even be part of that. But for the most part, people are not going to jump around much. I know that I'm only concerned about endgame PvE insofar as I need a specific cosmetic from a vet DLC dungeon, and once I finally get it (or give up and buy a carry since it requires a nodeath run) I doubt I'll even do any more dungeons after that. It's just not how I choose to play the game. More power to anyone who likes the endgame gear, but that's just not for me.2 -
Mancombe_Nosehair✭✭✭✭✭tomofhyrule wrote: »Looks like my previous post was removed. Odd as it didn't violate any terms...but I'll try rewording.
I think ESO is three different games and part of the reason the developers seem so out of touch with the players is that they are putting too much emphasis on the third of the three games.
Game 1: PVP: Clearly broken
Game 2: Endgame PVE: Partially broken
Game 3: Low-skill PVE/Housing/Fashion/trading: Working perfectly
Read any thread on this board that complains about a broken feature, skill, class, system, process, or performance and that thread will be flooded by people posting that the game "works fine for them." Those are the Game 3 people who don't PVP, don't run vet dungeons, don't run trials, and don't run arenas. They don't LA weave, animation cancel, burst, or utilize the vast majority of game mechanics. They don't care about class and skill nerfs because they don't use or need most of these things anyway. I know these people because I'm in guilds with 1200+ of them.
They don't post complaints on this board because the few things they do in game are light on resources and work fine. Instead they post threads praising the artwork, design, writing, and voice acting in the game. They post screenshots of their outfit or their house or some quirky NPC interaction. And, if you'll notice, those threads almost always get a ZOS response like "That's awsome! Thanks for posting."
It seems ZOS is catering to those folks. Maybe that's where the revenue is? Maybe that's why they spend so much time rolling out new, simple-to-complete quests with loads of non-combat pets, outfits, houses, and furnishings. There are people who literally do nothing harder than a delve in this game for years and years and are perfectly happy with the outfitting stations, pets, and decorating houses.
This is a true statement, and I'll say that as someone who's definitely in the 'Game 3' category.
ZOS probably has data on how many people play in each of these gamestyles, but I bet there's a large percentage of people who are in Game 3. And with Greymoor, they're definitely expecting an influx of new players drawn by Skyrim nostalgia and the fact that TES hasn't had another game in the past 8.5 years. I was one of them.
I don't play MMOs. I'd prefer to do everything solo. I'm trying to learn some mechanics, but I'm here to enjoy life in Tamriel, not try to get a full time job as a data cruncher to get best-in-show gear. I'll leave that for the people who care about it.
Now most of these incoming characters will be 'Game 3.' And I'm sure 90+% or so of Crown Store sales are from this group as well. That's where they're seeing revenue, so of course they're going to care more about it. And I'm sure that when TES6 finally comes out, most of Game 3 will be dropping ESO like a hot potato to head over there, since that's what they like. When that day comes, it would be nice if ZOS were able to keep some of the Game 1 or Game 2 people around, so absolutely they should be trying to work with that, but they have to balance the fact that there are so many more Game 3 people they're expecting to have in the next few months.
It seems that they also want people to do the newest content, so things tend to get nerfed as time goes along in order to push people to the newest stuff, if Iceheart vs. Mother Ciannit is any indication.
Obviously the ideal would be to get people to do everything, but there's no magic button for that. PvP and PvE are inherently different beasts - iirc people said that PvP took a huge drop in quality once most of the calculations were moved from client to server to avoid cheating, but that subjected most of the calcs to ping. Also, there are several things that you'll never encounter if you PvE (crit resitance), which makes the builds inherently different. And in terms of the casual vs. endgame PvE, I've noticed that on the whole the 'Game 1' and 'Game 2' people as a whole tend to look down on the 'Game 3' crowd. Everyone reads 'play as you want' a different way, and some people prefer the relaxing stuff whereas others are striving to be the best of the best. I'm not gonna pretend that all of the casual gamers are blameless - there are plenty of people who are dismissive of the concerns of endgame players or PvPers since they're never going to do that content. But the casuals don't like to be dismissed as "princess Barbie dreamland," as I've seen some forum members put it, just because we don't feel like dedicating months to grinding Maelstrom Arena. Both hardcore endgame and casual solo play are legit ways to play.
There are some attempts to get people to step outside their comfort zones: Midyear Mayhem, or any of the trial/arena events like Orsinium celebration. This change they're doing with the vMA weapons may even be part of that. But for the most part, people are not going to jump around much. I know that I'm only concerned about endgame PvE insofar as I need a specific cosmetic from a vet DLC dungeon, and once I finally get it (or give up and buy a carry since it requires a nodeath run) I doubt I'll even do any more dungeons after that. It's just not how I choose to play the game. More power to anyone who likes the endgame gear, but that's just not for me.
That is one of the most balanced and sensible posts I have seen on this forum in a long time.3 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭When people say PvP is broken, don't they mean just Cyrodiil? I don't see as many comments about Imperial City, Battlegrounds or Dueling. Moreover, when they say Cyrodiil, don't they mean the one campaign everyone wants to join? I have seen people mentioning other campaigns not having problems but for some reason people don't spread out between the campaigns and I don't understand why PvP guilds don't organise that. Note that is just the impression I get from reading the forums, as I don't PvP I do stand to be corrected!
I do also get that endgame PvE also has problems, and I personally find that overland PvE including delves, dolmens and world bosses is fine - including on PC EU.
Delves, dolmens and WBs are not end-game 🤣
I never suggested they were. I meant that I know that endgame PvE has problems, and that my personal experience is that the non-endgame PvE does not.0 -
Destai✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Nope, PVE is going downhill, at least on PS4. I've been experiencing the following issues recently.
1. Skill clog. Skills won't fire for a minute and then all of sudden the last 2 or 3 skills fire all at once.
2. Skills and actions not responding. Simple actions like attacking cause my character to stutter and fail.
3. Mobs not responding to hits then falling down dead. Or some jerk mob launches me into a space with something I previously dodged. Sidenote, it'd be great if I didn't have to hit a mob that's been following me for the past 45 minutes for them to give up.
4. UI hanging up. I was literally submitting a ticket for the above issues from PS4 and the UI glitched out.
5. Log out hanging up. It'll just sit there sometimes.
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