Still social banned... for no reason!

mandricus
mandricus
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I wasn't aware of the "social ban" in ESO. I have to say that the game itself does not warn you in any way that you are social banned. I was going nuts because I noticed that in the past two days people weren't answering to my whispers and I didn't understand why! Turned out that I got social banned. I am not able to access guild traders in any city, nor I'm able to put anything on sale on my commercial trading guilds.

I've discovered this thread on the forum

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/521458/gms-getting-social-banned-for-no-reason

Where some GM of large commercial guilds got social banned in the past days. They thought that this had something to do with the use of Shissu's guild tool and the send of large amount of email so user. Now, the thing is, I've *never* sent any group email to anyone, so I wasn't really understanding why I got banned. Then I found this comment:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6706745/#Comment_6706745

The user reported that in the past he has been social banned in ESO because he bought too many motifs all at once, triggering some sort of suspicious activity that led him to being social banned.

That's it, I did exactly the same! Since it was the last day of the event, and I made almost 3 millions during this event (doing writs dailies on 18 alts every day, 108 boxes per day, tons of motifs sold in the event's weeks), at the end of the event I went shopping like crazy, and I bought a lot (and I mean A LOT) of missing motifs on my main character (which is also a crafter) alltogheter, in order to recover pace with the latest motifs of the last 3 patches (I was on-par until Murkmire knowing all the motifs of the game) . That's it, since motifs are one of my things in this game, I used the money earned during the event to close the gap and be on-pace with all the new motifs.

Now, I would like to ask why, in the first place, this activity can lead you to be social banned. This makes no sense at all.

The result is: I can't access guild traders, I can't put anything on sale, I can't send mail, I CAN'T EVEN WHISPER OR TALK TO ANYONE IN THE GAME.

Funny fact, the game does not warn you in any way that you are social banned. I spent two days trying to understand what was going on. If you try to send whispers to anyone, you see your whispers going out in the chat, and nothing warn you that the other person IS NOT GETTING ANYTHING. I was getting nuts, asking to myself, in the first two days before I realized what was going on, why people were not answering me anymore!

I opened a ticket to the support3 days ago, but at the moment still no answer from anyone. As of today, it's my 5th day of social ban.

I'm still social banned FOR NO REASON, as I did something completely legit. But I still can't buy anything, can't sell anything, can't talk to anyone. Can't reach the requested weekly sales, can't donate on guild banks to compensate for the lack of sales, CAN'T EVEN CONTACT GM OF THOSE GUILDS TO MAKE THEY KNOW WHAT IS HAPPENING. I'm simply cut out from the game, for *NO* ***** *REASON*.

This is starting to get very annoying and as you may imagine I'm quite pissed of the situation. Does anyone knows how could I proceed in order to make ZOS restore social functionality on my account?
  • idk
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    There is a reason even if you are not aware of what happened. What likely happened was a response to the client requests to the server crossing over a threshold which triggers an automatic ban. What may be the culprit is an addon or multiple addons.

    It is also not surprising that Zos has not responded to your ticket. We know Zos is impacted by Covid-19 just as other games have noted their impact. This has slowed things down.

    Hopefully this ends for you soon. It has to be frustrating. I would make sure you have no out-of-date addons. Beyond that I do not know how one would make sure their add-ons were working properly.
  • geonsocal
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    that's a crazy story...I'm sure it happens more than most of us would ever be aware of...

    hope you're able to get this situation sorted out soon...
    PVP Campaigns Section: Playstation NA and EU (Gray Host) - This Must be the Place
  • Tandor
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    If multiple guild mails aren't the culprit, then add-ons and lag are often cited in these cases, the lag issue being one of delayed inputs all firing off at the same moment giving the game's data tracker the idea that you're spamming commands when you're not. However, all you can do for now is wait on a reply from Customer Support with full allowance for the fact that they're working from home/sick/caring for sick loved ones. Make sure you reply to any acknowledgement or it will be assumed the issue is resolved, and do not under any circumstances send additional tickets or each one will put you to the back of the queue.
  • mandricus
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    idk wrote: »
    There is a reason even if you are not aware of what happened. What likely happened was a response to the client requests to the server crossing over a threshold which triggers an automatic ban. What may be the culprit is an addon or multiple addons.

    As I wrote, this has nothing to do with addons, client requests or any other similar thing.
    I was social banned because I've bought and read too many motifs all at once (about 50-60 motifs in less than 10 mins).
    That's the reason why I'm so pissed.
    Why buying and reading 50 or 100 motifs at once is supposed to trigger an automatic ban?

    Edited by mandricus on April 18, 2020 4:28PM
  • Gaebriel0410
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    This is bizarre! I hope you'll get it resolved soon! A guildie of mine was also social banned for no reason, and has been waiting eighteen days for it to be resolved now.

    I mean 18 days, that would be lengthy for a legitimate ban! He told me he wasn't even notified of the ban and thought it was an addon bug at first.
  • Tandor
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    mandricus wrote: »
    idk wrote: »
    There is a reason even if you are not aware of what happened. What likely happened was a response to the client requests to the server crossing over a threshold which triggers an automatic ban. What may be the culprit is an addon or multiple addons.

    As I wrote, this has nothing to do with addons, client requests or any other similar thing.
    I was social banned because I've bought and read too many motifs all at once (about 50-60 motifs in less than 10 mins).
    That's the reason why I'm so pissed.
    Why buying and reading 50 or 100 motifs at once is supposed to trigger an automatic ban?

    As you were told, and accepted, in the other thread it would seem that such an action tripped a "fraud protection fuse". That may actually have been aggravated by any lag shortening the time in which all the motif inputs appeared to be made. No-one here can tell you why that should be the case with motifs, and ZOS aren't going to explain their fraud protection mechanisms for obvious reasons so all you can sensibly do is await a response to your ticket. As always with tickets, a patient and polite reply will pay dividends in getting a positive outcome.
  • Klad
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    From my knowledge, they increased social banning arbitrarily back in December, it's not just the guild tool....I mean ZoS ignored folks who were getting Death threats for silly reasons like riding a Apex mount for years.

    Now read a motifs too fast, use an approved addon or tell someone you don't agree with their progressive, SJW delusions and you won't be able to communicate with anyone again.

    Another reason I play other MMo's more than I do ESO.
    Edited by Klad on April 18, 2020 5:17PM
  • Ackwalan
    Ackwalan
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    mandricus wrote: »
    idk wrote: »
    There is a reason even if you are not aware of what happened. What likely happened was a response to the client requests to the server crossing over a threshold which triggers an automatic ban. What may be the culprit is an addon or multiple addons.

    As I wrote, this has nothing to do with addons, client requests or any other similar thing.
    I was social banned because I've bought and read too many motifs all at once (about 50-60 motifs in less than 10 mins).
    That's the reason why I'm so pissed.
    Why buying and reading 50 or 100 motifs at once is supposed to trigger an automatic ban?

    If you found, bought and read 50 to 100 motifs in less then ten minutes, that is an indication that a 3rd party program was used which would trigger the anti cheat program.
  • mandricus
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    He told me he wasn't even notified of the ban and thought it was an addon bug at first.

    That's part of the issue. I was not notified in any way that I got social banned, and I thought it was an add-on bug too at first. It took me 2 days to figure out what was going on.
  • mandricus
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    Ackwalan wrote: »

    If you found, bought and read 50 to 100 motifs in less then ten minutes, that is an indication that a 3rd party program was used which would trigger the anti cheat program.

    What 3rdy party software are you talking about? I just started to randomly check in guild traders from city to city for all unknown motifs (using awesome guild trader add-on), and bought all unknown motifs on sale for less than 20k. Then I jumped to another city, learned all the motifs I received by email in the meantime and started another search. Rinse & repeat, does not take too much time to buy and learn 50 or more motifs this way.

  • Ackwalan
    Ackwalan
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    mandricus wrote: »
    Ackwalan wrote: »

    If you found, bought and read 50 to 100 motifs in less then ten minutes, that is an indication that a 3rd party program was used which would trigger the anti cheat program.

    What 3rdy party software are you talking about? I just started to randomly check in guild traders from city to city for all unknown motifs (using awesome guild trader add-on), and bought all unknown motifs on sale for less than 20k. Then I jumped to another city, learned all the motifs I received by email in the meantime and started another search. Rinse & repeat, does not take too much time to buy and le arn 50 or more motifs this way.

    In the post I responded to, you said you did that in under ten minutes. Doing all of that in that time frame would trigger the anti cheat program.

  • Beardimus
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    mandricus wrote: »
    I wasn't aware of the "social ban" in ESO. I have to say that the game itself does not warn you in any way that you are social banned. I was going nuts because I noticed that in the past two days people weren't answering to my whispers and I didn't understand why! Turned out that I got social banned. I am not able to access guild traders in any city, nor I'm able to put anything on sale on my commercial trading guilds.

    I've discovered this thread on the forum

    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/521458/gms-getting-social-banned-for-no-reason

    Where some GM of large commercial guilds got social banned in the past days. They thought that this had something to do with the use of Shissu's guild tool and the send of large amount of email so user. Now, the thing is, I've *never* sent any group email to anyone, so I wasn't really understanding why I got banned. Then I found this comment:

    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6706745/#Comment_6706745

    The user reported that in the past he has been social banned in ESO because he bought too many motifs all at once, triggering some sort of suspicious activity that led him to being social banned.

    That's it, I did exactly the same! Since it was the last day of the event, and I made almost 3 millions during this event (doing writs dailies on 18 alts every day, 108 boxes per day, tons of motifs sold in the event's weeks), at the end of the event I went shopping like crazy, and I bought a lot (and I mean A LOT) of missing motifs on my main character (which is also a crafter) alltogheter, in order to recover pace with the latest motifs of the last 3 patches (I was on-par until Murkmire knowing all the motifs of the game) . That's it, since motifs are one of my things in this game, I used the money earned during the event to close the gap and be on-pace with all the new motifs.

    Now, I would like to ask why, in the first place, this activity can lead you to be social banned. This makes no sense at all.

    The result is: I can't access guild traders, I can't put anything on sale, I can't send mail, I CAN'T EVEN WHISPER OR TALK TO ANYONE IN THE GAME.

    Funny fact, the game does not warn you in any way that you are social banned. I spent two days trying to understand what was going on. If you try to send whispers to anyone, you see your whispers going out in the chat, and nothing warn you that the other person IS NOT GETTING ANYTHING. I was getting nuts, asking to myself, in the first two days before I realized what was going on, why people were not answering me anymore!

    I opened a ticket to the support3 days ago, but at the moment still no answer from anyone. As of today, it's my 5th day of social ban.

    I'm still social banned FOR NO REASON, as I did something completely legit. But I still can't buy anything, can't sell anything, can't talk to anyone. Can't reach the requested weekly sales, can't donate on guild banks to compensate for the lack of sales, CAN'T EVEN CONTACT GM OF THOSE GUILDS TO MAKE THEY KNOW WHAT IS HAPPENING. I'm simply cut out from the game, for *NO* ***** *REASON*.

    This is starting to get very annoying and as you may imagine I'm quite pissed of the situation. Does anyone knows how could I proceed in order to make ZOS restore social functionality on my account?

    Support have replied to me.
    Make sure you logged it right not just for information. Reply to the auto email they send you and get into it there.

    If there's no reason am sure they will it
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  • ZonasArch
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    It is worth noting that "no reason" is not "no reason". Something triggered it, and you wanna find out what even before the ban lifts, so you don't get banned again right away. If it wasn't an actual thing you said to someone and for reported, next guess is add-ons like you imagined. What add-ons you have are doing actions for you? AGS for example clicks things for you, like next page, skipping trader dialog and the likes. This is macroing/automatization of inputs, which is against the TOS, so is personal assistant, lazy crafter, yada yada...

    It's not unheard of, people getting in trouble for these, but I can't verify the reports, so I treat them as rumours and just proceed with care when using these. Again, though... They are all breaking the TOS.
    Edited by ZonasArch on April 18, 2020 7:53PM
  • SeaGtGruff
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    Ackwalan wrote: »
    mandricus wrote: »
    Ackwalan wrote: »

    If you found, bought and read 50 to 100 motifs in less then ten minutes, that is an indication that a 3rd party program was used which would trigger the anti cheat program.

    What 3rdy party software are you talking about? I just started to randomly check in guild traders from city to city for all unknown motifs (using awesome guild trader add-on), and bought all unknown motifs on sale for less than 20k. Then I jumped to another city, learned all the motifs I received by email in the meantime and started another search. Rinse & repeat, does not take too much time to buy and le arn 50 or more motifs this way.

    In the post I responded to, you said you did that in under ten minutes. Doing all of that in that time frame would trigger the anti cheat program.

    The problem seems to be that "the anti cheat program" which was instituted several months back-- apparently in response to the repeated high-profile posts in this forum about large amounts of money being transferred from account to account via the sale of "trash" items for astronomical prices in the guild traders-- seems to be a completely automated process that has no human oversight until well after the fact, if at all. It seems to be "found guilty and punished until proven to be innocent," and the "proven to be innocent" doesn't happen until the person who was "found guilty and punished" has instigated a Support ticket, which then has to be back-and-forthed for a while (days? weeks?) before it reaches a level where it's escalated to an actual investigation by a human to see what triggered the punishment in the first place and whether it was warranted or not.

    Don't get me wrong; I'm all for anti-cheat policing. But it seems like there's a huge dichotomy between players who report other players for suspected cheating or botting yet nothing ever seems to be done about it, versus players being automatically social-banned at the apparent whim of an algorithm which is apparently (judging from posts in this forum) catching innocent players in its net. (And don't get me wrong about players reporting other players for suspected offenses, because I think it's a very good thing that those reports don't result in insta-perma-bans or whatever, but instead must apparently go through some sort of human-conducted investigation.)
    I've fought mudcrabs more fearsome than me!
  • SeaGtGruff
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    mandricus wrote: »
    CAN'T EVEN CONTACT GM OF THOSE GUILDS TO MAKE THEY KNOW WHAT IS HAPPENING.

    The best thing to do in that respect would be to contact the GMs of your guilds via Discord and let them know about your predicament.
    I've fought mudcrabs more fearsome than me!
  • MasterSpatula
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    This kind of nonsense is the predictable and predicted result of a company using algorithms because it's not willing to pay people for a job that requires human judgement.
    "A probable impossibility is preferable to an improbable possibility." - Aristotle
  • Tandor
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    This kind of nonsense is the predictable and predicted result of a company using algorithms because it's not willing to pay people for a job that requires human judgement.

    Or to put it another way, it's the predictable consequence of some players cheating resulting in the need for the algorithms in the first place, and which has the predicted result of innocent players being disadvantaged.
  • Elsonso
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    Tandor wrote: »
    This kind of nonsense is the predictable and predicted result of a company using algorithms because it's not willing to pay people for a job that requires human judgement.

    Or to put it another way, it's the predictable consequence of some players cheating resulting in the need for the algorithms in the first place, and which has the predicted result of innocent players being disadvantaged.

    ...and the additional predicted result of increasing customer support load at a time when they are telling everyone that there will be a delay in customer response times due to high demand for customer support. :neutral:
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  • SammiSakura
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    @mandricus how are you getting on with this issue? Ive just posted a thread myself for the same issue, but probably triggered from guild mails or something
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  • godagarah5000
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    sounds like a bug dam
  • mandricus
    mandricus
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    Hi @SammySakura, my account social functionality were restored by the customer support after a couple of days.
    Edited by mandricus on May 4, 2020 4:41PM
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