The real reason group queuing should be allowed for Battlegrounds.

Deathlord92 · April 2020

No one missing pre mades except pre mades there’s always cyrodiil if you want to pile up on solo players or unorganised groups and spam aoes

Qbiken · April 2020

Deathlord92 wrote: »

No one missing pre mades except pre mades there’s always cyrodiil if you want to pile up on solo players or unorganised groups and spam aoes

I'd rather be steamrolled by a premade 10 times over than trying to play in Cyrodil where my skills and actions takes 5+ seconds to go off, assuming the go off at all.

Xologamer · April 2020

Deathlord92 wrote: »

No one missing pre mades except pre mades there’s always cyrodiil if you want to pile up on solo players or unorganised groups and spam aoes

1. cyro is unplayble after ~18.00
2. its not about being premades and zerging everone down its more about playing with friends witch is a big part of a mmo...

thechiefisback · April 2020

Deathlord92 wrote: »

No one missing pre mades except pre mades there’s always cyrodiil if you want to pile up on solo players or unorganised groups and spam aoes

As mentioned you need to be in the same alliance to play together in imperial city or Cyrodiil. I can't play with my main character since it's Aldmeri and my friends are Daggerfall. In BGs that was no problem.

Deathlord92 · April 2020

I like to play solo and before the bgs change all I remember is me fighting by myself because the rest of my team is either to scared of the pre made or they just quit bgs that imo is not fun at all because everyone in a proper pre made I’m talking is running the best build and are just as good as me maybe even better highly doubt it 💪 but I hope you get my point.

Deathlord92 · April 2020

I also have friends I’m in a social guild but I like to play by myself occasionally I’d play with my friends then we was the pre mades yeah it’s awesome crushing everyone but I also remember how much it sucks being that solo player getting destroyed by pre mades

BNOC · April 2020

Just to reiterate since people are talking like they think otherwise: nobody is against 2 queues, only groups queuing into solos.

With a working Mmr system, it would be interesting to see how many premades still enjoy BGs when they’re against others, similarly solo q I imagine.

TequilaFire · April 2020

Makes 1vX farming much easier when the enemies aren't organized.

Grianasteri · April 2020

The real reason group queuing should be allowed for Battlegrounds???

Because on every level, its idiotic to not be able go play with your friends and guildies, in an MMO, ffs.

To fix one issue, you don't make a new one and just shrug our shoulders... Zos.

The solution was fairly obvious, stop putting large premades of 3 and 4 people, up against PUGs and groups with 2 or less premades.

The other alternative is to increase team sizes to 6 (like Cod etc), although exactly the same premade issues exist, on average, these will be lessened because it is less likely high numbers of 5 or 6 person premades will exist in comparison.

precambria · April 2020

There needs to be Duo queue , this made the meta complete garbage, made countless healer support players stop doing BGs or quit the game, the team balance is worse than ever and there are WAY less people doing BGS I can say this for sure because I have been one of the highest playtime BG PvPers on PC NA for months.

Entire guilds of people have left the game, there was RARELY if ever full premades running, high mmr consisted of mostly 2 main guilds and players in them almost always ran solo or with one other person what would be the point of "pug stomping" premades when all the solo queue high MMR players were our friends and guildies.

There is basically no high level PvP in BGs at all now which is as much a problem of the MMR reset as many of the good players leaving the game or BGs because they can't even practice group play there now, it's also to late now to fix it before players with good group synergy and teamwork would rise to the high MMR bracket, now it's just HIGH DPS/BURST doesn't matter if you just run around solo with no concept on position because there is always people that can be 2 shotted in the BG even when getting healed.To people who do maybe 1-2 BGs a day they think this change is good even though it probably had no effect on their win rate, streamers like it because they don't have to face organized players as much, reality is there is so much of the time where your team is just a loss and nothing you can do which for video games spells disaster players need to feel like they have an impact or can improve being put into hopeless games where no matter how well you play or what actions you chose happens WAY more now than it did even when there were actual groups to contend with

iCaliban · April 2020

Mancombe_Nosehair wrote: »

I'm sorry you can't play with your friends, but the reason for the change was that too many uber groups were ruining it for others, particularly newer players.

Two separate queues would unlikely work, as there wouldn't be enough players and wait times would be huge.

It's unfortunate for the likes of yourself and others, but the battlegrounds have proved to be more popular since the change.

There were always going to be winners and losers from this type of change, and the former is greater in numbers than the latter.

What a complete load of [Snip]. "Proven to be more popular"

Ill tell you some actual facts. Im co gm of the largest bg guild NA. Prior to this change we had 50+ people in bgs at a time during prime time. Now a full night is 20+

[Edited for profanity bypass]

Mancombe_Nosehair · April 2020

iCaliban wrote: »

Ill tell you some actual facts. Im co gm of the largest bg guild NA. Prior to this change we had 50+ people in bgs at a time during prime time. Now a full night is 20+

So what you are saying is that you and your mates were creating uber groups to beat up on people, and now you can't so some of them have left?

This is exactly what Zos is trying to stop.

Rave the Histborn · April 2020

paul.olesonb14_ESO wrote: »

So yeah, I was upset when they removed the ability for my friends and I to queue up for battlegrounds, since then we've discovered the "real" problem that needs to be addressed ASAP, specifically before the release of Greymoor.

So with Greymoor coming out combined with the covid19 pandemic ESO has seen a massive influx of new and returning players, however us NEW/returning players have run into a problem, which is... the Non-CP PvP content is non-existent. Prior to the change my friends and I just queued up for battlegrounds (which was fun and sufficient), now we have a choice, either go up against people who have 810+ CP or go roam around a completely empty "Non-CP Cyrodiil / Non-CP Imperial City", both of which have very little attendance if at all.

So what do new/returning players do who don't have 810+ CP?? The answer is dueling? nope, can't do that, CP works in duels, battlegrounds?? Nope can't do that, group queuing is not allowed...

So yeah, please consider re-adding some sort of group queue feature to battlegrounds by the launch of your Greymoor expansion otherwise my friends and I are just going to quit, we aren't going to farm 810+ CP to just play PvP together, it's not a realistic expectation of a newer/returning player.

So if you're sitting there with 810+ CP you're probably not worried about any of this, I get it, but do you want new players in your game? Do you want the game to continue to grow and increase? If not then do exactly what you are doing, just continue to ignore these types of changes and posts. However, if you do want these new players to keep playing and you do want the game to grow etc, I highly recommend speaking up and helping change the game in a positive way so newer players have content to do.

tldr; newer players like my friend and I, are not any where near level CP810, the Non-CP Cyrodiil/Imperial City are absolute ghost towns, those are not viable options for us.

If you think new players want to be zerged down constantly by mediocre papers that are incapable of solo queueing together you haven't really been here that long. I have a PVP background and there's nothing more frustrating then 4 guys obv on mics that come in and just spam executes at you

Amunari · April 2020

I have some key arguments for enabling group queues.

1. It is highly destructive to guilds dedicated to pvp to have this turned off. it would be equal to removing group ques from pve dungeons, and trials. Think about how destructive that is for that form of game play.

2. It was likely turned off for the purpose of balance, but balance is already bad. It is better to que with friends and lose and learn, then it is to not be able to que at all. so if you cant balance the game now, and not later, then there is no reason to make the argument to turn it off for balance.

3. Its destructive to competitive and cooperative content beyond guilds.

Folkvar · May 2020

So my wife is new to pvp and getting wrecked by zergs(cyro) and imperial physique farm groups(IC) is not quite fun for her at the moment. She used to love Battlegrounds with me before taking a hiatus.

This is also really bad for guilds who pvp together. And honestly if you suck its not the fault of the premade group. Its normal to get wrecked in an mmo. AND I am certain the people who complained about it are getting wrecked still.

I bet also many of these people are still sending in complaints about premade groups. Thinking they are losing because of this.

Common ZOS.... this was a bad change..

Berek_Bloodfang · May 2020

Folkvar wrote: »

So my wife is new to pvp and getting wrecked by zergs(cyro) and imperial physique farm groups(IC) is not quite fun for her at the moment. She used to love Battlegrounds with me before taking a hiatus.

This is also really bad for guilds who pvp together. And honestly if you suck its not the fault of the premade group. Its normal to get wrecked in an mmo. AND I am certain the people who complained about it are getting wrecked still.

I bet also many of these people are still sending in complaints about premade groups. Thinking they are losing because of this.

Common ZOS.... this was a bad change..

We get wrecked because we have 200-400 CP total per character, going up against people with 810+. So yeah we can't touch them, it has nothing to do with skill because when we were able to do battlegrounds together we did fine.

max_only · May 2020

Kahnak wrote: »

paul.olesonb14_ESO wrote: »

So yeah, I was upset when they removed the ability for my friends and I to queue up for battlegrounds, since then we've discovered the "real" problem that needs to be addressed ASAP, specifically before the release of Greymoor.

So with Greymoor coming out combined with the covid19 pandemic ESO has seen a massive influx of new and returning players, however us NEW/returning players have run into a problem, which is... the Non-CP PvP content is non-existent. Prior to the change my friends and I just queued up for battlegrounds (which was fun and sufficient), now we have a choice, either go up against people who have 810+ CP or go roam around a completely empty "Non-CP Cyrodiil / Non-CP Imperial City", both of which have very little attendance if at all.

So what do new/returning players do who don't have 810+ CP?? The answer is dueling? nope, can't do that, CP works in duels, battlegrounds?? Nope can't do that, group queuing is not allowed...

So yeah, please consider re-adding some sort of group queue feature to battlegrounds by the launch of your Greymoor expansion otherwise my friends and I are just going to quit, we aren't going to farm 810+ CP to just play PvP together, it's not a realistic expectation of a newer/returning player.

So if you're sitting there with 810+ CP you're probably not worried about any of this, I get it, but do you want new players in your game? Do you want the game to continue to grow and increase? If not then do exactly what you are doing, just continue to ignore these types of changes and posts. However, if you do want these new players to keep playing and you do want the game to grow etc, I highly recommend speaking up and helping change the game in a positive way so newer players have content to do.

It's the new players that are complaining, my dude. The complaint is that they are getting beat up by all of the premade groups and all of the BG matches are one sided.

Yes.

thechiefisback wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

thechiefisback wrote: »

Is there a chance that you can play with your friends again in battlegrounds in this multiplayer game with the start of Greymoor instead of playing with random persons you don't even know? Many people I know and myself would appreciate that very much. It's really no fun playing alone. If you want to keep it like that then please create at least another queue for people who want to play with friends. Please don't let battlegrounds get abandoned @ZOS_GinaBruno :'(

Splitting the queue won't work, @thechiefisback ... as it will make the queue longer on both sides (both solo and pre-made).

Any reason why you can't play with friends in Cyrodiil or Imperial City??

Well you have to be in the same alliance to play together. Just as easy as that. If you are from different alliances it's hard to play together.

Alliance change token is on the way.

thechiefisback wrote: »

Mancombe_Nosehair wrote: »

I'm sorry you can't play with your friends, but the reason for the change was that too many uber groups were ruining it for others, particularly newer players.

Two separate queues would unlikely work, as there wouldn't be enough players and wait times would be huge.

It's unfortunate for the likes of yourself and others, but the battlegrounds have proved to be more popular since the change.

There were always going to be winners and losers from this type of change, and the former is greater in numbers than the latter.

I don't know about the popularity. Where did you hear about that? In my guild no one is playing battlegrounds anymore since it's just no fun playing alone in a multiplayer game. And we used to play it a lot.

That’s the opposite for the people I know.

I hope they separate the queues so that group queue people can make post after post of how long it takes and how broken it is while the rest of us have fun proving ourselves as competent even with a mixed bag of nuts for teammates.

Also, duos should absolutely be banned from the solo queue. I’ve seen what a near constant uptime on Guard looks like when 2 people on comms have coordinated their outfits, skills, and synergy.

Not knowing who you’re grouped with is part of the challenge. It’s everyone is random or no one is.

JmJ · May 2020

When we first got the BG's i believe they sayd that que works in a way that premade group's are facing other premade group's. This was something that sadly never worked and most of the time you where facing some randoms that had no change what so ever in those games. I dont pvp enough to say if this is good or bad change, but at least it seems more fair.

Langeston · May 2020

TequilaFire wrote: »

Agreed basic fact of multiplayer games, problem is so many want to turn this into a solo game.

paul.olesonb14_ESO wrote: »

Do people not realize they can go play Skyrim?? I am here to play (WITH) people....

I'm kinda tired of seeing this bogus argument.

Single-player games (such as Skyrim) are PVE. Most PVP players despise playing PVE — they resent even having to do a dungeon for a monster helmet.

PVP means "Player Versus Player" — PVPers primarily play because they want to compete against other people. Certain exceptions notwithstanding, (i.e. the "win at any cost" sub-50 BG players that gold out full sets) many (most?) PVP players would rather play in a balanced PUG match than on or against a premade that just curb-stomps the other two teams. It's fine if you don't feel the same way, but quit misrepresenting their stance on the issue.

TL;DR: No one is trying to turn ESO into a single player game. Find a better straw man.

zyk · May 2020

I don't understand why they don't let players setup their own BG matches. Also add some 4v4 maps. It's like ZOS doesn't want competitive players in ESO.

"our research shows our most profitable customers feel good players ruin their immersion. they insist on good player tokens -- and god knows we're trying -- but I think we all know what we need to do..."

Langeston · May 2020

zyk wrote: »

I don't understand why they don't let players setup their own BG matches. Also add some 4v4 maps. It's like ZOS doesn't want competitive players in ESO.

"our research shows our most profitable customers feel good players ruin their immersion. they insist on good player tokens -- and god knows we're trying -- but I think we all know what we need to do..."

My guess is, it's because there wouldn't be enough players to populate the BG queues if they did. I'd love it if group duels were a thing — it'd be cool AF to turn one of my houses into a multi-level personal battleground and have BG tournaments. Unfortunately, I don't see it happening.

Qbiken · May 2020

If people want to seperate groups vs solo, I think ZOS should change so that only people that group up can end up on the leaderboards, and at the same time improve the rewards you get from leaderboards. I think that would be a fair compromise, + it would make battlegrounds feel a lot more competitive.

SweepsAllClowns · May 2020

BNOC wrote: »

With a working Mmr system, it would be interesting to see how many premades still enjoy BGs when they’re against others, similarly solo q I imagine.

I remember from Xbox EU many times some players, who I faced in the obvious premade groups with the same names daily. Once one of these premade warriors happened to be solo queing after the rest of the group had gone offline and joining my random group, well we had few less experienced against some very strong team and it was quite clear from start how the match will end no matter how well I played, this noble warrior made the true badarse move and just quit very soon, similar has happened many times. What annoyed me was he and his group were dominating in relic run match just earlier and were flexing with the last relic and didn't bother delivering it and ending the match, very arrogant in full premade group, not so much in random group. This happened long ago, but this situation still comes to mind when I think how some true group warriors play as solo.

jecks33 · May 2020

paul.olesonb14_ESO wrote: »

the Non-CP PvP content is non-existent.

i'm a night player, i do bgs one after the other 'till 5am, to enter the no-cp campaing i usually have a queue of 30 players at 9pm on pc. The no-cp content is healty here

Kadoin · May 2020

Sometimes these forums are more comedic than anyone gives them credit for.

Sharee · May 2020

Amunari wrote: »

I have some key arguments for enabling group queues.

1. It is highly destructive to guilds dedicated to pvp to have this turned off. it would be equal to removing group ques from pve dungeons, and trials. Think about how destructive that is for that form of game play.

This is a flawed analogy.

PvE has static opponents. You need to meet certain criteria for group composition/quality, or you won't succeed at winning the encounter. Therefore, being able to set up your group in advance is critical for your success.

On the other hand, opponents in BG PvP are dynamic. There is no bar you have to meet or fail. Especially now that there are no premades. So not being able to set up an ideal group in advance isn't a prerequisite for winning. The random composition of groups affect your chances, but it is just as likely to help you as it is to hurt you, so over time it cancels out.

TequilaFire · May 2020

Langeston wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Agreed basic fact of multiplayer games, problem is so many want to turn this into a solo game.

paul.olesonb14_ESO wrote: »

Do people not realize they can go play Skyrim?? I am here to play (WITH) people....

I'm kinda tired of seeing this bogus argument.

Single-player games (such as Skyrim) are PVE. Most PVP players despise playing PVE — they resent even having to do a dungeon for a monster helmet.

PVP means "Player Versus Player" — PVPers primarily play because they want to compete against other people. Certain exceptions notwithstanding, (i.e. the "win at any cost" sub-50 BG players that gold out full sets) many (most?) PVP players would rather play in a balanced PUG match than on or against a premade that just curb-stomps the other two teams. It's fine if you don't feel the same way, but quit misrepresenting their stance on the issue.

TL;DR: No one is trying to turn ESO into a single player game. Find a better straw man.

Strawman? It is the main divide between the MMO players and players that want it to be Skyrim online.
Not to mention the epeeners who want to 1vX to show off their perfected videos on Youtube.

Langeston · May 2020

TequilaFire wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Agreed basic fact of multiplayer games, problem is so many want to turn this into a solo game.

paul.olesonb14_ESO wrote: »

Do people not realize they can go play Skyrim?? I am here to play (WITH) people....

I'm kinda tired of seeing this bogus argument.

Single-player games (such as Skyrim) are PVE. Most PVP players despise playing PVE — they resent even having to do a dungeon for a monster helmet.

PVP means "Player Versus Player" — PVPers primarily play because they want to compete against other people. Certain exceptions notwithstanding, (i.e. the "win at any cost" sub-50 BG players that gold out full sets) many (most?) PVP players would rather play in a balanced PUG match than on or against a premade that just curb-stomps the other two teams. It's fine if you don't feel the same way, but quit misrepresenting their stance on the issue.

TL;DR: No one is trying to turn ESO into a single player game. Find a better straw man.

Strawman? It is the main divide between the MMO players and players that want it to be Skyrim online.
Not to mention the epeeners who want to 1vX.

Yes, the argument that PVPers want to do away with premades in BGs because they want ESO to be a single player game is a straw man. It's also a ridiculous argument at that, by virtue of the simple fact that Player Versus Player doesn't work particularly well when there is only one player.

I don't blame people for disagreeing with the change, but misrepresenting someone's argument simply because it doesn't align with yours benefits no one.

ZOS_FalcoYamaoka · May 2020

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Berek_Bloodfang · May 2020

Langeston wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Agreed basic fact of multiplayer games, problem is so many want to turn this into a solo game.

paul.olesonb14_ESO wrote: »

Do people not realize they can go play Skyrim?? I am here to play (WITH) people....

I'm kinda tired of seeing this bogus argument.

Single-player games (such as Skyrim) are PVE. Most PVP players despise playing PVE — they resent even having to do a dungeon for a monster helmet.

PVP means "Player Versus Player" — PVPers primarily play because they want to compete against other people. Certain exceptions notwithstanding, (i.e. the "win at any cost" sub-50 BG players that gold out full sets) many (most?) PVP players would rather play in a balanced PUG match than on or against a premade that just curb-stomps the other two teams. It's fine if you don't feel the same way, but quit misrepresenting their stance on the issue.

TL;DR: No one is trying to turn ESO into a single player game. Find a better straw man.

Here's a better straw for you; it was a feature that was allowed when we bought the game, every other MMORPG has this feature, now it has been removed for "testing" purposes, however it hasn't been re-abled in months and no information has been discussed regarding this change... We had the ability to before and was the reason we bought the game. It's not like we're asking for a feature that didn't exist, we're asking for something that was sold to us be reopened.