I'll probably just wait until they release numbers...

Vevvev wrote: »

For starters having normal abilities cost more at stage 1 is just silly in my opinion, but I feel like 15% should be the stage 4 cap. Not too brutal and should be how it scales if stage 1 had no increases or decreases in ability costs.

So ten percent extra regen is op, but a 15 percent cost increase is ok.

That's totally objective.

Luckily the cost will be most likely between 5-7

Some background context.

My vampire character is an exiled ashlander who uses martial weapons because that's what makes sense for his background. He is not, however, a stamina character, which means in terms of game mechanics he is using the "wrong" weapon type for his stat allocation. I am able to get this to work fairly well, but he does not have the ability to restore resources with his weapon attacks. Any increase to the cost of his abilities is therefore a lot more problematic for him than for any of my other characters.

I have no interest keeping him at Stage 4 (I typically keep him at 1 or 2 presently), but if he was at stage four, anything beyond about a 10% increase would start to be a significant problem for him. If he used a staff, pushing to 20% wouldn't really be an issue, but again, he's a magicka character who uses martial (stamina) weapons and can't recover resources with them.

To me, from a dps standpoint, it depends on how worthwhile the abilities that do damage and/or increase damage end up. Potentially including multiple vamp abilities at greatly reduced cost in a rotation could go a long way to make up for the increased cost on the non vamp abilities.

If they make the tradeoff too good it'll just be another BiS thing people mindlessly get. Leave it high as long as there are other VAMPIRE abilities that are useful.
The Vampire skill list is about being a VAMPIRE, it should not be about meta.

Vevvev wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

If we still had the regen it would be ok at ten percent, but losing our regen and paying ten percent more is too much. Maximum should be 7 tops, but since we lost our regen, there is no reason to have any increase really. 5 is the only tolerable amount really, 7 is pushing it.

I was just going off the stuff we saw and calculating from there. I personally would like it if they scrapped the ability cost increase/decrease all together and added a reduced healing received debuff instead. Would make it harder to keep up with the vampire's powerful health cost ability while not destroying people's ability to sustain.

They could simply reintroduce the 75 percent health regen debuff and be done with it imo. I was totally fine with that. It was enough that you couldnt really be a health regen tank, but not enough that you couldnt work around. I feel like they went a bit too debuff heavy, but will reserve final judgement for pts. I really wish they wouldnt have released those special builds to certain streamers , all they did was cause, once again , extra stress for no reason.

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

If they make the tradeoff too good it'll just be another BiS thing people mindlessly get. Leave it high as long as there are other VAMPIRE abilities that are useful.
The Vampire skill list is about being a VAMPIRE, it should not be about meta.

Its not about being meta, its about balance. We already lost our regen, and we know there will be an increased cost to normal abilities, even at 5 percent it would be a big enough deterrent that meta players using new moon acolyte would not use it. 10 percent is too much, for me the compromise would be 7 percent. Will really have to wait and see. Every class should be viable with vampire builds, because even if we use all the vamp skills, we still have to rely on 50 percent of our skills being class or weapon skills. Anything over 7 percent, would hurt a lot.

My favorite example is mag sorc, it has to be used at range, it just cannot be in melee range and hope to compete with melee builds, so we would at most use 2-4 of the new abilities, and would still need to use our heavy hitting class abilities in order to be useful, and we should also be able to be stage four.

Vevvev wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

They could simply reintroduce the 75 percent health regen debuff and be done with it imo. I was totally fine with that. It was enough that you couldnt really be a health regen tank, but not enough that you couldnt work around. I feel like they went a bit too debuff heavy, but will reserve final judgement for pts. I really wish they wouldnt have released those special builds to certain streamers , all they did was cause, once again , extra stress for no reason.

75% percent as it is on live is way better than the 100% we saw on the demo videos. If you have 0 healing abilities slotted that basically means at stage 4 if you get hurt you'll always be at that level. Some people might see it as a bug or something.

The most " recent " demo video had the health regen loss only at 10 percent, and the fire damage at 15. So all these numbers are pretty unreliable atm. Different videos are showing different percentages. I really wish they would release a statement at this point at minimum.