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Is ice staffs being a tanking tool part of the lore in elder scrolls?
Somber97866
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I'm curious about this and I'm sure some of you are like super elder scrolls lore buffs. Can anyone answer this for me?
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TheFM✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Technically anything could be used for tanking in tes lore, but logically an alteration staff would be more for that job.8 -
Donny_Vito✭✭✭✭✭
✭Doubtful. I can't imagine a DK rolling around Tamriel with an Ice Staff.
But it's still extremely useful to a Tank (or a lightning staff) to reduce the most amount of resistances the enemy has due to how ZoS changed enchant for 1-handed weapons, so in my opinion... usefulness > lore.1 -
Somber97866✭✭✭✭✭Or like a quarterstaff. But the ice staff has never been used as a defensive tool in the lore of Elder scrolls , has it?0
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AcadianPaladin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Lore is of no help here. Lol.
Having played the series since 2007, I am quite pleased overall that in ESO, for the first game in Elder Scrolls history, staves are good weapons!
That said, I agree that the current ice staff is inferior to S&B as a tank weapon and inferior to shock and fire staves as a dps weapon. The poor confused ice staff could certainly use some focus and direction.
PC NA(no Steam), PvE, mostly solo7 -
xWarbrain✭✭✭✭✭It is now.XB1 NA
Your nerf suggestion is dumb. Learn to counter other players instead of having the game rebuilt to your ability level.6 -
opaj✭✭✭✭✭
✭Somber97866 wrote: »So technically it's lore breaking?
As @Raisin said, ideas like "tanking" aren't really in lore, because tanking is a game mechanic.
That said, something not being in the lore doesn't mean it's lore breaking. If that were the case, it would be impossible to add new lore whenever a new game came out. Tamriel is a continent with thousands of years of history, but all of the lore written for it was made in the last twenty-five years, so there will always be massive knowledge gaps in history, tradition, and yes--ways that magic has been used throughout history.5 -
Somber97866✭✭✭✭✭Okay so wait a minute you're trying to say that tanking DPS and healing is all lore breaking?1
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Jimmy_The_Fixer✭✭✭✭✭OP, I’m more concerned about your interest in this subject, why does this matter to you?1
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Somber97866✭✭✭✭✭Yeah but using ice staff as a defensive tool has never from what I can tell been a part of elder scrolls?0
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SpacemanSpiff1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭i doubt it. eso is mechanically different from the ES single player games, so it will not align 100% with them. there are roles and group dynamics rather than a single person experience.0 -
luen79rwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well it's a crazy idea from someone at ZOS in an attempt to make ice staves useful.
It might not be an establishment on past ES games but them devs have said that everything in ESO is canon. So if they decide to keep this crazy ice staff tanking idea we might also see it on ES VI
PC/DC/NAserver
V16 sorc - V16 temp - V16 dk - V1 nb - V1 temp - V1 dk1 -
belial5221_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Just cause it's not recorded in books,doesn't mean it's not something that happens.Same for what is written,doesn't mean it actually happened/happens.3
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Netheniel✭✭✭The Morrowind trailer showcased a Warden using an ice shield to block a Dwemer Construct's cannon fire. By nature of ice being a solid, it goes without saying that if you can control ice, it is not outside the realm of possibility it could be used as a defensive shield.
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Raisin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Somber97866 wrote: »Okay so wait a minute you're trying to say that tanking DPS and healing is all lore breaking?
Healing is not. Tanking is...questionable. There may be fighters who build for defence and try to be in the front lines to take heavy hits and distract from their squshier allies. But that's vague at best and you know there's no way to work taunting into lore. It's really just an MMO mechanic.2 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭What have you ever needed to tank before in an Elder Scrolls game? Hint: roles are gameplay, not lore. If there's not a gameplay need for it, a mechanic is unlikely to be included when its not needed.
Seriously, unless you were like "I know, I'll be a pure healer while Lydia does all the damage" there was no tank/healer/DD trinity in the single player games. Like in VMA, you played all three roles at once because the singleplayer games are solo content. Role in group content terms is irrelevant.
For all we know, its entirely possible there is an ice spell that taunts an enemy in the 3rd and 4th era. But because there are no bosses to tank, our characters didn't need to know it (and the devs had no reason to include stuff we didn't know).
Lore wise in terms of past (future) games: taunts fall in with illusion while wards/mage armor fall into alteration or restoration. ZOS didn't add an illusion or alteration staff to flesh out magicka tanking. They also didn't stick to parceling out the schools of magic the way the other games did - not surprisingly as the Mages Guild doesn't exactly have the same influence now as it did by the end of the 3rd era when the other games take place.
In short, magic isn't necessary defined by the "schools" of magic in the lore as evidenced by a number of spell effects moving to different schools from game to game. (RIP Mysticism). Trying to say that 2nd Era ice staffs can't possibly use an illusion effect just because they never did in the 3rd and 4th era doesn't actually prove anything about what's possible in the 2nd Era.
If anything, you can probably thank the adventurers of the 2nd Era and eventually Tiber Septim for wiping out the majority of the boss monsters who necessitated using taunt spells - if you want a lore explanation for why taunts aren't used much in the 3rd and 4th era, there's as good a reason as any.4 -
xWarbrain✭✭✭✭✭No, it would be lore-breaking if it was once known that ice staves caused enemies to flee and now in ESO they're suddenly used for the opposite.XB1 NA
Your nerf suggestion is dumb. Learn to counter other players instead of having the game rebuilt to your ability level.0 -
Ratzkifal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Ice has always been part of the Destruction familly, so it's supposed to be magicka dps.
Usually the elements get their identity from their differing secondary effects on enemies.- Frost damages stamina, so it's good against warriors
- Shock damages magicka, so it's good against casters
- Fire deals additional damage over time
In ESO the secondary effects are- Shock applies minor vulnerability
- Fire applies a dot
- Frost applies minor maim
However that doesn't mean Frost should be shoehorned into a tanking role. Especially given how the frost staff taunt works, this is really a joke. You need to drop block and wind-up a full heavy attack to apply taunt to a single enemy. So if you need to keep a group taunted, there is no time for you to block.
Knowing ZOS they will adress this by making stamina taunts have an equally long cast time, because they just don't want to scrap their terrible Frost = tank idea.
What ZOS should do is change the Chilled status effect to be something that dps actually wants, perhaps it could deal a bit of direct damage whenever it's applied and maybe stack up, or they use the new mechanic they invented for DK's that subsequent damage taken by chilled enemies from any source gets increased by a flat amount.
Throw in some changes to Warden frost skills to allow them to be actual good DPS or morph into tanks if they want, perhaps a class frost taunt too and everyone would be happy.
Oh and remove the taunt from Frost staves because it's silly.This Bosmer was tortured to death. There is nothing left to be done.3 -
Konstant_Tel_Necris✭✭✭✭✭Well Hrormir used his Icestaff, to get attention from Nocturnal sort of like that
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Song_of_HrormirEdited by Konstant_Tel_Necris on February 5, 2020 4:04PM1 -
Ratzkifal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Technically anything could be used for tanking in tes lore, but logically an alteration staff would be more for that job.
Agreed. That and Restoration magic which can magically project LITERAL SHIELDS that BLOCK damage. What was ZOS thinking...This Bosmer was tortured to death. There is nothing left to be done.1 -
CMDR_Un1k0rn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MMO = Different gameplay mechanics.
It really is that simple.In-game username: Un1korn | Happy member of the PCNA UESP guild (Resident Daggerfall Covenant enjoyer) | Main & basically only character: Crucian Vulpin, Imperial Dragonknight of the Daggerfall Covenant, and Undaunted Bulwark (I tank) | Mountain bike enjoyer and vulpine appreciator | If you know me from PCEU: No | To ZOS: THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME BRING MY HORSE INTO BATTLE!0 -
CASP3R421✭✭✭everything but solo RP carebear builds are lorebreaking
My Alt is a Mer
Due to the excessive amount of bait that we had to remove, this thread will remain closed1 -
Shantu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I suppose any role is what you make of it. Personally, I feel staves on a tank are just dumb.
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xenowarrior92eb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭yeah make resto staves for tanking instead...give dem cry babies back their snowball throwing sticks back
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Dark_Lord_Kuro✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Somber97866 wrote: »I'm curious about this and I'm sure some of you are like super elder scrolls lore buffs. Can anyone answer this for me?
Nope its a DESTRUCTION staff1
