It's a mass semi-open pvp area, intended for group play.

You can't really expect for a few soloers or random pug groups having much of chances against a group that invested a lot of time to make builds for group play, training and coordinating player members to be most effective in movement, reaction and skills.

So besides your claimings to be wrong/false, are you blaming people for playing in teams and coordinating in a open area designed for group play?

Or do you think that one of those ballgroup players running with EOTS+Sap+Deto doing high damage output is using heavy? Would you really run heavy armor if you were looking for max damage effectiveness?

And those stamdens running Spin+Sub.Assault+Perma/DB etc , do you really think they are running heavy armor? Same logic here.

And it goes on for healers, support roles etc, etc..

Just cause you see 28-32K+ HP on enemies HP bars, and they are hard to kill doesn't mean they're all in Heavy and only stacking rad regen.

If you want to have a chance, group up, adapt, learn and be prepared to wipe against groups that have years of pvp experience together.

Suggestion: Next time you encounter a ballgroup, pay attention to movement, reaction time, terrain tactics, maybe log the events and try to understand how a group pulls something like 20k+ DPS AOE, has high HPS numbers when needed and manages to kill hundreds of players without wiping.

And stop whining about group play in a group play pvp instance.

LoveForElderScrolls wrote: »

Zabulus wrote: »

Yes, ball group is a problem. But no ...
1. They are all Magicka players : false
2. They all use AOE skills for damage : almost
3. They all slot the proximity detonation skill : some
4. They all slot resto staff and rely on that for healing each other : some of course
5. They all use the radiating regeneration skill : no
6. They run in towers and chokepoints then drop ultimates and harmony bombs : yes, and sometime they walk to you in the wild and you stand ...
7. They usually all use heavy armor : no

But you have a point, ball group is a major problem creating massive lag, and bringing an awfull pvp to the community.

I knew before I posted this topic that some stuff I mentioned was not entirely true but I wrote them anyway.

You don't say?

"I've never played in a ball group and I don't know how they work, but I know it takes no skill and want to nerf some random things."

L_Nici wrote: »

Ballgroups are a huge problem even if you yourself are organized. They are usually 24 people and most skilled organized groups in PvP are smallscale (about 6 or less players), it takes no skill to win with 24 Ballgroups at all, its just blind R+X spam or on whatever you have ultimate and synergy.
Especially during the event they made a big return even on the not Zerg campaigns like Laatvulon. Sure as organized smallscale group you can outplay them pretty easy, but not in terms of killing them but in preventing them from hitting you, to kill them is basically impossible.
We are normally 4-5 in our guild group and even an organized Ult Dumb didn't even scratch them (2 Dawnbreaker, 1 Coloss, 1 Negate and 1 Meteor). And in the end we died to idiotic randoms that run in, die and trigger Vicious Death explosions all around, while we kite them in very close range, to force them to waste their Ultisynergy.

Playing in this huge ballgroups is the worst balanced thing in the game, takes no skill whatsoever, but always works and if it is just because they kill your FPS and Ping, so you can't even try to defend yourself. I mean seriously there even is one Ballgroup called "low FPS incoming". They know very well that they are mostly garbage players that would die in a split second without the group around them, and are very knowledgeable about what they cause for the server and players.

A 24m is not a ball group.

Equally you can't expect to kill a zerg group with smallscale 1vX builds unless they are complete pugs.
It's very easy to actually wipe such groups with even just 1-2 ppl if you know what you are doing and are surfing your faction.

NBrookus wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

NBrookus wrote: »

"I've never played in a ball group and I don't know how they work, but I know it takes no skill and want to nerf some random things."

Yea, this is one of smaller scalers/solo players biggest problems. Lack of respect and just trying to protect their ego, instead of understanding it’s a different playstyle and trying to understand why it works so they’ll stop getting farmed.

Don't try to pin this one on smaller scalers and solos. They don't get farmed by ball groups because they aren't at the same places.

If one is "solo" or "small man" with 50+ members of their faction nearby, one is just faction surfing. If you choose to school with the fishies, expect predators.

Agreed yea. Those people who duo with 60 other of their faction around and call themselves small scale are a joke. Yea, with 2 of us we took that group out!

I just mean usually they think they’re the best players, are in overly tanky specs designed to farm noobs or Xv1, and have ridiculous ideas about how ball groups even work. Their tactics are all designed around fighting solo or small groups and think something’s broken if it doesn’t work against everyone.

The complaints about lag are true, but it’s a lot of these ‘best players’ needing to get good. It’s like a small group of people in OP solo specs complaining they can’t beat a trial. Next will be the ‘come duel me brah’ comment.

LoveForElderScrolls wrote: »

The thing is that I didn't ask for nerfs on this topic. The word "adjust" doesn't necessarily mean nerfing, it could mean no change at all but all the people that are in a ball group themselves and replied to this topic though I asked for a nerf which means they know how OP ball groups are...

No, we know that you asked for nerfs and explained to you why you shouldn't call for adjustments or nerfs to things that literally have no bearing on how ball groups perform.

xWarbrain wrote: »

In fact, it could be argued that we were trying to protect you, the victims, by pointing out that these "adjustments" would only make the ball groups stronger and you weaker (i.e. nerfing heavy armor that they don't use).

So they don't use heavy armor huh? Then how is it possible for a Magicka sorcerer to cast no shield and cast no heals except radiant regen and stay alive and have the damage to kill you with VD?

LoveForElderScrolls wrote: »

xWarbrain wrote: »

In fact, it could be argued that we were trying to protect you, the victims, by pointing out that these "adjustments" would only make the ball groups stronger and you weaker (i.e. nerfing heavy armor that they don't use).

So they don't use heavy armor huh? Then how is it possible for a Magicka sorcerer to cast no shield and cast no heals except radiant regen and stay alive and have the damage to kill you with VD?

No, we don't all run around in heavy armor. There might be one or two people in the group wearing heavy for certain set bonuses, but not the mag DPS. I'm not going to write a guide for you but there are other set bonuses and a healer involved. If you're wearing VD on mag, you won't wear heavy armor as your other set because you wouldn't do enough damage to kill anyone to proc the VD.


There's a LOT more that goes into a successful ball group than "wahhhh they spam regen and all wear heavy armor". The difference between a ball group and a 24 man zerg is like a vet trials group compared to a PUG vet DLC. Except its fun because you don't just fight the same NPCs standing still in the same spot every time.

LoveForElderScrolls wrote: »

xWarbrain wrote: »

In fact, it could be argued that we were trying to protect you, the victims, by pointing out that these "adjustments" would only make the ball groups stronger and you weaker (i.e. nerfing heavy armor that they don't use).

So they don't use heavy armor huh? Then how is it possible for a Magicka sorcerer to cast no shield and cast no heals except radiant regen and stay alive and have the damage to kill you with VD?

No.

What people, some kindly, some not so kindly, are trying to say is that it would be a good idea to actually understand the combat mechanics and what these organized groups are doing before calling for "adjustments." The magicka sorcerer has numerous healers and other members of their group support them so they dont have to rely on their gear to survive. It's pretty much that simple.

Also, contrary to the salty misguided belief out there, most of the people in organized groups are very strong players, or at least their core is. The magicka sorcerer will have a shield on their bar and use it when their judgment calls for it to be used, it just wont be spammed.

sharquez wrote: »

I sToOd iN ReD wHile OuTnUmBeRed aNd dIeD iN PvP. EnEMy pLaYeRs aRe oVeRpoWerEd NeRf thEm!111

Don’t worry about the red circles, just block cast and you’ll be fine. It’s not like they fear or anything.

Wait, isnt there abilities that significantly reduce aoe dmg?

If you can't take on a ball group...AVOID.

They are most likely farming, so they hang around picking off "determined" players until a counter group is initiated.

Problem is there are not a lot of groups. And they avoid each other. So these groups will set up a farm. Then groups will avoid it so more and more pugs will go. Performance goes down. Eventually ball group dies.
Then they complain they got faction stacked to kill them. Or my personal favorite a DC streamer that loves to xv1, talks crap that, gasp, defenders use a bunch of siege on them.
End result that matters, whether you are 12 or 24 man, your goal is FARMING PUGS which leads to performance tanking. I get you want good fights by being outnumbered, but it kills performance.