My oh my what happened to stamina heals?

AverageJo3Gam3r · December 2019

Coming back after a long break. My oh my what happened to stamina heals? Vigor is only self targeted. Rally has no hot. Most classes lack stamina healing options so these have formed the basis of stamina healing, along with defensive sets like trollking, 7th legion heals, etc

AoE seems strong as ever with permafrost and jabby jabs even with new shuffle to reduce the damage. What are folks doing these days to adapt?

Also, I need to L2P, los, counterburst, strategically CC, etc. Just preempting all those comments

EDIT: fwiw, trying out one of those new fangled stam necros. Orc with BS, spriggan, bone pirate, back bar potentates 2H/bow. Using the ghost and shuffle for passive mitigation.

Iskiab · December 2019

Yea, stamina has changed a lot. Rally spam with the self heal vigor I’ve seen people use to good effect.

I’d try the DW BRP weapons for your back bar too. As a magtemplar it’s damn effective against me, major evasion plus protection to heal through the sweeps before counter attacking. With bloodlust most Templars (like me) will let their mitigation buffs drop trying to take you down.

EtTuBrutus · December 2019

Stamina healing is way better than it was.

NyassaV · December 2019

Stamina healing is better than classes who use healing ward lel

mursie · December 2019

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Coming back after a long break. My oh my what happened to stamina heals? Vigor is only self targeted. Rally has no hot. Most classes lack stamina healing options so these have formed the basis of stamina healing, along with defensive sets like trollking, 7th legion heals, etc

AoE seems strong as ever with permafrost and jabby jabs even with new shuffle to reduce the damage. What are folks doing these days to adapt?

Also, I need to L2P, los, counterburst, strategically CC, etc. Just preempting all those comments

EDIT: fwiw, trying out one of those new fangled stam necros. Orc with BS, spriggan, bone pirate, back bar potentates 2H/bow. Using the ghost and shuffle for passive mitigation.

PVE - specifically PTS PVE. Some PVE all-stars wrote up a thesis that dedicated PVE healing in trials on PTS (few patches back) was completely useless due to stam-necro vigor cross heals. 3 days later - vigor was gutted.

gotta love PVE

Dyride · December 2019

IMO they overbuffed the single target Vigor. Should have just nerfed the AOE component but leave some amount of stamina crosshealing on Resolving Vigor.

Having stamina players completely selfish ruins ad-hoc pugging in pvp and BGs cause everyone just scatters to themselves instead of strength in numbers.

ChunkyCat · December 2019

Dyride wrote: »

Having stamina players completely selfish ruins ad-hoc pugging in pvp and BGs cause everyone just scatters to themselves instead of strength in numbers.

This guy gets it.

Always blame ZoS for a BG loss.

Fur_like_snow · December 2019

Without an easy way to swap between the selfish morph and the group morph only thing Zeni accomplished was adding an extra hurdle to overcome. Just let me change morph from the skill screen without having to add at least another two loading screens just to swap a single skill. It was a bad QoL change what they did to vigor.

BaiterOfZergs · December 2019

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Stamina healing is way better than it was.

Way better is an exaggeration, if you use the selfish vigor morph it’s only a few hundred more hp to make up for the change to rally. Resolving vigor only got increased by 3-5 percent. It really was only a buff for players that don’t slot rally. Still having to choose between a selfish heal and a group heal is a big change. Very noticeable by anyone finding themselves in 2v10s. Magic healing and utility is still superior in comparison to stam.

fred4 · December 2019

Vigor is shorter and stronger. Rally has lost the HOT, but it scales from a higher base value. You get some healing by spamming it and you get to higher heals quicker.

Then there's all the new foods. I stack Steed mundus, gold food and 7th Legion on my DK. With a potion I'm at 2K health regen without Troll King. Cauterize is a good option to run on top. Just an example. I don't play the other stamina classes enough to say what you do with them, but my DK feels insanely tanky and "healy" running Fury, 7th and Blood Spawn.

Ragnarock41 · December 2019

I believe both the HoT and DoT reworks missed the mark by a lot.

Dyride wrote: »

IMO they overbuffed the single target Vigor. Should have just nerfed the AOE component but leave some amount of stamina crosshealing on Resolving Vigor.

Having stamina players completely selfish ruins ad-hoc pugging in pvp and BGs cause everyone just scatters to themselves instead of strength in numbers.

Stamina grouping is completely dead now outside of the DLC classes that actually bring group utility. What does a stamblade-stamsorc-stamDK-stamplar brings over their magicka counterpart? A huge nothing honestly.

As a stamina player I had good uptime on fragmented+vigor combo and it was one of the ways I shined in groups, now its completely gone and I'm sad.

fred4 · December 2019

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

I believe both the HoT and DoT reworks missed the mark by a lot.

Dyride wrote: »

IMO they overbuffed the single target Vigor. Should have just nerfed the AOE component but leave some amount of stamina crosshealing on Resolving Vigor.

Having stamina players completely selfish ruins ad-hoc pugging in pvp and BGs cause everyone just scatters to themselves instead of strength in numbers.

Stamina grouping is completely dead now outside of the DLC classes that actually bring group utility. What does a stamblade-stamsorc-stamDK-stamplar brings over their magicka counterpart? A huge nothing honestly.

As a stamina player I had good uptime on fragmented+vigor combo and it was one of the ways I shined in groups, now its completely gone and I'm sad.

Minor Brutality and a small shield from Fragmented. Healing from Cauterize, if you so choose. That's not nothing. Echoing Vigor is possible as well, although I admit that doesn't look viable to me as a solo / PuG player.

Iskiab · December 2019

BaiterOfZergs wrote: »

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Stamina healing is way better than it was.

Way better is an exaggeration, if you use the selfish vigor morph it’s only a few hundred more hp to make up for the change to rally. Resolving vigor only got increased by 3-5 percent. It really was only a buff for players that don’t slot rally. Still having to choose between a selfish heal and a group heal is a big change. Very noticeable by anyone finding themselves in 2v10s. Magic healing and utility is still superior in comparison to stam.

Yea I agree with this a lot. With the changes it’s created a situation where stam gets weaker the more players there are in pvp.

Solo or BGs it’s not obvious, but Cyrodiil larger scale is basicly dominated by mag right now.

Ragnarock41 · December 2019

fred4 wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

I believe both the HoT and DoT reworks missed the mark by a lot.

Dyride wrote: »

IMO they overbuffed the single target Vigor. Should have just nerfed the AOE component but leave some amount of stamina crosshealing on Resolving Vigor.

Having stamina players completely selfish ruins ad-hoc pugging in pvp and BGs cause everyone just scatters to themselves instead of strength in numbers.

Stamina grouping is completely dead now outside of the DLC classes that actually bring group utility. What does a stamblade-stamsorc-stamDK-stamplar brings over their magicka counterpart? A huge nothing honestly.

As a stamina player I had good uptime on fragmented+vigor combo and it was one of the ways I shined in groups, now its completely gone and I'm sad.

Minor Brutality and a small shield from Fragmented. Healing from Cauterize, if you so choose. That's not nothing. Echoing Vigor is possible as well, although I admit that doesn't look viable to me as a solo / PuG player.

MagDk also provides minor brutality and magicka resto staff healing is MILES ahead of echoing vigor.

Qbiken · December 2019

Echoing Vigor is pretty underwhelming and it´s a shame how much ZOS gutted staminas ability to assist/off-heal allies. For some reason they think cross-healing is some magicka exclusive feature.....

In my opinion ZOS should:

* Reduce the selfheal tooltip by 10% and let Resolving Vigor heal allies again, but for 50% of the self-heal value. Rework Echoing Vigor to get some unique utility function (not sure what though)

ketsparrowhawk · December 2019

mursie wrote: »

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Coming back after a long break. My oh my what happened to stamina heals? Vigor is only self targeted. Rally has no hot. Most classes lack stamina healing options so these have formed the basis of stamina healing, along with defensive sets like trollking, 7th legion heals, etc

AoE seems strong as ever with permafrost and jabby jabs even with new shuffle to reduce the damage. What are folks doing these days to adapt?

Also, I need to L2P, los, counterburst, strategically CC, etc. Just preempting all those comments

EDIT: fwiw, trying out one of those new fangled stam necros. Orc with BS, spriggan, bone pirate, back bar potentates 2H/bow. Using the ghost and shuffle for passive mitigation.

PVE - specifically PTS PVE. Some PVE all-stars wrote up a thesis that dedicated PVE healing in trials on PTS (few patches back) was completely useless due to stam-necro vigor cross heals. 3 days later - vigor was gutted.

gotta love PVE

Yeah PvPers totally weren't complaining at all about 4-man unkillable stamDen squads giving each other 10k HPS by spamming vigor and 4x sub-assaulting everyone to death.

Iskiab · December 2019

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

mursie wrote: »

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Coming back after a long break. My oh my what happened to stamina heals? Vigor is only self targeted. Rally has no hot. Most classes lack stamina healing options so these have formed the basis of stamina healing, along with defensive sets like trollking, 7th legion heals, etc

AoE seems strong as ever with permafrost and jabby jabs even with new shuffle to reduce the damage. What are folks doing these days to adapt?

Also, I need to L2P, los, counterburst, strategically CC, etc. Just preempting all those comments

EDIT: fwiw, trying out one of those new fangled stam necros. Orc with BS, spriggan, bone pirate, back bar potentates 2H/bow. Using the ghost and shuffle for passive mitigation.

PVE - specifically PTS PVE. Some PVE all-stars wrote up a thesis that dedicated PVE healing in trials on PTS (few patches back) was completely useless due to stam-necro vigor cross heals. 3 days later - vigor was gutted.

gotta love PVE

Yeah PvPers totally weren't complaining at all about 4-man unkillable stamDen squads giving each other 10k HPS by spamming vigor and 4x sub-assaulting everyone to death.

I’ve seen a group of stam try the same thing in cyrodiil now. It went as expected, ends up echoing vigor doesn’t have a 3 times limit.

Thing about healing in pvp is burst healing is just as important as burst damage. Vigor while strong wasn’t what made those groups really strong.

Ragnarock41 · December 2019

Iskiab wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

mursie wrote: »

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Coming back after a long break. My oh my what happened to stamina heals? Vigor is only self targeted. Rally has no hot. Most classes lack stamina healing options so these have formed the basis of stamina healing, along with defensive sets like trollking, 7th legion heals, etc

AoE seems strong as ever with permafrost and jabby jabs even with new shuffle to reduce the damage. What are folks doing these days to adapt?

Also, I need to L2P, los, counterburst, strategically CC, etc. Just preempting all those comments

EDIT: fwiw, trying out one of those new fangled stam necros. Orc with BS, spriggan, bone pirate, back bar potentates 2H/bow. Using the ghost and shuffle for passive mitigation.

PVE - specifically PTS PVE. Some PVE all-stars wrote up a thesis that dedicated PVE healing in trials on PTS (few patches back) was completely useless due to stam-necro vigor cross heals. 3 days later - vigor was gutted.

gotta love PVE

Yeah PvPers totally weren't complaining at all about 4-man unkillable stamDen squads giving each other 10k HPS by spamming vigor and 4x sub-assaulting everyone to death.

I’ve seen a group of stam try the same thing in cyrodiil now. It went as expected, ends up echoing vigor doesn’t have a 3 times limit.

Thing about healing in pvp is burst healing is just as important as burst damage. Vigor while strong wasn’t what made those groups really strong.

Really what made stamden groups tanky was their access to class based heals, some of them AoE burst, some of them heal over time of different types, but they all can proc minor toughness and major mending. Vigor stacking itself was really strong when you had a lot of stamDks around because they could control when to have major mending on their vigors.

Either way this change hurt others more than it hurt stamden, which can still heal friendlies. I think echoing vigor needs to be 5 second HoT and work similarly to old vigor where you get two separate values, self heal part and AoE heal for others. I believe a 10 second weak HoT is so pointless that even the amount of healing modifiers a Dk has, doesn't make it worthwhile.

Iskiab · December 2019

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

mursie wrote: »

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Coming back after a long break. My oh my what happened to stamina heals? Vigor is only self targeted. Rally has no hot. Most classes lack stamina healing options so these have formed the basis of stamina healing, along with defensive sets like trollking, 7th legion heals, etc

AoE seems strong as ever with permafrost and jabby jabs even with new shuffle to reduce the damage. What are folks doing these days to adapt?

Also, I need to L2P, los, counterburst, strategically CC, etc. Just preempting all those comments

EDIT: fwiw, trying out one of those new fangled stam necros. Orc with BS, spriggan, bone pirate, back bar potentates 2H/bow. Using the ghost and shuffle for passive mitigation.

PVE - specifically PTS PVE. Some PVE all-stars wrote up a thesis that dedicated PVE healing in trials on PTS (few patches back) was completely useless due to stam-necro vigor cross heals. 3 days later - vigor was gutted.

gotta love PVE

Yeah PvPers totally weren't complaining at all about 4-man unkillable stamDen squads giving each other 10k HPS by spamming vigor and 4x sub-assaulting everyone to death.

I’ve seen a group of stam try the same thing in cyrodiil now. It went as expected, ends up echoing vigor doesn’t have a 3 times limit.

Thing about healing in pvp is burst healing is just as important as burst damage. Vigor while strong wasn’t what made those groups really strong.

Really what made stamden groups tanky was their access to class based heals, some of them AoE burst, some of them heal over time of different types, but they all can proc minor toughness and major mending. Vigor stacking itself was really strong when you had a lot of stamDks around because they could control when to have major mending on their vigors.

Either way this change hurt others more than it hurt stamden, which can still heal friendlies. I think echoing vigor needs to be 5 second HoT and work similarly to old vigor where you get two separate values, self heal part and AoE heal for others. I believe a 10 second weak HoT is so pointless that even the amount of healing modifiers a Dk has, doesn't make it worthwhile.

Yea I agree. I just meant there were no groups of Stamblades running around stacking vigor right?

As much as solo and small scalers hate that heals stack, it’s sort of required for balance. Damage stacks from multiple sources, if stamina can’t support each other it’s too much of a downside to playing stamina in group play.

Taking away the accessible group support skill from stamina only hurt classes with already limited group support like stamblade. There have been calls to nerf healing (or resto staff) which will likely have the same effect; it won’t hurt classes like Magplars and MagWarden but will hurt classes without a healing toolkit.

Keeping vigor and rapid regen strong would be a good way to equalize pvp across the board. Class homogenization aside, some things like being able to recover from burst is too important in pvp to be class specific.

Ragnarock41 · December 2019

Iskiab wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

mursie wrote: »

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Coming back after a long break. My oh my what happened to stamina heals? Vigor is only self targeted. Rally has no hot. Most classes lack stamina healing options so these have formed the basis of stamina healing, along with defensive sets like trollking, 7th legion heals, etc

AoE seems strong as ever with permafrost and jabby jabs even with new shuffle to reduce the damage. What are folks doing these days to adapt?

Also, I need to L2P, los, counterburst, strategically CC, etc. Just preempting all those comments

EDIT: fwiw, trying out one of those new fangled stam necros. Orc with BS, spriggan, bone pirate, back bar potentates 2H/bow. Using the ghost and shuffle for passive mitigation.

PVE - specifically PTS PVE. Some PVE all-stars wrote up a thesis that dedicated PVE healing in trials on PTS (few patches back) was completely useless due to stam-necro vigor cross heals. 3 days later - vigor was gutted.

gotta love PVE

Yeah PvPers totally weren't complaining at all about 4-man unkillable stamDen squads giving each other 10k HPS by spamming vigor and 4x sub-assaulting everyone to death.

I’ve seen a group of stam try the same thing in cyrodiil now. It went as expected, ends up echoing vigor doesn’t have a 3 times limit.

Thing about healing in pvp is burst healing is just as important as burst damage. Vigor while strong wasn’t what made those groups really strong.

Really what made stamden groups tanky was their access to class based heals, some of them AoE burst, some of them heal over time of different types, but they all can proc minor toughness and major mending. Vigor stacking itself was really strong when you had a lot of stamDks around because they could control when to have major mending on their vigors.

Either way this change hurt others more than it hurt stamden, which can still heal friendlies. I think echoing vigor needs to be 5 second HoT and work similarly to old vigor where you get two separate values, self heal part and AoE heal for others. I believe a 10 second weak HoT is so pointless that even the amount of healing modifiers a Dk has, doesn't make it worthwhile.

Yea I agree. I just meant there were no groups of Stamblades running around stacking vigor right?

As much as solo and small scalers hate that heals stack, it’s sort of required for balance. Damage stacks from multiple sources, if stamina can’t support each other it’s too much of a downside to playing stamina in group play.

Taking away the accessible group support skill from stamina only hurt classes with already limited group support like stamblade. There have been calls to nerf healing (or resto staff) which will likely have the same effect; it won’t hurt classes like Magplars and MagWarden but will hurt classes without a healing toolkit.

Keeping vigor and rapid regen strong would be a good way to equalize pvp across the board. Class homogenization aside, some things like being able to recover from burst is too important in pvp to be class specific.

I mean the key issue here is that they took hot stacking from stamina but gave it to magicka, there is a lack of consistency here.

They keep giving classes mechanics to include them in PvE raids however for some reason they were completely okay with killing majority of stamina classes in PvP groups.

Solo or Bg players may not realize how big of a difference it makes but when you face a fully optimized magicka group the winner is very clear. And saddest part is this applies to all 4 base stamina classes, they are ALL outperformed by magicka counterparts and it is sad that these classes offer almost nothing unique to the table in PvP.

Its especially stamblade and stamDK in my opinion are the literal worst classes you can have in a coordinated group(The bigger the fight is, the worse these classes get and it really limits the things you can do with them.), they bring literally nothing useful to the table while stamsorc and stamplar bring very ,very little.

Iskiab · December 2019

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

mursie wrote: »

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Coming back after a long break. My oh my what happened to stamina heals? Vigor is only self targeted. Rally has no hot. Most classes lack stamina healing options so these have formed the basis of stamina healing, along with defensive sets like trollking, 7th legion heals, etc

AoE seems strong as ever with permafrost and jabby jabs even with new shuffle to reduce the damage. What are folks doing these days to adapt?

Also, I need to L2P, los, counterburst, strategically CC, etc. Just preempting all those comments

EDIT: fwiw, trying out one of those new fangled stam necros. Orc with BS, spriggan, bone pirate, back bar potentates 2H/bow. Using the ghost and shuffle for passive mitigation.

PVE - specifically PTS PVE. Some PVE all-stars wrote up a thesis that dedicated PVE healing in trials on PTS (few patches back) was completely useless due to stam-necro vigor cross heals. 3 days later - vigor was gutted.

gotta love PVE

Yeah PvPers totally weren't complaining at all about 4-man unkillable stamDen squads giving each other 10k HPS by spamming vigor and 4x sub-assaulting everyone to death.

I’ve seen a group of stam try the same thing in cyrodiil now. It went as expected, ends up echoing vigor doesn’t have a 3 times limit.

Thing about healing in pvp is burst healing is just as important as burst damage. Vigor while strong wasn’t what made those groups really strong.

Really what made stamden groups tanky was their access to class based heals, some of them AoE burst, some of them heal over time of different types, but they all can proc minor toughness and major mending. Vigor stacking itself was really strong when you had a lot of stamDks around because they could control when to have major mending on their vigors.

Either way this change hurt others more than it hurt stamden, which can still heal friendlies. I think echoing vigor needs to be 5 second HoT and work similarly to old vigor where you get two separate values, self heal part and AoE heal for others. I believe a 10 second weak HoT is so pointless that even the amount of healing modifiers a Dk has, doesn't make it worthwhile.

Yea I agree. I just meant there were no groups of Stamblades running around stacking vigor right?

As much as solo and small scalers hate that heals stack, it’s sort of required for balance. Damage stacks from multiple sources, if stamina can’t support each other it’s too much of a downside to playing stamina in group play.

Taking away the accessible group support skill from stamina only hurt classes with already limited group support like stamblade. There have been calls to nerf healing (or resto staff) which will likely have the same effect; it won’t hurt classes like Magplars and MagWarden but will hurt classes without a healing toolkit.

Keeping vigor and rapid regen strong would be a good way to equalize pvp across the board. Class homogenization aside, some things like being able to recover from burst is too important in pvp to be class specific.

I mean the key issue here is that they took hot stacking from stamina but gave it to magicka, there is a lack of consistency here.

They keep giving classes mechanics to include them in PvE raids however for some reason they were completely okay with killing majority of stamina classes in PvP groups.

Solo or Bg players may not realize how big of a difference it makes but when you face a fully optimized magicka group the winner is very clear. And saddest part is this applies to all 4 base stamina classes, they are ALL outperformed by magicka counterparts and it is sad that these classes offer almost nothing unique to the table in PvP.

I wouldn’t say stam are underpowered in BGs. Moreso like... Stam perform best with a couple of mag in the group for cross healing. It’s like any selfish build (not meaning the player but how they end up spec’d), they perform well but without support they’re too weak. Similar to trying to run a dungeon with everyone in solo builds - each individually strong, but weak as a group.

EtTuBrutus · December 2019

BaiterOfZergs wrote: »

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Stamina healing is way better than it was.

Way better is an exaggeration, if you use the selfish vigor morph it’s only a few hundred more hp to make up for the change to rally. Resolving vigor only got increased by 3-5 percent. It really was only a buff for players that don’t slot rally. Still having to choose between a selfish heal and a group heal is a big change. Very noticeable by anyone finding themselves in 2v10s. Magic healing and utility is still superior in comparison to stam.

I fail to see how anyone's healing is not diminished when outnumbered. Vigors increase its only a small increase if you look at tooltips only. It came with the loss of a tick, making each tick stronger, meaning keeping it up is a significant buff. If got friends with 6 to 7k vigor crits. Combine with block and roll and you don't even need rally generally. But, you have rally, which can completely reset the fight and can also be spammed back to back for another 7k crit heal every second.

Idk, my friends and i are really having fun on stam atm. We miss being able to cross vigor, as 3vx it was incredibly strong when used in conjunction, but we all play solo a good bit and it's been very helpful having great self heals.

BaiterOfZergs · December 2019

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

BaiterOfZergs wrote: »

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Stamina healing is way better than it was.

Way better is an exaggeration, if you use the selfish vigor morph it’s only a few hundred more hp to make up for the change to rally. Resolving vigor only got increased by 3-5 percent. It really was only a buff for players that don’t slot rally. Still having to choose between a selfish heal and a group heal is a big change. Very noticeable by anyone finding themselves in 2v10s. Magic healing and utility is still superior in comparison to stam.

I fail to see how anyone's healing is not diminished when outnumbered. Vigors increase its only a small increase if you look at tooltips only. It came with the loss of a tick, making each tick stronger, meaning keeping it up is a significant buff. If got friends with 6 to 7k vigor crits. Combine with block and roll and you don't even need rally generally. But, you have rally, which can completely reset the fight and can also be spammed back to back for another 7k crit heal every second.

Idk, my friends and i are really having fun on stam atm. We miss being able to cross vigor, as 3vx it was incredibly strong when used in conjunction, but we all play solo a good bit and it's been very helpful having great self heals.

Ok

Anyron · January 2020

BaiterOfZergs wrote: »

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Stamina healing is way better than it was.

Way better is an exaggeration, if you use the selfish vigor morph it’s only a few hundred more hp to make up for the change to rally. Resolving vigor only got increased by 3-5 percent. It really was only a buff for players that don’t slot rally. Still having to choose between a selfish heal and a group heal is a big change. Very noticeable by anyone finding themselves in 2v10s. Magic healing and utility is still superior in comparison to stam.

While damage and mobility is better on stam. I could say utility too , since CC break, block and roll is utility too

BaiterOfZergs · January 2020

Anyron wrote: »

BaiterOfZergs wrote: »

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Stamina healing is way better than it was.

Way better is an exaggeration, if you use the selfish vigor morph it’s only a few hundred more hp to make up for the change to rally. Resolving vigor only got increased by 3-5 percent. It really was only a buff for players that don’t slot rally. Still having to choose between a selfish heal and a group heal is a big change. Very noticeable by anyone finding themselves in 2v10s. Magic healing and utility is still superior in comparison to stam.

While damage and mobility is better on stam. I could say utility too , since CC break, block and roll is utility too

With summerset and the recent change to sprint, magic isn’t too far behind for mobility, the large stam pull is the only thing keeping stam ahead.

As for utility, those mechanics are tied to about everything a stam player does. The more you do each of those the more you hit your main resource pool. You run empty on stam and it’s pretty much death but if you run empty on stam for magic it sets you up to die.