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Should (Normal) Trials be added to the dungeon finder?

  • MartiniDaniels
    MartiniDaniels
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    No (please give reason)
    Group finder barely manages 4-man groups, how it will manage 12-man groups?
  • azjuwelz
    azjuwelz
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    No (please give reason)
    Anyone who voted yes has apparently never read a thread on here complaining about pugging dungeons.

    Trials require coordination and knowledge of game roles. (I also think DLC dungeons should have their own finder or be removed from the current group finder.)

    Also, really? You want to put more stress on the game tool that has repeatedly been causing crashes, lag, and near unplayability?? Really????????
    Xbox-NA
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  • Asardes
    Asardes
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    Yes this is definitely needed
    It's all fun and game til you get put into surprise pug HoF.

    Yes, in that trial it's actually easy to wipe at every boss, if group DPS is low and people ignore mechanics. The worse is when you tell them what to do and they keep doing what they want. Ex. you tell them not to attack the boss when he's crouching in the middle, and they do exactly that 3 times or more in a row, die then yell in chat to res them. Probably the same kind of player who comes and whines here on the forum that the big bad elitist hurt his feelings.
    Edited by Asardes on November 27, 2019 4:20PM
    Beta tester since February 2014, played ESO-TU October 2015 - August 2022, currently on an extended break
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  • Shanehere
    Shanehere
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    No (please give reason)
    People are already queueing as off-roles in vet DLC dungeons, making it impossible to clear.

    Normal Trials definitely aren't hard but their mechanics still require tanks to be tanks.
    Edited by Shanehere on November 27, 2019 4:22PM
  • AlnilamE
    AlnilamE
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    Yes this is definitely needed
    No.

    One of the major reasons that trials can be more challenging content is that ZOS doesn't have to balance for 12 random players thrown together with no communication beforehand beyond picking a role in groupfinder.
    No. Again.

    A 4 player dungeon pug with no communication can go berserk, imagine a group of 12...


    PS - There's several threads about this, I don't see the point of creating another one...

    I PUGged trials almost daily during the Witches' Festival and it worked out really well. I even talked guildies who don't like grouping with randoms to come with me for the skulls and they had a good time.

    The only thing would be that the group finder would have to have a pre-set group role pattern, and that might not be the same for each trial. The Craglorn trials require one tank, some of the others (like Sunspire) require 2. So that could become tricky.
    The Moot Councillor
  • Jeremy
    Jeremy
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    Yes this is definitely needed
    NaomiHutt wrote: »

    Yes.

    To those who oppose this - I can guarantee you most of them (probably all) have trial groups they run them with. Because there is little difference in grabbing strangers through zone chat to run a trial with and then having random players matched up automatically through the activity finder.

    Also: a lot of the normal trials aren't even that hard. Many of the Vet DLC dungeons (which are already available through the activity finder) are far more difficult. So the argument they are too challenging to be allowed onto the activity finder doesn't really make any sense. At least not to me.
    Edited by Jeremy on November 27, 2019 5:36PM
  • Nairinhe
    Nairinhe
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    Yes this is definitely needed
    It's all fun and game til you get put into surprise pug HoF.

    I've been in a HoF pug. We had only one tank, but managed to clear and had ton of fun, actually
  • valeriiya
    valeriiya
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    Yes this is definitely needed
    I wouldn't use it but if people want to torture themselves, let them
  • nickl413
    nickl413
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    Yes this is definitely needed
    Don't know why anyone would be opposed to this being an option for other players. If you don;t think a normal trial is doable with a pug group then just dont use it. Vet DLC dungeons are harder than normal trials, would you vote to remove that option as well?
  • KappaKid83
    KappaKid83
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    No (please give reason)
    I voted no based on the fact that the current one can't handle the original functions it was designed to do at 100% functionality. That being said, if the Activity Finder was working at 100% I would say yes to add them.
  • gronoxvx
    gronoxvx
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    No (please give reason)
    People complain enough about fake tanks/healers enough as it is.
  • ArchMikem
    ArchMikem
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    Yes this is definitely needed
    I always PuG my Trials (no Guilds), I've even PuGed Vet Trials with success, so getting a random group through the Finder for Normals should be no problem. They'd definitely need qualifying restrictions in place to queue though. A certain number of Champion Points at least if not more requirements.

    Trials already take forever. You don't want to spend 5 hours in nHRC because several of your DD's hit like potatoes.
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  • Kelces
    Kelces
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    No (please give reason)
    I have seen problems in other MMO games before with this type of system, which is not the developers fault just to be clear. Unfortunately people arriving there become lazy, even the "best" players tend to do so after some time getting accustomed to it.

    It becomes a problem when it is considered a "grind", just like you see with 4 player dungeons a lot today. Would you say, that would be really exciting in a trial? Organizing a group allows for more familiarity and communication too, which is totally lacking aswell elsewhere. You won't get far most of the time in trials, if people are not responsive enough.
    You reveal yourself best in how you play.

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  • Frostystuff
    Frostystuff
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    No (please give reason)
    I would like to say yes, but the system barely works as it is.
  • kaisernick
    kaisernick
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    No (please give reason)
    simply becaue at the time of me replying there is another thread on dungon finder being broken.

    Once it works and works well, id consider it a good idea but as of right now, NO.
  • DraconicFalcon
    No (please give reason)
    I would say no. The thing about trials is that it involves 12 people instead of 4. And the Tank-DPS-Healer numbers will vary differently depending on the trial. I'd imagine usually only 1 tank is needed for most trials but for vets it can vary. In addition to that, trials need more organising and coordination with roles and what sets each individual wears. We definitely do not want a case where 2 tanks are running Ebon and they don't have any other set to change out into. Lastly, there will always be those groups of people that are incapable of pulling their own weight and expect to be carried hoping no one will notice.
  • BeamsForDemacia
    BeamsForDemacia
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    Yes this is definitely needed
    well the Argument with the sets and low dps doesnt really Count, because in a normal craglorn pug u a) are happy About any tank no matter what sets b) unless u dont have more than 30% dps its ok
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  • idk
    idk
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    No (please give reason)
    Granted, I would find it very entertaining to read complaints blaming everyone else in the group for their failure to clear some of the newer trials on normal. Even more so because the person writing it is probably even more inept than those they are complaining about.

    It is not hard to form a group. I suggest trying that as I expect, hope, Zos is smart enough to not add normal trials to the GF because they are aware of the train wrecks that will occur from most groups that would use the GF to find a trial group. Pretty much a no brainer. All one has to do is read the thread about GF complaints to come up with the same conclusion. It is the same people who would use it for trials.

    Besides that I could care less as it is easy to get into a raid group. I just think it would be bad for the game.
  • Zer0_CooL
    Zer0_CooL
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    Should the dungeon finder work propperly before adding 12 player groups?
  • Kalik_Gold
    Kalik_Gold
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    No (please give reason)
    Nah
    Main Character:
    Ras Kalik a Redguard Templar, the Vestige

    PvP Pure-class:
    Goliath of Hammerfell a Redguard Dragonknight
    Jux Blackheart a Redguard Nightblade
    Aurik Siet'ka a Redguard Necromancer
    Cacique the Sage of Ius a Redguard Warden
    Kaotik Von Dae'mon a Redguard* Sorcerer

    PvP: Subclassed or Specialty
    Movárth Piquine a Nord Vampiric Necromancer (Tank)
    Voa a Priest of Sep a Redguard* Necromancer (Healer)
    Tsar af-Bomba a Redguard Vampiric Nightblade (Bomber)
    Two-Big-Horns an Argonian Arcanist /Sorcerer
    Uri Ice-Heart the Twin a Nord Vampiric Warden (Ice-Theme)

    PvE:
    Cinan Tharn an Imperial Dragonknight (Tank)
    Herzog Zwei the Genesis an Akavari* Templar (Healer)
    Bates Vesuius of Dawnstar an Redguard** Dragonknight (Raid Damage) --- Name change needed

    PvE: Specialty
    Tyrus Septim an Imperial Sorcerer (Dungeon Damage)
    Tav'i at-Shinji a Redguard** Warden (Arenas)
    Lucky Hunch the Gambler - a Redguard Nightblade (Thief)

    Leveling...
    Styx of Akatosh a Goblin*** Arcanist --- Race change needed
    Zenovia at-Tura a Redguard** Lycan Sorcerer
    Yesi af-Kalik a Redguard Templar
    ======
    Passives of another race used:
    *Breton
    **Imperial
    ***Argonian




    __________________________Backstories:_________________________

    Ras Kalik the Vestige, a renown Redguard warrior; He has been blessed to save Tamriel from Molag Bal’s destructive Planemeld while reuniting the Five Companions. His further accomplishments after defeating Molag Bal, has been to stop the destruction of Morrowind, the Clockwork City, return order to the isle of Summerset and create a new king in Wrothgar and a queen in Elsywer. These events have made him a living legend and continue to lead him into new adventures throughout Tamriel, as well as into the hearts of many ladies including the Elf Queen, Aryenn. Over many years of adventurous travels, Ras Kalik had become a loner, until he re-visited his homeland of Alik'r.

    Alik'r and it's cities were overrun by the undead Ra-Netu and therefore he made an allegiance with Alik'r's own Ash'abah tribe. These Ash'abah with his help, cleansed the city of Sentinel in Alik'r desert and it's surrounding areas of the undead brought to life by the Withered Hand. After rescuing Sentinel from the undead zombies, King Fahara’jad’s personal bodyguard the Goliath of Hammerfell, who was given this name by Imperials in the region; was asked to assist the tribe after learning of the defeat of the Withered Hand to the Ash'abah. Kalik promised Goliath he would task him with fighting living enemies on the battlefield if he so desired. Goliath being a Yokudan warrior wields a massive sword in respect to the Ansei, a gift given by the Imperial, Cinan Tharn. Not many soldiers are able to wield double two handed weapons, but Goliath loves to get up and personal in a fight, so he also carries a giant maul, both weapons laced with magical flames.

    Jux Blackheart is a master thief that masquerades as a Bard at the Sisters of the Sands inn, with his younger sidekick Lucky Hunch for pilfering and gambling during this time. Jux was known to infiltrate any towns bank vault he came across and even delved into Ayelid ruins without detection. Kalik can vividly recall the night he met the famed thief. Jux found himself rummaging thru a slightly inebriated Kalik’s pocket for too long, on a full-mooned night and because of his greed and the glimmer of his golden armor in the moonlight. He lost his left pinky fingertip as a lesson! But in return, he gained a new friend, as it was his first time since a child being caught red-handed...

    Upon arrival back in the Alik'r after many moons of adventuring, Ras Kalik ventures to Bergama. Visiting The Winking Jackal, he runs into Jux Blackheart, who introduces him to the coin game Crowns vs Forebearers (Heads vs Tails) and Golden Dwemer (RBG).... Jux constantly takes gold from the unfortunate thru theft or gambling, his biggest gambling victim is actually his partner in crime known as Lucky Hunch the Gambler. Lucky doesn't mind losing any gold coins to Jux... as Jux saved him from Altmer slavers in Summerset, by stealing a key and sending him on a boat to the mainland years prior. Lucky spent years in slavery with Khajiits in Summerset and picked up the art of subterfuge, using illusion magic disguises and stealing there.

    Kaotik Von’Daemon an outcast, and a half-caste between a Breton mother and a Redguard father. Kaotik become a pariah due to his conjuration of Daedra pets. He was taught healing magic during his childhood years by his Breton mother. His father due to Redguard customs exiled him from the desert, sending him by wagon caravan to be a soldier in the war in Cyrodiil. He happened to meet Kalik while traveling from Alik'r, during this long caravan ride the caravan he was in was ambushed in Bangkorai by a group of bandits. Kalik by chance was also traveling thru this area on his Auridon Warhorse (which was bestowed to him by his friend, Darien Gautier). During this ambush, Kalik was able to rescue five hostages from the bandits. Kaotik was the first rescued, and Ras Kalik also recruited him to be in the Ash'abah tribe. These core Ash'abah tribesmen may never be seen together in travel as they partake in their own adventures but they always know what each other is doing; as they frequent a hideout in northern Bankorai. Their hideout an old Orc castle ruin, is kept watch by Nuzhimeh and she passes messages written between them, and frequently they also enjoy her company and her bed.

    The other men rescued were a Dunmer banker, an Imperial mercenary and two other soldiers, an Imperial and a Breton Knight, stating proudly he was an Akavir descendent. One of the Imperials, Cinan, claimed to be related to Abnur Tharn the Battlemage of the Imperial Elder Council (One of Ras Kalik's mentors in the Five Companions). Cinan Tharn was really Abnur's drunkard treasure hunting illegitimate son. He was caught smuggling artifacts out of the Ayleid ruins in Cyrodiil and the elder of the two Imperials was Tyrus Septim a retired Imperial navy battle-mage (now a Lycan mercenary living in the city of Rimmen) and guard to the Tharn family. As much as Abnur Tharn hated his half-sister Euraxia, he dislikes his bas†ard son Cinan more. Tyrus now a ruffian and privateer had been paid by Abnur Tharn to watch over Cinan as much as possible. Cinan Tharn a drunkard, loves to drink at least a quarter barrel of Nord mead before he raids various delves and dungeons for relics to sell on the black market. Cinan also plans to one day, run an illegal gambling ring... which he thinks will net him more gold for his wares.

    The Dunmer captive shackled to the Imperials looked familiar to Kalik from his time in Morrowind.... and he recognized him as Tythis Andromo a House Telvanni slave-owner and banker from Vvardenfell. During a rough interrogation to Tythis, Ras Kalik learnt why the bandits accosted him. The racist Dunmer was providing slaves as soldiers for the Three Banner War. The bandits were trying to negotiate a lucrative ransom for Andromo and the Imperials.... Kalik did not need any of this gold and he could never set Tythis free as he did with the two Imperial soldiers. His past involvement with slavery and war crimes, made Kalik's blood boil. He chose not to execute Tythis, as he figured the worse punishment for this former rich and opulent slave owner, is to now be an imprisoned servant for Ras Kalik and the tribe.

    Herzog Zwei the Genesis a reknown Imperial/Akavirri battle-mage. His roots going back to Akavir through his mother’s bloodline. (His mother is descended from the Akaviri, through Versidue-Shae, and his Imperial father met her in Hakoshae, while traveling) Herzog earned the nickname "the Genesis" from his father as a child, as he was his mother's first born child, and last, as she tragically died in child-birth.

    Herzog was seeking to purchase an artifact from Cinan Tharn, before their capture and was meeting Tyrus while in Rimmen, who introduced him to Cinan. This artifact being the Ayelid artifact; the sword Sinweaver. After their rescue and the exchange of gold to Cinan for the sword he decided to slip away before Ras Kalik could question who he was, and why the Akavir descendant really wanted that sword. Herzog was headed to Nagastani — An Ayleid ruin in eastern Cyrodiil. He had read in scrolls that the Sword would give him magical powers to meet his mothers spirit, if he performed an Ayleid ritual at an old shrine hidden there. Equipped with the artifact sword, he was off to start his own adventure but Ras Kalik, did indeed notice the sword however and instead sent a letter to Jux Blackheart (whom also was interested in Ayleid treasures), to attempt to find Herzog and acquire the sword. (*Azani Blackheart in Elder Scroll's Oblivion is Jux's descendant some 747 years later)

    And so the Redguard, Imperial and Akaviri men parted ways ... While Ras Kalik went off to Elsweyr to encounter the latest threat to Tamriel, with Abnur Tharn and Sai Sahan - - DRAGONS!! Little did Ras Kalik know a few people were awaiting him in Senchal besides Sai. A necromancer survived his attack on the Withered Hand, while in Alik'r. The necromancer known as Auriek Siet'ka is also following him to the land of the Khajiits and Cacique the Sage of Ius a Shaman mystic who has become attuned spiritually with Tu'whacca (a Redguard God) and Ius (the Animal God), after being burned severely by the escaped dragons in Elsywer, is awaiting his arrival also. Aurik is a soldier of the Daggerfall Covenant that was introduced to necromancy while in the military, even though this magicka art is not spoken of openly by most of the Military leaders. He came to Alik'r and worked with the Withered Hand before Ras Kalik intervened on their plans. After the defeat of the Withered Hand, he aligned with the Worm Cult, and is constantly adapting and perfecting his necromantic arts.

    After his journey to Rimmen, Kalik heads south to Senchal, in the southern regions of Elyswer. This new adventure will also put him on a path to meet a strange Redguard man. The stranger which was infected with an untreated Peyrite disease and also was the exiled from the Order of the New Moon cult, due to his sickness. He originally joined the cult to worship Laatvulon, the green dragon, mistakenly thinking it was the Daedric prince Peyrite. This confused and suffering cultist is known as Tsar al-Bomba and he is on a path to spread the disease. He was originally infected in Orccrest while recruiting members there. Can Ras Kalik and the shaman Cacique cure this poor soul, only time will tell. Little does Tsar al-Bomba know, that his infection is tied to Vampirism, and eventually the desire for blood will take over his mind. Senchal also offers Kalik his latest love interest... Aeliah. Whom he fondly led thru battles with the Dragonguard.

    After the trek thru the heat, tropical and desert climate of Northern and Southern Elyswer, Ras Kalik heads north to the cold mountain range of Skyrim. His companion friend Lyris beckons for him with a letter sent by crow...

    Movárth Piquine - a former vampire hunter (now infected), within the Fighter's Guild (and a secretive necromancer) was in Skyrim working with the Morthaal Guard. On a patrol mission he was caught in Frewien's ice curse outside of Morthaal with the frozen undead. Movárth's vampiric infection kept him from becoming an undead minion to the curse. He was able to use necromantic ice-magic to encase himself safely until he was freed with Freiwen, when the Vestige Ras Kalik broke the curse.

    Uri Ice-Heart - brother of Urfon Ice-Heart. The twin sons of Atli and Oljourn Ice-Heart. The Ice-Heart family are originally from Markarth but now reside on the Jerall Mountain range near Cyrodiil, with their younger sister Araki. The twins had joined the Winterborn Reachmen while living in Markarth. Urfon pushed west to Orsinium with the Winterborn Clan, leaving his family behind. Uri stayed behind with his parents and sister to live in the family cabin for safety, avoiding the Vampire plague infiltrating the Reach. After news reaches him and he hears of Urfon's death... Uri leaves and heads home and is seeking vengeance. Meanwhile, his sister has also moved on to Windhelm to join the Fighter's guild. He will visit his sister, once before going to seek vengeance and she will craft him armor mixed with ice, called Stalhrim armor. Uri fearing death, after his brother's passing, falls victim to the convincing talk of Movárth at a Nordic tavern, and will also becomes a vampire.

    {time moves forward through the hour-glass}
    PS5/NA - Ras Kalik a Redguard Templar - Daggerfall Covenant
  • Tommy_The_Gun
    Tommy_The_Gun
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    Yes this is definitely needed
    (I will just assume that group finder works fine).

    Yes, imho there is no reason why normal trials are not supported by group finder (maybe other than technical issues, but like I have said, I am going to ignore that).

    DLC Dungeons are supported by group finder and those are (arguably) very difficult, and ptobably more difficult than some older trials. Especially if you consider the fact that group finder supports them on veteran dificulty mode too.

    So basically, I just dont see any drawback of adding trial support for group finder. More people would do this content, more people will learn the mechanics, more people will have better knowledge of how the game works and also gear-power difference will go down slighly as more people will have trial gear.
    Personally, I would like to add arena support too, as this would be much easier to do, since it is also 4-man content.
    Edited by Tommy_The_Gun on December 2, 2019 7:52AM
  • huntgod_ESO
    huntgod_ESO
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    Yes this is definitely needed
    I'd be fine with this...I'd never use it, but sure what the hell.

    They need to have some more granularity to the selection.

    Select :

    Random Normal Dungeons (excluding DLC)
    Random Normal Dungeons (only DLC or including DLC)
    Random Veteran Dungeons (excluding DLC)
    Random Veteranl Dungeons (only DLC or including DLC)
    Specific Normal Trials

    I'd also love the ability to "Take any 4" so it just grabs four people who have that selected, I don't care if it's 4DPS on a normal non DLC dungeon.
    --- HuntGod ---
    Officer of the Unrepentant
    www.unrepentantgaming.com
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