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Wings
regime211
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Is ASS! You literally gave dragonknight no defense for projectiles ONCE AGAIN that reduction does nothing when a 100 man zerg is on you..smh..straight garbage change.
6
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MercilessnVexed✭✭✭✭Last I checked, you probably shouldn't be alone in a 100 man zerg situation...28 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Hmmmm... No... Or yes.
Seriously?
Last I checked everyone can roll dodge. Also even old wings wouldn't give you protection against 100 man zerg, even vs 10 man zergs as it absorbed only 4 projectiles so it would be destroyed in less than half GCD. New wings actually will give you more protection against 8+ man groups and the more attackers the better they are, not even taking into consideration smart attackers that used LA to disable your wings before stronger blows.
In the end it's not about 1v100 situations but probably you're mad because you got killed by some single sniper
I'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.11 -
Ragnarock41✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Its a great skill if you're not a Dk. Since the ability was reworked for non-DK players in mind, I find it to be a major success.0 -
Glurin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭So.....you're mad because wings don't help one person v.s. 100?
Why should it?
"He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you..."6 -
Qagh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It was my best weapon against sorcs (not zergs).CP 2900+ PC/EU
Ich habe so viele Khajiit, dass ich eine ganze Kolonie gründen könnte.0 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.4 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.I'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.3 -
Curious_Death✭✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
FEEL THE SORC'S PAIN UNKILLABLE DK
(sarcasm)1 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.
Wings are great against magsorcs and ranged specs. But cloak, cleanse and ward are great against anybody. That's the difference. If I were in ZOS, I'll add minor evasion and minor expedition to them (for 6 seconds).1 -
BNOC✭✭✭✭✭It all started years ago with a nerf to Ritual that stopped you cleansing projectiles before they hit you (that's cleansing, not firing back) , wings followed with a rightful nerf, though they kept some damage return on one morph, then came Crystallized Slab that I don't think was touched at all (though I don't know).
If anything, Dragon Fire Scale and Crystallized Slab need their damage component removed - Unbelievably noob friendly skills, not as much as wings was in the past, but still more than enough.
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox EU - 15/11/16
578,000 - 36 Minutes 58 Seconds (Top 2 World?)
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox NA
569,000 - 40 minutes (350CP, Non optimised runs)0 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.
Wings are great against magsorcs and ranged specs. But cloak, cleanse and ward are great against anybody. That's the difference. If I were in ZOS, I'll add minor evasion and minor expedition to them (for 6 seconds).
Parts of the DK crowd never ceases to amaze me. In another thread someone wanted Stone Fist to be an instant, ranged Dizzy-level Damage and now this. Talk about overloaded abilities. And I wonder why the Devs come up with some of their changes, e.g. how they wanted to overbuff Ball of Lightning.
But let's follow your suggestion for a second. Give DK 50% projectile mitigation, snare/root immunity, minor evasion and minor expedition for 6s. What would you do to balance this? Raise the cost by 50% and shut out Stam DKs from using it? What would you do in terms of Stam Sorcs "unique" feat, minor expedition?
Don't take this as an insult, I honestly want to know how you would handle this as I doubt you would simply add these two buffs without any kind of adjustment.3 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.
Wings are great against magsorcs and ranged specs. But cloak, cleanse and ward are great against anybody. That's the difference. If I were in ZOS, I'll add minor evasion and minor expedition to them (for 6 seconds).
Parts of the DK crowd never ceases to amaze me. In another thread someone wanted Stone Fist to be an instant, ranged Dizzy-level Damage and now this. Talk about overloaded abilities. And I wonder why the Devs come up with some of their changes, e.g. how they wanted to overbuff Ball of Lightning.
But let's follow your suggestion for a second. Give DK 50% projectile mitigation, snare/root immunity, minor evasion and minor expedition for 6s. What would you do to balance this? Raise the cost by 50% and shut out Stam DKs from using it? What would you do in terms of Stam Sorcs "unique" feat, minor expedition?
Don't take this as an insult, I honestly want to know how you would handle this as I doubt you would simply add these two buffs without any kind of adjustment.
Ball of Lightning already provides better protection then wings and have built-in gap closer/escape. BoL gives 3 seconds of projectile immunity. While wings give 6 seconds of 50% damage reduction, which means that debuffs attached to projectiles are applied to DK and not applied to sorc. And if that was not enough BoL is best kite/disengage tool in the game and gap closer as well.
Any talk about current wings being "balanced" means that BoL is hugely imbalanced. Ok, attach 15 m jump to wings, and add escalating cost. I agree, 100%, anytime.3 -
Curious_Death✭✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.
Wings are great against magsorcs and ranged specs. But cloak, cleanse and ward are great against anybody. That's the difference. If I were in ZOS, I'll add minor evasion and minor expedition to them (for 6 seconds).
Parts of the DK crowd never ceases to amaze me. In another thread someone wanted Stone Fist to be an instant, ranged Dizzy-level Damage and now this. Talk about overloaded abilities. And I wonder why the Devs come up with some of their changes, e.g. how they wanted to overbuff Ball of Lightning.
But let's follow your suggestion for a second. Give DK 50% projectile mitigation, snare/root immunity, minor evasion and minor expedition for 6s. What would you do to balance this? Raise the cost by 50% and shut out Stam DKs from using it? What would you do in terms of Stam Sorcs "unique" feat, minor expedition?
Don't take this as an insult, I honestly want to know how you would handle this as I doubt you would simply add these two buffs without any kind of adjustment.
Ball of Lightning already provides better protection then wings and have built-in gap closer/escape. BoL gives 3 seconds of projectile immunity. While wings give 6 seconds of 50% damage reduction, which means that debuffs attached to projectiles are applied to DK and not applied to sorc. And if that was not enough BoL is best kite/disengage tool in the game and gap closer as well.
Any talk about current wings being "balanced" means that BoL is hugely imbalanced. Ok, attach 15 m jump to wings, and add escalating cost. I agree, 100%, anytime.
AND BOL FOLLOWS U LIKE WINGS DO?
L2P issue
BTW (6 sec of BOL costs 9k)magicka 6 sec of wings costs 3.3k umm ... l2p0 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Curious_Death wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.
Wings are great against magsorcs and ranged specs. But cloak, cleanse and ward are great against anybody. That's the difference. If I were in ZOS, I'll add minor evasion and minor expedition to them (for 6 seconds).
Parts of the DK crowd never ceases to amaze me. In another thread someone wanted Stone Fist to be an instant, ranged Dizzy-level Damage and now this. Talk about overloaded abilities. And I wonder why the Devs come up with some of their changes, e.g. how they wanted to overbuff Ball of Lightning.
But let's follow your suggestion for a second. Give DK 50% projectile mitigation, snare/root immunity, minor evasion and minor expedition for 6s. What would you do to balance this? Raise the cost by 50% and shut out Stam DKs from using it? What would you do in terms of Stam Sorcs "unique" feat, minor expedition?
Don't take this as an insult, I honestly want to know how you would handle this as I doubt you would simply add these two buffs without any kind of adjustment.
Ball of Lightning already provides better protection then wings and have built-in gap closer/escape. BoL gives 3 seconds of projectile immunity. While wings give 6 seconds of 50% damage reduction, which means that debuffs attached to projectiles are applied to DK and not applied to sorc. And if that was not enough BoL is best kite/disengage tool in the game and gap closer as well.
Any talk about current wings being "balanced" means that BoL is hugely imbalanced. Ok, attach 15 m jump to wings, and add escalating cost. I agree, 100%, anytime.
AND BOL FOLLOWS U LIKE WINGS DO?
L2P issue
BTW (6 sec of BOL costs 9k)magicka 6 sec of wings costs 3.3k umm ... l2p
Looks like learn to calculate for me...
3 seconds of immunity give same damage reduction as 6 seconds of 50% mitigation. And on top of that all projectiles are consumed which means dots and debuffs applied to those projectiles are not applied to sorc, but they are applied to DK.4 -
D0PAMINE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
I loved wings. I fought a lot of players and friends when they used to reflect, and I never had one complaint that they were OP or I was crutching on them, or it was unfair. Out of all the comments in this thread, I think this one is quite accurate.2 -
Curious_Death✭✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Curious_Death wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.
Wings are great against magsorcs and ranged specs. But cloak, cleanse and ward are great against anybody. That's the difference. If I were in ZOS, I'll add minor evasion and minor expedition to them (for 6 seconds).
Parts of the DK crowd never ceases to amaze me. In another thread someone wanted Stone Fist to be an instant, ranged Dizzy-level Damage and now this. Talk about overloaded abilities. And I wonder why the Devs come up with some of their changes, e.g. how they wanted to overbuff Ball of Lightning.
But let's follow your suggestion for a second. Give DK 50% projectile mitigation, snare/root immunity, minor evasion and minor expedition for 6s. What would you do to balance this? Raise the cost by 50% and shut out Stam DKs from using it? What would you do in terms of Stam Sorcs "unique" feat, minor expedition?
Don't take this as an insult, I honestly want to know how you would handle this as I doubt you would simply add these two buffs without any kind of adjustment.
Ball of Lightning already provides better protection then wings and have built-in gap closer/escape. BoL gives 3 seconds of projectile immunity. While wings give 6 seconds of 50% damage reduction, which means that debuffs attached to projectiles are applied to DK and not applied to sorc. And if that was not enough BoL is best kite/disengage tool in the game and gap closer as well.
Any talk about current wings being "balanced" means that BoL is hugely imbalanced. Ok, attach 15 m jump to wings, and add escalating cost. I agree, 100%, anytime.
AND BOL FOLLOWS U LIKE WINGS DO?
L2P issue
BTW (6 sec of BOL costs 9k)magicka 6 sec of wings costs 3.3k umm ... l2p
Looks like learn to calculate for me...
3 seconds of immunity give same damage reduction as 6 seconds of 50% mitigation. And on top of that all projectiles are consumed which means dots and debuffs applied to those projectiles are not applied to sorc, but they are applied to DK.
and... ofcz STILL BOL doesnt FOLLOW U... so... still u can defend more in 6 sec with 50% migration that 3 sec ...
its smilar to vBRP DW nerf post.... ppl cant understand that u still needs to KEEP BUFFS UP
18 sec on wings = 9.9k magicka
18 sec of BOL(casted 1 by 1) = 27,083 magicka (3.3+25%=4125+25%=5156+25%=6445+25%=8057+25%) 6 casts1 -
Curious_Death✭✭✭✭✭18 sec on wings = 9.9k magicka
18 sec of BOL(casted 1 by 1) = 27,083 magicka (3.3+25%=4125+25%=5156+25%=6445+25%=8057+25%) 6 casts[/quote]
almost forgot !
for around 15k of magicka i can heal out my ass for 100% more dmg than BOL defended comparing to wings in that 18 sec .. and wings follow my ass around LOS so i can definitly survive more when fighting... and i dont have to "hide" after BOL or get wreckt...1 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.
Wings are great against magsorcs and ranged specs. But cloak, cleanse and ward are great against anybody. That's the difference. If I were in ZOS, I'll add minor evasion and minor expedition to them (for 6 seconds).
Parts of the DK crowd never ceases to amaze me. In another thread someone wanted Stone Fist to be an instant, ranged Dizzy-level Damage and now this. Talk about overloaded abilities. And I wonder why the Devs come up with some of their changes, e.g. how they wanted to overbuff Ball of Lightning.
But let's follow your suggestion for a second. Give DK 50% projectile mitigation, snare/root immunity, minor evasion and minor expedition for 6s. What would you do to balance this? Raise the cost by 50% and shut out Stam DKs from using it? What would you do in terms of Stam Sorcs "unique" feat, minor expedition?
Don't take this as an insult, I honestly want to know how you would handle this as I doubt you would simply add these two buffs without any kind of adjustment.
Ball of Lightning already provides better protection then wings and have built-in gap closer/escape. BoL gives 3 seconds of projectile immunity. While wings give 6 seconds of 50% damage reduction, which means that debuffs attached to projectiles are applied to DK and not applied to sorc. And if that was not enough BoL is best kite/disengage tool in the game and gap closer as well.
Any talk about current wings being "balanced" means that BoL is hugely imbalanced. Ok, attach 15 m jump to wings, and add escalating cost. I agree, 100%, anytime.
Since you won't answer my question I assume you simply want to overbuff wings and be done with it. That's fine and fits just what I expect from the forums. Just not what I call unbiased or interested in balance.
However, many sorc mains were against the BoL changes last PTS and openly spoke out against them. Especially against the buff to the absorb duration.
You can ask for buffs after buffs to Wings and yet people won't stop complaining about the skill until they get their borderline broken cheese back they once had. Right?0 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Curious_Death wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Curious_Death wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.
Wings are great against magsorcs and ranged specs. But cloak, cleanse and ward are great against anybody. That's the difference. If I were in ZOS, I'll add minor evasion and minor expedition to them (for 6 seconds).
Parts of the DK crowd never ceases to amaze me. In another thread someone wanted Stone Fist to be an instant, ranged Dizzy-level Damage and now this. Talk about overloaded abilities. And I wonder why the Devs come up with some of their changes, e.g. how they wanted to overbuff Ball of Lightning.
But let's follow your suggestion for a second. Give DK 50% projectile mitigation, snare/root immunity, minor evasion and minor expedition for 6s. What would you do to balance this? Raise the cost by 50% and shut out Stam DKs from using it? What would you do in terms of Stam Sorcs "unique" feat, minor expedition?
Don't take this as an insult, I honestly want to know how you would handle this as I doubt you would simply add these two buffs without any kind of adjustment.
Ball of Lightning already provides better protection then wings and have built-in gap closer/escape. BoL gives 3 seconds of projectile immunity. While wings give 6 seconds of 50% damage reduction, which means that debuffs attached to projectiles are applied to DK and not applied to sorc. And if that was not enough BoL is best kite/disengage tool in the game and gap closer as well.
Any talk about current wings being "balanced" means that BoL is hugely imbalanced. Ok, attach 15 m jump to wings, and add escalating cost. I agree, 100%, anytime.
AND BOL FOLLOWS U LIKE WINGS DO?
L2P issue
BTW (6 sec of BOL costs 9k)magicka 6 sec of wings costs 3.3k umm ... l2p
Looks like learn to calculate for me...
3 seconds of immunity give same damage reduction as 6 seconds of 50% mitigation. And on top of that all projectiles are consumed which means dots and debuffs applied to those projectiles are not applied to sorc, but they are applied to DK.
and... ofcz STILL BOL doesnt FOLLOW U... so... still u can defend more in 6 sec with 50% migration that 3 sec ...
its smilar to vBRP DW nerf post.... ppl cant understand that u still needs to KEEP BUFFS UP
18 sec on wings = 9.9k magicka
18 sec of BOL(casted 1 by 1) = 27,083 magicka (3.3+25%=4125+25%=5156+25%=6445+25%=8057+25%) 6 casts
It all depends on circumstances. You can't sustain 100% uptime of wings or 100% uptime of BoL. You use them to mitigate burst (this is why wings so good against sorc, since burst is 100% predictable) or to disengage when X amount of players spam something in your back. For both cases BoL is better (though maybe more timing dependent) because if you want to mitigate burst you can remain in same place where BoL landed and in case of disengage 2 uses of BoL put you out of gap closer range.
Anyway, I don't think that BoL should be nerfed, I just say wings are too situational. Of course they are sort of counter to magsorc and any magsorc looks at any buffs to them as hilarious idea. But against majority of specs they are good only as snare removal which is pretty expensive...
Ok, another option will be to reduce cost of wings to 2k but make them consume let's say 300 magicka per second in case there were incoming projectiles. Then wings will be cheap snare removal but cost under projectile pressure will be the same. So it will be sort of magicka block.1 -
srfrogg23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Why do you think you should be able to survive a 1v"100" situation? Beating 2 other players at the same time would a bit unbalanced on it's own. Never mind these absurd 1vX scenarios that people whine about losing.
PvP happened in a pvp place.0 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.
Wings are great against magsorcs and ranged specs. But cloak, cleanse and ward are great against anybody. That's the difference. If I were in ZOS, I'll add minor evasion and minor expedition to them (for 6 seconds).
Parts of the DK crowd never ceases to amaze me. In another thread someone wanted Stone Fist to be an instant, ranged Dizzy-level Damage and now this. Talk about overloaded abilities. And I wonder why the Devs come up with some of their changes, e.g. how they wanted to overbuff Ball of Lightning.
But let's follow your suggestion for a second. Give DK 50% projectile mitigation, snare/root immunity, minor evasion and minor expedition for 6s. What would you do to balance this? Raise the cost by 50% and shut out Stam DKs from using it? What would you do in terms of Stam Sorcs "unique" feat, minor expedition?
Don't take this as an insult, I honestly want to know how you would handle this as I doubt you would simply add these two buffs without any kind of adjustment.
Ball of Lightning already provides better protection then wings and have built-in gap closer/escape. BoL gives 3 seconds of projectile immunity. While wings give 6 seconds of 50% damage reduction, which means that debuffs attached to projectiles are applied to DK and not applied to sorc. And if that was not enough BoL is best kite/disengage tool in the game and gap closer as well.
Any talk about current wings being "balanced" means that BoL is hugely imbalanced. Ok, attach 15 m jump to wings, and add escalating cost. I agree, 100%, anytime.
Since you won't answer my question I assume you simply want to overbuff wings and be done with it. That's fine and fits just what I expect from the forums. Just not what I call unbiased or interested in balance.
However, many sorc mains were against the BoL changes last PTS and openly spoke out against them. Especially against the buff to the absorb duration.
You can ask for buffs after buffs to Wings and yet people won't stop complaining about the skill until they get their borderline broken cheese back they once had. Right?
I didn't answer which question? How to compensate for added minor expedition and minor evasion (I specially mentioned for 6 seconds, not for 15 like sorc's minor expedition)?
I answered that BoL has more features then Wings. If we take fact that BoL is balanced, then you can freely add something to wings without increasing cost.
Anyway, I understand that if you are magsorc, then wings are big counter to you in U24 and you can't bear the thought that they will be buffed. But when you (DK) fight with melee stamsorc for example, wings are just a wasted space on bar.. so what I propose is to make them more universally useful.1 -
BNOC✭✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
I loved wings. I fought a lot of players and friends when they used to reflect, and I never had one complaint that they were OP or I was crutching on them, or it was unfair. Out of all the comments in this thread, I think this one is quite accurate.
You never had anyone tell you that you were crutching on wings?? That *** was the most noob friendly, OP thing in game.
It was literally a proc set that the opponent triggered on themselves with 100% up-time on any decent dueller and it was more effective the better the opponent was.
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox EU - 15/11/16
578,000 - 36 Minutes 58 Seconds (Top 2 World?)
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox NA
569,000 - 40 minutes (350CP, Non optimised runs)2 -
D0PAMINE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
I loved wings. I fought a lot of players and friends when they used to reflect, and I never had one complaint that they were OP or I was crutching on them, or it was unfair. Out of all the comments in this thread, I think this one is quite accurate.
You never had anyone tell you that you were crutching on wings?? That *** was the most noob friendly, OP thing in game.
It was literally a proc set that the opponent triggered on themselves with 100% up-time on any decent dueller and it was more effective the better the opponent was.
I forgot to mention in my post I play a Redguard sDK.0 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Wings and empowering chains need a buff, 100%. Abilities are not useless (dependent on build) but are under-powered in comparison to damage escape/gap closers of other classes.
Compare wings to ward, to cloak, to cleanse.. compare empowering chains to streak, to ambush/fan, to toppling charge. They are not comparable in any way, DK tools much weaker.
Chains? Yes, this is weak skill and deserves some attention and buffs.
Wings? Immobilize and snare immunity + 50% projectile damage reduction? You call this weak? Not even close. Its almost double major protection + very good utility. Yes you can't cheese anymore vs magsorcs or magblades but thats good thing.
Wings are great against magsorcs and ranged specs. But cloak, cleanse and ward are great against anybody. That's the difference. If I were in ZOS, I'll add minor evasion and minor expedition to them (for 6 seconds).
Parts of the DK crowd never ceases to amaze me. In another thread someone wanted Stone Fist to be an instant, ranged Dizzy-level Damage and now this. Talk about overloaded abilities. And I wonder why the Devs come up with some of their changes, e.g. how they wanted to overbuff Ball of Lightning.
But let's follow your suggestion for a second. Give DK 50% projectile mitigation, snare/root immunity, minor evasion and minor expedition for 6s. What would you do to balance this? Raise the cost by 50% and shut out Stam DKs from using it? What would you do in terms of Stam Sorcs "unique" feat, minor expedition?
Don't take this as an insult, I honestly want to know how you would handle this as I doubt you would simply add these two buffs without any kind of adjustment.
Ball of Lightning already provides better protection then wings and have built-in gap closer/escape. BoL gives 3 seconds of projectile immunity. While wings give 6 seconds of 50% damage reduction, which means that debuffs attached to projectiles are applied to DK and not applied to sorc. And if that was not enough BoL is best kite/disengage tool in the game and gap closer as well.
Any talk about current wings being "balanced" means that BoL is hugely imbalanced. Ok, attach 15 m jump to wings, and add escalating cost. I agree, 100%, anytime.
Since you won't answer my question I assume you simply want to overbuff wings and be done with it. That's fine and fits just what I expect from the forums. Just not what I call unbiased or interested in balance.
However, many sorc mains were against the BoL changes last PTS and openly spoke out against them. Especially against the buff to the absorb duration.
You can ask for buffs after buffs to Wings and yet people won't stop complaining about the skill until they get their borderline broken cheese back they once had. Right?
I didn't answer which question? How to compensate for added minor expedition and minor evasion (I specially mentioned for 6 seconds, not for 15 like sorc's minor expedition)?
I answered that BoL has more features then Wings. If we take fact that BoL is balanced, then you can freely add something to wings without increasing cost.
Anyway, I understand that if you are magsorc, then wings are big counter to you in U24 and you can't bear the thought that they will be buffed. But when you (DK) fight with melee stamsorc for example, wings are just a wasted space on bar.. so what I propose is to make them more universally useful.
So simply slapping two buffs on them and be done with it is your definition of balance. Interesting. Since you are so spoony with BoL you might realize that it lost it's stun and has a fatigue. Do you want that steep fatigue on Wings as well?
There is nothing wrong with situational skills. To make it more universally useful is why they baked mobility into it.
To make this clear: would you call it balanced if I asked for Hurricane to get 50% projectile mitigation on top of what it has, for the same cost, to make it more universally useful because it only does damage if I'm in melee range?
Edit: just read your idea about cost decrease in the other comment. That's a kind of buff to wings I could get behind as it won't overload it.Edited by Chilly-McFreeze on November 25, 2019 12:11PM0
