Additive vs Multiplicative

adirondack · October 2019

From patch notes 5.2.6: Fixed multiple issues where Champion Point abilities that dealt with cost reduction were additive instead of multiplicative.

Ok, cool. I took math in grade school, I know the difference btw adding and multiplying. What is lost on me is the net end effect by this change. Will I have more or less cost reduction? Can't we just state the result for the end users who are still drinking coffee and trying hard not to think too much?

Thanks.

silvermistktralasub17_ESO · October 2019

As far as I can tell, by knowing what I do about how the points apply, with these changes, the points you put in will lower the cost of your abilities significantly more than they currently are. This is not entirely a surprise, as I've been listening to my guild's theorycrafters, and where they've been frustrating could well be solved by merely making the math right here. (or at least some of the worst of it). So, my guess is that things will get much better quickly for at least some players.

ZonasArch · October 2019

Additive 10% with 10% means flat 20% reduction, say 100 becomes 80. Multiplicative means, as I understand, 100*.9*.9, which means 81 instead of 80.

Then again, ESO numbers work funny sometimes, so I may be wrong.

DTStormfox · October 2019

Responding to: What is lost on me is the net end effect by this change

The ned end effect in numbers is already shown by ZonasArch.
In terms of gameplay, it will mean that you can basically never reach zero cost.

I don't know what calculations they used precisely, but suppose you have 2000 stamina cost for an ability and can stack reductions of 20%. You will see that it is a curve that will never reach zero. You can approach y=0 but never actually reach it.

I plotted some points on a graph to make it visual:
https://imgur.com/gKs84gn

Jhalin · October 2019

Abilities will cost more when utilizing the Unchained star

Unchained: Reduce stamina costs by 80% for 3s after breaking free from CC

I can’t find any other CP node that deals with cost reductions, so I guess that’s all they were messing with.

adirondack · October 2019

Jhalin wrote: »

Abilities will cost more when utilizing the Unchained star

Unchained: Reduce stamina costs by 80% for 3s after breaking free from CC

I can’t find any other CP node that deals with cost reductions, so I guess that’s all they were messing with.

My thanks sir. Nicely explained.

WrathOfInnos · October 2019

For any reductions (like mitigation or cost), additive is more powerful than multiplicative. For any increases (like damage done or vulnerability debuffs), multiplicative is more powerful than additive.

ZonasArch · October 2019

Jhalin wrote: »

Abilities will cost more when utilizing the Unchained star

Unchained: Reduce stamina costs by 80% for 3s after breaking free from CC

I can’t find any other CP node that deals with cost reductions, so I guess that’s all they were messing with.

Dunno names, but we have break free, sneaking, sprinting, roll dodging and blocking for cost reductions.

MartiniDaniels · October 2019

ZonasArch wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

Abilities will cost more when utilizing the Unchained star

Unchained: Reduce stamina costs by 80% for 3s after breaking free from CC

I can’t find any other CP node that deals with cost reductions, so I guess that’s all they were messing with.

Dunno names, but we have break free, sneaking, sprinting, roll dodging and blocking for cost reductions.

And that thingy which reduced magicka cost after pot is gulped. 80% of blockade cost economy once in 45 seconds is not that small actually.

Jhalin · October 2019

ZonasArch wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

Abilities will cost more when utilizing the Unchained star

Unchained: Reduce stamina costs by 80% for 3s after breaking free from CC

I can’t find any other CP node that deals with cost reductions, so I guess that’s all they were messing with.

Dunno names, but we have break free, sneaking, sprinting, roll dodging and blocking for cost reductions.

I’d honestly forgotten we have reductions for actions that aren’t abilities via non-CP sources.

So blocking (tanks stacked from jewels) and sprinting (armor passives) will cost more. Bretons might see a cost increase in some cases.