[Proposal] Make all bound on pickup items (except pure PvE trial gear) tradable for AP

Bashev · September 2019

I think it will be nice for both types of players if BoP items can be traded for AP. Currently if I PvP I can trade my items for gold and I find it really nice income. It will be cool if the PvE players sell their items for AP that later they can use on the vendors.

All pure PvE gear that comes from the trials should not be tradable.

What are your thoughts?

gimpdrb14_ESO · September 2019

I would be ok with this.

Major_Lag · September 2019

Better yet: make it tradable for telvar insted of AP, giving the long-neglected Imperial City a new purpose

VaranisArano · September 2019

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Bashev · September 2019

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Can you tell me why shall I pvp? What gear is locked behind pvp that is not tradable? I am talking about gear not skill lines.

Major_Lag · September 2019

VaranisArano wrote: »

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

I don't want to rain on your parade, but there are plenty of ways to earn AP that do not involve "PvP" by the common definition of actually fighting other players.
For example:

Repairing doors/walls, when buying repair kits with gold (expensive but very safe),
Sieging from keep walls (fairly safe, very common),
PvDooring empty keeps/outposts,
etc.

Besides, some players simply hate PvP, or refuse to participate in it for whatever reasons.
Or they are not interested, but want the geodes, for which PvP is the most efficient source.
Such players will invariably go down the path of least resistance, no matter what.

In that way it's similar to the fake tanks and fake healers you see in dungeons.
Except that instead of those, we have fake PvPers in Cyrodiil who can't and don't actually PvP.

VaranisArano · September 2019

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Can you tell me why shall I pvp? What gear is locked behind pvp that is not tradable? I am talking about gear not skill lines.

There isnt any BOP gear in PVP. Lots of other rewards/achievements you only get from PVP activities, but not BOP gear.
There IS, however, BOP in PVE, which ZOS implemented to get people to run dungeons, arenas, and trials.

This suggestion is trying to circumvent the necessity for all players to run dungeons and arenas if they want BOP gear (minus the Monster Helms/Jewelry that comes up on the Golden Vendor, takes quite subject to RNG).

Its also trying to circumvent the necessity of players to participate in PVP acticities if they want to farm AP, by allowing players to trade in BOP gear. That messes with rewards, the alliance war skill line leveling process, and Alliance War Rank which grants skill points. Seriously, under your suggestion, a dedicated dungeon runner could turn in enough BOP gear to get a high PVP rank without ever killing another player.

Its outright asking for the option to skip content players don't like and get the rewards anyways. (I see this same line of argument from the PVE players who want a PVE-only Cyrodiil so they can get their rewards with none of the risk. Its a bad suggestion and counter to the intent of the game in the same way your suggestion is.)

Why should you PVP?
Because you like it.
Because you want AP.
Because you want other rewards/achievements obtained in PVP enabled zones.

Why should you run dungeons/arenas?
Because you like it.
Because you want the BOP gear they drop without waiting for the Golden Vendor to sell the helm/jewelry.
Because you want the other rewards/achievements for running dungeons/arenas.

ZOS doesnt really care if you play the content because you love it or because you want the rewards, like those tickets for another shiny Indrik. They care that you play the content, especially their brand new content or whatever content they are featuring during an event. Why on earth would they make it easier to skip the content and still get the rewards anyway?

Its not hard to grasp. ZOS wants you to play all of the game if you want all of the rewards. They want players playing as much of the game as possible, especially since they balance PVP and PVE together. They want players to be semi-experienced with both aspects of the game. They aren't going to make it easier for all players to skip running PVE group content by selling BOP gear from dungeons and arenas for AP. They arent going to make it easier for PVEers to farm AP by skipping PVP content. That would be counterproductive for them in the long term.

Really, how hard is it to just play the game? You want BOP PVE gear? Just run the PVE content. You want the rewards from PVP activities? Prepare for PVP, give it your best shot, and persevere.

AlnilamE · September 2019

OP, what exactly is "Pure PvE gear"? Can you give an example?

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Can you tell me why shall I pvp? What gear is locked behind pvp that is not tradable? I am talking about gear not skill lines.

Varanis said "rewards", which are not only limited to gear. From a totally non-combat perspective, there are some really nice dyes you can get in Cyrodiil.

Bashev · September 2019

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Can you tell me why shall I pvp? What gear is locked behind pvp that is not tradable? I am talking about gear not skill lines.

Really, how hard is it to just play the game? You want BOP PVE gear? Just run the PVE content. You want the rewards from PVP activities? Prepare for PVP, give it your best shot, and persevere.

Yes I want to play the game as I enjoy it. But I am forced to spend some time for something that I dont enjoy. Imagine if some BIS pve gear was locked behind PvP and all the gear was bop.

VaranisArano · September 2019

Major_Lag wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

I don't want to rain on your parade, but there are plenty of ways to earn AP that do not involve "PvP" by the common definition of actually fighting other players.
For example:
Repairing doors/walls, when buying repair kits with gold (expensive but very safe),

Sieging from keep walls (fairly safe, very common),

PvDooring empty keeps/outposts,

etc.

Besides, some players simply hate PvP, or refuse to participate in it for whatever reasons.
Or they are not interested, but want the geodes, for which PvP is the most efficient source.
Such players will invariably go down the path of least resistance, no matter what.

In that way it's similar to the fake tanks and fake healers you see in dungeons.
Except that instead of those, we have fake PvPers in Cyrodiil who can't and don't actually PvP.

That, uh, would be why I included "farming AP" by doing "activities in a PVP-enabled zone."

Because while those activities can be done fairly safely by a smart and cautious player, they do indeed require "acitivities in a PVP-enabled zone."

And the only method to get AP that doesn't, the daily log-in reward, can't be considered farming. Even getting AP via sitting in your home base waiting for your alliance members to recapture a scroll can't be considered farming.

I did consider all that and was very precise with my words because of it.

The OP wants PVE players to be able to trade in BOP gear to acquire AP. Its entirely possible to farm BOP gear in large quantities, which would enabled PVE players to farm AP without doing any PVP or any activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

Worse, as noted in my above comment, AP isnt just a currency. It impacts the leveling of the Alliance War skill line and the Alliance Ranks. Ranks grant skill points, and increase based on how much AP you've gained.

Under the OP's suggestion, a dedicated PVE dungeon/arena runner could farm BOP gear, trade it in for AP, and reach a high Alliance rank without ever engaging in any PVP fighting or activities in a PVP-enabled zone. Literally buying their way to high rank in PVP with no risk of PVP.

Bashev · September 2019

AlnilamE wrote: »

OP, what exactly is "Pure PvE gear"? Can you give an example?

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Can you tell me why shall I pvp? What gear is locked behind pvp that is not tradable? I am talking about gear not skill lines.

Varanis said "rewards", which are not only limited to gear. From a totally non-combat perspective, there are some really nice dyes you can get in Cyrodiil.

Trials gear with damage increased or decreased vs monsters. Useless for pvp.

VaranisArano · September 2019

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Can you tell me why shall I pvp? What gear is locked behind pvp that is not tradable? I am talking about gear not skill lines.

Really, how hard is it to just play the game? You want BOP PVE gear? Just run the PVE content. You want the rewards from PVP activities? Prepare for PVP, give it your best shot, and persevere.

Yes I want to play the game as I enjoy it. But I am forced to spend some time for something that I dont enjoy. Imagine if some BIS pve gear was locked behind PvP and all the gear was bop.

So what?

Seriously. Skills like Vigor, Caltrops, Purge, and Warhorn are still locked behind PVP, even if its a lower minimum of one character at rank 10 in order to buy them.

If you want a reward bad enough, you'll suck it up and play the content. ZOS knows that.

ESO is not a game where you get instant gratification. Its a game where, yeah, you might have to play content you don't like in order to get the rewards you want. Sometimes ZOS makes it easier under limited circumstances (transmutation, selling skill lines, Golden Vendor, etc.) They don't, as a general rule, let you skip content entirely without paying for it - as in *real money* paying for it.

I should hope the reasons for that from a financial and game design standpoint are obvious.

Bashev · September 2019

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Can you tell me why shall I pvp? What gear is locked behind pvp that is not tradable? I am talking about gear not skill lines.

Really, how hard is it to just play the game? You want BOP PVE gear? Just run the PVE content. You want the rewards from PVP activities? Prepare for PVP, give it your best shot, and persevere.

Yes I want to play the game as I enjoy it. But I am forced to spend some time for something that I dont enjoy. Imagine if some BIS pve gear was locked behind PvP and all the gear was bop.

So what?

Seriously. Skills like Vigor, Caltrops, Purge, and Warhorn are still locked behind PVP, even if its a lower minimum of one character at rank 10 in order to buy them.

If you want a reward bad enough, you'll suck it up and play the content. ZOS knows that.

ESO is not a game where you get instant gratification. Its a game where, yeah, you might have to play content you don't like in order to get the rewards you want. Sometimes ZOS makes it easier under limited circumstances (transmutation, selling skill lines, Golden Vendor, etc.) They don't, as a general rule, let you skip content entirely without paying for it - as in *real money* paying for it.

I should hope the reasons for that from a financial and game design standpoint are obvious.

I dotn want it for free, or to pay real money, I want to spend some currency that I earned. It is just economy. I think it will be better for the game as the PvE players will not be so annoyed when an item drops in impentetrable trait as they will be able to sell it for AP.

If some PvE players try to farm gear and make easy AP, if there are a lot of supply the AP price will be low so they will not earn easy AP. It is simple economy.

Taleof2Cities · September 2019

Bashev wrote: »

Trials gear with damage increased or decreased vs monsters. Useless for pvp.

That doesn’t stop quite a few healers from wearing Olorime in Cyrodiil.

Bashev wrote: »

Yes I want to play the game as I enjoy it. But I am forced to spend some time for something that I dont enjoy. Imagine if some BIS pve gear was locked behind PvP and all the gear was bop.

As primarily a PvP player, so do I.

However, I also appreciate that I can try new types of content and improve myself in different types of gameplay.

VaranisArano · September 2019

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Can you tell me why shall I pvp? What gear is locked behind pvp that is not tradable? I am talking about gear not skill lines.

Really, how hard is it to just play the game? You want BOP PVE gear? Just run the PVE content. You want the rewards from PVP activities? Prepare for PVP, give it your best shot, and persevere.

Yes I want to play the game as I enjoy it. But I am forced to spend some time for something that I dont enjoy. Imagine if some BIS pve gear was locked behind PvP and all the gear was bop.

So what?

Seriously. Skills like Vigor, Caltrops, Purge, and Warhorn are still locked behind PVP, even if its a lower minimum of one character at rank 10 in order to buy them.

If you want a reward bad enough, you'll suck it up and play the content. ZOS knows that.

ESO is not a game where you get instant gratification. Its a game where, yeah, you might have to play content you don't like in order to get the rewards you want. Sometimes ZOS makes it easier under limited circumstances (transmutation, selling skill lines, Golden Vendor, etc.) They don't, as a general rule, let you skip content entirely without paying for it - as in *real money* paying for it.

I should hope the reasons for that from a financial and game design standpoint are obvious.

I dotn want it for free, or to pay real money, I want to spend some currency that I earned. It is just economy. I think it will be better for the game as the PvE players will not be so annoyed when an item drops in impentetrable trait as they will be able to sell it for AP.

If some PvE players try to farm gear and make easy AP, if there are a lot of supply the AP price will be low so they will not earn easy AP. It is simple economy.

You fundamentally misunderstand some basics of how ESO is designed.

ESO is not designed so that you can do one type of content to the exclusion of other types and still get all the rewards. You might want that, but that's detrimental to the game as a whole.

ESO is designed, for very good reasons, so that you must do all of the content to get all of the rewards. ESO encourages players to play ALL of the game, or at least try out ALL of the game.
Reasons:
A. Encouraging players to try out different content increases the likelihood that they will find something they enjoy, which in turn increases the longevity of their time playing the game. It doesnt work for everyone in every content, but it works for a lot of players. (Personally, I only started to PVP because I wanted the Cyrodiil fish for Master Angler.)
B. ESO balances PVE and PVP together, and so it benefits when players understand how to PVE and PVP. Game balance works a lot better when players have at least a basic experience with both types of content. The Class Reps are typically individuals with experience in both types. We see a lot of problems arising when players make suggestions based on either PVE or PVP exclusively.

When you suggest that PVE players should be able to trade in BOP gear for AP, or that all players should be able to buy BOP gear for AP, you are, among the other issues I've listed:
A. Lowering the longevity of dungeon/arena content, since players can avoid the dungeons and get all the rewards by AP or by farming other dungeons for BOP gear.
B. Making arena rewards laughable, since your suggestion includes purchasing vMA and vBRP weapons for AP.
C. Diminishing the value of New DLC Dungeons by making their BOP gear immediately available for AP. This alone would be the nail in the coffin for your idea because there's no way ZOS is going to make it easy to get their newest BOP sets without buying and playing the DLC.

Now, all that may sound great to you. After all, you get great PVE gear from doing the PVP content that appeals to you. And PVE players can get AP and thus BOP gear from harder dungeons by farming Fungal Grotto 1 to their heart's content! What's not to love about this idea from a player's perspective? It makes BOP gear so much easier to obtain!

Its not gonna happen for that exact reason. ZOS wants you to actually run the content if you want the rewards. Whether you like it or whether you are just sucking it up for the rewards.

Its not really about what you want, because players are always going to want the easy way out and to acquire good gear for the least effort. Part of good game design is making players put in the effort so they experience all that your game has to offer.

Bashev · September 2019

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Can you tell me why shall I pvp? What gear is locked behind pvp that is not tradable? I am talking about gear not skill lines.

Really, how hard is it to just play the game? You want BOP PVE gear? Just run the PVE content. You want the rewards from PVP activities? Prepare for PVP, give it your best shot, and persevere.

Yes I want to play the game as I enjoy it. But I am forced to spend some time for something that I dont enjoy. Imagine if some BIS pve gear was locked behind PvP and all the gear was bop.

So what?

Seriously. Skills like Vigor, Caltrops, Purge, and Warhorn are still locked behind PVP, even if its a lower minimum of one character at rank 10 in order to buy them.

If you want a reward bad enough, you'll suck it up and play the content. ZOS knows that.

ESO is not a game where you get instant gratification. Its a game where, yeah, you might have to play content you don't like in order to get the rewards you want. Sometimes ZOS makes it easier under limited circumstances (transmutation, selling skill lines, Golden Vendor, etc.) They don't, as a general rule, let you skip content entirely without paying for it - as in *real money* paying for it.

I should hope the reasons for that from a financial and game design standpoint are obvious.

I dotn want it for free, or to pay real money, I want to spend some currency that I earned. It is just economy. I think it will be better for the game as the PvE players will not be so annoyed when an item drops in impentetrable trait as they will be able to sell it for AP.

If some PvE players try to farm gear and make easy AP, if there are a lot of supply the AP price will be low so they will not earn easy AP. It is simple economy.

You fundamentally misunderstand some basics of how ESO is designed.

ESO is not designed so that you can do one type of content to the exclusion of other types and still get all the rewards. You might want that, but that's detrimental to the game as a whole.

ESO is designed, for very good reasons, so that you must do all of the content to get all of the rewards. ESO encourages players to play ALL of the game, or at least try out ALL of the game.
Reasons:
A. Encouraging players to try out different content increases the likelihood that they will find something they enjoy, which in turn increases the longevity of their time playing the game. It doesnt work for everyone in every content, but it works for a lot of players. (Personally, I only started to PVP because I wanted the Cyrodiil fish for Master Angler.)
B. ESO balances PVE and PVP together, and so it benefits when players understand how to PVE and PVP. Game balance works a lot better when players have at least a basic experience with both types of content. The Class Reps are typically individuals with experience in both types. We see a lot of problems arising when players make suggestions based on either PVE or PVP exclusively.

When you suggest that PVE players should be able to trade in BOP gear for AP, or that all players should be able to buy BOP gear for AP, you are, among the other issues I've listed:
A. Lowering the longevity of dungeon/arena content, since players can avoid the dungeons and get all the rewards by AP or by farming other dungeons for BOP gear.
B. Making arena rewards laughable, since your suggestion includes purchasing vMA and vBRP weapons for AP.
C. Diminishing the value of New DLC Dungeons by making their BOP gear immediately available for AP. This alone would be the nail in the coffin for your idea because there's no way ZOS is going to make it easy to get their newest BOP sets without buying and playing the DLC.

Now, all that may sound great to you. After all, you get great PVE gear from doing the PVP content that appeals to you. And PVE players can get AP and thus BOP gear from harder dungeons by farming Fungal Grotto 1 to their heart's content! What's not to love about this idea from a player's perspective? It makes BOP gear so much easier to obtain!

Its not gonna happen for that exact reason. ZOS wants you to actually run the content if you want the rewards. Whether you like it or whether you are just sucking it up for the rewards.

Its not really about what you want, because players are always going to want the easy way out and to acquire good gear for the least effort. Part of good game design is making players put in the effort so they experience all that your game has to offer.

I guess you cannot understand that I am not asking for all rewards, I am asking for tradable gear. All PvP gear is tradable and can be used by PvE players it is not the case with the PvE gear.

You can keep the rewards as titles, dyes, mounts and costumes for the completed content, they are not important for your builds.

VaranisArano · September 2019

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a PVPer with millions of AP? No. The Golden Vendor is quite enough.

One of the fundamental design principles of ESO is that if you want all of the rewards, you have to play all of the game. If you want dungeon gear - or if you want Arena Gear which I note you did not exclude - you need to run the dungeons and arenas.

The Golden Vendor is a slight exception in that you can acquire BOP dungeon items, but it's extremely dependent on RNG. If you wanted Earthgore, on PC/NA you waited about a year after launch if you got it from the Golden.

And I'm definitely against the idea that PVE players can farm AP via selling items that has nothing to do with PVP. AP is a PVP currency. Farming AP ought to require PVP or activities in a PVP-enabled zone.

This is a transparent attempt to get out of doing content that players don't like, and that's just not going to fly with ZOS. The Devs who balance PVE and PVP together arent going to make it easier for players to skip doing dungeons and arenas or to farm AP with non-PVP activities.

Can you tell me why shall I pvp? What gear is locked behind pvp that is not tradable? I am talking about gear not skill lines.

Really, how hard is it to just play the game? You want BOP PVE gear? Just run the PVE content. You want the rewards from PVP activities? Prepare for PVP, give it your best shot, and persevere.

Yes I want to play the game as I enjoy it. But I am forced to spend some time for something that I dont enjoy. Imagine if some BIS pve gear was locked behind PvP and all the gear was bop.

So what?

Seriously. Skills like Vigor, Caltrops, Purge, and Warhorn are still locked behind PVP, even if its a lower minimum of one character at rank 10 in order to buy them.

If you want a reward bad enough, you'll suck it up and play the content. ZOS knows that.

ESO is not a game where you get instant gratification. Its a game where, yeah, you might have to play content you don't like in order to get the rewards you want. Sometimes ZOS makes it easier under limited circumstances (transmutation, selling skill lines, Golden Vendor, etc.) They don't, as a general rule, let you skip content entirely without paying for it - as in *real money* paying for it.

I should hope the reasons for that from a financial and game design standpoint are obvious.

I dotn want it for free, or to pay real money, I want to spend some currency that I earned. It is just economy. I think it will be better for the game as the PvE players will not be so annoyed when an item drops in impentetrable trait as they will be able to sell it for AP.

If some PvE players try to farm gear and make easy AP, if there are a lot of supply the AP price will be low so they will not earn easy AP. It is simple economy.

You fundamentally misunderstand some basics of how ESO is designed.

ESO is not designed so that you can do one type of content to the exclusion of other types and still get all the rewards. You might want that, but that's detrimental to the game as a whole.

ESO is designed, for very good reasons, so that you must do all of the content to get all of the rewards. ESO encourages players to play ALL of the game, or at least try out ALL of the game.
Reasons:
A. Encouraging players to try out different content increases the likelihood that they will find something they enjoy, which in turn increases the longevity of their time playing the game. It doesnt work for everyone in every content, but it works for a lot of players. (Personally, I only started to PVP because I wanted the Cyrodiil fish for Master Angler.)
B. ESO balances PVE and PVP together, and so it benefits when players understand how to PVE and PVP. Game balance works a lot better when players have at least a basic experience with both types of content. The Class Reps are typically individuals with experience in both types. We see a lot of problems arising when players make suggestions based on either PVE or PVP exclusively.

When you suggest that PVE players should be able to trade in BOP gear for AP, or that all players should be able to buy BOP gear for AP, you are, among the other issues I've listed:
A. Lowering the longevity of dungeon/arena content, since players can avoid the dungeons and get all the rewards by AP or by farming other dungeons for BOP gear.
B. Making arena rewards laughable, since your suggestion includes purchasing vMA and vBRP weapons for AP.
C. Diminishing the value of New DLC Dungeons by making their BOP gear immediately available for AP. This alone would be the nail in the coffin for your idea because there's no way ZOS is going to make it easy to get their newest BOP sets without buying and playing the DLC.

Now, all that may sound great to you. After all, you get great PVE gear from doing the PVP content that appeals to you. And PVE players can get AP and thus BOP gear from harder dungeons by farming Fungal Grotto 1 to their heart's content! What's not to love about this idea from a player's perspective? It makes BOP gear so much easier to obtain!

Its not gonna happen for that exact reason. ZOS wants you to actually run the content if you want the rewards. Whether you like it or whether you are just sucking it up for the rewards.

Its not really about what you want, because players are always going to want the easy way out and to acquire good gear for the least effort. Part of good game design is making players put in the effort so they experience all that your game has to offer.

I guess you cannot understand that I am not asking for all rewards, I am asking for tradable gear. All PvP gear is tradable and can be used by PvE players it is not the case with the PvE gear.

You can keep the rewards as titles, dyes, mounts and costumes for the completed content, they are not important for your builds.

And I'm making it very clear that:

A. PVE BOP gear is in fact a reward for doing PVE dungeon and arena content that you want to get without doing the content.

B. ZOS is never ever going to devalue their dungeon and arena content by letting players buy BOP gear for AP. Not only do PVP players get to skip PVE group content entirely, but PVE players could farm Fungal Grotto 1, trade in BOP gear for AP, and get the BOP gear from harder dungeons. That makes selling DLC dungeons a joke.

You aren't grappling with any of the many problems your suggestion causes for ZOS. Even though you want it, it's not actually a good thing for ESO as a whole to make it easy to buy BOP gear for AP or to let players trade BOP gear for AP.

I mean, you want what you want. But unless you convince ZOS its to their benefit, this is never going to happen.