Maintenance for the week of September 15:
• [COMPLETE] Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – September 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
• [COMPLETE] PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – September 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
• [COMPLETE] Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – September 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
• [COMPLETE] PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – September 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
Cast time on ultimate's is garbage
-
khajiitNPC✭✭✭✭✭sample size on the forum is laughable — how many people actually participated? No seriously. How many total?
Anyhow — yes the cast times suck for sure, but those who complained about AC are still dying on my side. Shrugs. Unnecessary change, that did nothing the whiners wanted. Now I don’t mind them, because I still get my kills, but if they are going to do it to some ultimates, they should do it to all of them. Or revert the change and tell the bad players to get gud.Edited by khajiitNPC on August 28, 2019 4:41AM0 -
Rikumaru✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Clearly you have never been involved in game programming
Clearly you haven't played this game. The combat was silky smooth back in 1.6, changes since then patch by patch have often introduced some new problem / bug with the combat system. It begun with gap closers, then movement (particularly jumping), then animations and how skills activated when ZOS last attempted to mess with animation cancelling, then it was how skills targeted players. And sure, server were a little laggy even back then but the combat itself was super smooth and functional. The game has only gotten laggier since (especially this year for PC-EU). Hell, you can see it for yourself from videos.Edited by Rikumaru on August 28, 2019 4:47AMOverload rework. Power Overload now does physical damage and grants you the power of a tornado: You throw a brick at the target with a light attack, and you hammer your head into that brick with every heavy attack. We have decreased its Ultimate cost, but increased the chance that you get stuck in the animation.5 -
BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Clearly you have never been involved in game programming
Clearly you haven't played this game. The combat was silky smooth back in 1.6, changes since then patch by patch have often introduced some new problem / bug with the combat system. It begun with gap closers, then movement (particularly jumping), then animations and how skills activated when ZOS last attempted to mess with animation cancelling, then it was how skills targeted players. And sure, server were a little laggy even back then but the combat itself was super smooth and functional. The game has only gotten laggier since (especially this year for PC-EU). Hell, you can see it for yourself from videos.
I’ve been around since launch and and I wouldn’t ever say the combat has ever been silky smooth. Second part of performance issues in game is players constantly asking for faster and faster combat basically 1-2 shot builds with the new combat changes slow down your play style and see what happens. Fight fast die fast.0 -
Rikumaru✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Clearly you have never been involved in game programming
Clearly you haven't played this game. The combat was silky smooth back in 1.6, changes since then patch by patch have often introduced some new problem / bug with the combat system. It begun with gap closers, then movement (particularly jumping), then animations and how skills activated when ZOS last attempted to mess with animation cancelling, then it was how skills targeted players. And sure, server were a little laggy even back then but the combat itself was super smooth and functional. The game has only gotten laggier since (especially this year for PC-EU). Hell, you can see it for yourself from videos.
I’ve been around since launch and and I wouldn’t ever say the combat has ever been silky smooth. Second part of performance issues in game is players constantly asking for faster and faster combat basically 1-2 shot builds with the new combat changes slow down your play style and see what happens. Fight fast die fast.
What? At launch you could have hundreds of players on screen at once and the servers didn't lag at all and you got decent FPS with all of the going on. Now I'm not sure what change they did, but they made a change to the game which has forever made the game laggy from that point onwards, particularly when a large amount of players are grouped together in an area. They had to cut down on Cyrodill max population repeatedly from that point onwards.Overload rework. Power Overload now does physical damage and grants you the power of a tornado: You throw a brick at the target with a light attack, and you hammer your head into that brick with every heavy attack. We have decreased its Ultimate cost, but increased the chance that you get stuck in the animation.3 -
Rake✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭"Ultimate abilities are some of the most powerful abilities in the game. We added cast times so there is counter play; we felt that having 3-4 abilities hitting you at once, including an Ultimate, is just too much."
I hope ZOS realise you can't cast more than 1 ability (barring flying blade morph) in a GCD. And if they are talking about weaving light attacks, DoTs, delayed attacks such as shulks, enchants or bash; you can still do all of the above with a cast time. The cast time on ultimates literally makes zero sense and feels awful to play with. And it seems the vast majority of players agree that cast times suck too.
Going to side with what ever ZoS employee made that quote.
Cast times on ultimate abilities were necessary. It was extremely chessy and stupid to have people just dump all their ultimate abilities on you for instant death kills. So I disagree with the OP about this - as well as that poll.
PvP generally has improved quite a bit since the update. It's still deadly. But there is less instant death and counter play actually exists now - where as before it was just death with no way to avoid it.
Instant death kills.
Show me instant life kills.
Instant death lives
Also pvp has improved to the point that its absolute trash tier now2 -
Heatnix90✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Clearly you have never been involved in game programming
Clearly you haven't played this game. The combat was silky smooth back in 1.6, changes since then patch by patch have often introduced some new problem / bug with the combat system. It begun with gap closers, then movement (particularly jumping), then animations and how skills activated when ZOS last attempted to mess with animation cancelling, then it was how skills targeted players. And sure, server were a little laggy even back then but the combat itself was super smooth and functional. The game has only gotten laggier since (especially this year for PC-EU). Hell, you can see it for yourself from videos.
I’ve been around since launch and and I wouldn’t ever say the combat has ever been silky smooth. Second part of performance issues in game is players constantly asking for faster and faster combat basically 1-2 shot builds with the new combat changes slow down your play style and see what happens. Fight fast die fast.
Somehow I don't believe you, mainly because you actually believe that animation canceling causes lag.5 -
Nyladreas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭"Ultimate abilities are some of the most powerful abilities in the game. We added cast times so there is counter play; we felt that having 3-4 abilities hitting you at once, including an Ultimate, is just too much."
I hope ZOS realise you can't cast more than 1 ability (barring flying blade morph) in a GCD. And if they are talking about weaving light attacks, DoTs, delayed attacks such as shulks, enchants or bash; you can still do all of the above with a cast time. The cast time on ultimates literally makes zero sense and feels awful to play with. And it seems the vast majority of players agree that cast times suck too.
Lmao 95, 156, and 310 pathetic votes. Is this what you want to base a developer decision on? Wow.Edited by Nyladreas on August 28, 2019 5:38AM1 -
eso_lags✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
This actually makes no sense. In more than one way.2 -
eso_lags✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭"Ultimate abilities are some of the most powerful abilities in the game. We added cast times so there is counter play; we felt that having 3-4 abilities hitting you at once, including an Ultimate, is just too much."
I hope ZOS realise you can't cast more than 1 ability (barring flying blade morph) in a GCD. And if they are talking about weaving light attacks, DoTs, delayed attacks such as shulks, enchants or bash; you can still do all of the above with a cast time. The cast time on ultimates literally makes zero sense and feels awful to play with. And it seems the vast majority of players agree that cast times suck too.
Lmao 95, 156, and 310 pathetic votes. Is this what you want to base a developer decision on? Wow.
Pathetic? Want to elaborate on that? And ya they absolutely should take it into account. At least the biggest polls or a group of polls together. Everyone can participate.
Its a sample size of a larger group of people for zos to take into consideration (or at least they should), whats the issue?2 -
Vapirko✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Don’t use DBoS anymore. People bitched and ZOS listened and ruined it. Go Onslaught or go home. Still has a cast time but at least it’s not the conal AoE. Between that and the cast time Onslaught is far more reliable, does circular AoE damage and gives the pen vs all enemies. Besides in the QA ZOS says that the cast times are here to stay since getting hit with multiples ultimates at once was too much. Because you can’t still time them together according to ZOS, and also apparently heath desyncs are better.Edited by Vapirko on August 28, 2019 6:05AM2 -
eso_lags✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Clearly you have never been involved in game programming
Clearly you haven't played this game. The combat was silky smooth back in 1.6, changes since then patch by patch have often introduced some new problem / bug with the combat system. It begun with gap closers, then movement (particularly jumping), then animations and how skills activated when ZOS last attempted to mess with animation cancelling, then it was how skills targeted players. And sure, server were a little laggy even back then but the combat itself was super smooth and functional. The game has only gotten laggier since (especially this year for PC-EU). Hell, you can see it for yourself from videos.
I’ve been around since launch and and I wouldn’t ever say the combat has ever been silky smooth. Second part of performance issues in game is players constantly asking for faster and faster combat basically 1-2 shot builds with the new combat changes slow down your play style and see what happens. Fight fast die fast.
When have they increased the speed of combat? And what is the deal with people talking about these 1-2 shot builds? What game are you playing? Or what build are you running?
I've played a medium armor stamplar, stam necro, and a med or heavy stam sorc, for the entire elsweyr patch and I have only never been 2 shot. Once while I was AFK I got hit with an uppercut, berserker strike, and a couple executes, by a stamblade but even thats not a 2 shot. And I do play a bit tanker medium armor builds than usual but the point is you shouldnt be getting 2 shot unless you're getting ganked. And ganking was much worse in the past. I used to run alchemist and archers mind and actually 2 shot people back before morrowind.. Heavy bow attack, surprise attack, dead.
But this update? Im getting ripped by dots. Magplars reign supreme, apparently, because they now hit like trucks and are tanky AF. Damage is higher, surviving is harder, and it looks like zos is pushing us deeper into the tank meta. It also looks like, yet again, solo players got hit worst. I could be wrong because I've only had today to test solo fighting different builds and classes, but from what I can tell this update is awful compared to elsweyr, and thats saying something.1 -
eso_lags✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Don’t use DBoS anymore. People bitched and ZOS listened and ruined it. Go Onslaught or go home. Still has a cast time but at least it’s not the conal AoE. Between that and the cast time Onslaught is far more reliable, does circular AoE damage and gives the pen vs all enemies. Besides in the QA ZOS says that the cast times are here to stay since getting hit with multiples ultimates at once was too much. Because you can’t still time them together according to ZOS, and also apparently heath desyncs are better.
Agreed. They seem to be playing a different game.1 -
Rikumaru✭✭✭✭✭
✭"Ultimate abilities are some of the most powerful abilities in the game. We added cast times so there is counter play; we felt that having 3-4 abilities hitting you at once, including an Ultimate, is just too much."
I hope ZOS realise you can't cast more than 1 ability (barring flying blade morph) in a GCD. And if they are talking about weaving light attacks, DoTs, delayed attacks such as shulks, enchants or bash; you can still do all of the above with a cast time. The cast time on ultimates literally makes zero sense and feels awful to play with. And it seems the vast majority of players agree that cast times suck too.
Lmao 95, 156, and 310 pathetic votes. Is this what you want to base a developer decision on? Wow.
Wanna pull some better evidence regarding cast times on ultimates? Yeah didn't think so. Though judging by some of your past comments I'm not particularly surprised you are defending a change aimed at nerfing player skill.Overload rework. Power Overload now does physical damage and grants you the power of a tornado: You throw a brick at the target with a light attack, and you hammer your head into that brick with every heavy attack. We have decreased its Ultimate cost, but increased the chance that you get stuck in the animation.3 -
BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Clearly you have never been involved in game programming
Clearly you haven't played this game. The combat was silky smooth back in 1.6, changes since then patch by patch have often introduced some new problem / bug with the combat system. It begun with gap closers, then movement (particularly jumping), then animations and how skills activated when ZOS last attempted to mess with animation cancelling, then it was how skills targeted players. And sure, server were a little laggy even back then but the combat itself was super smooth and functional. The game has only gotten laggier since (especially this year for PC-EU). Hell, you can see it for yourself from videos.
I’ve been around since launch and and I wouldn’t ever say the combat has ever been silky smooth. Second part of performance issues in game is players constantly asking for faster and faster combat basically 1-2 shot builds with the new combat changes slow down your play style and see what happens. Fight fast die fast.
Somehow I don't believe you, mainly because you actually believe that animation canceling causes lag.
Somehow you don’t understand what happens with animation canceling your are to simplify it to common words your forcing calculations that are normally done sequentially to be done simultaneously in a shorter time frame then this concept is multiplied by number of players doing the same thing hence why cyrodil performance is normally bad same with trials.2 -
Vlad9425✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Trying to reason with ZOS is like talking to a brick wall. I bet we will still have cast time ULTs in the next update. One of the most unpopular decisions they’ve made so far which the majority of the community dislikes yet they don’t even comment on whether they plan to revert this dumb change.0 -
eso_lags✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Trying to reason with ZOS is like talking to a brick wall. I bet we will still have cast time ULTs in the next update. One of the most unpopular decisions they’ve made so far which the majority of the community dislikes yet they don’t even comment on whether they plan to revert this dumb change.
They did comment on it. I put it in my OP. They know that it was the change that had the most negative reactions. They know people hate it and dont want it. They dont care. They think that they know best but fail to realize that the community can sometimes be right. Especially when its something so widely disliked. Its not for no reason, the reason is actually very simple, its a bad change.0 -
Fur_like_snow✭✭✭✭✭
✭It’s a bad change overall. One good thing is that now you just cancel the DB and try to fake out your opponent. Sometimes they waste stam trying to dodge roll then you clap them for real lights out.1 -
J2JMC✭✭✭✭✭"Ultimate abilities are some of the most powerful abilities in the game. We added cast times so there is counter play; we felt that having 3-4 abilities hitting you at once, including an Ultimate, is just too much."
I hope ZOS realise you can't cast more than 1 ability (barring flying blade morph) in a GCD. And if they are talking about weaving light attacks, DoTs, delayed attacks such as shulks, enchants or bash; you can still do all of the above with a cast time. The cast time on ultimates literally makes zero sense and feels awful to play with. And it seems the vast majority of players agree that cast times suck too.
What about this this doesn't make sense?
The logic behind cast time on ultimates is incredibly simple: ZOS feels these abilities are so strong that their damage and effects should not hit instantly. Even if you disagree, it makes complete sense. It's not possible to misunderstand.
A significant majority of people complaining are stambuilds upset that their instant damage AOE move that hit like a single target with an accompanying dot was functionally nerfed. If DB was left untouched, most of ya'll wouldn't even care. Which makes me think that ZOS thought DBoS was overperforming, and unfortunately other ults were casualties of ZOS attempting to nerf it without changing the numbers.
Personally, I agree that the cast times don't look or feel good. I also agree their reasoning about not wanting multiple skills to hit at the same time seems a little odd. But I don't disagree with the design philosophy. High damage aoe ultimates that also provide cc probably shouldn't be instant. And tbh, there's been a precedent for that design since the game launched (meteor). That's a completely reasonable viewpoint. I just wish they would have hit DBoS directly and left the other ultimates alone. Absolutely no one was complaining about the nightblade ults or the weapon skill line ults.Knee Jerk, L2P, Obtuse, Casual, Entitled, All The Best, unnecessary mention of CoD
Battle leveling for pve content defeats the idea of progression. Remove CP
"Apparently the players are more informed than we are"-Richard Lambert1 -
Dojohoda✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I never was one to purposefully ani-canel an ultimate, but my incapacitate strikes are aesthetically pleasing. Leaping into potentially a 360 to land one, and they usually land. I think the enemy is simply dazzeled into submission. 😵Edited by Dojohoda on August 28, 2019 4:47PMFan of playing magblade since 2015. (PC NA)
Might be joking in comments.
-->(((Cyrodiil)))<--0 -
eso_lags✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭"Ultimate abilities are some of the most powerful abilities in the game. We added cast times so there is counter play; we felt that having 3-4 abilities hitting you at once, including an Ultimate, is just too much."
I hope ZOS realise you can't cast more than 1 ability (barring flying blade morph) in a GCD. And if they are talking about weaving light attacks, DoTs, delayed attacks such as shulks, enchants or bash; you can still do all of the above with a cast time. The cast time on ultimates literally makes zero sense and feels awful to play with. And it seems the vast majority of players agree that cast times suck too.
What about this this doesn't make sense?
The logic behind cast time on ultimates is incredibly simple: ZOS feels these abilities are so strong that their damage and effects should not hit instantly. Even if you disagree, it makes complete sense. It's not possible to misunderstand.
A significant majority of people complaining are stambuilds upset that their instant damage AOE move that hit like a single target with an accompanying dot was functionally nerfed. If DB was left untouched, most of ya'll wouldn't even care. Which makes me think that ZOS thought DBoS was overperforming, and unfortunately other ults were casualties of ZOS attempting to nerf it without changing the numbers.
Personally, I agree that the cast times don't look or feel good. I also agree their reasoning about not wanting multiple skills to hit at the same time seems a little odd. But I don't disagree with the design philosophy. High damage aoe ultimates that also provide cc probably shouldn't be instant. And tbh, there's been a precedent for that design since the game launched (meteor). That's a completely reasonable viewpoint. I just wish they would have hit DBoS directly and left the other ultimates alone. Absolutely no one was complaining about the nightblade ults or the weapon skill line ults.
But the logic is incredibly flawed for multiple reasons. The simplest reason is that the change is just bad for the combat style of this game. It also hurts melee players while other play styles still have options that arent impacted by this.
Id like for you, or someone, to try to tell how dawnbreaker was overperforming. Was it because a lot of people used it? Well lets see. Stam sorcs had no other option, at least for aoe. Stamplars and stamdens as well. Stam dks had leap and stam necros have bash and the collosus. Not everyone has options when that want a good aoe damage ultimate. Mag builds have much more options though..
Another thing is that every ultimate has its advantage and disadvantage. Lets compare other ults to DBOS, ill put it in this spoiler..
Well dawny stuns, deals good damage, and has a medium cost.. Its down side is that its easier to dodge than other AOE ults because its AOE is a cone in front of you. There is its balance.
Leap deals more damage than DB, is an AOE, and stuns but has no DoT, it also has a cheaper cost.
Sweep deals good damage in a cone AOE and has a DoT/upfront damage.. But does not stun. In exchange it has a very low cost.
Collosus deals good damage and applies major vulnerability which makes the good damage it has actually like a truck, but in exchange its expensive and takes a few seconds.
Frost storm deals high damage, gives people protection, and snares/ccs people. It has a high cost.
Nova deals good damage in a large AOE, gives major maim to enemies, and has a synergy for friendlies to deal even more damage. It has a high cost.
Soul tether deals decent damage, heals you, stuns enemies, and has a medium cost.
Standard does good dot damage in a large AOE, gives major defile to enemies in it, has a synergy for allies, and has the option to either reduce your damage taken or to move the standard around to keep it on enemies. It has a high cost.
Berserker strike deals good damage, is now AOE damage, ignores the targets resistance, and grants you phys/spell pen for 11 seconds.
And thats just the mainly damage ults, some with utility. Corrosive and Goliath could also be included for multiple reasons.
The reason I listed these things is to explain that certain ultimates have certain advantages, im aware they are all different. Some of those advantages dont need to utilize a fast paced combat style that animation canceling a dawnbreaker offered. The other point I didnt mention is that this 400ms cast time LITERALLY does nothing for what zos was trying to accomplish.
If the ability is over performing, what does this cast time do? Makes the ability more clunky, makes combat slightly slower and more clunky, and delays a player being hit by a dawnbreaker by less than half a second. A dawnbreaker they are going to be hit by regardless.
Or maybe zos wanted to make certain ultimates interruptible? If thats the case then look at the list above. Some of those ultimates offer so much damage and utility without the risk of being interrupted. And even if they can be, for certain play styles it doesnt matter. Like a mag necro dropping a collosus down from a distance wouldnt have to worry about that as much as an in your face melee stam sorc.
There are so many flaws in the theory that dawnbreaker was over performing, and that adding this cast time has fixed it. Melee builds were definitely hit harder by this change, especially if you use DB. But range has its benefits like i said before. Not everything in this game is equal.
In the end, as usual, this change hurts small scale players the most. Like I've said multiple times. Solo/small scale players often depend on fast, precise, and strategic gameplay to try and survive fighting outnumbered. Same goes for end game pve players.. Im not sure who would want slower clunky combat, especially since eso has such amazing combat. Even many people who play more casually or play large scale pvp dont like this. Again because it feels awful.
It also hurts console players and any players who experience lag on a daily basis like many console pvp players do. Because any cast time gets increased in lag, by a lot sometimes.
Edited by eso_lags on August 29, 2019 7:09AM1 -
itscompton✭✭✭✭✭
✭Royalthought wrote: »The update made it easier for zergs to stack DoTs and kill solo players.
The update made it more difficult for solo players to quickly kill individuals in a zerg.
Strongly disagree based on my own experience playing today. I was playing solo in large scale fights and I busted a few zergs by stacking dots on different individuals and whittling them down 2-3 at a time. I am loving this patch.0 -
Anyron✭✭✭✭✭
✭Definitely one of the worst choices zos has ever made. You really should start thinking of the bigger picture with the changes you make. When scalebreaker hit console today I got on and was reminded of how disgusting these cast times feel. While playing around with dawnbreaker I started thinking, why would you do this when you literally cannot fix performance issues? This is going to be awful in the laggy mess that is pvp. Its already hard enough to get my dawnbreaker to work when the game is lagging, like it normally does..
I've played dswing builds for years now, as awful as it is in lag. I know how bad cast times are when the game is lagging. You have done nothing for ultimate's except give them the same effect that dswing has in pvp, a much longer cast time than intend. And whats the reason?Adding cast times to Ultimates appears to be a change most people here have reacted negatively to. Why are these cast times being added? What issue is the team attempting to solve with this change?
Ultimate abilities are some of the most powerful abilities in the game. We added cast times so there is counter play; we felt that having 3-4 abilities hitting you at once, including an Ultimate, is just too much. You also can’t animation cancel them because we don’t want players to be able to instantly cast them anymore. They are just too powerful.
Hmmm.. So for the entire life of this game you've been wrong about ultimate's right? They've always been "too strong" but you've now just realized it.. Well its good to see you guys admitting that you're wrong about things but sadly you're apparently wrong twice because ultimate's were fine how they were.
I know tons of people posted about this but i dont care. Im not here to argue about it.. Just to add another negative reaction to the list. Its a bad change and there is no reason for it. You have yet again hurt small scale/solo pvpers more than anyone. And for what? The small amount of people who choose to not get better and get bursted sort of quickly by an ultimate? But everyone's a tank so does that even happen? I dont get it, I dont know who really benefits.. You've also hurt anyone who deals with the horrible performance of this game as well, so thanks for that too.
Good players will adapt to this change and still be fine, and bad players will still die quickly. The only thing you've accomplished is making combat more clunky. For no reason. And thats sad because the combat is the best thing this game has to offer. GG.
when players discovered animation cancelling it was same. and it remained.
at least this is change i agree with. hard hitting ultimates should never be cancelled. it only creates toxic playstyle2 -
WillhelmBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Definitely one of the worst choices zos has ever made. You really should start thinking of the bigger picture with the changes you make. When scalebreaker hit console today I got on and was reminded of how disgusting these cast times feel. While playing around with dawnbreaker I started thinking, why would you do this when you literally cannot fix performance issues? This is going to be awful in the laggy mess that is pvp. Its already hard enough to get my dawnbreaker to work when the game is lagging, like it normally does..
I've played dswing builds for years now, as awful as it is in lag. I know how bad cast times are when the game is lagging. You have done nothing for ultimate's except give them the same effect that dswing has in pvp, a much longer cast time than intend. And whats the reason?Adding cast times to Ultimates appears to be a change most people here have reacted negatively to. Why are these cast times being added? What issue is the team attempting to solve with this change?
Ultimate abilities are some of the most powerful abilities in the game. We added cast times so there is counter play; we felt that having 3-4 abilities hitting you at once, including an Ultimate, is just too much. You also can’t animation cancel them because we don’t want players to be able to instantly cast them anymore. They are just too powerful.
Hmmm.. So for the entire life of this game you've been wrong about ultimate's right? They've always been "too strong" but you've now just realized it.. Well its good to see you guys admitting that you're wrong about things but sadly you're apparently wrong twice because ultimate's were fine how they were.
I know tons of people posted about this but i dont care. Im not here to argue about it.. Just to add another negative reaction to the list. Its a bad change and there is no reason for it. You have yet again hurt small scale/solo pvpers more than anyone. And for what? The small amount of people who choose to not get better and get bursted sort of quickly by an ultimate? But everyone's a tank so does that even happen? I dont get it, I dont know who really benefits.. You've also hurt anyone who deals with the horrible performance of this game as well, so thanks for that too.
Good players will adapt to this change and still be fine, and bad players will still die quickly. The only thing you've accomplished is making combat more clunky. For no reason. And thats sad because the combat is the best thing this game has to offer. GG.
when players discovered animation cancelling it was same. and it remained.
at least this is change i agree with. hard hitting ultimates should never be cancelled. it only creates toxic playstyle
Players with poor gear and skill are still getting clapped in 3 seconds so what difference has it made?PC EU0 -
Ermiq✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Your opponent is right, man.
If only you have known how online games work, you would believe it. But you judge it from the point of view of a regular player who only sees what's on the surface. Yet you're pretty sure somehow that you're right, huh?brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Clearly you have never been involved in game programming
Clearly you haven't played this game. The combat was silky smooth back in 1.6, changes since then patch by patch have often introduced some new problem / bug with the combat system. It begun with gap closers, then movement (particularly jumping), then animations and how skills activated when ZOS last attempted to mess with animation cancelling, then it was how skills targeted players. And sure, server were a little laggy even back then but the combat itself was super smooth and functional. The game has only gotten laggier since (especially this year for PC-EU). Hell, you can see it for yourself from videos.
I’ve been around since launch and and I wouldn’t ever say the combat has ever been silky smooth. Second part of performance issues in game is players constantly asking for faster and faster combat basically 1-2 shot builds with the new combat changes slow down your play style and see what happens. Fight fast die fast.
Somehow I don't believe you, mainly because you actually believe that animation canceling causes lag.
LA weaving affects the server performance, and out-of-GCD ultimates did the same. That's just true. That's how things work. Believe or not, it's your choice though.One of the two of us definitely has gone mad. It only remains to define whether this one is the whole world or just me.
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
Sick&tired of being kicked off from your house when you complete a dungeon? ComingBackHome addon is what you need!
Me is russian little bad in english :b0 -
Kalante✭✭✭✭✭
✭Cast delays on ultimates with this lag? how arrogant and blind do these developers have to be? seriously.... releasing cast delays as if this game had 30-100+ buttery smooth frame rates with a network code to match league of legends or CSGO. Absolutely so detached from their game.
Edited by Kalante on August 30, 2019 9:16AM1 -
Rianai✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Your opponent is right, man.
If only you have known how online games work, you would believe it. But you judge it from the point of view of a regular player who only sees what's on the surface. Yet you're pretty sure somehow that you're right, huh?brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Clearly you have never been involved in game programming
Clearly you haven't played this game. The combat was silky smooth back in 1.6, changes since then patch by patch have often introduced some new problem / bug with the combat system. It begun with gap closers, then movement (particularly jumping), then animations and how skills activated when ZOS last attempted to mess with animation cancelling, then it was how skills targeted players. And sure, server were a little laggy even back then but the combat itself was super smooth and functional. The game has only gotten laggier since (especially this year for PC-EU). Hell, you can see it for yourself from videos.
I’ve been around since launch and and I wouldn’t ever say the combat has ever been silky smooth. Second part of performance issues in game is players constantly asking for faster and faster combat basically 1-2 shot builds with the new combat changes slow down your play style and see what happens. Fight fast die fast.
Somehow I don't believe you, mainly because you actually believe that animation canceling causes lag.
LA weaving affects the server performance, and out-of-GCD ultimates did the same. That's just true. That's how things work. Believe or not, it's your choice though.
Ofc everything affects server performance. So the best way to fix lag is to just delete the game, right? 100% success.
But on its own, stuff like la weaving has a completely negligible impact. It is also pure guessing that skills with cast times have less impact than instant skills. Fact is that sever performance is getting worse and worse despite their attempts to dumb down combat, so that's obviously not a working solution.
And ultimates are not and never were "out-of-gcd". They work exactly like normal skills.
Cast times on ultimates are awful, garbage, annoying, buggy, and not fun to use. And non of the affected ultimates was op enough to warrant those harsh nerfs, in fact they even have been nerfed before already, after being deemed balanced for years (maybe with the exception of the new Onslaught).0 -
Ermiq✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Your opponent is right, man.
If only you have known how online games work, you would believe it. But you judge it from the point of view of a regular player who only sees what's on the surface. Yet you're pretty sure somehow that you're right, huh?brandonv516 wrote: »Smooth combat I think people don’t quite comprehend what that means because animation canceling actually takes away from smooth combat sure it feels cool when 3-5 skills go off in 1 go. Has anyone actually realized animation canceling is the biggest cause for lag and performance issues in this game?
Well clearly removing it from a few ultimates hasn't improved performance one bit. Dare we try to add a cast time to every skill and see how "good" the game will play? I think you'll put your foot in your mouth.
Clearly you have never been involved in game programming
Clearly you haven't played this game. The combat was silky smooth back in 1.6, changes since then patch by patch have often introduced some new problem / bug with the combat system. It begun with gap closers, then movement (particularly jumping), then animations and how skills activated when ZOS last attempted to mess with animation cancelling, then it was how skills targeted players. And sure, server were a little laggy even back then but the combat itself was super smooth and functional. The game has only gotten laggier since (especially this year for PC-EU). Hell, you can see it for yourself from videos.
I’ve been around since launch and and I wouldn’t ever say the combat has ever been silky smooth. Second part of performance issues in game is players constantly asking for faster and faster combat basically 1-2 shot builds with the new combat changes slow down your play style and see what happens. Fight fast die fast.
Somehow I don't believe you, mainly because you actually believe that animation canceling causes lag.
LA weaving affects the server performance, and out-of-GCD ultimates did the same. That's just true. That's how things work. Believe or not, it's your choice though.
Ofc everything affects server performance. So the best way to fix lag is to just delete the game, right? 100% success.
But on its own, stuff like la weaving has a completely negligible impact. It is also pure guessing that skills with cast times have less impact than instant skills. Fact is that sever performance is getting worse and worse despite their attempts to dumb down combat, so that's obviously not a working solution.
And ultimates are not and never were "out-of-gcd". They work exactly like normal skills.
Cast times on ultimates are awful, garbage, annoying, buggy, and not fun to use. And non of the affected ultimates was op enough to warrant those harsh nerfs, in fact they even have been nerfed before already, after being deemed balanced for years (maybe with the exception of the new Onslaught).
LA weaving impact is not negligible. I would even say it actually doubles the calculations per second required on the server side. If there wasn't LA weaving, it would have been just an ability OR a LA per GCD to calculate. As it is now, it's both an ability AND a LA have to be calculated within the same second.
Considering ultimates not being out-of-GCD, well, I'll check this out tonight. I had a feeling that they are actually, but I'm not sure though.
Considering the ultimates not being OP, why was the Dawnbraker commonly used ultimate in almost every stamina build then? I mean, ZOS don't nerf things because someone told them to nerf it, nor because they have a random thought that it would be fun to nerf something today. They do it because they have statistics, they saw everyone uses Dawnbreaker, they saw no one uses Soul Trap, etc. Reading patch notes I clearly see what they do and I know why they do it. Sometimes the way they do it seems odd though, but that's how all combat teams work in all MMORPGs, we don't know how things are going on in there.Edited by Ermiq on August 29, 2019 10:17AMOne of the two of us definitely has gone mad. It only remains to define whether this one is the whole world or just me.
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
Sick&tired of being kicked off from your house when you complete a dungeon? ComingBackHome addon is what you need!
Me is russian little bad in english :b1 -
Rianai✭✭✭✭✭
✭With all the buffs, debuffs, heals, dots, procs, aoe and other stuff flying arround constantly, one single target dmg instance more per second isn't going to have a significant impact, let alone "double the calculations".0