Rune Cage vs Fossilize
teladoy
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Why Rune Cage has an animation where players can roll and Fossilize no? Rune Cage is pretty useless against good players...
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JumpmanLane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭“Why must I cry, THESE tears from mine eyes? Why must I carry this heavy, heavy, heavy load? Why must I trod this lonely, lonely, lonely road? Why must I cry...?”-Peter Tosh!Edited by JumpmanLane on August 18, 2019 12:11AM2 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Why Rune Cage has an animation where players can roll and Fossilize no? Rune Cage is pretty useless against good players...
Maybe because fossilize is melee and DK doesn't have class passives which buff all possible stats in the game? Plz don't forget that other classes then sorc don't have plain +10-1% to all damage, -15% ulti cost, -5 6% cost to everything (notice that ZOS doesn't forget to buff sorc for cost reduction), +8% health, +20%stam/health regen and +10% magicka regen and so on? ok they have something single from that, but not all together.10 -
GeorgeBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Why does stamsorc get maj brutality and healing per crit
and stamDK gets maj brutality and maj sorcery?
Why does sorc get passives that affect all sorc skills and DK gets passives that affect only skill lines?
Why does sorc get it's nerfs watered down (shields-> no cast time, added resistances. Streak fatique instead of large magika cost) but DK wings got 100% removed from the game?
Why cant you see that fossilize has a very short range and it caters to a different playstyle?
Why do you play a pew pew pew pew fps class in an mmorpg?
Because you are the typical robe nuker gamer.
Why arent you glad that instead of being a glass cannon you can whithstand multiple enemies on you even tho you wear robes?
Why do you QQ when you had a class that was top tier for 5 years and cant just face the fact that there are ups and downs?11 -
teladoy✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »Why does stamsorc get maj brutality and healing per crit
and stamDK gets maj brutality and maj sorcery?
Why does sorc get passives that affect all sorc skills and DK gets passives that affect only skill lines?
Why does sorc get it's nerfs watered down (shields-> no cast time, added resistances. Streak fatique instead of large magika cost) but DK wings got 100% removed from the game?
Why cant you see that fossilize has a very short range and it caters to a different playstyle?
Why do you play a pew pew pew pew fps class in an mmorpg?
Because you are the typical robe nuker gamer.
Why arent you glad that instead of being a glass cannon you can whithstand multiple enemies on you even tho you wear robes?
Why do you QQ when you had a class that was top tier for 5 years and cant just face the fact that there are ups and downs?
Nothing of that is 100% true. DKs have a lot of different passives and skills that make the class unique in their own way and we could discuss it for a whole day.
But is true i didn't saw the range of both skills. Anyways i believe it is pretty useless against skilled players. They should reduce the range and make it instant. Then at least would be of something.1 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »Why does stamsorc get maj brutality and healing per crit
and stamDK gets maj brutality and maj sorcery?
Why does sorc get passives that affect all sorc skills and DK gets passives that affect only skill lines?
Why does sorc get it's nerfs watered down (shields-> no cast time, added resistances. Streak fatique instead of large magika cost) but DK wings got 100% removed from the game?
Why cant you see that fossilize has a very short range and it caters to a different playstyle?
Why do you play a pew pew pew pew fps class in an mmorpg?
Because you are the typical robe nuker gamer.
Why arent you glad that instead of being a glass cannon you can whithstand multiple enemies on you even tho you wear robes?
Why do you QQ when you had a class that was top tier for 5 years and cant just face the fact that there are ups and downs?
Nothing of that is 100% true. DKs have a lot of different passives and skills that make the class unique in their own way and we could discuss it for a whole day.
But is true i didn't saw the range of both skills. Anyways i believe it is pretty useless against skilled players. They should reduce the range and make it instant. Then at least would be of something.
Imagine playing PVP enough to demand buffs from devs and didn't know range of one of the most common used distinctive things lmao
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Canned_Apples✭✭✭✭✭
✭you do know that sorcs have an unblockable stun now right? right???
The DK stun also costs more magicka.0 -
Marcus684✭✭✭✭✭
✭Emma_Overload wrote: »
Imagine believing the devs harbor some kind of love or hatred for any particular class in the game, then actually expressing that belief to others. Smh.2 -
Miloscpolski✭✭✭Why Rune Cage has an animation where players can roll and Fossilize no? Rune Cage is pretty useless against good players...Why Rune Cage has an animation where players can roll and Fossilize no? Rune Cage is pretty useless against good players...
Why streak have cast time? that why fossilize dont have cast time, do not write such nonsense0 -
jcm2606✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Because one can be used from 36+ meters away, while the other requires you to be sitting right on top of your opponent?3 -
sly007✭✭✭✭Canned_Apples wrote: »you do know that sorcs have an unblockable stun now right? right???
The DK stun also costs more magicka.
Unblockable, aoe , and attached to mobility.1 -
Fur_like_snow✭✭✭✭✭
✭Don’t know any mSorcs using RC. Better comparison is with streak which they made unblockable this patch and it scales dmg to max stat. Honestly a better skill all around. Meanwhile fossilize gets a cost increase so stamDK can’t sustain outside a 1v1.Edited by Fur_like_snow on August 18, 2019 2:39AM0 -
bardx86✭✭✭✭✭
✭Fur_like_snow wrote: »Don’t know any mSorcs using RC. Better comparison is with streak which they made unblockable this patch and it scales dmg to max stat. Honestly a better skill all around. Meanwhile fossilize gets a cost increase so stamDK can’t sustain outside a 1v1.
Steak my be good on paper but it sucks.0 -
bardx86✭✭✭✭✭
✭Fur_like_snow wrote: »Don’t know any mSorcs using RC. Better comparison is with streak which they made unblockable this patch and it scales dmg to max stat. Honestly a better skill all around. Meanwhile fossilize gets a cost increase so stamDK can’t sustain outside a 1v1.
Steak my be good on paper but it sucks.
No one dies because of steak. lol1 -
DKMaestro✭✭✭Why Rune Cage has an animation where players can roll and Fossilize no? Rune Cage is pretty useless against good players...
Why do every class need to be carbon copies of the others? Should we also have access to a cloak? Should DKs have access to steak?
Learn to deal with it. Nothing but complaining on these forums, and if everyone had their way, there would be one race and all could be the same.
That’s all fine in Denmark. We are a socialist country and everyone are equal, I don’t care for it in my game!Old man playing. Have a life, a job and only one character, which is grumpy (all the time)0 -
Darkenarlol✭✭✭✭✭
✭because DK knows how to protect their OP tools
they just bring their NB friends and starts the *NERF SORCS* mantra
so actually when you try to bring up their OPness on forum
it becomes a religion offending
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GrimTheReaper45✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »
Really I just get the feeling they hate all mag toons in general.
Like dont get me wrong, Im a sorc main. Sorc is the worse treated class in game by far, by how the devs handle us and the community at large. Really though it is beginning to feel like mag is just something extra from the old days that the current devs dont want to exist anymore.2 -
teladoy✭✭✭✭✭Because one can be used from 36+ meters away, while the other requires you to be sitting right on top of your opponent?
Then explain how Templars have a Magicka and stamina morph that stuns from the other side of the map.Why Rune Cage has an animation where players can roll and Fossilize no? Rune Cage is pretty useless against good players...
Why do every class need to be carbon copies of the others? Should we also have access to a cloak? Should DKs have access to steak?
Learn to deal with it. Nothing but complaining on these forums, and if everyone had their way, there would be one race and all could be the same.
That’s all fine in Denmark. We are a socialist country and everyone are equal, I don’t care for it in my game!
I'm not saying that they have to be a copy, I just did a comparison of two skills with the same principle but one is effective and the other one no.
In a PVP world where rolling is what most are doing all the time a skill that has long range BUT also a delay is the same as almost useless.
They don't have to do the same as Fossilize but maybe they could make more reliable and viable.0 -
jcm2606✭✭✭✭✭
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Because Javelin is a projectile, hence having a travel time, and is also blockable? Prior to adding the delay, Rune Cage was effectively an instant cast stun that could be used from 36+ meters away, on a class that can easily 2-shot around that stun.
There was no way of knowing that Rune Cage was coming, and by the time you broke out of it, a half-way decent Sorc already had Curse and the execute on you, might have a Meteor about to hit just as Curse hits, and has a frags proc lined up immediately after. In other words, by the time you broke out of it, you were pretty much already dead.
Compare that to Javelin, which has a travel time and is on a class that can't combo around that stun nearly as easily as Sorc could. If you're actually fighting that Templar at even mid range, you have a window where you can block or dodge their Javelin, and that window gets longer the further they are away. If you aren't fighting that Templar, or you took the stun regardless, they don't have anywhere near the amount of burst that Sorc can dish out, and their combo has a 6-second heads up telegraph from the massive pillar of light over you.
Back to DK, compare both Rune Cage and Javelin to Fossilize, which now costs an arm and a leg (cost was almost doubled since Scalebreaker dropped), has a range of 7 meters meaning the DK has to be on top of you to use it, and is on a class that crutches pretty hard on that stun to guarantee everything lands without you blocking or dodging it. Yes, the stun is unblockable and undodgeable, but if you break it and immediately block, at the least you've blocked a leap or a whip, and you may have even blocked both, shutting down the tail end of their combo. Doubly so if they're running Flame Lash, since they need to hit you with whip while you're stunned to proc Power Lash on the next whip, giving you an extra GCD to break out and block.
The old Rune Cage was literally a more OP Fossilize on a class that can easily 2-shot around that stun. That's why it was nerfed.
EDIT: I do agree that Sorc needs something to help with perma-rollers, though. I just don't want this to turn into a Fossilize nerf thread, because DK crutches on Fossilize to pull of its entire combo, so nerfing Fossilize will gut DK. But I don't think reintroducing a stun as powerful as old Rune Cage on a class with that much killing power is a good idea.
IMO, they should start by making a few of the damage skills undodgeable, so Sorc's can at least deal some damage to perma-rollers. Start by making the execute undodgeable, so that way a Sorc can at least line up Curse with some Force Pulse spam to soften the perma-roller up a little, maybe using Streak to close the gap and catch them in a stun for your full combo.Edited by jcm2606 on August 18, 2019 8:22AM4 -
Nerftheforums✭✭✭✭✭
✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »Why does stamsorc get maj brutality and healing per crit
and stamDK gets maj brutality and maj sorcery?
Why does sorc get passives that affect all sorc skills and DK gets passives that affect only skill lines?
Why does sorc get it's nerfs watered down (shields-> no cast time, added resistances. Streak fatique instead of large magika cost) but DK wings got 100% removed from the game?
Why cant you see that fossilize has a very short range and it caters to a different playstyle?
Why do you play a pew pew pew pew fps class in an mmorpg?
Because you are the typical robe nuker gamer.
Why arent you glad that instead of being a glass cannon you can whithstand multiple enemies on you even tho you wear robes?
Why do you QQ when you had a class that was top tier for 5 years and cant just face the fact that there are ups and downs?
Nothing of that is 100% true. DKs have a lot of different passives and skills that make the class unique in their own way and we could discuss it for a whole day.
But is true i didn't saw the range of both skills. Anyways i believe it is pretty useless against skilled players. They should reduce the range and make it instant. Then at least would be of something.
This is totally *** up. You don't understand the game, the skill you are using as benchmark and yet you write ont he forums asking for changes.
First learn this game, THEN start discussing it. This works for life too btw.2 -
teladoy✭✭✭✭✭
Because Javelin is a projectile, hence having a travel time, and is also blockable? Prior to adding the delay, Rune Cage was effectively an instant cast stun that could be used from 36+ meters away, on a class that can easily 2-shot around that stun.
There was no way of knowing that Rune Cage was coming, and by the time you broke out of it, a half-way decent Sorc already had Curse and the execute on you, might have a Meteor about to hit just as Curse hits, and has a frags proc lined up immediately after. In other words, by the time you broke out of it, you were pretty much already dead.
Compare that to Javelin, which has a travel time and is on a class that can't combo around that stun nearly as easily as Sorc could. If you're actually fighting that Templar at even mid range, you have a window where you can block or dodge their Javelin, and that window gets longer the further they are away. If you aren't fighting that Templar, or you took the stun regardless, they don't have anywhere near the amount of burst that Sorc can dish out, and their combo has a 6-second heads up telegraph from the massive pillar of light over you.
Back to DK, compare both Rune Cage and Javelin to Fossilize, which now costs an arm and a leg (cost was almost doubled since Scalebreaker dropped), has a range of 7 meters meaning the DK has to be on top of you to use it, and is on a class that crutches pretty hard on that stun to guarantee everything lands without you blocking or dodging it. Yes, the stun is unblockable and undodgeable, but if you break it and immediately block, at the least you've blocked a leap or a whip, and you may have even blocked both, shutting down the tail end of their combo. Doubly so if they're running Flame Lash, since they need to hit you with whip while you're stunned to proc Power Lash on the next whip, giving you an extra GCD to break out and block.
The old Rune Cage was literally a more OP Fossilize on a class that can easily 2-shot around that stun. That's why it was nerfed.
EDIT: I do agree that Sorc needs something to help with perma-rollers, though. I just don't want this to turn into a Fossilize nerf thread, because DK crutches on Fossilize to pull of its entire combo, so nerfing Fossilize will gut DK. But I don't think reintroducing a stun as powerful as old Rune Cage on a class with that much killing power is a good idea.
IMO, they should start by making a few of the damage skills undodgeable, so Sorc's can at least deal some damage to perma-rollers. Start by making the execute undodgeable, so that way a Sorc can at least line up Curse with some Force Pulse spam to soften the perma-roller up a little, maybe using Streak to close the gap and catch them in a stun for your full combo.
I'm not searching for a nerf. I can't remember how was the old Rune Cage but it bother me that it has a visual warning while javelin if it is a travel and blockable projectile at least your enemy don't see it coming and this is something I can confirm as a main stamplar.
I finish my stamsorc yesterday and I noticed that Rune Cage ist under performing in compare to other classes stuns. Only that.
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Vapirko✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Hey you could be a stamina templar that has such a lack luster CC that using the magicka gap closer is far and away a better choice.0 -
Vlad9425✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »
Imagine actually believing this lol. Sorcs went for years without any significant nerfs while NBs had half of their kit nerfed. Can’t comment on DKs cos I don’t play that class anymore.3 -
Bosov✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »
Imagine actually believing this lol. Sorcs went for years without any significant nerfs while NBs had half of their kit nerfed. Can’t comment on DKs cos I don’t play that class anymore.
He/she/It actually does. There are two people on the forum who will do anything to claim that sorc is a weak overnerfed class and that pets were fine, frags need more damage + stun and that you should be able to streak forever.
Lets not forget they also think cloak is the devil and dks are too tankie....
One of those two made the hilarious reply you replied to.. the other one will show up soon enough.Edited by Bosov on August 18, 2019 11:52AMXbox One - EU - GT : Bosov
PC - EU - @Bosov91
ESO Highight :
https://twitter.com/SlashLurk/status/8950683392733102082 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So far despite matriarch and shield nerf sorc seems very good and comfortable in any range and situation. Devs took out some tools and provided replacement, maybe magsorc became more dependent on player's actions but new streak is just great+overload+range option completely viable...
OP completely wrong, devs always care about magsorc because it is most popular class in the game by huge margin and even with showy nerfs always provide something new. I.e. shields nerfed -> pets buffed. Pets nerfed -> streak+dots just amazing right now. Maybe rune cage is not that good, but all classes have meh or niche abilities and morphs. Now devs decided it's season of streak. Adapt and have fun.
DK on the other side received ton of nerfs and only replacement is changes to combustion which is questionable buff and increased damage of melee dots in meta of ranged dots.2
