What Ever Happened to Scathing Mage?

kylewwefan · August 2019

I’m going to share with you my super secret build. It’s so good. You’ll be wandering why isn’t anyone talking about this. Ok, it’s because all the cool kids are concerned with getting 100k DPS making sweet Love to some iron Atros and not actually playing the game.

So you’re gonna need that Trials gear. No getting around it. You’ve heard of it. Seen people linking and collecting it. It’s so good. On Every magic character ever. 5 years in the making for the Dev team to give us the Magicka Equivalent of Vicious Ophidian.

False God’s Devotion

This set is perfect in every way even in plain un-Perfected form. It’s a DPS Set, a Crit Set, and a sustain set all rolled into one. You need it in your life like yesterday.

Now what do you pair it with? Julianos? BSW? Spider? Netch? Sun?

Scathing Mage

This is a grind few are willing to contend with. But it is so good. Ok you caught me. I probably wouldn’t grind this out either, but I so happened to have a, Ice Staff and a couple lightning staves of it lying around. Sure an inferno would be better, but it’s still good and I Love it I’m sure you will too.

So the bad news is You’re gonna need That Scathing Destro Staff to really make it Pop. But it’s game changing. Just like A BSW Inferno.

Iceheart Monster Set it gives you some Crit, a Damage shield, and it does a little bit of DPS for you. It procs non stop. Really should be BiS for any magic based character trying to get through VMA and dungeons.

A Few Disclaimers

First off, know that I am bad. Meaning I’ll often set my skills out in the wrong place, have to reposition, roll dodge, heal up, start rotation over again etc. I’ll probably never “get good” in that aspect of things.

Secondly, I strongly detest beating on dummies to perfect a rotation, so some will very well likely do much better than I with the same gear. It is possible also that I’m kind of ok, so some will struggle to get up to my level.

So, sloppy rotation. Probably not the most efficient rotation, definitely not BiS gear combos. Arcane Jewelry. Apprentice Mundus for spell power.

So my results on the Mournful Aegis 6.4mil dummy are:

Warden w/ Scathing ice staff front Maelstrom Inferno back - 31kDPS

Necromancer w/ Scathing Lightning Front Maelstrom Inferno back 34kDPS

Edit to add a little:

Here is a small clip of it in action. Notice how magic sustain is not really an issue. And using tripots instead of spell power pots. And don’t worry about the game puking all over itself because that’s just what it does.

https://youtu.be/xsjT9d1I7M8

MartiniDaniels · August 2019

Or you may just use buffed OP Shadow mundus with mother sorrow which can be bought without any grind, pair it with false god and iceheart and have easy time almost everywhere if you are not running for scoreboards.

kylewwefan · August 2019

Sure. I tried Mother Sorrow and Spell Strat and BSW and Julianos. I don’t knkw what it is about Scathing, but it seems to work very good with my warden and necromancer.

MartiniDaniels · August 2019

kylewwefan wrote: »

Sure. I tried Mother Sorrow and Spell Strat and BSW and Julianos. I don’t knkw what it is about Scathing, but it seems to work very good with my warden and necromancer.

Well, I'm not saying that scathing is bad, it's simply fact that ZOS overbuffed Shadow mundus and now everybody, like monkeys, run with mother sorrow which doesn't have any quirks or downsides other then demand to be on back bar as less as possible.

Taleof2Cities · August 2019

kylewwefan wrote: »

Scathing Mage

This is a grind few are willing to contend with. But it is so good. Ok you caught me. I probably wouldn’t grind this out either, but I so happened to have a, Ice Staff and a couple lightning staves of it lying around. Sure an inferno would be better, but it’s still good and I Love it I’m sure you will too.

So the bad news is You’re gonna need That Scathing Destro Staff to really make it Pop. But it’s game changing. Just like A BSW Inferno.

BSW and Scathing Mage grinds are child’s play compared to getting Maelstrom 5-piece weapons.

Winterborn Ice Staff and Elemental Succession Inferno Staff ... those are grinds.

kylewwefan · August 2019

I have a few winterborn Ice Staff. It’s a really great set too. Only have lightning Staves of Succession. Gotta wait for the new patch to hit console to try them out. Currently, it’s not so great.

kojou · August 2019

I actually like that Mother's Sorrow doesn't have some gimicky stupid proc condition. I hope it and the Shadow Mundus stay BiS forever.

NBrookus · August 2019

I always find it amusing the gushing love over Briarheart but how Scathing Mage is ignored.

Runefang · August 2019

kojou wrote: »

I actually like that Mother's Sorrow doesn't have some gimicky stupid proc condition. I hope it and the Shadow Mundus stay BiS forever.

I doubt MS is still BiS because so much time gets split between front bar and back bar. It’s going to be more like BSW front bar when cleave is needed, Spell Strat otherwise.

Grandma · August 2019

Runefang wrote: »

kojou wrote: »

I actually like that Mother's Sorrow doesn't have some gimicky stupid proc condition. I hope it and the Shadow Mundus stay BiS forever.

I doubt MS is still BiS because so much time gets split between front bar and back bar. It’s going to be more like BSW front bar when cleave is needed, Spell Strat otherwise.

Nah. MS is still fine to front bar. On all my builds i have worked a way so that aside buffing i'm only casting 1 more skill on my back bar than before. casting 1 extra skill and LA isn't going to account for MS going from BiS to trash to front bar.

That being said, Scathing Mage is actually a really cool niche set and i'm glad OP stumbled across it. Pain in the extreme ass to farm though, otherwise i'd actually use it.

Runefang · August 2019

Grandma wrote: »

Runefang wrote: »

kojou wrote: »

I actually like that Mother's Sorrow doesn't have some gimicky stupid proc condition. I hope it and the Shadow Mundus stay BiS forever.

I doubt MS is still BiS because so much time gets split between front bar and back bar. It’s going to be more like BSW front bar when cleave is needed, Spell Strat otherwise.

Nah. MS is still fine to front bar. On all my builds i have worked a way so that aside buffing i'm only casting 1 more skill on my back bar than before. casting 1 extra skill and LA isn't going to account for MS going from BiS to trash to front bar.

That being said, Scathing Mage is actually a really cool niche set and i'm glad OP stumbled across it. Pain in the extreme ass to farm though, otherwise i'd actually use it.

I'll try it out tonight, you might be right but I know in my rotation I spent 40% of the time on my back bar which is 15% more than pre-Scalebreaker. It seems like a proc based front bar should be better now given that difference.

therift · August 2019

Khajit Necro with Scathing? Hmmm

Grandma · August 2019

Runefang wrote: »

Grandma wrote: »

Runefang wrote: »

kojou wrote: »

I actually like that Mother's Sorrow doesn't have some gimicky stupid proc condition. I hope it and the Shadow Mundus stay BiS forever.

I doubt MS is still BiS because so much time gets split between front bar and back bar. It’s going to be more like BSW front bar when cleave is needed, Spell Strat otherwise.

Nah. MS is still fine to front bar. On all my builds i have worked a way so that aside buffing i'm only casting 1 more skill on my back bar than before. casting 1 extra skill and LA isn't going to account for MS going from BiS to trash to front bar.

That being said, Scathing Mage is actually a really cool niche set and i'm glad OP stumbled across it. Pain in the extreme ass to farm though, otherwise i'd actually use it.

I'll try it out tonight, you might be right but I know in my rotation I spent 40% of the time on my back bar which is 15% more than pre-Scalebreaker. It seems like a proc based front bar should be better now given that difference.

yeah most of my friends i've been asking are reporting around 30-40%. I'm still not sure that's high enough to warrant a proc front bar, but i'm pretty addicted to MS/pFGD right now. If i got the scathing gear i needed i'd totally give it a shot though.

Faulgor · August 2019

Grandma wrote: »

Runefang wrote: »

kojou wrote: »

I actually like that Mother's Sorrow doesn't have some gimicky stupid proc condition. I hope it and the Shadow Mundus stay BiS forever.

I doubt MS is still BiS because so much time gets split between front bar and back bar. It’s going to be more like BSW front bar when cleave is needed, Spell Strat otherwise.

Nah. MS is still fine to front bar. On all my builds i have worked a way so that aside buffing i'm only casting 1 more skill on my back bar than before. casting 1 extra skill and LA isn't going to account for MS going from BiS to trash to front bar.

That being said, Scathing Mage is actually a really cool niche set and i'm glad OP stumbled across it. Pain in the extreme ass to farm though, otherwise i'd actually use it.

You could also try to get the destro staff from chests, the ones you can open with ... was it 150 tokens?
Probably expensive, but possible.

If people are looking for a cheap proc-set for front bar, there's still Mechanical Acuity. I haven't seen anyone talk about it, but it performed quite nicely for me since the Shadow mundus buff. Not for Necros, obviously.

kylewwefan · August 2019

I decided to drink a little more of my own cool aid last night and transmuted all my jewelry to Bloodthirsty on the necromancer. Wow! What a difference that made!

I got no math to back anything up but man it really seems to wreck stuff quick.

Considering upgrading Jewelry to legendary gold quality now. That would be kind of a major big step for me.

I tried farming imperial city prison for an Inferno Staff last night. I don’t know what it is with that place. Didn’t find one chest and my drops were poo. This could be a very nasty grind. Don’t think I can just run in here solo and have any kind of success.

NBrookus wrote: »

I always find it amusing the gushing love over Briarheart but how Scathing Mage is ignored.

Briarhearts has been one of my favorite Stam sets for quite some time. It may end up testing out about the same as Hundings Rage, but in practice it has such a bursty feel to it I’d recommend it to anyone.

It’s probably also why I’m digging the Scathing Mage so much right now. It feels so Bursty in action. I play stamina and magic characters very similar so maybe it just kind of works better for me in that regard. One day I might learn and get better.

Grandma · August 2019

Faulgor wrote: »

Grandma wrote: »

Runefang wrote: »

kojou wrote: »

I actually like that Mother's Sorrow doesn't have some gimicky stupid proc condition. I hope it and the Shadow Mundus stay BiS forever.

I doubt MS is still BiS because so much time gets split between front bar and back bar. It’s going to be more like BSW front bar when cleave is needed, Spell Strat otherwise.

Nah. MS is still fine to front bar. On all my builds i have worked a way so that aside buffing i'm only casting 1 more skill on my back bar than before. casting 1 extra skill and LA isn't going to account for MS going from BiS to trash to front bar.

That being said, Scathing Mage is actually a really cool niche set and i'm glad OP stumbled across it. Pain in the extreme ass to farm though, otherwise i'd actually use it.

You could also try to get the destro staff from chests, the ones you can open with ... was it 150 tokens?
Probably expensive, but possible.

If people are looking for a cheap proc-set for front bar, there's still Mechanical Acuity. I haven't seen anyone talk about it, but it performed quite nicely for me since the Shadow mundus buff. Not for Necros, obviously.

i've actually been talking about MA a bit lately. Unfortunately, this patch it took a drop in usage since nobody is using spammables anymore. Even a static NB rotation only has time for 1, 2, at themost 3 spams before having to reapply dots. just too many dots. I used to run it on my khajiit sorcerer though.

Most inferno staves are a pain in the butt to get- the overwhelming majority of magicka sets are dungeon/trial based, so your odds are pretty crappy. here's some less painful options though.

1) Master Architect
albeit this only works on templars, nightblades, and wardens. I front barred this on my magplar last patch and had pretty good uptimes. drops from a raid so you have 12 shots at getting it. I got mine after like 4 normal runs with the intent of farming it.

2) Elemental Succession. This is actually super good on DK and necromancer right now allegedly. Kinda annoying to get due to completing vma but there is a 2x event going on right now. I certainly have enough to body this set with all divines due to how many drops i've gotten.

3) Moondancer
I somehow lost all my pieces of this but I used to use this back before when your only other option was siroria on classes like sorc. the 5 piece is fun to use, resources are always needed on magsorc too.

Oreyn_Bearclaw · August 2019

Scathing was one of those sets that everyone thought was going to be the end all be all like 4 years ago, and it just never panned out. False God is the new obvious meta set for the vast majority of content. But why would I grind Scathing (Not that I would need to as I have tons of the stuff), when I can just front bar MS that ultimately gives more DPS?

If you want to call out dummy humpers for running siroria and make the claim that FG is a better all around set for actual content, I am on board. You are trading raw damage for utility, which is a fair trade off away from a dummy. FG is really hard to beat as a trial damage set in actual content, even though siroria is more dummy DPS

But the same logic doesnt hold for scathing. It's perhaps a bit burstier than MS, but from a raw damage perspective, its just not as good, and you have essentially no control over when the set procs. Both are damage sets, nothing more, and one is objectively better than the other. They have no utility to speak of, so your trial dummy argument makes no sense.

kaithuzar · August 2019

My opinion of BiS for magicka toons:

Trials:
2x slimecraw or 1x slimecraw & 1x ice heart, or 2x skoria (I’ve heard Zaan is bugged on some bosses & range was nerfed to 8m)
1x perfected asylum (inferno)
1x maelstrom (lightening or inferno)
5x perfected false gods
3x willpower (gold jewelry either all infused or 2x infused & 1x bloodthirsty)
1x recovery & 2x spell dmg
High elf, shadow mundus

Maelstrom
2x ice heart
5x perfected false gods
1x maelstrom inferno
1x Perfected BRP Resto (you could also use perfected asylum resto)
3x willpower (same as above)

kylewwefan · August 2019

If I could get my hands on a Perfected Asylum Inferno, sure. Yes. I’d Love to have one. Or 6. But that hasn’t happened since Clockwork came out or the years since.

Same thing with the Perfected False God. Don’t have but one piece of that yet. And Perfected Siroria Or Relequen they’re way far off the list of anything I’ll be getting my hands on anytime soon.

You might find this hard to believe, but not many people can do those trials even now. (Without paying) They’ll probably have to nerf them into irrelevance before I get a shot at it.

Oreyn_Bearclaw, do you have an abundance of Mother’s Sorrow to sell? Just kidding! I get the feeling like you kind of know your stuff. But I don’t know what it is with that set. It gets no Love from me.

Everyone and their brother promotes “Mother Sorrow” like it is so good. I don’t get it? I have a set. A couple of overpriced inferno staves. Sigh, gold jewelry. It doesn’t pop. I don’t get it. Not that great to me.

Feels like I’d be better off with Julianos, or BSW or something else. Spell strat pops. Kind of. Against one mob. Every six seconds. That mob is gonna be dead in 2 seconds. Similar reasons why I rarely ever use Zaans that I had to get cause it’s so great. I find Iceheart far better in every situation.

BSW is good. Not so great with lightning staves or ice staves. That’s probably why I’m digging Scathing. That Ice Staff, that does nothing for DPS; is very easy to weave with. Because remember, I’m kind of bad. I pick up on these minor details.

kaithuzar · August 2019

Yea best option until getting perfected false god is probably bsw or julianos.

I’ve often wondered if treasure hunter could be a replacement for mother’s sorrow because it saves you the bar slot of using mage light, now that everyone’s slotting the soul skill.

kylewwefan · August 2019

It’s like them people at ZOS were following me thread. Of course I had to pick up a couple Sweet gold necklace from the golden vendor. I ran ICP about 10 times over the weekend. Got another lightning staff. I’d be ok with a Scathing Ice Staff, but inferno would be nice.

On a side note, I got a precise BSW Inferno yesterday! It’s how this game works. Farm hard for one thing, pick up something else to distract me.

I Pug a lot btw.

Oreyn_Bearclaw · August 2019

kylewwefan wrote: »

If I could get my hands on a Perfected Asylum Inferno, sure. Yes. I’d Love to have one. Or 6. But that hasn’t happened since Clockwork came out or the years since.

Same thing with the Perfected False God. Don’t have but one piece of that yet. And Perfected Siroria Or Relequen they’re way far off the list of anything I’ll be getting my hands on anytime soon.

You might find this hard to believe, but not many people can do those trials even now. (Without paying) They’ll probably have to nerf them into irrelevance before I get a shot at it.

Oreyn_Bearclaw, do you have an abundance of Mother’s Sorrow to sell? Just kidding! I get the feeling like you kind of know your stuff. But I don’t know what it is with that set. It gets no Love from me.

Everyone and their brother promotes “Mother Sorrow” like it is so good. I don’t get it? I have a set. A couple of overpriced inferno staves. Sigh, gold jewelry. It doesn’t pop. I don’t get it. Not that great to me.

Feels like I’d be better off with Julianos, or BSW or something else. Spell strat pops. Kind of. Against one mob. Every six seconds. That mob is gonna be dead in 2 seconds. Similar reasons why I rarely ever use Zaans that I had to get cause it’s so great. I find Iceheart far better in every situation.

BSW is good. Not so great with lightning staves or ice staves. That’s probably why I’m digging Scathing. That Ice Staff, that does nothing for DPS; is very easy to weave with. Because remember, I’m kind of bad. I pick up on these minor details.

MS weapons are actually a pretty easy chest farm, and the jewelry drops like candy from dolmens. I used to farm MS chests back when I played BGs and was always waiting in a queue. I have tons of the stuff, because it's a go to front bar set for just about any magic toon. MS is far and away an easier farm the ICP in my opinion, and its BOE, so if the farm drags, you can just pay gold. ICP is a pretty painful farm if you are after weapons. Not a terribly hard dungeon, but it is one of the longer ones.

MS is hyped because it does the most damage. If Scathing did more, it would be hyped. If scathing were easier to acquire than MS, it would perhaps be a good alternative, but its not. As far as gear goes, overland gear is right behind crafted gear in terms of ease of acquisition.

Only two real reasons to turn down a meta DPS set. 1. It's hard to acquire (not the case with MS). 2. You are willing to trade max DPS potential for utility (not the case when comparing MS to Scathing).

OG_Kaveman · August 2019

They need to up the proc chance to like 25% for this set to be worth anything, especially in this dot meta we got going on.

Kel · August 2019

I use Mother's Sorrow and Scathing Mage on my magnecro.

It's really good.
I'm sitting on around 70% crit. With the necro passives, anything below 25% basically blows up.

(Of course, I don't have Scalebreaker yet, being on PS4, so take that with a grain of salt...)

svendf · August 2019

Started to collect Scathing Mage a month or so ago. Something got me interested in that set.

kringled_1 · August 2019

Kel wrote: »

I use Mother's Sorrow and Scathing Mage on my magnecro.

It's really good.
I'm sitting on around 70% crit. With the necro passives, anything below 25% basically blows up.

(Of course, I don't have Scalebreaker yet, being on PS4, so take that with a grain of salt...)

This is the combination I'm curious about, since I have a scathing mage inferno staff (byproduct of getting some leeching plate pieces). But I'm not sure post Scalebreaker what builds if any have enough front bar direct damage to be worth using.

OG_Kaveman · August 2019

kringled_1 wrote: »

Kel wrote: »

I use Mother's Sorrow and Scathing Mage on my magnecro.

It's really good.
I'm sitting on around 70% crit. With the necro passives, anything below 25% basically blows up.

(Of course, I don't have Scalebreaker yet, being on PS4, so take that with a grain of salt...)

This is the combination I'm curious about, since I have a scathing mage inferno staff (byproduct of getting some leeching plate pieces). But I'm not sure post Scalebreaker what builds if any have enough front bar direct damage to be worth using.

It's not worth using if you are not using force pulse.

kringled_1 · August 2019

I guess it will probably just stay in the storage coffer then until I have a build that does. Thanks for the input.

BNOC · August 2019

Not a PvE related response but I farmed Scathing mage recently to try on a Magplar in PVP, need one more piece still and got tired of the grind as you suggested haha - I will finish it.

I seen so many people running strategist and thought, on paper, scathing mage looked better for an aggressive type and especially in vX situations.

I didn't know if there was an ICD on the proc so was under the impression it would be 100% uptime - Do you know, having tested it?

kylewwefan · August 2019

I don’t know how %10 extra Crit chance on one bar can be worth so much more than 500 Spell damage. Can’t really argue with ya; you guys got math we can’t even dream of on console.

Yes, I use force pulse/ crushing shock. It might not be the best, but I like it.

Again with the console, there’s not really a good way to test uptime with accuracy. It procs a lot but I don’t think it’s %100 up time. I dont know?

OG_Kaveman · August 2019

BNOC wrote: »

Not a PvE related response but I farmed Scathing mage recently to try on a Magplar in PVP, need one more piece still and got tired of the grind as you suggested haha - I will finish it.

I seen so many people running strategist and thought, on paper, scathing mage looked better for an aggressive type and especially in vX situations.

I didn't know if there was an ICD on the proc so was under the impression it would be 100% uptime - Do you know, having tested it?

The proc from scathing mage has a 6 second cool down, as long as the proc is. Meaning you can't proc it while it is up.

kylewwefan wrote: »

I don’t know how %10 extra Crit chance on one bar can be worth so much more than 500 Spell damage. Can’t really argue with ya; you guys got math we can’t even dream of on console.

Yes, I use force pulse/ crushing shock. It might not be the best, but I like it.

Again with the console, there’s not really a good way to test uptime with accuracy. It procs a lot but I don’t think it’s %100 up time. I dont know?

Because you will never get close to 100% uptime. Best I have seen, I do have a fire staff and use force pulse on my magblade with MS, so 70+% crit, is like 50-60% uptime. That leads to an average of 250-300 spell damage. If you run a front bar MS inferno, you, in a good rotation, spend at least 60% of your time on that bar. Whether this is better or worse is up to you.

Side note, I would do bad things for a mag version of Tzogvin's Warband. Would make all this a moo point.