NB leech tank - comments on my build?

Mariusghost84 · August 2019

I made a NB tank build that focuses on selfsustain and i would love some input from you guys. This is the first build ive ever come up with on my own. What inspired me was the curiosity to try out an other class than DK for veteran dungeon tanking.

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildEditor?id=168470

1. Did i miss anything crucial in my build?
2. Could this work - yes - and if not - why not?

Curious to what you guys think

Lisutaris · August 2019

No silver leash. No grp Support sets.
5/10 because it looks like it will be able to be useful in some situations like vdsa boss kiting.
Well, and maybe useful for unexp Tanks /players.

FrancisCrawford · August 2019

I haven't tried it in practice yet at all, but there's a lot to be attracted to in NB tanking, including:

Taunt: 1H&S, Undaunted, or ice heavy attack (Do you need all three?)
Breach/Fracture: 1H&S taunt or Reaper's Mark
Personal shield: Defensive Stance or Bone Shield
Self-heal (Health-based): Reaper's Mark (trash fights only) or Dark Cloak (note that the latter procs Major Ward/Resolve)
Major Evasion: Mirage (if you don't have a healer who'll give you Minor Ward/Resolve via Combat Prayer) or the other morph (if you run with real healers)
Minor Maim: Heroic Slash or Dark Shade (AoE and procs Major Ward/Resolve)
Immobilization: Mass Hysteria (also briefly cuts incoming damage) or Bombard (also procs backbar enchant)
Extra damage reduction: Grim Focus (either morph)
Sustain: Siphoning Strikes (either morph, but probably Leeching), plus some passives
Chain: Silver Leash
Backbar enchant proc: Endless Hail (bow) or Wall of Elements (staff)

I'd pick 10 non-ultimate skills mainly or entirely from those, perhaps switching loadouts somewhat between trash and boss fights. Despite my usual magicka bias, I might go bow in this case.

NB also has couple of interesting class ultimates.

Unij · August 2019

I've tried these sets some time ago, and I called it afk-tank, when you combine it with Malubeth instead.

I would add some more nb skills to your repertoire, like Mark Target (fast heal, when the target dies, just make sure to mark something with already low health), Teleport Strike or Invasion from 1H&S as gapcloser, Consuming Darkness for Damage Reduction, very important Aspekt of Terror your only class-CC, Summon Shade to reduce the enemies damage, Soul Shred for selfheal also Drain Power, Grim Focus, destro skills like Force Pulse as Ranged Interrupt, Elemental Blockade to slow down Enemies. The Vampire Skills, all of them can be useful, best is in my opinion Mist form because of Damage Reduction. Silver Bolts from Fighters Guild, I think I don't need to explain why. Barrier is really useful, Purge if you want to run HoF trial. With all these skills you are prepared for all dungeons and trials. Pvp is something completely different.

mocap · August 2019

or you could just "Meditate" incoming damage instead of ton of selfheal sets and skills.

FrancisCrawford · August 2019

mocap wrote: »

or you could just "Meditate" incoming damage instead of ton of selfheal sets and skills.

In what content does that suffice?

mocap · August 2019

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

In what content does that suffice?

any vet hm dungeons.
Did vMHK several times with PUG team and completely without a healer. With DK though )

Lisutaris · August 2019

But in which scenario would you use any other set instead of yolna+alkosh in a 4ppl setup? That is around 5k dps per dd extra. Less boss fight time, less need for selfheal, block,....
As long as a tank is able to survive with these sets, i will call survival Equipment a bad choice.
edit: ebon instead alkosh would be still supporting and more defensive for the tank. No class skill can give the grp as much as these sets.
edit2: for vet hm... Tanking healing and dps ing should be less about your role and more about "how to Support your grp". In normal vet dungeons it does not matter, but i like to get boosted as a dd

FrancisCrawford · August 2019

Lisutaris wrote: »

But in which scenario would you use any other set instead of yolna+alkosh in a 4ppl setup? That is around 5k dps per dd extra. Less boss fight time, less need for selfheal, block,....
As long as a tank is able to survive with these sets, i will call survival Equipment a bad choice.
edit: ebon instead alkosh would be still supporting and more defensive for the tank. No class skill can give the grp as much as these sets.

Not everybody who runs dungeons also runs trials. But yes, Alkosh has always been abusrdly overpowered.

Gatviper · August 2019

I'd be careful with vampire stage 4 when tanking, fire will get you down very quickly even with 40k or more health, and as a tank you don't want to be dying to the group.

Lisutaris · August 2019

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

Lisutaris wrote: »

But in which scenario would you use any other set instead of yolna+alkosh in a 4ppl setup? That is around 5k dps per dd extra. Less boss fight time, less need for selfheal, block,....
As long as a tank is able to survive with these sets, i will call survival Equipment a bad choice.
edit: ebon instead alkosh would be still supporting and more defensive for the tank. No class skill can give the grp as much as these sets.

Not everybody who runs dungeons also runs trials. But yes, Alkosh has always been abusrdly overpowered.

Its also one of the best setups for 4ppl content.
Sets for support and skills for survival is the way to go as tank. NB tanks are a good choice if the player can manage to use the silver leash well.

MartiniDaniels · August 2019

This is great fun build for tanking base vets with pugs, but bad for any content of serious difficulty. Well, I can imagine some encounters where this sets can carry when group dps is really bad, but those are too rare to keep this sets in backpack.

Still, I used leeching+ebon just for testing after buff and it carried me in vFL on last stage cause I was able to res surrounded by ton of skeles while dragon was doing his breath attack.

So if you really want to use leeching for fun effect (for example to hear warden's voice when you rise shield lol), I think you can use it in pair with ebon or yolna in dungeons. Really who cares about 5% of pug dps? If dps are good, they will deal with anything if you provide major breach/fracture + infused crusher + mob control and boss aggro and fulfill mechanics. And if dps are bad extra 150 wd/sd or 3k pen won't help them.

MartiniDaniels · August 2019

Lisutaris wrote: »

But in which scenario would you use any other set instead of yolna+alkosh in a 4ppl setup? That is around 5k dps per dd extra. Less boss fight time, less need for selfheal, block,....
As long as a tank is able to survive with these sets, i will call survival Equipment a bad choice.
edit: ebon instead alkosh would be still supporting and more defensive for the tank. No class skill can give the grp as much as these sets.
edit2: for vet hm... Tanking healing and dps ing should be less about your role and more about "how to Support your grp". In normal vet dungeons it does not matter, but i like to get boosted as a dd

On many vdlc bosses with ton of mechanics and movement alkosh is just a waste because chance to have synergy in time is pretty low, well maybe on necro tank it is better, but on others...
Imo yolna +ebon/PA/torug are generally more reliable combinations. I personally have all those 5 sets linked in dressing room in different combinations and love switching them on the run several times during dungeon

Huyen · August 2019

And once again it comes down to this: follow the meta or suck in anything you do.

Blackleopardex · August 2019

Very very old setup, easy to survive but there are better sets for that too, like seducer, spam more orbs -heal yourself and allies while supporting sustain.. just one exsample. Ofc, optimally you would use stuff like Alkosh/torugs/Yolnah/symphony.. I do that and still self sustain on NB-tank.

FrancisCrawford · August 2019

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Very very old setup, easy to survive but there are better sets for that too, like seducer, spam more orbs -heal yourself and allies while supporting sustain.. just one exsample. Ofc, optimally you would use stuff like Alkosh/torugs/Yolnah/symphony.. I do that and still self sustain on NB-tank.

Only until Update 23.

Nemesis7884 · August 2019

for more group support you could exchange bloodspawn and bahraha with battalion defender and warden or nightflame....

with nightflame and bat defender you still have alot self heal but support the group more

sr

dragon guard and ebon r also options

Blackleopardex · August 2019

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Very very old setup, easy to survive but there are better sets for that too, like seducer, spam more orbs -heal yourself and allies while supporting sustain.. just one exsample. Ofc, optimally you would use stuff like Alkosh/torugs/Yolnah/symphony.. I do that and still self sustain on NB-tank.

Only until Update 23.

?

RavenSworn · August 2019

Huyen wrote: »

And once again it comes down to this: follow the meta or suck in anything you do.

"If you are nothing without the meta, you don't deserve the meta." - Tony stank.

kylewwefan · August 2019

This is Gilliam’s build from years ago, but with bloodspawn instead of Malubeth the scourge.

For group utility, add in a blood alter and throw out some orbs. You’ll do fine. Remember to put some shield play enchants on your jewelry. Get rid of the Stam recovery mundus and pick up the max health one or something else.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · August 2019

Blackleopardex wrote: »

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Very very old setup, easy to survive but there are better sets for that too, like seducer, spam more orbs -heal yourself and allies while supporting sustain.. just one exsample. Ofc, optimally you would use stuff like Alkosh/torugs/Yolnah/symphony.. I do that and still self sustain on NB-tank.

Only until Update 23.

?

Next patch you can only have 1 orb out at a time. Though all players in the path of the orb can synergize it without the orb going away.

max_only · August 2019

This brings back memories. Nb tank is good for pledges, but anyone slotting a taunt and blocking is good for pledges so that’s not saying much.

I had a main, nb saptank that I was building for trials and then they ruined it. I turned it into a dodgetank for at least dlc vet dungeons and they ruined that. Nb tanks are gone.

Suddwrath · August 2019

max_only wrote: »

Nb tanks are gone.

NB tanks are alive and well. They are actually in a very good spot right now due to their high damage mitigation and HoT. NB tanks are also the best class for main-tanking vSS.

However, the classic “sap” tank is a different story. I doubt those will ever come back the way that they used to be.

Lisutaris · August 2019

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Lisutaris wrote: »

But in which scenario would you use any other set instead of yolna+alkosh in a 4ppl setup? That is around 5k dps per dd extra. Less boss fight time, less need for selfheal, block,....
As long as a tank is able to survive with these sets, i will call survival Equipment a bad choice.
edit: ebon instead alkosh would be still supporting and more defensive for the tank. No class skill can give the grp as much as these sets.
edit2: for vet hm... Tanking healing and dps ing should be less about your role and more about "how to Support your grp". In normal vet dungeons it does not matter, but i like to get boosted as a dd

On many vdlc bosses with ton of mechanics and movement alkosh is just a waste because chance to have synergy in time is pretty low, well maybe on necro tank it is better, but on others...
Imo yolna +ebon/PA/torug are generally more reliable combinations. I personally have all those 5 sets linked in dressing room in different combinations and love switching them on the run several times during dungeon

This.
I see only grp support sets, which get changed per situation. Therefore excellent tank.

An acceptable tank is some1 with ego sets and a taunt. Everything inbetween would be a good one.

Decide it yourself, what you want to be.
Playing a tank is not thinking about you, but grp friends.
IF the healer is also building around ego sets and dont give a damn about spc/olorime and running 2h crushee backbar...
If a dd tells me he does not feel the difference in his dps he is lying to me. Same goes for usinf warhorn instead of a tanking or healing ult.

Good dps numbers will get awesome, and crappy ones less awful. In both situations the grp gets benefits if the healer and tank do their job... And Support.

Again 5/10.its good but that is all.
~lisu

exeeter702 · August 2019

Mariusghost84 wrote: »

I made a NB tank build that focuses on selfsustain and i would love some input from you guys. This is the first build ive ever come up with on my own. What inspired me was the curiosity to try out an other class than DK for veteran dungeon tanking.

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildEditor?id=168470

1. Did i miss anything crucial in my build?
2. Could this work - yes - and if not - why not?

Curious to what you guys think

Leeching and barahas are not useful. Use ebon and maybe torugs.

Go nord intead of imp

BS is good.

Silver leesh is good

Drop meditate, go vamp, and slot ult gen vamp drain. Jewelry traits changed to infused with pot cd enchants for max uptime on catalyst passive.
With these 2 changes along with going nord you will enjoy the highest warhorn uptime of any tank. Vamp negatives are entirely manageable.

Frost path is good but make sure torugs and crusher enchant are on that bar.

Blur is situational, consider it a flex spot. Power extraction is a better option next patch as a siphoning skill you can throw out every 4 seconds and provides a unique mob debuff unavailable to other tanks.

Remember, you want to have access to a usable cheap siphoning skill you can throw out every 4 seconds (siphoning attacks is not that) to maximize ult gen via the transfer passive.

NB tanks are absolutely not gone and absolutely can function up to vet trials.

Blackleopardex · August 2019

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Very very old setup, easy to survive but there are better sets for that too, like seducer, spam more orbs -heal yourself and allies while supporting sustain.. just one exsample. Ofc, optimally you would use stuff like Alkosh/torugs/Yolnah/symphony.. I do that and still self sustain on NB-tank.

Only until Update 23.

?

Next patch you can only have 1 orb out at a time. Though all players in the path of the orb can synergize it without the orb going away.

And??? Whats the issue? Use one orb/healthy offering/refreshing path and sap gets a buff(about time) ect.. many things to do as tank...
The main point of what I'm saying is, if you wanna go defensive/selfish there are better sets out there, for example alteration/seducer/stonekeeper/jorvuld(also group buff)... The sets you use will only make you a bag on sand that enough targets can use as a punching bag. Yes you can get heals from these sets, but how do they make you self sustain? Trust me, been tanking on NB for many years and I have tested most sets for soloing endgame content, and similar stuff, I even think i have a video on vCoAII solo where i use this setup on a boss..

Blackleopardex · August 2019

-double post-

Mariusghost84 · August 2019

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Very very old setup, easy to survive but there are better sets for that too, like seducer, spam more orbs -heal yourself and allies while supporting sustain.. just one exsample. Ofc, optimally you would use stuff like Alkosh/torugs/Yolnah/symphony.. I do that and still self sustain on NB-tank.

Only until Update 23.

?

Next patch you can only have 1 orb out at a time. Though all players in the path of the orb can synergize it without the orb going away.

And??? Whats the issue? Use one orb/healthy offering/refreshing path and sap gets a buff(about time) ect.. many things to do as tank...
The main point of what I'm saying is, if you wanna go defensive/selfish there are better sets out there, for example alteration/seducer/stonekeeper/jorvuld(also group buff)... The sets you use will only make you a bag on sand that enough targets can use as a punching bag. Yes you can get heals from these sets, but how do they make you self sustain? Trust me, been tanking on NB for many years and I have tested most sets for soloing endgame content, and similar stuff, I even think i have a video on vCoAII solo where i use this setup on a boss..

THank you very much for your input. Am i to understand that with the setup i suggested, i am going to have major issues with sustain?

Mariusghost84 · August 2019

exeeter702 wrote: »

Mariusghost84 wrote: »

I made a NB tank build that focuses on selfsustain and i would love some input from you guys. This is the first build ive ever come up with on my own. What inspired me was the curiosity to try out an other class than DK for veteran dungeon tanking.

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildEditor?id=168470

1. Did i miss anything crucial in my build?
2. Could this work - yes - and if not - why not?

Curious to what you guys think

Leeching and barahas are not useful. Use ebon and maybe torugs.

Go nord intead of imp

BS is good.

Silver leesh is good

Drop meditate, go vamp, and slot ult gen vamp drain. Jewelry traits changed to infused with pot cd enchants for max uptime on catalyst passive.
With these 2 changes along with going nord you will enjoy the highest warhorn uptime of any tank. Vamp negatives are entirely manageable.

Frost path is good but make sure torugs and crusher enchant are on that bar.

Blur is situational, consider it a flex spot. Power extraction is a better option next patch as a siphoning skill you can throw out every 4 seconds and provides a unique mob debuff unavailable to other tanks.

Remember, you want to have access to a usable cheap siphoning skill you can throw out every 4 seconds (siphoning attacks is not that) to maximize ult gen via the transfer passive.

NB tanks are absolutely not gone and absolutely can function up to vet trials.

Appriciate the input. Thank you very much. I had to google catalyst passive, didnt really know it was a thing. Do you think sustain will be an issue on a build like this?

Blackleopardex · August 2019

Mariusghost84 wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Very very old setup, easy to survive but there are better sets for that too, like seducer, spam more orbs -heal yourself and allies while supporting sustain.. just one exsample. Ofc, optimally you would use stuff like Alkosh/torugs/Yolnah/symphony.. I do that and still self sustain on NB-tank.

Only until Update 23.

?

Next patch you can only have 1 orb out at a time. Though all players in the path of the orb can synergize it without the orb going away.

And??? Whats the issue? Use one orb/healthy offering/refreshing path and sap gets a buff(about time) ect.. many things to do as tank...
The main point of what I'm saying is, if you wanna go defensive/selfish there are better sets out there, for example alteration/seducer/stonekeeper/jorvuld(also group buff)... The sets you use will only make you a bag on sand that enough targets can use as a punching bag. Yes you can get heals from these sets, but how do they make you self sustain? Trust me, been tanking on NB for many years and I have tested most sets for soloing endgame content, and similar stuff, I even think i have a video on vCoAII solo where i use this setup on a boss..

THank you very much for your input. Am i to understand that with the setup i suggested, i am going to have major issues with sustain?

Well you called it a self-sustaining build. The thing is, you can probably sustain this as well(what you setup), with the right skills. However, when I do random runs as tank, if the content is hard and the heals/dps is bad enough i drop support sets like torugs/yolnahkriin/alkosh/symphony ect. and put in maybe on body seducer and on rings/neck/weapons Jorvould. Jorvould is still a good support set because you increase: Major force(warhorn), Minor Mending(healthy offering), major expedition(refreshing path), Minor protection(dark cloak), Minor heroism(heroic slash), major resolve/ward and more(depending on skill)- as well as recovery for yourself(win-win), op tank set. With seducer you can spam for exsample sap essence more for heals(also the group) you can use a frost-staff on back-bar to have the option to block with magicka(fun playstyle). You can also use stuff like funnel(not that great tbh) or swallow or if needed purge(on some bosses). Instead of using your set to give yourself directly heals, use the sets to give you the sustain to heal and support. Alteration is even stronger when it comes to this, it reduces both mag and stam skills(silver leash beeing important for chaining) and the ultimate get slightly cheaper on top of that. If you wanna talk more NB tank, message me private!

Ufretin · August 2019

SaltySudd wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

Nb tanks are gone.

NB tanks are alive and well. They are actually in a very good spot right now due to their high damage mitigation and HoT.

And that's why Grim Focus is being nerfed with U23. ZOS don't want NBs to tank, period.