Maintenance for the week of December 22:
• [COMPLETE] NA megaservers for maintenance – December 22, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 8:00AM EST (13:00 UTC)
• [COMPLETE] EU megaservers for maintenance – December 22, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 8:00AM EST (13:00 UTC)
• [COMPLETE] NA megaservers for maintenance – December 22, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 8:00AM EST (13:00 UTC)
• [COMPLETE] EU megaservers for maintenance – December 22, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 8:00AM EST (13:00 UTC)
Bosmer/Wood Elf, another open letter about stealth, combat abilities and flavor
-
Elijah_Crow✭✭✭✭✭
✭Bosmer are fine with the exception of the removal of Stealth radius. Giving detection radius which is really a PvP ability as NPC’s “Can’t be bothered to stealth”, was a horrible move.
1. It’s the only racial which is PvP focused.
2. It breaks established lore from other Elder Scrolls games.
3. Would have been better suited to Khajiit with their established “Night Eye” ability from other Elder Scrolls games.
4. Funnels new players into playing Khajiit if they are interested in stealth gameplay as they are now the only race with a bonus to stealth. It tells them this right on the character creation screen that this is the race they should choose to be stealthy.
5. When this was taken away a Dev note said the 3 meter reduction would be added to other skill lines to allow the same play style and so far this isn’t true.
6. This forced players who have enjoyed the stealth gameplay for the last 5 years to race change or give up playing as they have.
Rich @ZOS_RichLambert and Finn commented at Pax East/Bethesda Game Days on something similar in regards to changes. When asked about adding vampire and werewolf to justice system reactions like Necromancer, they commented that it’s much different when you take away the ability to play a certain way after many years. That’s exactly whats happened here.
All of this has been pointed out previously. Any rational developer would see reverting this one piece of the racial change and giving the stealth reduction back in place of detection is the right thing to do. It’s good for race diversity in the game, it’s good for the players, it preserves the lore, etc. there is no downside.
Whoever is responsible for this change believes their “vision” of how things should be is more important than all of this and refuses to swallow their pride and do the right thing.Edited by Elijah_Crow on July 8, 2019 7:44PM10 -
Elijah_Crow✭✭✭✭✭
✭Oh, I should have mentioned the dodge roll and increased penetration after. This is just silly.2 -
Nerouyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The loss of their stealth bonus was a hard hit, and seems not to fit to the lore.
Rubbing my crystal ball....
I would guess that they're seriously considering doing away with racials. Or at least stealth bonus ones. Because Elsweyr essentially buffed stealth for everyone.
With the darloc brae set giving stealth detection reduction at 4 pieces instead of 5, it means you can wear that plus night terror with its reduction at 3 pieces and either night mother's embrace for another reduction at 5 pieces or night's silence for the speed increase.
Presently a vampire khajiit can get mad stealth buffs. Which might be over-poweredness by design intended to have players crying "nerf that!". Plus there's all the bosmer upset about losing their stealth bonus. The easiest solution would be for no race to have a stealth bonus.0 -
thegreatme✭✭✭✭✭The easiest solution would be for no race to have a stealth bonus.
Which would then lead to 10 "give khajiit their stealth back" outrage threads saying how khajiit got screwed over lolThank You ZoS!:
◙ Blackfeather Court banker/merchant
◙ Blackfeather Houseguest
◙ Eyebright Raven
◙ Gloam Indrik
◙ Gloam Wolf Mount
◙ Gloam Senche
◙ Gloam Quasigriff
◙ Evergloam house
◙ Nocturnal Skill Styles
Let's See It Happen ZoS:
◙ /honorloop emote
◙ cross-legged sitting emote
◙ Hagraven Polymorph
◙ Hagraven Houseguest
◙ White Raven
◙ Evergloam Shade skin/polymorph
◙ Gloam bear4 -
Taloros✭✭✭✭Removing all racials (or reducing them to skill line XP bonus) would be a good idea. More variety, less balancing issues. It would also prevent ill-guided decisions like removing Bosmer stealth and replacing it with a completely OP PvP super skill like stealth detection.
Just this morning, I solo conquered Chalman keep by out-detecting the other team. It was glorious, but it also felt cheesy to just win by using an OP racial passive.1 -
anadandy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Elijah_Crow wrote: »Bosmer are fine with the exception of the removal of Stealth radius. Giving detection radius which is really a PvP ability as NPC’s “Can’t be bothered to stealth”, was a horrible move.
1. It’s the only racial which is PvP focused.
2. It breaks established lore from other Elder Scrolls games.
3. Would have been better suited to Khajiit with their established “Night Eye” ability from other Elder Scrolls games.
4. Funnels new players into playing Khajiit if they are interested in stealth gameplay as they are now the only race with a bonus to stealth. It tells them this right on the character creation screen that this is the race they should choose to be stealthy.
5. When this was taken away a Dev note said the 3 meter reduction would be added to other skill lines to allow the same play style and so far this isn’t true.
6. This forced players who have enjoyed the stealth gameplay for the last 5 years to race change or give up playing as they have.
Rich @ZOS_RichLambert and Finn commented at Pax East/Bethesda Game Days on something similar in regards to changes. When asked about adding vampire and werewolf to justice system reactions like Necromancer, they commented that it’s much different when you take away the ability to play a certain way after many years. That’s exactly whats happened here.
All of this has been pointed out previously. Any rational developer would see reverting this one piece of the racial change and giving the stealth reduction back in place of detection is the right thing to do. It’s good for race diversity in the game, it’s good for the players, it preserves the lore, etc. there is no downside.
Whoever is responsible for this change believes their “vision” of how things should be is more important than all of this and refuses to swallow their pride and do the right thing.
Agree with all of this. Rich also made that same type of comment in an interview as to why they won't get rid of animation cancelling- because it's been 5 years and people are used to it and they'd alienate players by taking it away. The inconsistency in how this is applied is troublesome at best. Reverting detection back to reduction would unbalance nothing.6 -
thegreatme✭✭✭✭✭Agree with all of this. Rich also made that same type of comment in an interview as to why they won't get rid of animation cancelling- because it's been 5 years and people are used to it and they'd alienate players by taking it away. The inconsistency in how this is applied is troublesome at best. Reverting detection back to reduction would unbalance nothing.
Which is why its so silly for them not to have just done it by now tbh, unless they're thinking by rolling back one thing, people will start demanding other roll-backs.
But its really all just speculation at this point because we haven't gotten a proper answer on if they are even considering this.Thank You ZoS!:
◙ Blackfeather Court banker/merchant
◙ Blackfeather Houseguest
◙ Eyebright Raven
◙ Gloam Indrik
◙ Gloam Wolf Mount
◙ Gloam Senche
◙ Gloam Quasigriff
◙ Evergloam house
◙ Nocturnal Skill Styles
Let's See It Happen ZoS:
◙ /honorloop emote
◙ cross-legged sitting emote
◙ Hagraven Polymorph
◙ Hagraven Houseguest
◙ White Raven
◙ Evergloam Shade skin/polymorph
◙ Gloam bear1 -
Jaraal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭thegreatme wrote: »
But its really all just speculation at this point because we haven't gotten a proper answer on if they are even considering this.
My guess is that pride is more important than happy customers. Nobody wants to admit they made a mistake. So they would rather hear our objections for years to come, rather have players forever puzzled by quest dialogues regarding Bosmer stealth, rather hope people forget that Bosmer have been stealthy for 20+ years. But the reality is that rather than making things right and people moving on and forgetting about a questionable decision..... it will remain a topic for discussion as long as this game lasts.7 -
nsmurfer✭✭✭✭✭thegreatme wrote: »
But its really all just speculation at this point because we haven't gotten a proper answer on if they are even considering this.
My guess is that pride is more important than happy customers. Nobody wants to admit they made a mistake. So they would rather hear our objections for years to come, rather have players forever puzzled by quest dialogues regarding Bosmer stealth, rather hope people forget that Bosmer have been stealthy for 20+ years. But the reality is that rather than making things right and people moving on and forgetting about a questionable decision..... it will remain a topic for discussion as long as this game lasts.
Bosmer stealth issue is not even close to bigger issues that ZOS ignored. During Morrowind patch, sustain was destroyed from what it was earlier and Templar got nerfed to the ground and lost iconic buffs including Major Mending, which was its class identity. It got named as the Templar funeral and the major sustain nerf. There were multiple posts with 100+ pages, filled with people hoping to change ZOS minds from the first week, which got closed by ZOS. Some of the games biggest streamers, Deltia and Sypher threatened to quit. Over half of PvE and PvP guilds threatened to quit(1st time, both PvE and PvPers teamed up).
What did ZOS do? Ignored every one and started banning the people, who spammed the forums. When Morrowind came, over half of the game's original playerbase quit. But the huge influx of new players for Morrowind meant that none of it mattered financially to ZoS. The endgame trial population and PvP population have still not recovered completely.Edited by nsmurfer on July 12, 2019 7:43AM3 -
A_Silverius✭✭✭✭✭Currently, their stats don't give them much of an identity, in my opinion. For example, Orcs are tough, physical brawler types. Redguards never tire. Khajit are stealth, lucky jack of all trades. But what about Bosmer?
This is our(Bosmer) identity now:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNj67kwWBoQ All over Tamriel, theres a sudden spike in Bosmers getting caught for their crimes. A sad day indeed... #FightForYourRite Give Bosmers back our stealth!4 -
Taloros✭✭✭✭Some of the games biggest streamers, Deltia and Sypher threatened to quit.
Considering the change in personnel at ZOS, one would expect that they avoid needless aggravation of their customers.
Balance changes - I can understand that, at least partially. MMO designers all seem to be bitten by this bug, and though it's probably impossible to achieve, they're all chasing that (un)holy grail.
But why take away a near inconsequential utility skill, and replace it with a compeletely useless - some say even detrimental - other ability?
It's just mind boggling.
Fun thing, though: I faced a 20+ player Daggerfall Covenant ball group on my Bosmer nightblade the other day. My sweet little Bosmer's Hunter's Eye hit them like a fist made out of other fists. That skill is so op, it even deals damage to the player behind the character.2 -
Jaraal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Some of the games biggest streamers, Deltia and Sypher threatened to quit.
Considering the change in personnel at ZOS, one would expect that they avoid needless aggravation of their customers.
Balance changes - I can understand that, at least partially. MMO designers all seem to be bitten by this bug, and though it's probably impossible to achieve, they're all chasing that (un)holy grail.
But why take away a near inconsequential utility skill, and replace it with a compeletely useless - some say even detrimental - other ability?
It's just mind boggling.
Fun thing, though: I faced a 20+ player Daggerfall Covenant ball group on my Bosmer nightblade the other day. My sweet little Bosmer's Hunter's Eye hit them like a fist made out of other fists. That skill is so op, it even deals damage to the player behind the character.
New Bosmer skill:
All Seeing Eye of Sauron
Cast time: 'Bout tree fiddy
Target: Everybody
Cost: Several Roll Dodges
When you Roll Dodge until you are out of stamina, activate Sauron's Eye and see all lore failures within 30,000 miles.
7 -
x48rph✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think ZOS just doesn't really care about this period. It's not that they care about swallowing their pride, it's that they change everything the way they wanted for good or ill and have no intentions of revisiting it. Lets remember they nerfed sustain food for everyone rather then touch the racials again.Edited by x48rph on July 12, 2019 11:13PM0 -
Minyassa✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I honestly don't even care about lore and flavor, when it comes down to it. I care about appearance of my toons, and care about utility in the broad sense that I build them to be what they are supposed to be at the time I've made them. I care about not having to race-change my dedicated THIEF that I specifically built to be a *money-making* specialist at the time. I don't role-play in this game. I never have. I do spend time participating in PvE activities that make me in-game money, and now I've lost one of my money makers.3 -
thegreatme✭✭✭✭✭I honestly don't even care about lore and flavor, when it comes down to it. I care about appearance of my toons, and care about utility in the broad sense that I build them to be what they are supposed to be at the time I've made them. I care about not having to race-change my dedicated THIEF that I specifically built to be a *money-making* specialist at the time. I don't role-play in this game. I never have. I do spend time participating in PvE activities that make me in-game money, and now I've lost one of my money makers.
Yeah, and to call it "Niche RP fluff" is just ridiculous because there is a lot - I mean A LOT - of people who use thieving as a major source of their gold who aren't strictly roleplayers.What did ZOS do? Ignored every one and started banning the people, who spammed the forums. When Morrowind came, over half of the game's original playerbase quit. But the huge influx of new players for Morrowind meant that none of it mattered financially to ZoS.
I've noticed this time around we allegedly have "ALL THESE NEW PLAYERS" and that lasted for about a month, now half the time I'm in Elsweyr the zone feels completely dead save for a few dedicated dragon zergs. I came into the game when Morrowind was new and it wasn't even half as dead as Elsweyr feels now.
Either everyone got tired of the new zone already and dispersed to everywhere else or a lot of people just outright dropped the game. I'm betting on the latter.Thank You ZoS!:
◙ Blackfeather Court banker/merchant
◙ Blackfeather Houseguest
◙ Eyebright Raven
◙ Gloam Indrik
◙ Gloam Wolf Mount
◙ Gloam Senche
◙ Gloam Quasigriff
◙ Evergloam house
◙ Nocturnal Skill Styles
Let's See It Happen ZoS:
◙ /honorloop emote
◙ cross-legged sitting emote
◙ Hagraven Polymorph
◙ Hagraven Houseguest
◙ White Raven
◙ Evergloam Shade skin/polymorph
◙ Gloam bear1 -
Jaraal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭thegreatme wrote: »I've noticed this time around we allegedly have "ALL THESE NEW PLAYERS" and that lasted for about a month, now half the time I'm in Elsweyr the zone feels completely dead save for a few dedicated dragon zergs. I came into the game when Morrowind was new and it wasn't even half as dead as Elsweyr feels now.
Either everyone got tired of the new zone already and dispersed to everywhere else or a lot of people just outright dropped the game. I'm betting on the latter.
Yeah, The Gold Coast and Hew's Bane used to be packed with node farmers during the double materials events like we are having right now. But they look like comparative ghost towns at the moment. No more fighting over node spawns is nice.... but it's proof that the "all these new players" mantra is a myth.
1 -
thegreatme✭✭✭✭✭Yeah, The Gold Coast and Hew's Bane used to be packed with node farmers during the double materials events like we are having right now. But they look like comparative ghost towns at the moment. No more fighting over node spawns is nice.... but it's proof that the "all these new players" mantra is a myth.
So I'm not the only one who noticed that.
I remember most of the events in the past year similar to this one. You couldn't even FIND nodes because people were fighting over so many of them. Wayshrines were so packed with people coming and going you had lag the length of the grand canyon.
Its actually been super easy to farm nodes and I've seen maybe 7 people max at wayshrines in Gold Coast and Hew's Bane. It really does go to show that for one reason or another, ESO has lost a lot of its player base.Thank You ZoS!:
◙ Blackfeather Court banker/merchant
◙ Blackfeather Houseguest
◙ Eyebright Raven
◙ Gloam Indrik
◙ Gloam Wolf Mount
◙ Gloam Senche
◙ Gloam Quasigriff
◙ Evergloam house
◙ Nocturnal Skill Styles
Let's See It Happen ZoS:
◙ /honorloop emote
◙ cross-legged sitting emote
◙ Hagraven Polymorph
◙ Hagraven Houseguest
◙ White Raven
◙ Evergloam Shade skin/polymorph
◙ Gloam bear2 -
Taloros✭✭✭✭If there are less people in event zones, that's not neccessarily an indication of lower overall players numbers. These events should hold more appeal to those who
a.) haven't progressed through the zone's content already and/or
b.) still need crafting resources.
Also, Elsweyr probably draws players away from older content. Selling Gold Cost / Hew's Bane after releasing Elsweyr just weeks before probably isn't easy.
Returning to topic, though:
Played in Cyrodil this morning on the Pact's side. We lost keeps faster to AD than Brexit Bojo is loosing credibility. Why? Superior numbers? Lacking organization on our part? Competent banana leadership?
No.
It was Hunter's Eye.
That's what.
Either remove that broken ability or give all factions access to op Bosmers. To add insult to injury, they're not only the superior PvP race, but also cuter than even Bretons!3 -
Cundu_Ertur✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭There's too many people who think you're being serious. And you know there's some dev who's keeping a tally, "Hey, look, these people LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE that skill."
The sarcasm detector is never operational for some folk.Taking stealth away from the Bosmer is like taking magic away from the Altmer, making Nords allergic to mead, or making Orcs pretty.2 -
Jaraal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Cundu_Ertur wrote: »And you know there's some dev who's keeping a tally, "Hey, look, these people LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE that skill."
However, players loving something about the game has never been a deterrent for them to not nerf it into the ground. In fact, I think it's the other way around. If too many people like something, they think it must be overpowered or too easy or something of that nature.
And a million people could actually love Hunter's Eye (hyperbolically speaking, of course, as I've yet to find even ONE person who has found passive stealth detection to actually be effective)...... and it would still be shockingly counter to decades of established lore. We've already had new folks coming to the forums asking "where's the Bosmer stealth?" And those folks don't have our experience of years of stealth play being yanked like a bad tooth, and having a piece of dog bone hammered into your jaw to replace it.
Edited by Jaraal on July 15, 2019 7:33AM1 -
Taloros✭✭✭✭*sighs*
I don't know.
- Pleading for a fix didn't provoke any reaction but locking the most popular thread.
- Funny pics haven't helped, although they are the internet's most accepted currency (even more so than Bitcoin or US Dollar).
- Crying for a "nerf" hasn't helped so far.
What's left to do? A naked protest in front of the ZOS headquarter? Building an AddOn* that puts a Bosmer overlay over your Khajit character? Hanging out with the furry crowd until you, uhm, start to "like" anthromorph cats?
I'm out of ideas. Good ones at least.
*By AddOn, I mean an AddOn to your display, not to the game, i. e. a sticker with a Bosmer picture to put on your display.Edited by Taloros on July 15, 2019 12:16PM0 -
anadandy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭They even closed the "Do you use Stealth Detect in PVE" thread because it was "several months old" and "could contain outdated information".
Hilarious. Outdated information - like suddenly Stealth Detection became useful in PVE?
As for stealth being fluff niche RP. The last event emphasizes that it's legit gameplay - DB and TG, two DLCs designed around stealthy activities. A whole DLC dungeon where you have to stealth to complete it and also to get the bonus Memento. Morrowind and now Elsweyr have major story questlines that require sneaking and stealthing into restricted areas, not getting caught and *not* killing anyone. Stealth is not only for roleplay or ganking.
edit: spellingEdited by anadandy on July 15, 2019 12:47PM3 -
baronzilch✭✭✭As a 5 year Bosmer on a couple of my mains, I'll chime in: I much prefer the stealth detection over the stealth extension.
I never found the stealth radius bonus useful in in PvE. Legerdemain can literally be done without stealth and TG/DB can be completed on any non stealth race with a little (easily obtainable) gear, patience and timing. I thought observing and figuring out and executing the timing was the fun of those quests...? If these threads are any indication, I guess maybe not...
It was a little useful in PvP, but, not really that much. Everyone stealths sometimes (it did help a little in moving around busy areas, which is very situational and also mostly avoidable), but, only a couple of demographics actually specialize in stealth: Rangegankers aren't going to initiate combat anywhere near their non-buffed stealth radius in the first place and NBs have a superior alternative for when they need stealth in close.
(And those specs would benefit more from the stacking 10% crit damage bonus than the extra stealth radius if they were Khajit. I really can't figure out why anyone would want the stealth radius increase passive at all - it seems to me to be the least useful racial there is.)
However, the detection bonus saves my life at least a couple times an hour in PvP and opens a skill/pot slot for something else. And to me that's priceless.
I would be very disappointed if they revert this.
1 -
Cundu_Ertur✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Just get the massively OP Way of Air set.
Hey, I have been told that I need to use sets to regain what I should have in my racial passive. It is therefor entirely valid to tell you the same to get an effect that is completely and utterly contrary to every bit of lore about Bosmer that has ever been written.
I am very disappointed that they haven't reverted this. Furthermore, my disappointment is registered by the complete lack of money that I have contributed since it was announced.Taking stealth away from the Bosmer is like taking magic away from the Altmer, making Nords allergic to mead, or making Orcs pretty.5 -
thegreatme✭✭✭✭✭As for stealth being fluff niche RP. The last event emphasizes that it's legit gameplay - DB and TG, two DLCs designed around stealthy activities. A whole DLC dungeon where you have to stealth to complete it and also to get the bonus Memento. Morrowind and now Elsweyr have major story questlines that require sneaking and stealthing into restricted areas, not getting caught and *not* killing anyone. Stealth is not only for roleplay or ganking.
Exactly my point. Calling it RP fluff is ridiculous in the first place because outside of PvP, stealth doesn't make you invisible to OTHER PLAYERS anyway. Only NPCs. The only places it matters is PvE or PvP. It doesn't do jack for RP. If I want RP fluff stealth that makes me visually hidden from players, there are quest disguises for that (we all know the one).baronzilch wrote: »I never found the stealth radius bonus useful in in PvE. Legerdemain can literally be done without stealth and TG/DB can be completed on any non stealth race with a little (easily obtainable) gear, patience and timing. I thought observing and figuring out and executing the timing was the fun of those quests...? If these threads are any indication, I guess maybe not...
Okay but here's a question for you. How often do you actually use stealth to run content? If the answer is "I never stealth for PvE (except maybe in those quests where stealth is the primary game-given directive)", then of course you aren't going to find it useful.
Mind you, that's not an accusation. I just never found many people to go through PvE content doing anything other than charging through at breakneck speed, which means a lot of people say "this is useless" and it gets taken away from those who it was actually useful to.
Echoing what was already said, if you can complete PvE stealth by just equipping sets that make you more stealthy, why can't you equip the sets the game gives us for better stealth detection if that's what you like to have? Its the same thing. Except that Bosmer have ALWAYS, until the last few months, had their stealth radius buff, which means people built whole playstyles around it fundamental to their Bos's identity as a character.
Bottom line is that people shouldn't have to be forced into equipping 2+ sets (Night Terror & Darloc Brae) to regain our effectiveness at something we always had, and now don't, because ZoS decided to replace our racials with an even MORE niche skill nobody wanted until it was literally force-changed on it. Its been said before. Way of Air had some of the least desirable set bonuses in game. A lot more people have better use for better stealth in situations across the board than they do for detection, a purely PvP passive.baronzilch wrote: »but, only a couple of demographics actually specialize in stealth: Rangegankers aren't going to initiate combat anywhere near their non-buffed stealth radius in the first place and NBs have a superior alternative for when they need stealth in close.
I mean you're kinda just proving our point right here.Thank You ZoS!:
◙ Blackfeather Court banker/merchant
◙ Blackfeather Houseguest
◙ Eyebright Raven
◙ Gloam Indrik
◙ Gloam Wolf Mount
◙ Gloam Senche
◙ Gloam Quasigriff
◙ Evergloam house
◙ Nocturnal Skill Styles
Let's See It Happen ZoS:
◙ /honorloop emote
◙ cross-legged sitting emote
◙ Hagraven Polymorph
◙ Hagraven Houseguest
◙ White Raven
◙ Evergloam Shade skin/polymorph
◙ Gloam bear6 -
Murador178✭✭✭✭Elijah_Crow wrote: »Bosmer are fine with the exception of the removal of Stealth radius. Giving detection radius which is really a PvP ability as NPC’s “Can’t be bothered to stealth”, was a horrible move.
1. It’s the only racial which is PvP focused.
2. It breaks established lore from other Elder Scrolls games.
3. Would have been better suited to Khajiit with their established “Night Eye” ability from other Elder Scrolls games.
4. Funnels new players into playing Khajiit if they are interested in stealth gameplay as they are now the only race with a bonus to stealth. It tells them this right on the character creation screen that this is the race they should choose to be stealthy.
5. When this was taken away a Dev note said the 3 meter reduction would be added to other skill lines to allow the same play style and so far this isn’t true.
6. This forced players who have enjoyed the stealth gameplay for the last 5 years to race change or give up playing as they have.
Rich @ZOS_RichLambert and Finn commented at Pax East/Bethesda Game Days on something similar in regards to changes. When asked about adding vampire and werewolf to justice system reactions like Necromancer, they commented that it’s much different when you take away the ability to play a certain way after many years. That’s exactly whats happened here.
All of this has been pointed out previously. Any rational developer would see reverting this one piece of the racial change and giving the stealth reduction back in place of detection is the right thing to do. It’s good for race diversity in the game, it’s good for the players, it preserves the lore, etc. there is no downside.
Whoever is responsible for this change believes their “vision” of how things should be is more important than all of this and refuses to swallow their pride and do the right thing.
U know that u can stealth infront of NPCs anyways or just slot the armor giving stealth radius. I dont know why this passive change upset people so much. It was a very weak passive to begin with - the new one is bad aswell but in the end it doesnt matter at all...1 -
BlueRaven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »Elijah_Crow wrote: »Bosmer are fine with the exception of the removal of Stealth radius. Giving detection radius which is really a PvP ability as NPC’s “Can’t be bothered to stealth”, was a horrible move.
1. It’s the only racial which is PvP focused.
2. It breaks established lore from other Elder Scrolls games.
3. Would have been better suited to Khajiit with their established “Night Eye” ability from other Elder Scrolls games.
4. Funnels new players into playing Khajiit if they are interested in stealth gameplay as they are now the only race with a bonus to stealth. It tells them this right on the character creation screen that this is the race they should choose to be stealthy.
5. When this was taken away a Dev note said the 3 meter reduction would be added to other skill lines to allow the same play style and so far this isn’t true.
6. This forced players who have enjoyed the stealth gameplay for the last 5 years to race change or give up playing as they have.
Rich @ZOS_RichLambert and Finn commented at Pax East/Bethesda Game Days on something similar in regards to changes. When asked about adding vampire and werewolf to justice system reactions like Necromancer, they commented that it’s much different when you take away the ability to play a certain way after many years. That’s exactly whats happened here.
All of this has been pointed out previously. Any rational developer would see reverting this one piece of the racial change and giving the stealth reduction back in place of detection is the right thing to do. It’s good for race diversity in the game, it’s good for the players, it preserves the lore, etc. there is no downside.
Whoever is responsible for this change believes their “vision” of how things should be is more important than all of this and refuses to swallow their pride and do the right thing.
U know that u can stealth infront of NPCs anyways or just slot the armor giving stealth radius. I dont know why this passive change upset people so much. It was a very weak passive to begin with - the new one is bad aswell but in the end it doesnt matter at all...
Because Wood Elves are known for three things; they are great archers, they are great thieves, and they are good at stealth. Before the racial changes they excelled at one maybe two of those three things, now they good at none of them.
Maybe the people advocating for the reversal of this horrible change are "purists", but we just want the race to adhere to the lore set out in the original ES universe. Wood Elves are not stealthy because they all went to the same crafting station. They are stealthy because that is their nature.
6
