Wings nerf is a game breaker!

lucky_Sage · June 2019

Wings is crap now 50% dmg from projectiles isn’t that good harness/dampen Magicka is better

Nerftheforums · June 2019

Magdk has a class skills that grant snare immunity tied to a "***" 50% ranged damage reduction, major expediton, a gapclosing ult and you call that turtle mobility? What should templars say? 😂
The fact that you were crutching so hard on wings to avoid range ccs actually prove an amazing point: learn to block in the right moments like (almost) all other classes. Only nbs have the luxury of cloaking ranged things coming to them, everybody else has to block. Wings were a cancer concept, being totally immune to range attacks is a *** up concept. You would cry 10x as much if someone had the same immunity to your melee attacks boi

D3N7157 · June 2019

ALL other classes have only projectile absorbtion if they have anything related to this, i DONT AGREE on magdk being a special snowflake reflecting my 15k tooltip frags/20k tooltip spectral bow right back at me with 20% additional damage. SORRY BUT CYRODIIL IS A BETTER PLACE NOW

Uryel · June 2019

Translation : "whine whine I can no longer one-shot snipers by doing nothing".

Fear not, Bosmers and bow have been nerfed too.

killimandrosb16_ESO · June 2019

D3N7157 wrote: »

ALL other classes have only projectile absorbtion if they have anything related to this, i DONT AGREE on magdk being a special snowflake reflecting my 15k tooltip frags/20k tooltip spectral bow right back at me with 20% additional damage. SORRY BUT CYRODIIL IS A BETTER PLACE NOW

And this is exactly why nerfing the reflect was a very bad idea. The funny part is, its not the DK as a class which is most hit by this change, its all glas cannon classes, in medium and with much less damage mitigation who now have to eat that 15k frag+ 20k tooltip spectral bow. DKs now build tanky so they hardly notice much else than clench. Ranged cc is the worst now for DK's.
When reflect was removed, ALL mediocre magsorcs got the pond for themself. No more having to worry about using abilities not reflectable, or having to think who they were targetting before fragging and clenching away. The bigger picture shows DK's indeed GOT a buff. A turtle buff. Meanwhile their ability to be the predator magsorcs in particular needs so the paper/scissor/stone system works, was removed. Theres no way now a DK with various ranged CC can reach a decent magsorc. No way. So whos gonna kill magsorcs now? With their shields, ranged cc and fast escape abilities? Exactly noone, and thats why we now have this tank meta getting out of control. You cant reach them. You cant interrut them, so then you have to survive them. And surviving is easiest for a DK.
Anyway, whats gonna happen next,knowing how the developers fix problems, is magsorcs damage will be nerfed. Frags will be next to useless and streaks cost will be increased. Pets will be nerfed so theyre easy to kill, and there will be a long summoning timer on pets. Heavy Armour will be nerfed too, medium will be BUFFED, and we will be back to where we were months ago with NB's the main predator. All because reflect was removed from wings.

merevie · June 2019

Sorcs kill DKs.
Mageblades kill sorcs.
DKs kill mageblades.
Circle of life.
Unless we came to an agreement where Dks didn't kill mageblades and we hunted sorcs for you? :P

mb10 · June 2019

Wings were way too overpowered and had the ability to shut off whole classes in a PVP stand point

Mag NB caster in particular and any sort of bow class was completely useless against a mag dk, and I mean pretty much every attack would reflect

D3N7157 · June 2019

killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

ALL other classes have only projectile absorbtion if they have anything related to this, i DONT AGREE on magdk being a special snowflake reflecting my 15k tooltip frags/20k tooltip spectral bow right back at me with 20% additional damage. SORRY BUT CYRODIIL IS A BETTER PLACE NOW

And this is exactly why nerfing the reflect was a very bad idea. The funny part is, its not the DK as a class which is most hit by this change, its all glas cannon classes, in medium and with much less damage mitigation who now have to eat that 15k frag+ 20k tooltip spectral bow. DKs now build tanky so they hardly notice much else than clench. Ranged cc is the worst now for DK's.
When reflect was removed, ALL mediocre magsorcs got the pond for themself. No more having to worry about using abilities not reflectable, or having to think who they were targetting before fragging and clenching away. The bigger picture shows DK's indeed GOT a buff. A turtle buff. Meanwhile their ability to be the predator magsorcs in particular needs so the paper/scissor/stone system works, was removed. Theres no way now a DK with various ranged CC can reach a decent magsorc. No way. So whos gonna kill magsorcs now? With their shields, ranged cc and fast escape abilities? Exactly noone, and thats why we now have this tank meta getting out of control. You cant reach them. You cant interrut them, so then you have to survive them. And surviving is easiest for a DK.
Anyway, whats gonna happen next,knowing how the developers fix problems, is magsorcs damage will be nerfed. Frags will be next to useless and streaks cost will be increased. Pets will be nerfed so theyre easy to kill, and there will be a long summoning timer on pets. Heavy Armour will be nerfed too, medium will be BUFFED, and we will be back to where we were months ago with NB's the main predator. All because reflect was removed from wings.

Really dude i dont care if you turtle im just happy the discussion of slot cage and force pulse is over once and for all, i want to be able to use my open world toolkit agains everyone, sorry but swapping clench for 2 diffreint skills is not possible to justify for me because of how tight sorc barspace is

leepalmer95 · June 2019

D3N7157 wrote: »

killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

ALL other classes have only projectile absorbtion if they have anything related to this, i DONT AGREE on magdk being a special snowflake reflecting my 15k tooltip frags/20k tooltip spectral bow right back at me with 20% additional damage. SORRY BUT CYRODIIL IS A BETTER PLACE NOW

And this is exactly why nerfing the reflect was a very bad idea. The funny part is, its not the DK as a class which is most hit by this change, its all glas cannon classes, in medium and with much less damage mitigation who now have to eat that 15k frag+ 20k tooltip spectral bow. DKs now build tanky so they hardly notice much else than clench. Ranged cc is the worst now for DK's.
When reflect was removed, ALL mediocre magsorcs got the pond for themself. No more having to worry about using abilities not reflectable, or having to think who they were targetting before fragging and clenching away. The bigger picture shows DK's indeed GOT a buff. A turtle buff. Meanwhile their ability to be the predator magsorcs in particular needs so the paper/scissor/stone system works, was removed. Theres no way now a DK with various ranged CC can reach a decent magsorc. No way. So whos gonna kill magsorcs now? With their shields, ranged cc and fast escape abilities? Exactly noone, and thats why we now have this tank meta getting out of control. You cant reach them. You cant interrut them, so then you have to survive them. And surviving is easiest for a DK.
Anyway, whats gonna happen next,knowing how the developers fix problems, is magsorcs damage will be nerfed. Frags will be next to useless and streaks cost will be increased. Pets will be nerfed so theyre easy to kill, and there will be a long summoning timer on pets. Heavy Armour will be nerfed too, medium will be BUFFED, and we will be back to where we were months ago with NB's the main predator. All because reflect was removed from wings.

Really dude i dont care if you turtle im just happy the discussion of slot cage and force pulse is over once and for all, i want to be able to use my open world toolkit agains everyone, sorry but swapping clench for 2 diffreint skills is not possible to justify for me because of how tight sorc barspace is

You could try not crutching on pets?

RedGirl41 · June 2019

I 100% agree with your original post. I’ve played a mag dk for two years and yes while a person spamming wings is annoying it’s a necessity now if you open world or 2vx. (Btw if sorcs cant kill a mag dk try running crushing shock over SPAMMING flame reach) mag dk is a tough small scale or solo class with how everyone wants to fight from 400 meters away

I never used to run wings at all. For a long time I was light armor, no shield, double sword and board. But now EVERYONE wants to play as ranged as possible with high burst and proc sets. It takes time to get up and close to someone to fight melee, let alone not get zerged in the process. The change to wings is irrelevant in my opinion when open world fighting, it doesn’t help at all. Currently getting Psijic on my dk and for the first time I’ll be cleansing vamp.

DTStormfox · June 2019

How about this change:
Shields no longer absorb 100% of all damage. But only removes immobilizations and reduces incoming damage from projectiles by 50%.

The Forums would explode.

Or this change:
Crystallized Shield (and morphs) now no longer absorbs all damage and doesn't return magicka and ultimate. But only removes immobilizations and reduces incoming damage from projectiles by 50%.

The Forums would explode.

Or this change:
Cloak now no longer makes you invisible and dodge every attack, including DoTs. But only removes immobilizations and reduces incoming damage from projectiles by 50%.

The Forums would explode

Or this change:
Cleansing Ritual (and morphs) no longer remove negative effects. But only removes immobilizations and reduces incoming damage from projectiles by 50% while you are in the circle of influence.

The Forums would explode

That is what basically happened with Wings.
They removed all the unique elements of it and made it a very generic boring ability.

jaws343 · June 2019

DTStormfox wrote: »

How about this change:
Shields no longer absorb 100% of all damage. But only removes immobilizations and reduces incoming damage from projectiles by 50%.

The Forums would explode.

Or this change:
Crystallized Shield (and morphs) now no longer absorbs all damage and doesn't return magicka and ultimate. But only removes immobilizations and reduces incoming damage from projectiles by 50%.

The Forums would explode.

Or this change:
Cloak now no longer makes you invisible and dodge every attack, including DoTs. But only removes immobilizations and reduces incoming damage from projectiles by 50%.

The Forums would explode

Or this change:
Cleansing Ritual (and morphs) no longer remove negative effects. But only removes immobilizations and reduces incoming damage from projectiles by 50% while you are in the circle of influence.

The Forums would explode

That is what basically happened with Wings.
They removed all the unique elements of it and made it a very generic boring ability.

Last I checked, I can still get stunned through a shield. Also last I checked, magdk has access to a shield as well.

Arrodisia · June 2019

Players who put a lot of effort into builds, and practice playing more often will almost always beat those who don't know much about abilities, don't practice much, and can't/won't adjust to changes. Nerfs and buffs will happen to every class. However, it's what you do with those changes, and how you adapt that makes all the difference. So what if a class ability was toned down? There are plenty of other possibilities to explore and put in it's place.

When I read some of these comments it sounded like "some" of the mag dk's gave up after that change, instead of accepting the challenge to find something more interesting/fun to do with their mag dk builds. I adapted and my mag dk did fine after the changes. I prefer to enjoy all of the skills the game has to offer since then. Good luck to you guys and have some fun.

D3N7157 · June 2019

leepalmer95 wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

ALL other classes have only projectile absorbtion if they have anything related to this, i DONT AGREE on magdk being a special snowflake reflecting my 15k tooltip frags/20k tooltip spectral bow right back at me with 20% additional damage. SORRY BUT CYRODIIL IS A BETTER PLACE NOW

And this is exactly why nerfing the reflect was a very bad idea. The funny part is, its not the DK as a class which is most hit by this change, its all glas cannon classes, in medium and with much less damage mitigation who now have to eat that 15k frag+ 20k tooltip spectral bow. DKs now build tanky so they hardly notice much else than clench. Ranged cc is the worst now for DK's.
When reflect was removed, ALL mediocre magsorcs got the pond for themself. No more having to worry about using abilities not reflectable, or having to think who they were targetting before fragging and clenching away. The bigger picture shows DK's indeed GOT a buff. A turtle buff. Meanwhile their ability to be the predator magsorcs in particular needs so the paper/scissor/stone system works, was removed. Theres no way now a DK with various ranged CC can reach a decent magsorc. No way. So whos gonna kill magsorcs now? With their shields, ranged cc and fast escape abilities? Exactly noone, and thats why we now have this tank meta getting out of control. You cant reach them. You cant interrut them, so then you have to survive them. And surviving is easiest for a DK.
Anyway, whats gonna happen next,knowing how the developers fix problems, is magsorcs damage will be nerfed. Frags will be next to useless and streaks cost will be increased. Pets will be nerfed so theyre easy to kill, and there will be a long summoning timer on pets. Heavy Armour will be nerfed too, medium will be BUFFED, and we will be back to where we were months ago with NB's the main predator. All because reflect was removed from wings.

Really dude i dont care if you turtle im just happy the discussion of slot cage and force pulse is over once and for all, i want to be able to use my open world toolkit agains everyone, sorry but swapping clench for 2 diffreint skills is not possible to justify for me because of how tight sorc barspace is

You could try not crutching on pets?

Seriously? And rely on what healing ward?

Raudgrani · June 2019

Wings is easy mode, none deserve that. The best 1xV/duelist/BG's guy I know of on Xbox EU didn't even had it slotted. He use the awfully useless/underpowered vampire skill Mistform instead.

Though I can say, it's a bit sad more or less FORCING you to be a vampire if not S&B/heavy etc., but wings was just too much. I got some hate message from a player, because I was "spamming wings against a ranged build". Sure, I get the point, but if you have a build that is ONLY ranged, I'm not the one to be blamed. I think new wings are pretty ok. It was kind of tiresome with "wing flappers", doing more or less nothing but kiting and reflecting everything ranged.

jdmoonan · June 2019

D3N7157 wrote: »

killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

ALL other classes have only projectile absorbtion if they have anything related to this, i DONT AGREE on magdk being a special snowflake reflecting my 15k tooltip frags/20k tooltip spectral bow right back at me with 20% additional damage. SORRY BUT CYRODIIL IS A BETTER PLACE NOW

And this is exactly why nerfing the reflect was a very bad idea. The funny part is, its not the DK as a class which is most hit by this change, its all glas cannon classes, in medium and with much less damage mitigation who now have to eat that 15k frag+ 20k tooltip spectral bow. DKs now build tanky so they hardly notice much else than clench. Ranged cc is the worst now for DK's.
When reflect was removed, ALL mediocre magsorcs got the pond for themself. No more having to worry about using abilities not reflectable, or having to think who they were targetting before fragging and clenching away. The bigger picture shows DK's indeed GOT a buff. A turtle buff. Meanwhile their ability to be the predator magsorcs in particular needs so the paper/scissor/stone system works, was removed. Theres no way now a DK with various ranged CC can reach a decent magsorc. No way. So whos gonna kill magsorcs now? With their shields, ranged cc and fast escape abilities? Exactly noone, and thats why we now have this tank meta getting out of control. You cant reach them. You cant interrut them, so then you have to survive them. And surviving is easiest for a DK.
Anyway, whats gonna happen next,knowing how the developers fix problems, is magsorcs damage will be nerfed. Frags will be next to useless and streaks cost will be increased. Pets will be nerfed so theyre easy to kill, and there will be a long summoning timer on pets. Heavy Armour will be nerfed too, medium will be BUFFED, and we will be back to where we were months ago with NB's the main predator. All because reflect was removed from wings.

Really dude i dont care if you turtle im just happy the discussion of slot cage and force pulse is over once and for all, i want to be able to use my open world toolkit agains everyone, sorry but swapping clench for 2 diffreint skills is not possible to justify for me because of how tight sorc barspace is

Dope so I don't want a templar to be able to purify my dots, so I can just use them on everyone! and my 20 meter fossilize back so I can kill sorcs that think it's ok to free cast in the back!

D3N7157 · June 2019

jdmoonan wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

ALL other classes have only projectile absorbtion if they have anything related to this, i DONT AGREE on magdk being a special snowflake reflecting my 15k tooltip frags/20k tooltip spectral bow right back at me with 20% additional damage. SORRY BUT CYRODIIL IS A BETTER PLACE NOW

And this is exactly why nerfing the reflect was a very bad idea. The funny part is, its not the DK as a class which is most hit by this change, its all glas cannon classes, in medium and with much less damage mitigation who now have to eat that 15k frag+ 20k tooltip spectral bow. DKs now build tanky so they hardly notice much else than clench. Ranged cc is the worst now for DK's.
When reflect was removed, ALL mediocre magsorcs got the pond for themself. No more having to worry about using abilities not reflectable, or having to think who they were targetting before fragging and clenching away. The bigger picture shows DK's indeed GOT a buff. A turtle buff. Meanwhile their ability to be the predator magsorcs in particular needs so the paper/scissor/stone system works, was removed. Theres no way now a DK with various ranged CC can reach a decent magsorc. No way. So whos gonna kill magsorcs now? With their shields, ranged cc and fast escape abilities? Exactly noone, and thats why we now have this tank meta getting out of control. You cant reach them. You cant interrut them, so then you have to survive them. And surviving is easiest for a DK.
Anyway, whats gonna happen next,knowing how the developers fix problems, is magsorcs damage will be nerfed. Frags will be next to useless and streaks cost will be increased. Pets will be nerfed so theyre easy to kill, and there will be a long summoning timer on pets. Heavy Armour will be nerfed too, medium will be BUFFED, and we will be back to where we were months ago with NB's the main predator. All because reflect was removed from wings.

Really dude i dont care if you turtle im just happy the discussion of slot cage and force pulse is over once and for all, i want to be able to use my open world toolkit agains everyone, sorry but swapping clench for 2 diffreint skills is not possible to justify for me because of how tight sorc barspace is

Dope so I don't want a templar to be able to purify my dots, so I can just use them on everyone! and my 20 meter fossilize back so I can kill sorcs that think it's ok to free cast in the back!

What you missed in you touching story is that the templar doesnt get extra damage against you for purging your dots, you are all a bunch of hypocrites!

ccmedaddy · June 2019

lucky_Sage wrote: »

Wings is crap now 50% dmg from projectiles isn’t that good harness/dampen Magicka is better

whynotboth.gif

JumpmanLane · June 2019

Folks, sorcs and NB’s THINK wings was a nerf and actually close the gap on my MagDk FOR me mistakingly thinking they can brawl in melee range. The smart ones streak/cloak/run away. The others die.

DreadDaedroth · June 2019

I think it's easy to admit the mistake and revert the change as wings has been balanced for years.

DarkPicture · June 2019

Stop crying about nerfs because its your main class.

Reflective never should exist in game it was cancer mechanic and if u not agree u dont have any idea for gameplay and balance for this game. Especially abusing thing vs range classes *tfu*

JackDaniell · June 2019

I like my games like I like my milk.

Homogenised

brandonv516 · June 2019

DK is in a really good spot right now.

Unlock RaT - it's amazing (for all classes really). It allows DKs to be mobile and reposition easy.

The new Whip morph is insane (and much more effective than Assassin's Will).

For Wings just choose the offensive morph and take advantage of a huge reduction to projectiles' damage.

The class can also be successful in both light armor and heavy armor.

Reverting to old Wings now would just make the class too powerful.

templesus · June 2019

L2P issue

david_m_18b16_ESO · June 2019

Reading the wings defender makes me feel like the class is even worst then magnec but fomr some reaosn theya re not free kill like a magnec is for me.

JumpmanLane · June 2019

I unno. I was laughing with a friend of mine who started MagDk when I did. She was like folks are stupid. Until wings had snare removal WE didn’t run wings we ran vamp and mist. We haven’t been running wings THAT long to not be able to mop fools without reflecting FOUR Projectiles Lol.

Give me 91% damage mitigation on ALL PROJECTILES, SnB/Wings. I think I’ll be aight. Lol.

P.S. whoever said L2P to the OP don’t know who the OP is. I don’t necessarily agree with the OP about wings on a MAGDK but I know for a fact he can BRAWL. Straight up.

D0PAMINE · June 2019

JumpmanLane wrote: »

I unno. I was laughing with a friend of mine who started MagDk when I did. She was like folks are stupid. Until wings had snare removal WE didn’t run wings we ran vamp and mist. We haven’t been running wings THAT long to not be able to mop fools without reflecting FOUR Projectiles Lol.

Give me 91% damage mitigation on ALL PROJECTILES, SnB/Wings. I think I’ll be aight. Lol.

P.S. whoever said L2P to the OP don’t know who the OP is. I don’t necessarily agree with the OP about wings on a MAGDK but I know for a fact he can BRAWL. Straight up.

Yeah im actually fine with is as I mentioned to in a similar thread. On my PvE tank I was easily able to rez in vICP HM during the shadow phase on a buggy dungeon run. I was standing in the only red spot too. Im too lazy to leave red a lot of times. Im keeping the fireball morph and just using S&B ult. Those 2 things work well together imo.

I'd also like to add that wings didn't make DK's op, the entire class is balanced to handle a lot of different things very well. A DK who is paying attention can eat projectiles without wings.

xaraan · June 2019

As someone that plays a mag dk most often in pvp, i disagree. Wings is fine as it is and in PvE it's actually a great tool for tanking now as well.

JumpmanLane · June 2019

D0PAMINE wrote: »

JumpmanLane wrote: »

I unno. I was laughing with a friend of mine who started MagDk when I did. She was like folks are stupid. Until wings had snare removal WE didn’t run wings we ran vamp and mist. We haven’t been running wings THAT long to not be able to mop fools without reflecting FOUR Projectiles Lol.

Give me 91% damage mitigation on ALL PROJECTILES, SnB/Wings. I think I’ll be aight. Lol.

P.S. whoever said L2P to the OP don’t know who the OP is. I don’t necessarily agree with the OP about wings on a MAGDK but I know for a fact he can BRAWL. Straight up.

Yeah im actually fine with is as I mentioned to in a similar thread. On my PvE tank I was easily able to rez in vICP HM during the shadow phase on a buggy dungeon run. I was standing in the only red spot too. Im too lazy to leave red a lot of times. Im keeping the fireball morph and just using S&B ult. Those 2 things work well together imo.

You’re right. SnB and wings go well together. It just WORKS.

Jodynn · June 2019

I main magDK in both PVE and PVP, and I can say without a doubt that wings when they reflected :
PvE were useless unless you were solo'ing some really weird stuff like vFL HM by yourself ( it's been done for some reason lol )
PvP the wings were such a terrible mechanic, it could reflect all the damage AND cc onto the person using it making them kill themselves which is just an awful time.

I do agree that 50% mitigation is a great factor, but I only have one slot on my backbar for a defense skill in it's spot, and the 2 seconds of snare immunity doesn't make it up for the fact I'm eating projectiles, I would rather use harness magicka, mist form, or even race against time ( which I don't because I'm too lazy to switch from channeled bc PvE ) because the latter two give me major expedition so I can actually hit things with more than light attacks and not be perma-snared ( some people just spam encase when they are in a group ), and the first one is useful against ALL builds, while projectiles are only useful against if someone is using a ranged weapon which bow light attacks don't really hurt all that much and snipe is easy to block so I don't even use that as an argument because if you are using snipe you are probably bad and I don't need any help killing you.

So would I call this skill useless now? In PvP, for me, personally, yes. The offensive morph is funny to kill people with spamming projectiles at you every .5s but unless I know who I'm fighting beforehand it can be completely use to my opponent.

In some situations it's amazing in PvE ( tank wise, dps it'd be stupid. )

Reverting reflect would be terrible, I would rather see reflect removed completely because it's a stupid mechanic period, but, the only time reflect really annoys me is npc's spamming eclipse every cc cooldown on me, so eh, I don't care enough.

My suggestion would be keep the skill the way it is, or add Major Expedition on the non-offensive morph, then I'd use it, otherwise, I'll use it when I'm feeling corny for the offensive morph, because the snare reduction doesn't make up for the fact you can kite around me with little problems spamming me especially with large numbers.

If you relied on this skill for your build before, well, adapt and realize it was a broken, overpowered skill.