Druid40 wrote: »

OK, real talk, why would ANYONE sacrifice ANY companion other than Varen? I would understand if Abnur was a choice, but he was not.

Yeah Varen felt like the best choice to be, finish what he started. Still makes me wonder though for the people that chose Sia, if they bring him back does that mean the Varen can return as well.

I mean Varen spirit does show up in Wrothgar to warn you about the 3 deadric princes are scheming.

Hallothiel wrote: »

Ok, this has got me wondering what happens then if you do Summerset before Morrowind? (Never done it as am far too sad as like to at least TRY to have narrative cohesion). How does that work?!

Agree I always wondered the same. I started a new main about 6 months ago to reply everything in chronological order again. But I still skipped morrowind and went right to my Faction question and soulshriven to start.

I always wondering how to explain Darian if you start with Summerset then do DC storyline. Which my only logic says even after both events he must still be alive (even after reading the book in Summerset also wrothgar is proof that he is still alive after soul shriven)... confused

bluebird wrote: »

Hallothiel wrote: »

@bluebird

But if Summerset done first, then you have to have gone back in time otherwise a certain elf would not be there in Morrowind! The events in Morrowind lead to the events in Summerset - or am i just not meant to know that?!!

Hate fecking time travel non-continuity headaches. 😡

If you choose to play things out of order, then yes... things will be out of order... But that's a completely different discussion because Sai shouldn't be in Dragonhold after the Main quest, so it's a continuity issue based on the actual order of things - rather than the continuity issue of playing Summerset before Morrowind or the DC areas, or meeting Tharn in Elsweyr first rather than the main quest which are continuity issues that are the result of a player's chosen order of playing through zones backwards.

It is only an issue if you sacrificed Sai, I always killed off Varen. Unless Zos can give us a good explanation if Sai was sacrificed. Maybe Akatosh saying "Eh, Sai has some potential, I'm going to bring him back, screw you Arkay, I'm in charge." though I hope there is a better explanation than that.

JobooAGS wrote: »

bluebird wrote: »

Hallothiel wrote: »

@bluebird

But if Summerset done first, then you have to have gone back in time otherwise a certain elf would not be there in Morrowind! The events in Morrowind lead to the events in Summerset - or am i just not meant to know that?!!

Hate fecking time travel non-continuity headaches. 😡

If you choose to play things out of order, then yes... things will be out of order... But that's a completely different discussion because Sai shouldn't be in Dragonhold after the Main quest, so it's a continuity issue based on the actual order of things - rather than the continuity issue of playing Summerset before Morrowind or the DC areas, or meeting Tharn in Elsweyr first rather than the main quest which are continuity issues that are the result of a player's chosen order of playing through zones backwards.

It is only an issue if you sacrificed Sai, I always killed off Varen. Unless Zos can give us a good explanation if Sai was sacrificed. Maybe Akatosh saying "Eh, Sai has some potential, I'm going to bring him back, screw you Arkay, I'm in charge." though I hope there is a better explanation than that.

Yeah I'm aware, but that's why it's silly - there was a player choice to do something and it shouldn't be disregarded like that. I didn't pick Sai to die in my main playthrough either, but I will kill him on my alt's playthrough now just out of principle

Game devs shouldn't be so challenged to write interesting storylines or characters that they need to bring back characters that could have been slain previously. The Dragon Age games did that very well, with several followup cameos in future games based on the player's choice, and the characters and their followup stories being entirely absent if they were killed (except Leliana who they did bring back with a 'it was a spirit from the fade' copout or some such nonsense). 'Akatosh resurrected him' would be a similar copout I think, and it would cheapen the immersion of the game.

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Vizikul wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

You can't play in whatever order AND have it make sense. The AD storyline is the prime example.

I assume that the new timeline id you want everything to make sense is:
1. Start Main Quest up to rescuing Abnur Tharn and Sai Sahan
2. DC questline up to Alikr Desert, then Wrathstone Dungeons
3. Elsweyr Prologue
4. Elsweyr
5. Finish up Main Quest

That order doesn't make sense either. Elsweyr must be set after the main quest. At the elsweyr proloque quest you get to talk with Abnur that it has been a while since the last contact between him and the vestige (referring to the entire plane meld scenario.) After the main quest he flees to the imperial city with the broken amulet of kings that he stole. Most likely he used the time that had passed since then, to figure out his plan to end the three banners war. In the main quest Abnur is one egoistic prick, in elsweyr he is suddenly an altruistic hero who wants to stop all the pointless killing. And let's not forget his new shiny armor. All of this suggests that he had some character development since event of the main quest.

There is no order. Tuttle confirmed that everything that has happened, somehow including Orsinium which has dates in books placing it in 583, as happening in 582. Every Chapter, every DLC, every Dungeon Pack has occurred in 582 and its all up to the players choice of what content they decide to do in what order they decide.

So there is no canonical order and there is no sense arguing over how all of this plays out because for ZOS. All that matters is that when they want to hype something up they can throw some nostalgia or favorite character at us and we will jump on it.

actual that is not true, at the end of orsinium you can meet the sacrificed soul (it was varen for me) and he tells you about clockwork city and a prophecy, Moreover Summerset HAS to play after the main quest and Morrowind since the story around darien and Naryus daughter wouldnt make sence otherwhise. At the same time you can get a prophecy that spoilers Summerset in the dark brotherhood questline so db have to play before summerset.
So even if the hole story happens in one year there is still an order

regarding the return of Sai Sahan: I bet it will be something like Varen/Lyris sacrificed them self in the last second, or that he lives now without a soul i mean the MC does the same after he broke out from coldhabour

StShoot wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Vizikul wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

You can't play in whatever order AND have it make sense. The AD storyline is the prime example.

I assume that the new timeline id you want everything to make sense is:
1. Start Main Quest up to rescuing Abnur Tharn and Sai Sahan
2. DC questline up to Alikr Desert, then Wrathstone Dungeons
3. Elsweyr Prologue
4. Elsweyr
5. Finish up Main Quest

That order doesn't make sense either. Elsweyr must be set after the main quest. At the elsweyr proloque quest you get to talk with Abnur that it has been a while since the last contact between him and the vestige (referring to the entire plane meld scenario.) After the main quest he flees to the imperial city with the broken amulet of kings that he stole. Most likely he used the time that had passed since then, to figure out his plan to end the three banners war. In the main quest Abnur is one egoistic prick, in elsweyr he is suddenly an altruistic hero who wants to stop all the pointless killing. And let's not forget his new shiny armor. All of this suggests that he had some character development since event of the main quest.

There is no order. Tuttle confirmed that everything that has happened, somehow including Orsinium which has dates in books placing it in 583, as happening in 582. Every Chapter, every DLC, every Dungeon Pack has occurred in 582 and its all up to the players choice of what content they decide to do in what order they decide.

So there is no canonical order and there is no sense arguing over how all of this plays out because for ZOS. All that matters is that when they want to hype something up they can throw some nostalgia or favorite character at us and we will jump on it.

actual that is not true, at the end of orsinium you can meet the sacrificed soul (it was varen for me) and he tells you about clockwork city and a prophecy

It's always Varen, regardless of who you choose.

p00tx wrote: »

If you're the kind of monster who sacrifices Sai, in spite of his potential happily-ever-after with Lyris, then you deserve to have your storyline messed with

Agree. Kill Varen. His fault anyway.

If you choose to sacrifice Sai Sahan, Cadwell says "He's part of you now, you know."

I wonder if that's a clue.

IIRC the reason why Martin was able to offer his life in return for Akatosh's power was because he was Dragonborn. Whoever we sacrifice in ESO is obviously not Dragonborn. Most of all, not Varen. What if Akatosh just chews the soul a bit, finds it unworthy, and spits it out?

Maybe that or 'you're too worthy and selfless a soul to be lost into nothingness. I'm in a good mood today so here, have a second chance!'

He was rezzed by a necromancer? This would explain why he is Back alive.Makes sense to me.

KMarble wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Season of the Dragon is terrible for anyone who wants a coherent storyline for the entire game.

Elsweyr does not really have a definite spot in the timeline. It can come before the events of the main quest. I don't think any reference is made to Molag Bal or the resolution of the Soulburst. There might be an offhand reference to what happened to Varen, indicating that the events of the main quest have already started.

I am thinking that Firor is right. Elsweyr could be a perfect starting place for new characters. If they retcon future interactions with certain characters that will be met later so that the character is recognized, then I think the best place for Elsweyr is prior to the main story.

The only outlier in that is Sai Sahan. He cannot be in Elsweyr in all cases: before, during, and after the main quest. They should have left him out of this one.

The problem with having Elsweyr happen before the main story is that all of the companions were stuck in Coldharbour. Sai, Lyris and the Prophet were prisoners and Tharn had very little freedom and was closely watched.

That isn't a problem if Elsweyr takes place before the Soulburst, by some scheme.

However, I agree with you. Things fall apart because Sai Sahan shows up. Abner, well, he was a cohort, not a prisoner, at least at the start.

ZOS thinks they have some clever reason that Sai can be there, but the real reason he is there is because they are dredging up characters from other stories and reusing them in an increasing number of cases.

I sacrificed Sai Sahan because I was still bitter over that Harvester/Lyris Doppelganger fight I had to go through to rescue him. Oh my gosh, that fight was so difficult back in 2014. Or maybe it was because I did not understand what "break free" was. Or "set gear". Or about a dozen other gameplay aspects that are now so instinctual I don't even think about it. Glad he is coming back. I killed poor Sai because I needed to git gud. It was not Sai's fault!

Perhaps he rezzed at a wayshrine.

Choosing Varen is probably canon.