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PvP Tips / Immunity Timers and Discussion
skiidzman
✭✭✭
So, I am not really sure where to start besides the fact that me and my buddy however frustrated are trying to learn end-game PvP.
I came from a game like Dark Ages of Camelot back in the day which was centralized around PvP. In that game, if someone was to stun you, after the stun wore off you would gain an "immunity timer" which basically says hey, you can't be stunned again for 60 seconds or 30 seconds, I can't remember the duration anymore. This applied to roots, stuns, and CC abilities. It did not apply to certain snare styles from melee classes which were capable of being spammed. Those are also in Elder Scrolls Online.
It created a situation in where your enemies, whether solo, or as a small group, had to coordinate proper times to stun, root, or CC. If those abilities were just spammed willy-nilly, you could very well lose the fight.
So we found similarities. But in ESO the immunity timer is pretty much non-existent/very short. Me and my friend dueled for probably 2 hours and he was able to knock me down, stun me, root me, set me off balance all about in 6 second revolving increments. What that created was a situation where I had to waste all of my stamina repeatedly breaking the CC or rolling. My first counter to this was changing my hot-keys for dodge roll and break-free. While this helped, I was on a Magicka class. I noticed almost immediately when dueling he would knock me down, dps, immobilize me, dps, set me off balance, dps... by this time I was out of stamina and he then immobilized me again and killed me. This was repeated a good 10 times. My next thought was to add an ability like the Psijic Order ability that cleanses this stuff. So I did, and it helped a little - but I noticed it became all I was spamming. It removed my thought of "what is next in my rotation, or where should I take the fight" ...
While I am highly interested in a discussion revolving around the implementation of longer immunity timers for immobilizes, CC, stuns, etc.... I am more interested in hearing from experienced PvP players on how to deal with my current situation of being unable to move during fights due to rotating CC. Do you guys just pop immovable potions every time and go in for the kill? Is this why CP-Cyrodiil is the meta as you can reduce cost of break-free and roll? If my friend was to rotate stun, off balance, immobilize, CC on you... how do you react in non-CP?
I am only 400 Champion Level. I will not be in CP-Cyrodiil until 700+.
Edited by skiidzman on June 2, 2019 3:22PM I came from a game like Dark Ages of Camelot back in the day which was centralized around PvP. In that game, if someone was to stun you, after the stun wore off you would gain an "immunity timer" which basically says hey, you can't be stunned again for 60 seconds or 30 seconds, I can't remember the duration anymore. This applied to roots, stuns, and CC abilities. It did not apply to certain snare styles from melee classes which were capable of being spammed. Those are also in Elder Scrolls Online.
It created a situation in where your enemies, whether solo, or as a small group, had to coordinate proper times to stun, root, or CC. If those abilities were just spammed willy-nilly, you could very well lose the fight.
So we found similarities. But in ESO the immunity timer is pretty much non-existent/very short. Me and my friend dueled for probably 2 hours and he was able to knock me down, stun me, root me, set me off balance all about in 6 second revolving increments. What that created was a situation where I had to waste all of my stamina repeatedly breaking the CC or rolling. My first counter to this was changing my hot-keys for dodge roll and break-free. While this helped, I was on a Magicka class. I noticed almost immediately when dueling he would knock me down, dps, immobilize me, dps, set me off balance, dps... by this time I was out of stamina and he then immobilized me again and killed me. This was repeated a good 10 times. My next thought was to add an ability like the Psijic Order ability that cleanses this stuff. So I did, and it helped a little - but I noticed it became all I was spamming. It removed my thought of "what is next in my rotation, or where should I take the fight" ...
While I am highly interested in a discussion revolving around the implementation of longer immunity timers for immobilizes, CC, stuns, etc.... I am more interested in hearing from experienced PvP players on how to deal with my current situation of being unable to move during fights due to rotating CC. Do you guys just pop immovable potions every time and go in for the kill? Is this why CP-Cyrodiil is the meta as you can reduce cost of break-free and roll? If my friend was to rotate stun, off balance, immobilize, CC on you... how do you react in non-CP?
I am only 400 Champion Level. I will not be in CP-Cyrodiil until 700+.
2
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frostz417✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Build into tankiness because all everyone does now is spam cc’s unfortunate but it’s the only way1 -
Crixus8000✭✭✭✭✭
✭All immunity is very short yes, this can feel hard to sustain in certain fights, mainly in no cp. You know your gonna get snared every 4 secs and need to break free every 6 seconds so basically just manage your stamina, that's the most simple way to defend from it. As a stam player I make sure I never overextend so I have enough stam to go defensive and also make sure to weave heavy attacks in when I can to keep my stam up.
You also want to keep your own debuffs and cc's up all the time, that will give you more breathing room and help you controll the fight more, when your opponent makes a mistake/let's their hp drop a bit that's when you go for the kill.0 -
skiidzman✭✭✭Crixus8000 wrote: »All immunity is very short yes, this can feel hard to sustain in certain fights, mainly in no cp. You know your gonna get snared every 4 secs and need to break free every 6 seconds so basically just manage your stamina, that's the most simple way to defend from it. As a stam player I make sure I never overextend so I have enough stam to go defensive and also make sure to weave heavy attacks in when I can to keep my stam up.
You also want to keep your own debuffs and cc's up all the time, that will give you more breathing room and help you controll the fight more, when your opponent makes a mistake/let's their hp drop a bit that's when you go for the kill.
How would you approach this on a Magicka class that has 1/3 of the pool of your Stamina class?0 -
THEDKEXPERIENCE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I cannot speak on dueling but I can absolutely speak on PVPing as a magic player with low stamina.
You aren’t too far off. Yes, immovable potions are vital. I burn through them about 25 to 50 an evening and they are the expensive ones with columbine, bugloss and wormwood (I think) so I need like 50 of each of those material per week just to stay afloat.
Aside from that my only stamina ability is rapid maneuvers which isn’t something that you’d use in a fight so I’m not burning any stamina aside from breaking free and dodge rolling. I get 2 to 3 DRs for my 11k stamina. You can’t just spam them. You have to be selective and use them when they are really needed like when oil is getting dumped. And blocking should be done by quickly hitting block, not holding it like a tank.
In most fights when I know they are coming I pop the immovable pot first for 10.4 seconds of immunity. Then it’s usually just spamming shields and heals instead of dodge rolling. The one advantage that a magic player should have over a stamina player is a bigger resource pool. If you’re trying to Cyrodiil as a magic player with under 40k magic it’s gonna be hard, but even just that 40k will give you 10k more than most stamina players. Once they are exhausted by attacking you, the fight can be won by you in that last 10k with that and your ultimate.
TLDR - replace spamming dodge rolls with heals and shields.3 -
skiidzman✭✭✭THEDKEXPERIENCE wrote: »I cannot speak on dueling but I can absolutely speak on PVPing as a magic player with low stamina.
You aren’t too far off. Yes, immovable potions are vital. I burn through them about 25 to 50 an evening and they are the expensive ones with columbine, bugloss and wormwood (I think) so I need like 50 of each of those material per week just to stay afloat.
Aside from that my only stamina ability is rapid maneuvers which isn’t something that you’d use in a fight so I’m not burning any stamina aside from breaking free and dodge rolling. I get 2 to 3 DRs for my 11k stamina. You can’t just spam them. You have to be selective and use them when they are really needed like when oil is getting dumped. And blocking should be done by quickly hitting block, not holding it like a tank.
In most fights when I know they are coming I pop the immovable pot first for 10.4 seconds of immunity. Then it’s usually just spamming shields and heals instead of dodge rolling. The one advantage that a magic player should have over a stamina player is a bigger resource pool. If you’re trying to Cyrodiil as a magic player with under 40k magic it’s gonna be hard, but even just that 40k will give you 10k more than most stamina players. Once they are exhausted by attacking you, the fight can be won by you in that last 10k with that and your ultimate.
TLDR - replace spamming dodge rolls with heals and shields.
I will try that thanks. Maybe absorbing the DPS is the key and waiting for openings.1 -
Sanctum74✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Crixus8000 wrote: »All immunity is very short yes, this can feel hard to sustain in certain fights, mainly in no cp. You know your gonna get snared every 4 secs and need to break free every 6 seconds so basically just manage your stamina, that's the most simple way to defend from it. As a stam player I make sure I never overextend so I have enough stam to go defensive and also make sure to weave heavy attacks in when I can to keep my stam up.
You also want to keep your own debuffs and cc's up all the time, that will give you more breathing room and help you controll the fight more, when your opponent makes a mistake/let's their hp drop a bit that's when you go for the kill.
How would you approach this on a Magicka class that has 1/3 of the pool of your Stamina class?
I use shacklebreaker, tri stat glyphs, and tri pots. It sucks being pigeonholed into using one particular set, but you really can't beat all the stats it gives you. I can break free and dodge roll for days. Amber plasm would also be a good set to use.
0 -
lukoi✭✭✭Also, I wouldn't be afraid to fight in CP-Cyro at sub 700. I started PvPing there once I hit 160 (max gear) and frankly, feel like it gives me alot of help in learning PvP aspects of the game. That was on a bow/bow character (MA NB) that fights as a skirmisher - meaning I'm not relying on cloak-spam to gank or to shoot and run every encounter. It's not a reliable behavior vs decent players anyway, so learning how to be aggressive and apply pressure is more key in my limited experience.
Just recently hit another PvP-toon at 50, and he's already in CP-Cyro at sub-500, and I'm enjoying it quite a bit. I don't feel like I'm dying overly much due to resource differences. I feel like it's clearly more that I got outplayed by someone, or that I over extended into a 1vX I'm not yet good enough to handle.
0 -
skiidzman✭✭✭Also, I wouldn't be afraid to fight in CP-Cyro at sub 700. I started PvPing there once I hit 160 (max gear) and frankly, feel like it gives me alot of help in learning PvP aspects of the game. That was on a bow/bow character (MA NB) that fights as a skirmisher - meaning I'm not relying on cloak-spam to gank or to shoot and run every encounter. It's not a reliable behavior vs decent players anyway, so learning how to be aggressive and apply pressure is more key in my limited experience.
Just recently hit another PvP-toon at 50, and he's already in CP-Cyro at sub-500, and I'm enjoying it quite a bit. I don't feel like I'm dying overly much due to resource differences. I feel like it's clearly more that I got outplayed by someone, or that I over extended into a 1vX I'm not yet good enough to handle.
Yeah I think I am going to go to CP-Cyrodiil. I just feel super nerfed in Non-CP Cyrodiil.0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You're losing a ton of the mag advantage in a duel.
You'll always be hit with a CC etc on cool down (this isn't true in OW or BGs where you can kite, run, LoS etc)
In a duel you're already engaged and in limited space. As a mag character, for the most part (there are exceptions), you'll be at a disadvantage.1 -
nekura✭✭✭I'm pretty sure DAoC was (duration of stun * 5) for the immunity, so my 9second Dragonfang stun would be a 45sec immunity.
Not only does ESO need longer duration immunity, it needs to work properly in the first place. You would never get chain stun'd in DAoC like you do in this game. Everything is so inconsistent.3 -
JumpmanLane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
First off, I started playing Vivec at level 10. How are you going to learn unless you DO it. How are you gonna be motivated to get better if you don’t die a lot.So, I am not really sure where to start besides the fact that me and my buddy however frustrated are trying to learn end-game PvP.
I came from a game like Dark Ages of Camelot back in the day which was centralized around PvP. In that game, if someone was to stun you, after the stun wore off you would gain an "immunity timer" which basically says hey, you can't be stunned again for 60 seconds or 30 seconds, I can't remember the duration anymore. This applied to roots, stuns, and CC abilities. It did not apply to certain snare styles from melee classes which were capable of being spammed. Those are also in Elder Scrolls Online.
It created a situation in where your enemies, whether solo, or as a small group, had to coordinate proper times to stun, root, or CC. If those abilities were just spammed willy-nilly, you could very well lose the fight.
So we found similarities. But in ESO the immunity timer is pretty much non-existent/very short. Me and my friend dueled for probably 2 hours and he was able to knock me down, stun me, root me, set me off balance all about in 6 second revolving increments. What that created was a situation where I had to waste all of my stamina repeatedly breaking the CC or rolling. My first counter to this was changing my hot-keys for dodge roll and break-free. While this helped, I was on a Magicka class. I noticed almost immediately when dueling he would knock me down, dps, immobilize me, dps, set me off balance, dps... by this time I was out of stamina and he then immobilized me again and killed me. This was repeated a good 10 times. My next thought was to add an ability like the Psijic Order ability that cleanses this stuff. So I did, and it helped a little - but I noticed it became all I was spamming. It removed my thought of "what is next in my rotation, or where should I take the fight" ...
While I am highly interested in a discussion revolving around the implementation of longer immunity timers for immobilizes, CC, stuns, etc.... I am more interested in hearing from experienced PvP players on how to deal with my current situation of being unable to move during fights due to rotating CC. Do you guys just pop immovable potions every time and go in for the kill? Is this why CP-Cyrodiil is the meta as you can reduce cost of break-free and roll? If my friend was to rotate stun, off balance, immobilize, CC on you... how do you react in non-CP?
I am only 400 Champion Level. I will not be in CP-Cyrodiil until 700+.
Run some sort of snare removal. You’ll get better with breaking free as you gain more cp, particularly in the reductions. Roll rarely. Block only when you have to.
Use pots. Tri, immovables whatever. Keep at it.
You are by your own admission inexperienced. Why should the game be changed to suit your inexperience? Nerfs buffs or either. Keep learning and go pvp TODAY.
Edited by JumpmanLane on June 2, 2019 11:20PM0 -
skiidzman✭✭✭JumpmanLane wrote: »
First off, I started playing Vivec at level 10. How are you going to learn unless you DO it. How are you gonna be motivated to get better if you don’t die a lot.So, I am not really sure where to start besides the fact that me and my buddy however frustrated are trying to learn end-game PvP.
I came from a game like Dark Ages of Camelot back in the day which was centralized around PvP. In that game, if someone was to stun you, after the stun wore off you would gain an "immunity timer" which basically says hey, you can't be stunned again for 60 seconds or 30 seconds, I can't remember the duration anymore. This applied to roots, stuns, and CC abilities. It did not apply to certain snare styles from melee classes which were capable of being spammed. Those are also in Elder Scrolls Online.
It created a situation in where your enemies, whether solo, or as a small group, had to coordinate proper times to stun, root, or CC. If those abilities were just spammed willy-nilly, you could very well lose the fight.
So we found similarities. But in ESO the immunity timer is pretty much non-existent/very short. Me and my friend dueled for probably 2 hours and he was able to knock me down, stun me, root me, set me off balance all about in 6 second revolving increments. What that created was a situation where I had to waste all of my stamina repeatedly breaking the CC or rolling. My first counter to this was changing my hot-keys for dodge roll and break-free. While this helped, I was on a Magicka class. I noticed almost immediately when dueling he would knock me down, dps, immobilize me, dps, set me off balance, dps... by this time I was out of stamina and he then immobilized me again and killed me. This was repeated a good 10 times. My next thought was to add an ability like the Psijic Order ability that cleanses this stuff. So I did, and it helped a little - but I noticed it became all I was spamming. It removed my thought of "what is next in my rotation, or where should I take the fight" ...
While I am highly interested in a discussion revolving around the implementation of longer immunity timers for immobilizes, CC, stuns, etc.... I am more interested in hearing from experienced PvP players on how to deal with my current situation of being unable to move during fights due to rotating CC. Do you guys just pop immovable potions every time and go in for the kill? Is this why CP-Cyrodiil is the meta as you can reduce cost of break-free and roll? If my friend was to rotate stun, off balance, immobilize, CC on you... how do you react in non-CP?
I am only 400 Champion Level. I will not be in CP-Cyrodiil until 700+.
Run some sort of snare removal. You’ll get better with breaking free as you gain more cp, particularly in the reductions. Roll rarely. Block only when you have to.
Use pots. Tri, immovables whatever. Keep at it.
You are by your own admission inexperienced. Why should the game be changed to suit your inexperience? Nerfs buffs or either. Keep learning and go pvp TODAY.
I am somewhat inexperienced yes. That is why I am here asking for help, nor did I ask for the game to be changed for my preference however it could be discussed. I think the game would improve with longer immunity timers, but for someone who hasn't experienced such a thing, I can see it as brooding.1 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭JumpmanLane wrote: »
First off, I started playing Vivec at level 10. How are you going to learn unless you DO it. How are you gonna be motivated to get better if you don’t die a lot.So, I am not really sure where to start besides the fact that me and my buddy however frustrated are trying to learn end-game PvP.
I came from a game like Dark Ages of Camelot back in the day which was centralized around PvP. In that game, if someone was to stun you, after the stun wore off you would gain an "immunity timer" which basically says hey, you can't be stunned again for 60 seconds or 30 seconds, I can't remember the duration anymore. This applied to roots, stuns, and CC abilities. It did not apply to certain snare styles from melee classes which were capable of being spammed. Those are also in Elder Scrolls Online.
It created a situation in where your enemies, whether solo, or as a small group, had to coordinate proper times to stun, root, or CC. If those abilities were just spammed willy-nilly, you could very well lose the fight.
So we found similarities. But in ESO the immunity timer is pretty much non-existent/very short. Me and my friend dueled for probably 2 hours and he was able to knock me down, stun me, root me, set me off balance all about in 6 second revolving increments. What that created was a situation where I had to waste all of my stamina repeatedly breaking the CC or rolling. My first counter to this was changing my hot-keys for dodge roll and break-free. While this helped, I was on a Magicka class. I noticed almost immediately when dueling he would knock me down, dps, immobilize me, dps, set me off balance, dps... by this time I was out of stamina and he then immobilized me again and killed me. This was repeated a good 10 times. My next thought was to add an ability like the Psijic Order ability that cleanses this stuff. So I did, and it helped a little - but I noticed it became all I was spamming. It removed my thought of "what is next in my rotation, or where should I take the fight" ...
While I am highly interested in a discussion revolving around the implementation of longer immunity timers for immobilizes, CC, stuns, etc.... I am more interested in hearing from experienced PvP players on how to deal with my current situation of being unable to move during fights due to rotating CC. Do you guys just pop immovable potions every time and go in for the kill? Is this why CP-Cyrodiil is the meta as you can reduce cost of break-free and roll? If my friend was to rotate stun, off balance, immobilize, CC on you... how do you react in non-CP?
I am only 400 Champion Level. I will not be in CP-Cyrodiil until 700+.
Run some sort of snare removal. You’ll get better with breaking free as you gain more cp, particularly in the reductions. Roll rarely. Block only when you have to.
Use pots. Tri, immovables whatever. Keep at it.
You are by your own admission inexperienced. Why should the game be changed to suit your inexperience? Nerfs buffs or either. Keep learning and go pvp TODAY.
I am somewhat inexperienced yes. That is why I am here asking for help, nor did I ask for the game to be changed for my preference however it could be discussed. I think the game would improve with longer immunity timers, but for someone who hasn't experienced such a thing, I can see it as brooding.
Longer immunity timers would be a good thing. Most people don’t like any changes and have no standard of comparison so don’t understand. That plus stuns being used on spammables is pretty common.
Most of the pvp strength of classes comes down to:
- Do you have a way to absorb/reflect projectiles/stuns?
- Do you have good cc capabilities?
Everything else is noise in terms of class balance.Edited by Iskiab on June 3, 2019 2:34AMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten1 -
JumpmanLane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭JumpmanLane wrote: »
First off, I started playing Vivec at level 10. How are you going to learn unless you DO it. How are you gonna be motivated to get better if you don’t die a lot.So, I am not really sure where to start besides the fact that me and my buddy however frustrated are trying to learn end-game PvP.
I came from a game like Dark Ages of Camelot back in the day which was centralized around PvP. In that game, if someone was to stun you, after the stun wore off you would gain an "immunity timer" which basically says hey, you can't be stunned again for 60 seconds or 30 seconds, I can't remember the duration anymore. This applied to roots, stuns, and CC abilities. It did not apply to certain snare styles from melee classes which were capable of being spammed. Those are also in Elder Scrolls Online.
It created a situation in where your enemies, whether solo, or as a small group, had to coordinate proper times to stun, root, or CC. If those abilities were just spammed willy-nilly, you could very well lose the fight.
So we found similarities. But in ESO the immunity timer is pretty much non-existent/very short. Me and my friend dueled for probably 2 hours and he was able to knock me down, stun me, root me, set me off balance all about in 6 second revolving increments. What that created was a situation where I had to waste all of my stamina repeatedly breaking the CC or rolling. My first counter to this was changing my hot-keys for dodge roll and break-free. While this helped, I was on a Magicka class. I noticed almost immediately when dueling he would knock me down, dps, immobilize me, dps, set me off balance, dps... by this time I was out of stamina and he then immobilized me again and killed me. This was repeated a good 10 times. My next thought was to add an ability like the Psijic Order ability that cleanses this stuff. So I did, and it helped a little - but I noticed it became all I was spamming. It removed my thought of "what is next in my rotation, or where should I take the fight" ...
While I am highly interested in a discussion revolving around the implementation of longer immunity timers for immobilizes, CC, stuns, etc.... I am more interested in hearing from experienced PvP players on how to deal with my current situation of being unable to move during fights due to rotating CC. Do you guys just pop immovable potions every time and go in for the kill? Is this why CP-Cyrodiil is the meta as you can reduce cost of break-free and roll? If my friend was to rotate stun, off balance, immobilize, CC on you... how do you react in non-CP?
I am only 400 Champion Level. I will not be in CP-Cyrodiil until 700+.
Run some sort of snare removal. You’ll get better with breaking free as you gain more cp, particularly in the reductions. Roll rarely. Block only when you have to.
Use pots. Tri, immovables whatever. Keep at it.
You are by your own admission inexperienced. Why should the game be changed to suit your inexperience? Nerfs buffs or either. Keep learning and go pvp TODAY.
I am somewhat inexperienced yes. That is why I am here asking for help, nor did I ask for the game to be changed for my preference however it could be discussed. I think the game would improve with longer immunity timers, but for someone who hasn't experienced such a thing, I can see it as brooding.
How would YOU know though. You duel some guy some? You’re waiting for 700 cp to “try” Cyro. You ARE advocating changes to the game based on your limited playing experience.
Geeze get better at the game first.Edited by JumpmanLane on June 3, 2019 4:28AM1 -
Demra✭✭✭But that's what he is doing... asking for advice to get better and try out something new. I think you're reading into his comment.
I do agree though that maybe a bit longer immunity would be great. But as for your question, try cp or perhaps add some stamina recovery. See if that helps.2 -
evoniee✭✭✭✭use addons to get a better view at vital buff/ debuff such as dodge fatigue, cc immunity, mark, etc. use srendar or other UI for example.
as long as you have the gear you need (no need to be perfect such as arena gear or full gold) you should practice from low cp, you can do it in no cp or cp.
i focus cyro cp from cp400, it is mostly skill based so better practice immediately.
dont rage if you met a meta chaser / carry set player.0 -
JumpmanLane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭So we need longer immunity timers because some 400 cp dude running god knows what, ain’t never been to Cyro, dueled some guy, burnt through his stam and lost...
1 -
Sheuib✭✭✭✭As stated already immovable pots are a must.
As a magicka player you can't ignore stam like stam players can ignore magicka. I run tri glyphs on all my gear and tri stat food. I have over 17k stam because of that. I use to run tri stat traits on my jewelry also and had over 19k stam.
You also cannot ignore stam regen. I use an altmer not only for the high magicka stats but also for the stam regen it provides. On top of that I am running 5 heavy armor pieces, 1 light, and 1 medium. Also, when you start getting higher in the CP numbers start putting some CP in stam regen. I currently have 50 in the stam regen portion.
You really can't beat heavy armor because you are getting both magicka and stam regen from it. Sure your damage isn't quite as high but that is really only on paper or PVE. In PVP heavy lets you stay on the offensive longer and therefore doing more damage.0 -
mague✭✭✭✭✭JumpmanLane wrote: »
First off, I started playing Vivec at level 10. How are you going to learn unless you DO it. How are you gonna be motivated to get better if you don’t die a lot.So, I am not really sure where to start besides the fact that me and my buddy however frustrated are trying to learn end-game PvP.
I came from a game like Dark Ages of Camelot back in the day which was centralized around PvP. In that game, if someone was to stun you, after the stun wore off you would gain an "immunity timer" which basically says hey, you can't be stunned again for 60 seconds or 30 seconds, I can't remember the duration anymore. This applied to roots, stuns, and CC abilities. It did not apply to certain snare styles from melee classes which were capable of being spammed. Those are also in Elder Scrolls Online.
It created a situation in where your enemies, whether solo, or as a small group, had to coordinate proper times to stun, root, or CC. If those abilities were just spammed willy-nilly, you could very well lose the fight.
So we found similarities. But in ESO the immunity timer is pretty much non-existent/very short. Me and my friend dueled for probably 2 hours and he was able to knock me down, stun me, root me, set me off balance all about in 6 second revolving increments. What that created was a situation where I had to waste all of my stamina repeatedly breaking the CC or rolling. My first counter to this was changing my hot-keys for dodge roll and break-free. While this helped, I was on a Magicka class. I noticed almost immediately when dueling he would knock me down, dps, immobilize me, dps, set me off balance, dps... by this time I was out of stamina and he then immobilized me again and killed me. This was repeated a good 10 times. My next thought was to add an ability like the Psijic Order ability that cleanses this stuff. So I did, and it helped a little - but I noticed it became all I was spamming. It removed my thought of "what is next in my rotation, or where should I take the fight" ...
While I am highly interested in a discussion revolving around the implementation of longer immunity timers for immobilizes, CC, stuns, etc.... I am more interested in hearing from experienced PvP players on how to deal with my current situation of being unable to move during fights due to rotating CC. Do you guys just pop immovable potions every time and go in for the kill? Is this why CP-Cyrodiil is the meta as you can reduce cost of break-free and roll? If my friend was to rotate stun, off balance, immobilize, CC on you... how do you react in non-CP?
I am only 400 Champion Level. I will not be in CP-Cyrodiil until 700+.
Run some sort of snare removal. You’ll get better with breaking free as you gain more cp, particularly in the reductions. Roll rarely. Block only when you have to.
Use pots. Tri, immovables whatever. Keep at it.
You are by your own admission inexperienced. Why should the game be changed to suit your inexperience? Nerfs buffs or either. Keep learning and go pvp TODAY.
I am somewhat inexperienced yes. That is why I am here asking for help, nor did I ask for the game to be changed for my preference however it could be discussed. I think the game would improve with longer immunity timers, but for someone who hasn't experienced such a thing, I can see it as brooding.
The game would do better without CC. But... go and play with your 400CP. There is such a difference between duelling and what is going on in Cyrodiil.0 -
THEDKEXPERIENCE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭As stated already immovable pots are a must.
As a magicka player you can't ignore stam like stam players can ignore magicka. I run tri glyphs on all my gear and tri stat food. I have over 17k stam because of that. I use to run tri stat traits on my jewelry also and had over 19k stam.
You also cannot ignore stam regen. I use an altmer not only for the high magicka stats but also for the stam regen it provides. On top of that I am running 5 heavy armor pieces, 1 light, and 1 medium. Also, when you start getting higher in the CP numbers start putting some CP in stam regen. I currently have 50 in the stam regen portion.
You really can't beat heavy armor because you are getting both magicka and stam regen from it. Sure your damage isn't quite as high but that is really only on paper or PVE. In PVP heavy lets you stay on the offensive longer and therefore doing more damage.
Can you kill anything with that build? Not even trolling, I’d be impressed if you could.
Basically everything you say you can’t ignore I do. lol
I definitely do not recommend copying what I do but it is possible if you’re enough of a ninja.
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Side note to the OP - I went into Cyrodiil on launch day as a level 10 against max ranked PC transfers and never looked back. The game was VASTLY more unbalanced at that point. Just give it a try.0 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm pretty sure DAoC was (duration of stun * 5) for the immunity, so my 9second Dragonfang stun would be a 45sec immunity.
Not only does ESO need longer duration immunity, it needs to work properly in the first place. You would never get chain stun'd in DAoC like you do in this game. Everything is so inconsistent.
The resource drain and CC is the only way you will kill some players here1 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
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1. Skills that gives immunity. Psijic's got Race Against Time, 2H sword got Forward Momentum, DragonKnight got wings, etc.I am more interested in hearing from experienced PvP players on how to deal with my current situation of being unable to move during fights due to rotating aCC. Do you guys just pop immovable potions every time and go in for the kill? Is this why CP-Cyrodiil is the meta as you can reduce cost of break-free and roll? If my friend was to rotate stun, off balance, immobilize, CC on you...
2. Immovable potions AND a few points into Alchemy craft, as it buffs (extend) the durations of potions. I drink 20+ pots per hours in Kaal campaign.
3. Dodge roll/block when timed right allows you to avoid being CC'd (rare exceptions are DK's Fossilize as an example) and costs less than break-free (and u pass on being beat up)
4. CP that not only reduce break-free/roll/block, but also adds Off-balance when u dodge, increase stam regen, etc. (ie. offensive, not just defensive)
5. CC them first. A good defense is a good offense.
6. Build defensively. Heavy armor for mitigation, or Medium for dodge cost reduction, monster or armor sets that stuns/procs, etc.
7. Experience. Timing, dodging, keeping ur distance, not wasting on blocking, line-of-sight, spatial awareness (don't stay in red circle, remember certain class' attack animation and dodge) etc.
everything above, minus the #4.do you react in non-CP?
I'd recommend going at 300CP. so you should be fine. Problem is under-810 people put their points in offensive, or split defense/offense.... then they get reckt.I am only 400 Champion Level. I will not be in CP-Cyrodiil until 700+.
Repeat this mantra in your head: dead people produce zero DPS.
In summary, the only thing u can do, CP or not, is,
1. PRACTICE on how to avoid certain obvious CC. (Skills, pots, awareness, CP, etc.)
2. BUILD on survivability first and foremost, on ur armor, skill, and CP. (cost reduction enchant, CC poison, armor set proc, wep resource leech enchant, etc.)
3. APPLY CC to others before they get a chance to CC you.
TLDR; u gon get rekt either way. no potions in Tamriel will allow u to escape CC in CP-campaigns Cyro. u will get to CP-1000 and u can still get rekt. You just have to practice minimizing the scenario by learning how to dodge theirs and apply yours first.
August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber0 -
Sheuib✭✭✭✭THEDKEXPERIENCE wrote: »As stated already immovable pots are a must.
As a magicka player you can't ignore stam like stam players can ignore magicka. I run tri glyphs on all my gear and tri stat food. I have over 17k stam because of that. I use to run tri stat traits on my jewelry also and had over 19k stam.
You also cannot ignore stam regen. I use an altmer not only for the high magicka stats but also for the stam regen it provides. On top of that I am running 5 heavy armor pieces, 1 light, and 1 medium. Also, when you start getting higher in the CP numbers start putting some CP in stam regen. I currently have 50 in the stam regen portion.
You really can't beat heavy armor because you are getting both magicka and stam regen from it. Sure your damage isn't quite as high but that is really only on paper or PVE. In PVP heavy lets you stay on the offensive longer and therefore doing more damage.
Can you kill anything with that build? Not even trolling, I’d be impressed if you could.
Basically everything you say you can’t ignore I do. lol
I definitely do not recommend copying what I do but it is possible if you’re enough of a ninja.
——
Side note to the OP - I went into Cyrodiil on launch day as a level 10 against max ranked PC transfers and never looked back. The game was VASTLY more unbalanced at that point. Just give it a try.
I get a lot of kills. The idea is to keep pressure with your normal abilities and get the kill with your ultimate.1 -
BNOC✭✭✭✭✭The stuns have to be short because ttk is so high on some classes - As it is, if you have to sit a full stun, you can almost guarantee that you're in trouble, even 1v1.
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox EU - 15/11/16
578,000 - 36 Minutes 58 Seconds (Top 2 World?)
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox NA
569,000 - 40 minutes (350CP, Non optimised runs)0 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭From how you are describing the duels, it sounds like your opponent had the initiative and was dictating the tempo of the fight (i.e. you were reacting to what he was doing rather than forcing him to react to you, proverbially "dancing to their tune.") In pretty much all competition, possessing the initiative is very strong and often decisive.
By 400 CPs, that ought to be enough to always have enough stamina to CC break and react provided you are mindful of it in your build and not wasting it by doing superfluous things like constantly sprinting. This, of course, assumes your opponent does not 100% possess the initiative where you are constantly reacting to them (which invariably will drain your stamina pool dry, because you will also have to block). The best way to deal with your stamina management is to force your opponent to react to you, because in such a scenario you wont be doing the things that drain your stamina nearly as much (namely, CC breaking, blocking, and sprinting).
As a magicka player, you *must* incorporate stamina management in your build. "Tri-Glyphs" (the ones that add all three attributes) on your "big" armor pieces are the most efficient way. Yes it's pricey, but yes it's worth it. You're also going to want to do something else, "tr-stat" food instead of Witchmother's brew, using a armor set like shacklebreaker or Amberplasm that has stamina or regen bonuses in it, or using a potion that has stamina replenishment as a trait are the most common.
Sometimes you just have to ask yourself if spending your stamina is worth it. If I'm on a mag sorc and I'm immobilized, against a single opponent I might not care because I can still attack at 100% effectiveness. As a templar, I might not block and attack because I have a strong cleanse and burst heal that I can use later. You have to be mindful of how much stamina you have and whether or not consuming it is worth the cost.
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Hexquisite✭✭✭✭I use Tri Glyphs, tri food, Race Against Time ( previously used Mist Form) and 2 dif kinds of Immovables, but my main one has speed and stam regen. Also LOS is huge--im not talking just running around rocks, but, not being in the open where 5 dif people can CC you. Ducking behind something to regen, etc. You should go into cp Cyrodil now, perhaps you will find a guild that runs groups and can help you out:)Edited by Hexquisite on June 4, 2019 8:13AMPC NA~Ethereal Traders Union~~Spicy Economics~~Tropic Thunder~~Us Ghosts~0 -
Vapirko✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I’m pretty certain they’ve screwed up the new immunity rules. I haven’t noticed any difference and I’ve been getting CCd mid dodge roll fairly often since Elsweyr. The thing is, performance is such *** in PvP most of the time, that you cannot even tell if things are working or broken.0 -
DemonDruaga✭✭✭✭The thing is, if you implement longer cooldowns on hard CC's (or any stun) you pretty much introduce true immortality for certain builds in 1v1, because then you could only hope for the kill like once every 30 seconds, but usualy you or your target is getting outnumbered by that time and the fight looses all its appealing anyway.
And imo it would make combat even more slow and boring, just offensive and defensive button smashing, without the need to really react to something outside of your health barArdor // Dunkelsicht // Pakt2 -
EtTuBrutus✭✭✭✭✭While i do think no stuns should be over 3 second long, immunity duration is on the money imo.2