Maintenance for the week of December 23:
• NA megaservers for maintenance – December 23, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EST (14:00 UTC)
• EU megaservers for maintenance – December 23, 9:00 UTC (4:00AM EST) - 14:00 UTC (9:00AM EST)
• NA megaservers for maintenance – December 23, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EST (14:00 UTC)
• EU megaservers for maintenance – December 23, 9:00 UTC (4:00AM EST) - 14:00 UTC (9:00AM EST)
Arctic Blast Discussion.
Casul
✭✭✭✭✭
✭
✭
This ability has had a rough time seeing gameplay after it was changed to a projectile stun. The AoE frost was good for applying chilled to groups and was a good choice for tanks.
Because we will likely not get the original back I feel like we should discuss what can be done to make this ability more competitive. To do this I am going to bring up the biggest pain points of the ability.
Damage/Heal
This ability currently does no damage, so it doesn’t have any use to a PvE player, likewise the heal is generally to small for any normal build (anything other then a healthden) to utilize.
Assuming 20k health you are looking at 3,000 initial with 600 ticks. Cut those in half for PvP players.
This leads to 9000 heal over 10 seconds (3000 initial + (600*10 ticks)
To combat this I think the heal should remain, but instead should work as a % of current health.
I propose it have the mechanics as follows.
When activated you heal for 4 values over a 4 second duration with ticks occurring every 1 second.
10%, 30%, 50%, and last 75%
On a 20k bar with 10k as current health it would be as follows (pvp in parentheses)
2000(1000), 2400(1200), 2800(1400), 2100(1050).
These values allow for 9300(4650) over a 4 second duration. Which I feel makes it more reasonable to the 9,000 over 10.
I am aware that this also means at lower health values the heal will be more potent but to prevent wardens from avoiding executes I made the first 2 heal ticks significantly weaker then the final 2.
Now before I get the posts about spamming it let’s get to the next part of this.
Utility
Currently the utility this ability offers is a stun that can be blocked, dodged, and reflected. (Source: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/443822/arctic-blast-interactions-reflect-block-dodge-roll)
I feel this is restrictive because of the interaction with how necessary as stun is in a wardens kit.
I propose a new idea that works as follows
Shoot a projectile at an enemy, this projectile can be dodged but not blocked or reflected. It puts an icy chill into the enemy applying a snare that gradually increases every second (starting a 10% and ending at 40%), at the end of the snare the enemy is stunned for 3 seconds.
This allows some counter play as it gives a 4 second window for people to prepare for the stun, while also not copying petrify and allowing warden to have a unique class stun. I also recommend this ability only be allowed to be active on one person at a time to prevent stacking the heal.
Recap/TLDR
So all together the tooltip would read as follows
Shoot an projectile at an enemy. When the enemy is hit heal for 10,30,50,75 % of current missing health every second over 4 seconds. During this duration the enemy is hit with a snare that increases in potency as the duration continues, starting at 10% and ending at 40%. At the end of the 4 second duration the enemy is stunned for 3 seconds. This ability can not be blocked or reflected.
Please feel free to engage in discussion and criticism. If you would like feel free to link me using @.
Edit: changed a few typos and added a bolder sentence about spamming.
Edited by Casul on April 24, 2019 7:22PM Because we will likely not get the original back I feel like we should discuss what can be done to make this ability more competitive. To do this I am going to bring up the biggest pain points of the ability.
Damage/Heal
This ability currently does no damage, so it doesn’t have any use to a PvE player, likewise the heal is generally to small for any normal build (anything other then a healthden) to utilize.
Assuming 20k health you are looking at 3,000 initial with 600 ticks. Cut those in half for PvP players.
This leads to 9000 heal over 10 seconds (3000 initial + (600*10 ticks)
To combat this I think the heal should remain, but instead should work as a % of current health.
I propose it have the mechanics as follows.
When activated you heal for 4 values over a 4 second duration with ticks occurring every 1 second.
10%, 30%, 50%, and last 75%
On a 20k bar with 10k as current health it would be as follows (pvp in parentheses)
2000(1000), 2400(1200), 2800(1400), 2100(1050).
These values allow for 9300(4650) over a 4 second duration. Which I feel makes it more reasonable to the 9,000 over 10.
I am aware that this also means at lower health values the heal will be more potent but to prevent wardens from avoiding executes I made the first 2 heal ticks significantly weaker then the final 2.
Now before I get the posts about spamming it let’s get to the next part of this.
Utility
Currently the utility this ability offers is a stun that can be blocked, dodged, and reflected. (Source: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/443822/arctic-blast-interactions-reflect-block-dodge-roll)
I feel this is restrictive because of the interaction with how necessary as stun is in a wardens kit.
I propose a new idea that works as follows
Shoot a projectile at an enemy, this projectile can be dodged but not blocked or reflected. It puts an icy chill into the enemy applying a snare that gradually increases every second (starting a 10% and ending at 40%), at the end of the snare the enemy is stunned for 3 seconds.
This allows some counter play as it gives a 4 second window for people to prepare for the stun, while also not copying petrify and allowing warden to have a unique class stun. I also recommend this ability only be allowed to be active on one person at a time to prevent stacking the heal.
Recap/TLDR
So all together the tooltip would read as follows
Shoot an projectile at an enemy. When the enemy is hit heal for 10,30,50,75 % of current missing health every second over 4 seconds. During this duration the enemy is hit with a snare that increases in potency as the duration continues, starting at 10% and ending at 40%. At the end of the 4 second duration the enemy is stunned for 3 seconds. This ability can not be blocked or reflected.
Please feel free to engage in discussion and criticism. If you would like feel free to link me using @.
Edit: changed a few typos and added a bolder sentence about spamming.
PvP needs more love.
0
-
Casul✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Cladius30 I totally agree, but it’s unlikely they will undo the change. So with that in mind what do you think of my proposed idea?PvP needs more love.0 -
Cladius30✭✭✭✭✭i think it should be able to heal when not in combat like an heal ability and then if your in combat it sends a stun0 -
Luckylancer✭✭✭✭✭Stunless class is better than a stun that is not used in that class. Scattershot and destro staff stun can do the job if the player desires it badly.i think it should be able to heal when not in combat like an heal ability and then if your in combat it sends a stun
I think it is hard mechanics wise.0 -
ccmedaddy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
I don't really care about the snare part tbh, but giving opponents 4 seconds of counterplay before the stun actually occurs is just way too generous for the opponents. It's Warden's only hard CC outside of Permafrost, so it should actually accomplish the job of stunning people first and foremost.0 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I'm all for buffing Arctic Blast but I'm not a fan of any of those solutions. : /
If they just add a damage component that scales on magicka stats it will be fine. The damage would be similar to Reach/Clench in the destruction line.1 -
psychotic13✭✭✭✭✭
✭I just want the old one back, i primarily used it as a source of AoE minor maim.0 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I'm all for buffing Arctic Blast but I'm not a fan of any of those solutions. : /
If they just add a damage component that scales on magicka stats it will be fine. The damage would be similar to Reach/Clench in the destruction line.
yeah i don't think they will implement the arctic blast part of the old arctic wind master plan. i needed to think more realistically. perhaps they can still add the old AoE back to polar.
----
how about this?:
Cast Time: Instant
Target: Enemy
Range: 28 meters
Cost: 3645 (base. was 4050)
Send forth a blast of arctic cold dealing 740 frost damage.
Stuns chilled enemies. (enemies who are immune to chilled or the stun take +10% more frost damage for 6 seconds.)
New effect:
No longer heals, now deals frost damage, costs less and stuns chilled enemies
----
notes:
I'd want to give us an option between spammables. a lower damage frost damage spammable that costs more but stuns under a specific circumstance, or a magicka based spammable that does more base, costs less and does up to 15% more damage at range while also giving the class +3% more damage just by having it slotted. this could be the start of the implementation of viable frost damage skills.
also to prevent any confusion about how you're going to apply chilled when you use a fire staff etc, remember that we not only have a frost damage enchantment, but also glacial presence with a new controllable single target damage skill!
(enemies who are immune to chilled or the stun take +10% more frost damage for 6 seconds.)
this effect was added because of Nords. since they are immune to chilled, i wanted to make it so that this skill wasn't useless against them. i also wanted to make the skill do something helpful when it isn't stunning the enemy, so this should be a group buff when necromancers and wardens are in the group.Edited by ESO_Nightingale on April 25, 2019 1:05PMPvE Frost Warden Main and teacher for ESO-U. Frost Warden PvE Build Article: https://eso-u.com/articles/nightingales_warden_dps_guide__frost_knight. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX0 -
sionIV✭✭✭✭✭Arctic Blast: Frost AoE that scales with Magicka and has a minor healing component or some utility added to it.
Polar Wind: Old Arctic Blast put together with the old Polar Wind. AoE damage based on maximum health, and you heal one additional target.0 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭thank you for using my post to reference this fallen from grace skill. (although we showed that it bypasses old reflect)
however i do not feel as if the stun should be prepared for in that manner. enemies will already prepare for deep fissure next patch anyway. I've listed another suggestion that could work with how the frost community's suggestions have been so far. it's been a lot of interactions with the chilled status effect. through buffing glacial presence and reworking crystallised slab into a proc skill that relies on chilled to proc it's effects.Edited by ESO_Nightingale on April 25, 2019 1:07PMPvE Frost Warden Main and teacher for ESO-U. Frost Warden PvE Build Article: https://eso-u.com/articles/nightingales_warden_dps_guide__frost_knight. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX0 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Arctic Blast: Frost AoE that scales with Magicka and has a minor healing component or some utility added to it.
Polar Wind: Old Arctic Blast put together with the old Polar Wind. AoE damage based on maximum health, and you heal one additional target.
i wanted this too. but it doesn't seem likely that that will happen. i think we have to work with our situation.PvE Frost Warden Main and teacher for ESO-U. Frost Warden PvE Build Article: https://eso-u.com/articles/nightingales_warden_dps_guide__frost_knight. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX0 -
Tryxus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Arctic Blast
Cost: 2835 Magicka (see note)
Fire a powerful blast of frost at an enemy, dealing x damage (see note) and stunning the target for 3 seconds. Upon impact, a shockwave will apply the Chilled status to enemies within 10m of the target.
Note: damage is similar to Destructive Touch without Master Staff while the cost is similar to Destructive Touch with Master Staff
Turning it into a useful stun that works nicely with Ice Staff while keeping in touch with the old Arctic Blast. Much more elegant solution, no?
And perhaps Polar Wind could also use the same cost reduction and maybe additionally heal 2 targets instead of one or apply Minor Vitality?Edited by Tryxus on April 25, 2019 1:11PM"We're all born under the same sky and on the same earth. Therefore, we all deserve the same amount of respect."
Tryxus of the Undying Song - Warden - PC/EU0 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Arctic Blast
Cost: 2835 Magicka (see note)
Fire a powerful blast of frost at an enemy, dealing x damage (see note) and stunning the target for 3 seconds. Upon impact, a shockwave will apply the Chilled status to enemies within 10m of the target.
Note: damage is similar to Destructive Touch without Master Staff while the cost is similar to Destructive Touch with Master Staff
Turning it into a useful stun that works nicely with Ice Staff while keeping in touch with the old Arctic Blast. Much more elegant solution, no?
tanks wouldn't use this in pve. as this no longer heals and requires a target. having the aoe chilled proc on a single target stun just seems really weird. it's not useless per-say but such an effect would be undesirable compared to other effects like making the single target damage closer to a spammable or exactly like a spammable.PvE Frost Warden Main and teacher for ESO-U. Frost Warden PvE Build Article: https://eso-u.com/articles/nightingales_warden_dps_guide__frost_knight. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX0 -
Tryxus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »Arctic Blast
Cost: 2835 Magicka (see note)
Fire a powerful blast of frost at an enemy, dealing x damage (see note) and stunning the target for 3 seconds. Upon impact, a shockwave will apply the Chilled status to enemies within 10m of the target.
Note: damage is similar to Destructive Touch without Master Staff while the cost is similar to Destructive Touch with Master Staff
Turning it into a useful stun that works nicely with Ice Staff while keeping in touch with the old Arctic Blast. Much more elegant solution, no?
tanks wouldn't use this in pve. as this no longer heals and requires a target. having the aoe chilled proc on a single target stun just seems really weird. it's not useless per-say but such an effect would be undesirable compared to other effects like making the single target damage closer to a spammable or exactly like a spammable.
Well it's not meant as a tank skill, the Polar Wind morph would.
An AoE Chilled proc at the end would actually be useful alongside the Ice Destro: Frost Blockade (AoE Chilled -> Root) and Clench (single target, stun + root). It's not that weird of an effect either, you got Shock Clench for instance dealing splash damage or Inevitable Detonation."We're all born under the same sky and on the same earth. Therefore, we all deserve the same amount of respect."
Tryxus of the Undying Song - Warden - PC/EU0 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »Arctic Blast
Cost: 2835 Magicka (see note)
Fire a powerful blast of frost at an enemy, dealing x damage (see note) and stunning the target for 3 seconds. Upon impact, a shockwave will apply the Chilled status to enemies within 10m of the target.
Note: damage is similar to Destructive Touch without Master Staff while the cost is similar to Destructive Touch with Master Staff
Turning it into a useful stun that works nicely with Ice Staff while keeping in touch with the old Arctic Blast. Much more elegant solution, no?
tanks wouldn't use this in pve. as this no longer heals and requires a target. having the aoe chilled proc on a single target stun just seems really weird. it's not useless per-say but such an effect would be undesirable compared to other effects like making the single target damage closer to a spammable or exactly like a spammable.
Well it's not meant as a tank skill, the Polar Wind morph would.
An AoE Chilled proc at the end would actually be useful alongside the Ice Destro: Frost Blockade (AoE Chilled -> Root) and Clench (single target, stun + root). It's not that weird of an effect either, you got Shock Clench for instance dealing splash damage or Inevitable Detonation.
i think it's weird that a single target skill does the chilled in an aoe. i'd maybe understand if it was a single target skill applying chilled to the single target, but i mean, we also have glacial pressence. i just feel that applying chilled like that defeats the purpose of glacial presence. i do not think it should have this effect. i think we should be passively applying the debuff.
edit: also i assumed this was trying to be for the tank as it applies aoe minor maim in the same fashion as, say, choking talons? it's currently more important to apply chilled as a tank than it is as a dps.
edit 2: i also still wouldn't use this skill over shock clench in pvp.Edited by ESO_Nightingale on April 25, 2019 1:37PMPvE Frost Warden Main and teacher for ESO-U. Frost Warden PvE Build Article: https://eso-u.com/articles/nightingales_warden_dps_guide__frost_knight. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX0 -
Tryxus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »ESO_Nightingale wrote: »Arctic Blast
Cost: 2835 Magicka (see note)
Fire a powerful blast of frost at an enemy, dealing x damage (see note) and stunning the target for 3 seconds. Upon impact, a shockwave will apply the Chilled status to enemies within 10m of the target.
Note: damage is similar to Destructive Touch without Master Staff while the cost is similar to Destructive Touch with Master Staff
Turning it into a useful stun that works nicely with Ice Staff while keeping in touch with the old Arctic Blast. Much more elegant solution, no?
tanks wouldn't use this in pve. as this no longer heals and requires a target. having the aoe chilled proc on a single target stun just seems really weird. it's not useless per-say but such an effect would be undesirable compared to other effects like making the single target damage closer to a spammable or exactly like a spammable.
Well it's not meant as a tank skill, the Polar Wind morph would.
An AoE Chilled proc at the end would actually be useful alongside the Ice Destro: Frost Blockade (AoE Chilled -> Root) and Clench (single target, stun + root). It's not that weird of an effect either, you got Shock Clench for instance dealing splash damage or Inevitable Detonation.
i think it's weird that a single target skill does the chilled in an aoe. i'd maybe understand if it was a single target skill applying chilled to the single target, but i mean, we also have glacial pressence. i just feel that applying chilled like that defeats the purpose of glacial presence. i do not think it should have this effect. i think we should be passively applying the debuff.
How about a tiny bit of splash damage, similar to the old Arctic Blast, instead of a Chilled proc then?"We're all born under the same sky and on the same earth. Therefore, we all deserve the same amount of respect."
Tryxus of the Undying Song - Warden - PC/EU0 -
brtomkin✭✭✭As much as I would like the old Arctic Blast back, I could get on board with this version if they simply changed it to an AOE CC like fear rather than a targeted CC.
PS5 NA: Pickmans__Model, CP 2000+0 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »ESO_Nightingale wrote: »Arctic Blast
Cost: 2835 Magicka (see note)
Fire a powerful blast of frost at an enemy, dealing x damage (see note) and stunning the target for 3 seconds. Upon impact, a shockwave will apply the Chilled status to enemies within 10m of the target.
Note: damage is similar to Destructive Touch without Master Staff while the cost is similar to Destructive Touch with Master Staff
Turning it into a useful stun that works nicely with Ice Staff while keeping in touch with the old Arctic Blast. Much more elegant solution, no?
tanks wouldn't use this in pve. as this no longer heals and requires a target. having the aoe chilled proc on a single target stun just seems really weird. it's not useless per-say but such an effect would be undesirable compared to other effects like making the single target damage closer to a spammable or exactly like a spammable.
Well it's not meant as a tank skill, the Polar Wind morph would.
An AoE Chilled proc at the end would actually be useful alongside the Ice Destro: Frost Blockade (AoE Chilled -> Root) and Clench (single target, stun + root). It's not that weird of an effect either, you got Shock Clench for instance dealing splash damage or Inevitable Detonation.
i think it's weird that a single target skill does the chilled in an aoe. i'd maybe understand if it was a single target skill applying chilled to the single target, but i mean, we also have glacial pressence. i just feel that applying chilled like that defeats the purpose of glacial presence. i do not think it should have this effect. i think we should be passively applying the debuff.
How about a tiny bit of splash damage, similar to the old Arctic Blast, instead of a Chilled proc then?
well, just make it deal shock damage and you have shock clench.
i do not believe that this sort of stun should have any aoe properties. not anymore anyway. see my original Arctic Wind Master Plan for that. it's more realistic and helpful for it to do more damage. i like the cost reduction and listed it for my own suggestion. it's pretty friggin expensive for how little it does. i think if we are to list suggestions that it's a better idea to make them easy to implement or straightforward. or both. my idea i listed above is (what i feel to be pretty straightforward) i added the last part because i realised that nord is a thing and thus is immune to blast's stun.Edited by ESO_Nightingale on April 25, 2019 1:44PMPvE Frost Warden Main and teacher for ESO-U. Frost Warden PvE Build Article: https://eso-u.com/articles/nightingales_warden_dps_guide__frost_knight. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX0 -
Casul✭✭✭✭✭
✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »ESO_Nightingale wrote: »ESO_Nightingale wrote: »Arctic Blast
Cost: 2835 Magicka (see note)
Fire a powerful blast of frost at an enemy, dealing x damage (see note) and stunning the target for 3 seconds. Upon impact, a shockwave will apply the Chilled status to enemies within 10m of the target.
Note: damage is similar to Destructive Touch without Master Staff while the cost is similar to Destructive Touch with Master Staff
Turning it into a useful stun that works nicely with Ice Staff while keeping in touch with the old Arctic Blast. Much more elegant solution, no?
tanks wouldn't use this in pve. as this no longer heals and requires a target. having the aoe chilled proc on a single target stun just seems really weird. it's not useless per-say but such an effect would be undesirable compared to other effects like making the single target damage closer to a spammable or exactly like a spammable.
Well it's not meant as a tank skill, the Polar Wind morph would.
An AoE Chilled proc at the end would actually be useful alongside the Ice Destro: Frost Blockade (AoE Chilled -> Root) and Clench (single target, stun + root). It's not that weird of an effect either, you got Shock Clench for instance dealing splash damage or Inevitable Detonation.
i think it's weird that a single target skill does the chilled in an aoe. i'd maybe understand if it was a single target skill applying chilled to the single target, but i mean, we also have glacial pressence. i just feel that applying chilled like that defeats the purpose of glacial presence. i do not think it should have this effect. i think we should be passively applying the debuff.
How about a tiny bit of splash damage, similar to the old Arctic Blast, instead of a Chilled proc then?
well, just make it deal shock damage and you have shock clench.
i do not believe that this sort of stun should have any aoe properties. not anymore anyway. see my original Arctic Wind Master Plan for that. it's more realistic and helpful for it to do more damage. i like the cost reduction and listed it for my own suggestion. it's pretty friggin expensive for how little it does. i think if we are to list suggestions that it's a better idea to make them easy to implement or straightforward. or both. my idea i listed above is (what i feel to be pretty straightforward) i added the last part because i realised that nord is a thing and thus is immune to blast's stun.
@ESO_Nightingale
I would like to have to be a viable option for stamina warden as well, similar to petrify for DK. I felt that if I made the skill have a damage component it would be overtuned. But you do bring up a good point with the cost of the ability. Which before any reduction sits at a whopping 4051 (Just for the record petrify sits at 2700, fear sits at 3780, rune cage sits at 3510)
But that brings up something important in regards to chilled, I am unaware of whether the projectile can proc chilled as it doesn't do any damage currently. Do you happen to know if it can proc chilled?PvP needs more love.0 -
ccmedaddy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
It doesn't. There's no hidden benefit to using this skill--it really is as garbage as it sounds.But that brings up something important in regards to chilled, I am unaware of whether the projectile can proc chilled as it doesn't do any damage currently. Do you happen to know if it can proc chilled?0 -
Casul✭✭✭✭✭
✭
It doesn't. There's no hidden benefit to using this skill--it really is as garbage as it sounds.But that brings up something important in regards to chilled, I am unaware of whether the projectile can proc chilled as it doesn't do any damage currently. Do you happen to know if it can proc chilled?
Man that’s a bummer. I really wanna make use of it somehow on my stamwarden, you know? Just to try lolPvP needs more love.0