Maintenance for the week of April 6:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
Event PVP: Was this an exploit or no?
-
Dashmatt✭✭✭✭FleetwoodSmack wrote: »It's not so much an exploit as it's just poor design. They could honestly have made the inside of the houses where it gives a full immunity buff for everyone that enters regardless of faction.
That about sums it up.
If an advantage exists, someone will exploit it. Even if it pretty pathetic, like killing people during load screens.
They aren’t breaking any rules though. This one is on ZOS.2 -
mairwen85✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »
They don't have doors anymore because it's not an exploit, if it was an exploit the doors would remain and players would be banned.
Them removing doors is a prime example of them changing a design rather than proof of an exploit
That's some of the most tortured logic I've seen on a forum. Care to explain how killing players as they are stuck in a load screen is not an exploit? Is there some amazing trick that enables a solo player to roll-dodge and leap through aoes and dots whilst they are in a load screen? If so, please, tell me now, load screens are littered throughout cyro and I for one am sick of getting ganked by them. Some days I think my death recap should be:
Loading Screen: 9,874 damage.
Loading Screen: 8,659 damage.
Loading Screen: 9,598 damage.
Hint: Try and avoid loading screens.
Exploit, mate. You know it, I know it.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_exploit
I linked above the definition of a “video game exploit” per Wikipedia. One can make the argument that this is in no way an exploit since no change to the program, or external program is being used. Personally, I think this comes down to whether you think the developers intended this game mechanic, or not.
I have never seen the developers comment on it one way, or another. They definitely are aware of all the ways players farm each other in Cyrodiil, and I’ve never heard them suggest that anyone doing a scroll farm is exploiting. Personally, it’s crossed my mind that some of them may in fact find these threads as hilarious as I do.
From your own link:In video games, an exploit is the use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, speed or level design etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.
From the same link you provide, what has been experienced is 'Griefing'.Edited by mairwen85 on April 23, 2019 1:51PM3 -
moonsugar66✭✭✭I was that guy who make you die with aoe in house.
Got 100-150k ap without lowpop bonus for 10 min.
It was fun, after 10 min farming blues come to house in 30ppl same time and kill us 5 hard.
Next time i would use few meatbags and coldharbour ballistas inside.
And tbh it's the funniest pvp content that devs provide us since summerset launch.
When you’re ready for some truly challenging PVP come to spots with the big Xs and play with us grownups.
8 -
bol✭✭✭This is probably the worst event so far. It is the most Toxic event I have ever seen. Could be dubbed a social experiment on how to bring the worst out of people. Creating a PvE event in a PvP zone is just a bad bad idea. They could have mitigated it by setting exp gained for killing people to 0. That would certainly lower the number of people standing there farming pve-ers. I say lower, because knowing human nature there would still be griefers doing it for their amusement.
I have personally avoided attacking anyone I meet doing quests unless they attack me first. Been chased by zergs a lot, not managed to escape every time time, but mostly I do. It breaks my heart everytime I see a bunch of people zerging down people who are completely unequipped to fight them. Worst yet the ones ganking at quest givers.
And to answer the people saying its a war zone, expect to be killed, and other bs like that.
Every war has objectives, mostly they are political. So does the one in Cyrodil. Its factions fighting for control of land and keeps. The goal is not genocide, so you do not have to kill everyone belonging to opposite faction, just those who are preventing you from achieving your war goals. Think about this for a while.3 -
NeroBad✭✭✭✭FleetwoodSmack wrote: »It's not so much an exploit as it's just poor design. They could honestly have made the inside of the houses where it gives a full immunity buff for everyone that enters regardless of faction.
That about sums it up.
If an advantage exists, someone will exploit it. Even if it pretty pathetic, like killing people during load screens.
They aren’t breaking any rules though. This one is on ZOS.
The ban hammer for Asylum Sanctorium when players used bad map design to make easy loot, showed bad unintended design is exploit in the eyes of ZOS. When Imperial City Event had brutal exp multiplier they banned many players also. I dont think now they will ban players, but who nows, if enough people report such behaviour then maybe ZOS will look into it.0 -
Blinkin8r✭✭✭✭✭VvardeFellow wrote: »DISCLAIMER: I despise PVP. I despise it because no one, ever, in the history of gaming has ever been able to control "greifers" and bad behavior disguised as "play".
That said, like many, many "tourists" who do not PVP, I went to the holy grail of Cyrodil this week, to get my boxes. First time there. Pretty place. Expected to die every second, but as I was there and stumbled into "dailies", and started doing those, it took awhile for someone, somewhere in the boonies to jump me. Shrug it off, learn the spawn and transit system.
So on day two, in Bruma, in what I think is a quest giver house, upon entering, I am immediately killed by what I later learn from those who know such things, as persistent AOE from a group of opposing faction players, although I hesitate to call them players because why insult the term players?
Anyway. some said it was an exploit, some said it was just your ordinary grief-er , and of course some said "git gud", as if bad spelling was somehow an antidote to anything.
I don't really care about getting grief-ed, after the second time and learning, I stayed away from the house. But, which is it? Exploit or what?
It's not technically an exploit, but it has to be the most scummy way of playing this game out there. Just think about it this way, 10+ lowlifes have nothing better to do and are so worthless they have to all sit in a house in the corner of cyrodiil spamming aoes on a door just to get a kill or two. Never message them and just go somewhere else to quest and they'll leave quickly.II Blinkin II
Xbox 1 NA
"A man without the sauce is lost, but the same man can become lost in the sauce."1 -
Raammzzaa✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »
They don't have doors anymore because it's not an exploit, if it was an exploit the doors would remain and players would be banned.
Them removing doors is a prime example of them changing a design rather than proof of an exploit
That's some of the most tortured logic I've seen on a forum. Care to explain how killing players as they are stuck in a load screen is not an exploit? Is there some amazing trick that enables a solo player to roll-dodge and leap through aoes and dots whilst they are in a load screen? If so, please, tell me now, load screens are littered throughout cyro and I for one am sick of getting ganked by them. Some days I think my death recap should be:
Loading Screen: 9,874 damage.
Loading Screen: 8,659 damage.
Loading Screen: 9,598 damage.
Hint: Try and avoid loading screens.
Exploit, mate. You know it, I know it.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_exploit
I linked above the definition of a “video game exploit” per Wikipedia. One can make the argument that this is in no way an exploit since no change to the program, or external program is being used. Personally, I think this comes down to whether you think the developers intended this game mechanic, or not.
I have never seen the developers comment on it one way, or another. They definitely are aware of all the ways players farm each other in Cyrodiil, and I’ve never heard them suggest that anyone doing a scroll farm is exploiting. Personally, it’s crossed my mind that some of them may in fact find these threads as hilarious as I do.
From your own link:In video games, an exploit is the use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, speed or level design etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.
From the same link you provide, what has been experienced is 'Griefing'.
Yes, exactly. So the point is did the developers intend this, or not?
For certain, they have known about scroll farming since the launch of the game. In case you do not, this is where a scroll is taken into one of these houses, winery, etc. as bait. You stack the door, drop AoEs and nuke other players from the enemy faction as they enter. It’s basically what is being called out in this thread except the bait in question is a scroll vs. a quest npc. So since they have known about players camping doors and killing enemies as they enter for years and have not addressed it, it seems likely that they want it to be that way, and this is “working as intended” as they say.
0 -
BNOC✭✭✭✭✭.moonsugar66 wrote: »I was that guy who make you die with aoe in house.
Got 100-150k ap without lowpop bonus for 10 min.
It was fun, after 10 min farming blues come to house in 30ppl same time and kill us 5 hard.
Next time i would use few meatbags and coldharbour ballistas inside.
And tbh it's the funniest pvp content that devs provide us since summerset launch.
When you’re ready for some truly challenging PVP come to spots with the big Xs and play with us grownups.
Yeah, go see him at the big X's
- I.E. The hordes of equally weak players with catapults running around like headless chickens because "truly challenging".
This should be fixed imo, but just move the quest givers outside or something, forget that dumb IC immunity that's being suggested; that should never have been implemented as it was.vMSA - Magplar - Xbox EU - 15/11/16
578,000 - 36 Minutes 58 Seconds (Top 2 World?)
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox NA
569,000 - 40 minutes (350CP, Non optimised runs)0 -
carlos424✭✭✭✭✭
Ya, its mostly people with little pvp skill and it makes them feel good to get some kills, or just people wanting to *** others off (We all know people like this.) Real pvpers rarely mess with capturing towns because they are rarely strategically significant. And its not about the AP, telvar, or whatever. You get way more of that capturing keeps/resources and fighting big groups.Can we stop pretending that killing players 6v1 as they zone into a building is PvP? It's taking advantage of game mechanics to defeat players who can't fight back, and it's pathetic. It's like walking into a daycare, smacking around the toddlers there, and then bragging about your fighting skills.
Edited by carlos424 on April 23, 2019 2:44PM2 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
You also had the old trick of hiding in the tower at resources.Waffennacht wrote: »
They don't have doors anymore because it's not an exploit, if it was an exploit the doors would remain and players would be banned.
Them removing doors is a prime example of them changing a design rather than proof of an exploit
That's some of the most tortured logic I've seen on a forum. Care to explain how killing players as they are stuck in a load screen is not an exploit? Is there some amazing trick that enables a solo player to roll-dodge and leap through aoes and dots whilst they are in a load screen? If so, please, tell me now, load screens are littered throughout cyro and I for one am sick of getting ganked by them. Some days I think my death recap should be:
Loading Screen: 9,874 damage.
Loading Screen: 8,659 damage.
Loading Screen: 9,598 damage.
Hint: Try and avoid loading screens.
Exploit, mate. You know it, I know it.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_exploit
I linked above the definition of a “video game exploit” per Wikipedia. One can make the argument that this is in no way an exploit since no change to the program, or external program is being used. Personally, I think this comes down to whether you think the developers intended this game mechanic, or not.
I have never seen the developers comment on it one way, or another. They definitely are aware of all the ways players farm each other in Cyrodiil, and I’ve never heard them suggest that anyone doing a scroll farm is exploiting. Personally, it’s crossed my mind that some of them may in fact find these threads as hilarious as I do.
From your own link:In video games, an exploit is the use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, speed or level design etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.
From the same link you provide, what has been experienced is 'Griefing'.
Yes, exactly. So the point is did the developers intend this, or not?
For certain, they have known about scroll farming since the launch of the game. In case you do not, this is where a scroll is taken into one of these houses, winery, etc. as bait. You stack the door, drop AoEs and nuke other players from the enemy faction as they enter. It’s basically what is being called out in this thread except the bait in question is a scroll vs. a quest npc. So since they have known about players camping doors and killing enemies as they enter for years and have not addressed it, it seems likely that they want it to be that way, and this is “working as intended” as they say.
This has been fixed.
See scroll farming is an issue, however here its more an tactical use of the load screen as its an very obvious trap.
Your only option is to try to force your way in who would be very hard with an large group inside or just ignore them until they get bored.
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well, the door is not bugged. It does what it should do. It’s bad design that the damage already starts before you have full control over your character again. But it’s the same with any door in Cyrodiil. So no, it’s Not an Exploit.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.1 -
Casdha✭✭✭✭✭
✭The more I think about this I think there is what could be considered an Exploit here.
As I stated in another thread, I don't remember seeing the town go into a battle state as long as the players were just inside the buildings. I remember being able to port directly back into the town every time at least until the fighting spilled outside.
If this was the case, the exploit would be that players don't get the heads up on the map that enemies are in the area fighting as they would if they were outside fighting at or near a location.Edited by Casdha on April 23, 2019 2:53PMProud member of the Psijic Order - The first wave - The 0.016%1 -
Raammzzaa✭✭✭✭✭The more I think about this I think there is what could be considered an Exploit here.
As I stated in another thread, I don't remember seeing the town go into a battle state as long as the players were just inside the buildings. I remember being able to port directly back into the town every time at least until the fighting spilled outside.
If this was the case, the exploit would be that players don't get the heads up on the map that enemies are in the area fighting as they would if they were outside fighting near at or near a location.
So by that logic every time someone goes to a keep that is not flagged and encounters another player that wants to fight them the other player is an exploiter?
Cyrodiil is an open world PvP zone. As soon as you step foot inside you are game anywhere in the zone. It makes no difference if the location you are in is flagged, or not.
4 -
DeadlyRecluse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭The more I think about this I think there is what could be considered an Exploit here.
As I stated in another thread, I don't remember seeing the town go into a battle state as long as the players were just inside the buildings. I remember being able to port directly back into the town every time at least until the fighting spilled outside.
If this was the case, the exploit would be that players don't get the heads up on the map that enemies are in the area fighting as they would if they were outside fighting at or near a location.
Fighting inside or outside has nothing to do with "battle state." The town only goes into "battle state" if a flag is being flipped.
You can even have one blue and two yellow flags, and if it goes a couple minutes without a flag starting to flip, it'll unflag--you can fight in a town all day without flagging it, if you don't want to.Thrice Empress, Forever Scrub0 -
Casdha✭✭✭✭✭
✭The more I think about this I think there is what could be considered an Exploit here.
As I stated in another thread, I don't remember seeing the town go into a battle state as long as the players were just inside the buildings. I remember being able to port directly back into the town every time at least until the fighting spilled outside.
If this was the case, the exploit would be that players don't get the heads up on the map that enemies are in the area fighting as they would if they were outside fighting near at or near a location.
So by that logic every time someone goes to a keep that is not flagged and encounters another player that wants to fight them the other player is an exploiter?
Cyrodiil is an open world PvP zone. As soon as you step foot inside you are game anywhere in the zone. It makes no difference if the location you are in is flagged, or not.
No because the game will put up a symbol that there is a fight going on once you start fighting. I'm saying I don't think this happened when the fighting was inside of a building within a town like it should have.Proud member of the Psijic Order - The first wave - The 0.016%0 -
xan4silkb14_ESO✭✭✭✭Let's stop splitting hairs here, it's an exploit, just not one that ZoS cares about as it generally doesn't occur very often. It doesn't matter that its a design flaw with the loading screens, the exploit is still there. They took the doors off the tower resources because it was an ongoing problem. They could do the same for the towns but won't because once this event is over this sort of thing will happen so infrequently, if ever, we won't talk about it until the next event.
4 -
DeadlyRecluse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭As I stated in another thread, I don't remember seeing the town go into a battle state as long as the players were just inside the buildings. I remember being able to port directly back into the town every time at least until the fighting spilled outside.
I stated this before, upthread: "battle state" is triggered by flags, not by fighting. You can always port into a town, even if there's a massive battle, as long as the invading team doesn't start flipping flags.
It's possible (and pretty common) for people to farm in the outside area of a town and avoid flipping the flags so that people keep trickling in.
Thrice Empress, Forever Scrub0 -
aaisoaho✭✭✭✭✭Since we're having a discussion if this is an exploit or not, here's my 2 cents.
So, we need to define what is an exploit:
For my argument, I'll use the previous definition from this thread, which was from Wikipedia article.
I bolded what I consider to be the issue: is it intended to be able to kill players while they are facing a loading screen?In video games, an exploit is the use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, speed or level design etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.
Yes, Cyrodiil is intended to be a PVP zone. PVP zone is a place where you can fight against other players. To my understanding, you cannot fight or react/defend when you're stuck in a loading screen, so it's debatable if you truly are fighting against someone or not. As others have stated in this thread: in a similar situation (resource tower doors) designers went and changed the doors so it couldn't happen there, it makes me believe this situation isn't intended either.
Now, if it is not intended to be able to kill players who are not able to control their character, it is an exploit and thus town building farmers are exploiters.
And of course, we can try to propose some changes to prevent further exploiting: because the problem is inability to control your character while being killed, I propose adding an immunity to players in a loading screen. This way the developers can reuse old functions to add the fix: the immunity is already in game on the safe zones.5 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Since we're having a discussion if this is an exploit or not, here's my 2 cents.
So, we need to define what is an exploit:
For my argument, I'll use the previous definition from this thread, which was from Wikipedia article.
I bolded what I consider to be the issue: is it intended to be able to kill players while they are facing a loading screen?In video games, an exploit is the use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, speed or level design etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.
Yes, Cyrodiil is intended to be a PVP zone. PVP zone is a place where you can fight against other players. To my understanding, you cannot fight or react/defend when you're stuck in a loading screen, so it's debatable if you truly are fighting against someone or not. As others have stated in this thread: in a similar situation (resource tower doors) designers went and changed the doors so it couldn't happen there, it makes me believe this situation isn't intended either.
Now, if it is not intended to be able to kill players who are not able to control their character, it is an exploit and thus town building farmers are exploiters.
And of course, we can try to propose some changes to prevent further exploiting: because the problem is inability to control your character while being killed, I propose adding an immunity to players in a loading screen. This way the developers can reuse old functions to add the fix: the immunity is already in game on the safe zones.
you can also deny them their pvp by not going into the door. Are you then also engaging in exploiting them by making them not PVP through the act of not pressing "E"?
Its a bad gameplay design nothing more lol.Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual2 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You all need to slot some impen and stop heading into strange buildings where weirdos lay an wait lol.
Inside the building is where the objective ends. This is why they took doors off of towers and give invulnerability after loading screen in Imperial City. Did you read any of the thread?
Id argue the main objective in PVP is to kill your targets, then PVE quest.
If you can't kill because of a door mechanic, stop walking through doors. Wait them out on the other side or find another location lol.
Cyro is your oyster.Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭To me; the only time "exploit" (the word) is used, is in the sense of a Bannable offense or not.
If you are not going to be banned; you are not exploiting the game.
If the word "exploit" is being used in any manner other than "bannable offense" it is not being used correctly on the forums.3 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »To me; the only time "exploit" (the word) is used, is in the sense of a Bannable offense or not.
If you are not going to be banned; you are not exploiting the game.
If the word "exploit" is being used in any manner other than "bannable offense" it is not being used correctly on the forums.
and to exploit requires you to always be actively making that decision/action. You can literally stop them from killing you if you don't go through the doors lolMinno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual2 -
Casdha✭✭✭✭✭
✭DeadlyRecluse wrote: »The more I think about this I think there is what could be considered an Exploit here.
As I stated in another thread, I don't remember seeing the town go into a battle state as long as the players were just inside the buildings. I remember being able to port directly back into the town every time at least until the fighting spilled outside.
If this was the case, the exploit would be that players don't get the heads up on the map that enemies are in the area fighting as they would if they were outside fighting at or near a location.
Fighting inside or outside has nothing to do with "battle state." The town only goes into "battle state" if a flag is being flipped.
You can even have one blue and two yellow flags, and if it goes a couple minutes without a flag starting to flip, it'll unflag--you can fight in a town all day without flagging it, if you don't want to.
Yes but the crossed swords show up anywhere there is fighting even if it is one on one, unless they changed something. I'll admit I don't pay attention as much as I used too.
Edit: I don't remember seeing them when the fighting was only inside the buildings.Edited by Casdha on April 23, 2019 4:48PMProud member of the Psijic Order - The first wave - The 0.016%0 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Back then you wanted to get the empiror we had issue other arriving at the "fight" ruining it.The more I think about this I think there is what could be considered an Exploit here.
As I stated in another thread, I don't remember seeing the town go into a battle state as long as the players were just inside the buildings. I remember being able to port directly back into the town every time at least until the fighting spilled outside.
If this was the case, the exploit would be that players don't get the heads up on the map that enemies are in the area fighting as they would if they were outside fighting near at or near a location.
So by that logic every time someone goes to a keep that is not flagged and encounters another player that wants to fight them the other player is an exploiter?
Cyrodiil is an open world PvP zone. As soon as you step foot inside you are game anywhere in the zone. It makes no difference if the location you are in is flagged, or not.
No because the game will put up a symbol that there is a fight going on once you start fighting. I'm saying I don't think this happened when the fighting was inside of a building within a town like it should have.
Solution was moving our rotating firing squad inside an delve.
This was also an buff as the one waiting could kill mobs
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭IzzyStardust wrote: »
I did. Stop going into buildings and instead wait for them to go outside. Then fight+kill them.
They are only there because they know PVE players are going in with divines/infused gear lol.Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0 -
aaisoaho✭✭✭✭✭Since we're having a discussion if this is an exploit or not, here's my 2 cents.
So, we need to define what is an exploit:
For my argument, I'll use the previous definition from this thread, which was from Wikipedia article.
I bolded what I consider to be the issue: is it intended to be able to kill players while they are facing a loading screen?In video games, an exploit is the use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, speed or level design etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.
Yes, Cyrodiil is intended to be a PVP zone. PVP zone is a place where you can fight against other players. To my understanding, you cannot fight or react/defend when you're stuck in a loading screen, so it's debatable if you truly are fighting against someone or not. As others have stated in this thread: in a similar situation (resource tower doors) designers went and changed the doors so it couldn't happen there, it makes me believe this situation isn't intended either.
Now, if it is not intended to be able to kill players who are not able to control their character, it is an exploit and thus town building farmers are exploiters.
And of course, we can try to propose some changes to prevent further exploiting: because the problem is inability to control your character while being killed, I propose adding an immunity to players in a loading screen. This way the developers can reuse old functions to add the fix: the immunity is already in game on the safe zones.
you can also deny them their pvp by not going into the door. Are you then also engaging in exploiting them by making them not PVP through the act of not pressing "E"?
Its a bad gameplay design nothing more lol.
No, if no one goes trough the door, no one ends up in a state where they can be killed without having a control over their character and thus there is no exploiting happening.You all need to slot some impen and stop heading into strange buildings where weirdos lay an wait lol.
Inside the building is where the objective ends. This is why they took doors off of towers and give invulnerability after loading screen in Imperial City. Did you read any of the thread?
Id argue the main objective in PVP is to kill your targets, then PVE quest.
If you can't kill because of a door mechanic, stop walking through doors. Wait them out on the other side or find another location lol.
Cyro is your oyster.
Actually, I would like to argue that the main objective or focus is not PVP in Cyrodiil. It is an objective and a focus, but not the main. We get hints about these by the reward structure: if you do something right, you get rewarded.
We have 2 leaderboards in a campaign: one based on an individual performance and the other based on alliance's performance. Your end of campaign rewards gets higher the higher your alliance scored. Being a lone huge reward, it puts a major significance on it.
Now, you are rewarded in a minor way by doing quests and killing players. These objectives only affect your individual scoring, they do not count for the alliance scoring. To me, it seems they are on an equal level of significance. You are also rewarded in a minor way when you capture objectives like resources, keeps and scrolls. These tough also affects your alliance scoring and individual scoring, so I think they are more significant than questing or killing players.0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Since we're having a discussion if this is an exploit or not, here's my 2 cents.
So, we need to define what is an exploit:
For my argument, I'll use the previous definition from this thread, which was from Wikipedia article.
I bolded what I consider to be the issue: is it intended to be able to kill players while they are facing a loading screen?In video games, an exploit is the use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, speed or level design etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.
Yes, Cyrodiil is intended to be a PVP zone. PVP zone is a place where you can fight against other players. To my understanding, you cannot fight or react/defend when you're stuck in a loading screen, so it's debatable if you truly are fighting against someone or not. As others have stated in this thread: in a similar situation (resource tower doors) designers went and changed the doors so it couldn't happen there, it makes me believe this situation isn't intended either.
Now, if it is not intended to be able to kill players who are not able to control their character, it is an exploit and thus town building farmers are exploiters.
And of course, we can try to propose some changes to prevent further exploiting: because the problem is inability to control your character while being killed, I propose adding an immunity to players in a loading screen. This way the developers can reuse old functions to add the fix: the immunity is already in game on the safe zones.
you can also deny them their pvp by not going into the door. Are you then also engaging in exploiting them by making them not PVP through the act of not pressing "E"?
Its a bad gameplay design nothing more lol.
No, if no one goes trough the door, no one ends up in a state where they can be killed without having a control over their character and thus there is no exploiting happening.You all need to slot some impen and stop heading into strange buildings where weirdos lay an wait lol.
Inside the building is where the objective ends. This is why they took doors off of towers and give invulnerability after loading screen in Imperial City. Did you read any of the thread?
Id argue the main objective in PVP is to kill your targets, then PVE quest.
If you can't kill because of a door mechanic, stop walking through doors. Wait them out on the other side or find another location lol.
Cyro is your oyster.
Actually, I would like to argue that the main objective or focus is not PVP in Cyrodiil. It is an objective and a focus, but not the main. We get hints about these by the reward structure: if you do something right, you get rewarded.
We have 2 leaderboards in a campaign: one based on an individual performance and the other based on alliance's performance. Your end of campaign rewards gets higher the higher your alliance scored. Being a lone huge reward, it puts a major significance on it.
Now, you are rewarded in a minor way by doing quests and killing players. These objectives only affect your individual scoring, they do not count for the alliance scoring. To me, it seems they are on an equal level of significance. You are also rewarded in a minor way when you capture objectives like resources, keeps and scrolls. These tough also affects your alliance scoring and individual scoring, so I think they are more significant than questing or killing players.
how can the first PVP zone at launch NOT be PVP as the main focused?! It's a 3-faction war for a reason lol. If you don't pvp, then the PVP will come to your front door, its inevitable.Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual3 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
If its an group inside that gear you are solo don't matter much, tank builds works well but don't have serious burst damage.IzzyStardust wrote: »
I did. Stop going into buildings and instead wait for them to go outside. Then fight+kill them.
They are only there because they know PVE players are going in with divines/infused gear lol.
Yes sending in the tank first then rest of group should probably work, however some of this setups sounds way overkill for killing questers more something like the scroll trap.
Yes they know they run into PvP groups sooner or later but still.
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
If its an group inside that gear you are solo don't matter much, tank builds works well but don't have serious burst damage.IzzyStardust wrote: »
I did. Stop going into buildings and instead wait for them to go outside. Then fight+kill them.
They are only there because they know PVE players are going in with divines/infused gear lol.
Yes sending in the tank first then rest of group should probably work, however some of this setups sounds way overkill for killing questers more something like the scroll trap.
Yes they know they run into PvP groups sooner or later but still.
there are ways to bait players out. Impatience is one of the main ones. They do the same tactic with scrolls; 9/10 times the best way is to organize and wait them out.
I 100% will guarantee that they will come out and fight you all if no one comes through those doors to farm.Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0
